Ederson Moraes

BobbyManc said:
No he’s not. Ederson’s had a good season. Let’s not forget he’s in the team for his build-up and that’s been exceptional as always, and he’s still kept the most clean sheets and kept us in a few games. Hardly a bad season individually.
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Being competent on the ball is all good and well, but you still need to be a capable shot stopper with good positioning.
 
Kaos said:
Being competent on the ball is all good and well, but you still need to be a capable shot stopper with good positioning.
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Which Ederson is. Honestly, I’m more worried about Laporte than I am about Ederson.
 
SilentWitness said:
No idea what he's thinking for the first goal and makes a mess of the third. Terrible performance.
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I've seen some criticism for the first goal but I'm not sure what he's meant to do?

He's come off his line to close down the 1 on 1 as he can't just stay rooted to his line and pray his defender makes a last ditch challenge. The challenge is made and he's unfortunate he's in no man's land, he has to retreat and the finish is perfect, I don't think any keeper would be anywhere near saving that.

3rd goal is obviously a shocker though.
 
Dominos said:
I've seen some criticism for the first goal but I'm not sure what he's meant to do?

He's come off his line to close down the 1 on 1 as he can't just stay rooted to his line and pray his defender makes a last ditch challenge. The challenge is made and he's unfortunate he's in no man's land, he has to retreat and the finish is perfect, I don't think any keeper would be anywhere near saving that.

3rd goal is obviously a shocker though.
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don’t think he needs to come out that far and then hesitates far too much after that.
 
BobbyManc said:
Which Ederson is. Honestly, I’m more worried about Laporte than I am about Ederson.
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He's a decent shot stopper, he's not what I'd call a good one. I like him as he's got tons of heart, commits to everything and is great on the ball. But in terms of pulling of WC saves its rare.
I agree on Laporte, he's been very ropey for us in the big games. Was poor tonight, was shocking vs Spurs last season in the CL He's a great player but looks like he's lacking a bit of heart at times (a common trait in our squad sadly).
 
His positioning is a huge liability, though that first goal is far from the biggest example of it. Always makes weird decisions about coming off of his line. That third goal is also unacceptable. DDG is finished at this point for me and yet he still will almost never push a shot like that into the center, handling is a very underrated attribute for goalkeepers.
 
ValenciasDrilledCrosses said:
His positioning is a huge liability, though that first goal is far from the biggest example of it. Always makes weird decisions about coming off of his line. That third goal is also unacceptable. DDG is finished at this point for me and yet he still will almost never push a shot like that into the center, handling is a very underrated attribute for goalkeepers.
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Its absolutely tactical and he's told to come for everything which constantly sees him running back etc.. His positioning isn't the best but its not terrible.

I don't blame him for the 1st goal at all. I blame Laporte for losing his man, Fernandinho for running into no mans land and Walker for not being able to look down a line.

3rd goal was shocking and simply a schoolboy error no top keeper should make. He maybe could have kept the 2nd one out too, its not a horror show but its the type of save the great keepers make and he simply rarely if ever does.
 
He’s a good keeper but not a great one and the perception around his ability is inflated by the fact city dominate the ball against most PL sides. However you’ve also got to counter that with the fact playing in that system exposes him to higher quality chances than most keepers face.

City in general just seem to have players around the back that are good but make mistakes in pressure moments and good isn’t enough when you don’t fire at the other end.
 
Makes a similar number mistakes as DDG, nowhere near the coverage though...

At fault in a way for all 3 goals tonight, a little harsh with the first maybe, but he still came charging off his line like a mad man. Should have saved the 2nd and not spilled the 3rd.

Was at fault for our 2 goals in the derby in March if I recall correctly.

Media love to gas him up as one of the best in the world but he's nowhere close.
 
How many mistakes does this guy need to make to officially be recognised as a fraud?

In recent years we’ve scored about 4 goals cause of his clangers alone. I remember him more for his calamities than anything good he does.
Unbelievably overrated.
 
Chief123 said:
How many mistakes does this guy need to make to officially be recognised as a fraud?

In recent years we’ve scored about 4 goals cause of his clangers alone. I remember him more for his calamities than anything good he does.
Unbelievably overrated.
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He should have saved Martial's 2 goals against him this season, one near post and one went right under him. Had a mare for the McTominay goal too yeah.
 
Schmeichel's Cartwheel said:
He should have saved Martial's 2 goals against him this season, one near post and one went right under him. Had a mare for the McTominay goal too yeah.
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Yep exactly my point. I can think of a few he’s had against Liverpool too. No point being able to play an amazing long pass when you can’t be trusted to stop goals going into your net.
 
padr81 said:
Its absolutely tactical and he's told to come for everything which constantly sees him running back etc.. His positioning isn't the best but its not terrible.

I don't blame him for the 1st goal at all. I blame Laporte for losing his man, Fernandinho for running into no mans land and Walker for not being able to look down a line.

3rd goal was shocking and simply a schoolboy error no top keeper should make. He maybe could have kept the 2nd one out too, its not a horror show but its the type of save the great keepers make and he simply rarely if ever does.
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Yeah you're probably right, he gets most of his runs off the line right and it must be tough to play that position with how high City's CBs are and their relative lack of pace. Ederson is a strange member of the current 'top keepers' club in that he's not an exceptional shot stopper, which is usually the base attribute for GK success nowadays. If City can get a settled backline next year for the first time in a while and stop being so susceptible to the counter I suspect he'll look much better than he did this past year.
 
ValenciasDrilledCrosses said:
Yeah you're probably right, he gets most of his runs off the line right and it must be tough to play that position with how high City's CBs are and their relative lack of pace. Ederson is a strange member of the current 'top keepers' club in that he's not an exceptional shot stopper, which is usually the base attribute for GK success nowadays. If City can get a settled backline next year for the first time in a while and stop being so susceptible to the counter I suspect he'll look much better than he did this past year.
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We'll never get a settled backline, dodgy and all as it is Pep ain't gonna change, we'll either outscore everyone and start winning again or keep getting mullered on the counter. Maybe I'm depressed after tonight but we've been found out this season. We has a soft centre and teams like you guys, Wolves, Lyon can run right through us at high pace and will beat us more often than not as long as you keep it tight. The blueprint has been well and truly shown this season and its down to Pep whether he adapts or gets more of the same. Ederson will be constantly left charging out covering CB's who are too high and themselves trying to mark 3 attackers between 2 of them.

That said we are the only team in the world where he would be considered a top keeper imho... in any other system under any other manager he's a good keeper but miles from being a top one.
 
A liability for them today, he's had a wreck of a season to be honest, I remember he gifted us two goals in the league, the one from Martial and the one from McTominay.
 
Dominos said:
I've seen some criticism for the first goal but I'm not sure what he's meant to do?

He's come off his line to close down the 1 on 1 as he can't just stay rooted to his line and pray his defender makes a last ditch challenge. The challenge is made and he's unfortunate he's in no man's land, he has to retreat and the finish is perfect, I don't think any keeper would be anywhere near saving that.

3rd goal is obviously a shocker though.
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He doesn't have to come out so far, Citys defender is in on the attacker.
All he has to do is narrow the angle with the angle the ball is being fought for.
When a player is through, like the 3rd goal, on his own then come rushing out. The attacker doesnt even get past the defender in the end up.
Its terrible decision making.
 
acnumber9 said:
The second goal isn’t being talked about much but it’s straight at him too. A keeper should be saving that one.
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but a 1v 1 you’re gambling as a keeper, in terms of where to put your limbs etc. It wasn’t straight at him ... Dembele tried to nutmeg him knowing/seeing he was about to try and spread frame in anticipation and got lucky. Almost an unexpected save.
 
BobbyManc said:
No he’s not. Ederson’s had a good season. Let’s not forget he’s in the team for his build-up and that’s been exceptional as always, and he’s still kept the most clean sheets and kept us in a few games. Hardly a bad season individually.
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I think it's a huge problem when the GKs best attribute is passing. Maybe that's an exaggeration but I don't think his season has been any better than DdG. At least DdG has a huge reservoir of bail outs for us that we can hope for a return to some semblance of that form. With Ederson is this more of him?
 
padr81 said:
2 Seasons? He was pretty good last season...
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I just don't think he's a very good goalkeeper. He's obviously very suitable for a pep team because of his ability with the ball at his feet but his actual goalkeeping is pretty average.
 
mav_9me said:
I think it's a huge problem when the GKs best attribute is passing. Maybe that's an exaggeration but I don't think his season has been any better than DdG. At least DdG has a huge reservoir of bail outs for us that we can hope for a return to some semblance of that form. With Ederson is this more of him?
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Comparing his season to de Gea’s is not even worth discussing.
It’s not a problem when his passing is the best in the world, if he was as good a keeper as he was a passer he’d be the best GK in history. Ederson has always just been a good, somewhat above average GK but with exceptional distribution. That’s perfect for City’s system. I wouldn’t swap him for someone like Oblak, even if Oblak is undoubtedly a level above Ederson in goal.
 
hasanejaz88 said:
I love how every commentator in England tries to make us believe he's one of the best keepers in the world. He has never, ever, been close to the top keepers in the world.

Just because he plays for City doesn't mean he's automatically one of the best.
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Yep and because he produces flashy passes.
 
BobbyManc said:
Comparing his season to de Gea’s is not even worth discussing.
It’s not a problem when his passing is the best in the world, if he was as good a keeper as he was a passer he’d be the best GK in history. Ederson has always just been a good, somewhat above average GK but with exceptional distribution. That’s perfect for City’s system. I wouldn’t swap him for someone like Oblak, even if Oblak is undoubtedly a level above Ederson in goal.
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Nobody presses you high anymore so what need is there for great distribution from your keeper?
Would you not want one who can make a save at this stage?
 
Liver_bird said:
He’s a good keeper but not a great one and the perception around his ability is inflated by the fact city dominate the ball against most PL sides. However you’ve also got to counter that with the fact playing in that system exposes him to higher quality chances than most keepers face.

City in general just seem to have players around the back that are good but make mistakes in pressure moments and good isn’t enough when you don’t fire at the other end.
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This. I really was looking forward to seeing how he would deal with he Bayern press.
 
De Gea (up until the last 2 years at least) Oblak, Neuer and perhaps Ter Stegen (yes, he was poor the other night), are goalkeepers currently playing who can hold a candle to the top keepers of 20-25 years ago. Heck, Italy as a nation, produced three or four prior to Buffon who were better than any current keeper playing today, other than the previously stated. I personally was a fan of Toldo. Anyway, I digress.

Yes, I know that this will make me sound nostalgic and horribly out of touch with modern tactics, but being very good at kicking the ball, yet average at saving it, just isn't for me. I maintain that Schmeichel was the best I've ever seen and yes, he was prone to the odd howler, but I find this current breed (again outside of the previously stated) to be an irritating bunch.
 
cyberman said:
Nobody presses you high anymore so what need is there for great distribution from your keeper?
Would you not want one who can make a save at this stage?
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Why do you think nobody presses us high (or at least do it far less)? It's because they've realised it's completely futile given Ederson's qualities, and his long-range passing actually makes it more dangerous to press in numbers. You've literally just proven why he is so valuable. Put Oblak in goal, and all of a sudden teams will start swarming on City because it's a new vulnerability.
 
He's not a massive improvement on Claudio Bravo or Willy Caballero in my opinion. Not sure why they spent so much on him.

I've have Willy out of those three any day.
 
BobbyManc said:
Why do you think nobody presses us high (or at least do it far less)? It's because they've realised it's completely futile given Ederson's qualities, and his long-range passing actually makes it more dangerous to press in numbers. You've literally just proven why he is so valuable. Put Oblak in goal, and all of a sudden teams will start swarming on City because it's a new vulnerability.
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Nobody really presses high anymore. DDG is terrible with the ball at his feet and nobody presses us. The modern press seems to be letting the opposition have it at the back then aggressively press through midfield.
Even then, teams know to sit back against you and hit you on the break. Its nothing to do with being worried about your keepers ball playing, its why you've lost a ridiculous amount of games this year.
Even by your logic its a false fallacy. You have keeper who cant use the attributes he has while he has to to rely on the area he is weak in.
Maybe get someone who is slightly less able with the ball at his feet but is a better shot stopper? It doesn't have to be all or nothing.
 
There might be something wrong with GK training methods at City: it's not the first keeper we see regressing his skills under Pep.
 
No other keeper can play the ball better than Ederson fair to say overall he didn't improve since he joined City. Their GK coach been there since Pellegrini but no keeper he worked with (Hart, Pantilimon, Willy, Bravo, Ederson) improved. More the opposite.
 
Since the start of last season.....

Errors leading to goal or chance:

Ederson - 7
De Gea - 4

Errors leading to a goal:

Ederson - 4
De Gea - 3

I look forward to Ederson's terrible form getting all the attention De Gea's has.
 
sullydnl said:
Since the start of last season.....

Errors leading to goal or chance:

Ederson - 7
De Gea - 4

Errors leading to a goal:

Ederson - 4
De Gea - 3

I look forward to Ederson's terrible form getting all the attention De Gea's has.
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As per my earlier posts in this thread. He is as fraudulent as Pickford.
 
sullydnl said:
Since the start of last season.....

Errors leading to goal or chance:

Ederson - 7
De Gea - 4

Errors leading to a goal:

Ederson - 4
De Gea - 3

I look forward to Ederson's terrible form getting all the attention De Gea's has.
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The difference is Ederson makes mistakes because he tries to dominate things, De Gea makes mistakes even while being conservative. He's very imposing in one-on-ones and obviously imposes himself in the build up and offside traps. Clearly worse in almost all aspects than Alisson, but he's still in that top bracket. De Gea's just not.
 
Kept us in the game today single handedly at times.
 
padr81 said:
Kept us in the game today single handedly at times.
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He did in the end. I think he is brainless at times in terms of his decision making, but he is a super athlete and his confidence appears to be unerring.

His head certainly doesn’t go down after a mistake. That sort of quality is invaluable with a keeper.
 
Maluco said:
He did in the end. I think he is brainless at times in terms of his decision making, but he is a super athlete and his confidence appears to be unerring.

His head certainly doesn’t go down after a mistake. That sort of quality is invaluable with a keeper.
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He switches off too much. He also rarely makes those kind of top saves, but he loses concentration too much. Its understandable when we are handing out whoopings but not when he's busy. For sure, unlike pickford for example, he's really good at shaking off an error or mistake.
 
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