Ederson - Atalanta Midfielder

[The Urban Goose]

“Communicated desire to make an offer”

That’s a new one

At least we skipped the "preparing to communicate a desire to make an offer" stage.

 

[aeh1991]

He is. I mentioned that I'd partner Ederson with a deep-lying playmaker but I doubt we'll get two midfielders.

For too long, we’ve lacked a midfielder who can dictate play from deep - something most top European sides have. Instead, our midfield has been filled with ball winners and runners, leaving us without that crucial composure in possession. That’s why, for me, a deep-lying playmaker should be the absolute priority.

I think Larsson and Ederson hve different qualities. Even if they share their optimal positions being B2B, I think Larsson is way better at build up and eventually more complete than Ederson. Also much younger, but still ready for the next step. I feel as if we'd lose another opportunity to get a great talent if we don't go for him.

 

[Marwood]

I really hate it, I want us to sign players that can dictate play and pass with volume, accuracy and some creativity. Why do we never seem to buy great ball playing midfielders?

It's a strange one for sure.

Signings might not work put bit we have tried all sorts of players.

Except CM's who can receive and pass the ball well.

It's no more evident than in the youth CM's who do and don't get given a chance.

 

[Gordon S]

Ederson seems like a versatile and wellrounded cm to me. He is good in defence and is a strong ballwiinner, and has decent vision and passing and overall good control of the ball. The type of player we need in midfield imo. As few big flaws as possible.

 

[abundance]

“Communicated desire to make an offer”

That’s a new one

Probably it's just a weird way to report about a step that's formally required in every transfer talk
(you're supposed to ask permission to the club before talking to a player that's under contract with them)

 

[Apokalips]

It’s not just who we buy but who we promote from youth. McTominay and Collyer both had/have more chances than the less physical but better footballers in Gomes and Garner. My two favourites to watch in the under 18s are Thwaites and Ibragimov but I fear they will have careers away from United whereas if they were from Barcelona they might already have first team action

It's a strange one for sure.

Signings might not work put bit we have tried all sorts of players.

Except CM's who can receive and pass the ball well.

It's no more evident than in the youth CM's who do and don't get given a chance.

I didn't even think about that but you're both right, I really hope we address this and bring in a couple of technical midfielders as I really miss seeing the passes the Scholes and Carrick could pull off, the way they could dictate proceedings and the way they (especially Scholesy) could take the sting out of a game when needed.

 

[funkhouser]

I've heard hes good but is he not more of a box to box midfielder?

Apparently Stiller is meant to be really good but he's not very dynamic from what I've heard.

I think Larsson can do a bit of both. Right now I think he’s more of a box to box midfielder but I can see him developing into a fine dlp. There were signs of those qualities during his second season with us, when he was 17 years old.

I think he’ll be quite expensive though.

 

[aeh1991]

I think Larsson can do a bit of both. Right now I think he’s more of a box to box midfielder but I can see him developing into a fine dlp. There were signs of those qualities during his second season with us, when he was 17 years old.

I think he’ll be quite expensive though.

Apparently available for something like €60m. I'd rather spend money on him than €50m on Quenda. Maybe we can also try selling Hojlund to them. He'd suit them.

 

[funkhouser]

Apparently available for something like €60m. I'd rather spend money on him than €50m on Quenda. Maybe we can also try selling Hojlund to them. He'd suit them.

Sounds like a good trade! Decent price either way. I would really like to see him at united. Malmös biggest talent since Zlatan, in my opinion.

 

[aeh1991]

Sounds like a good trade! Decent price either way. I would really like to see him at united. Malmös biggest talent since Zlatan, in my opinion.

Yes would be a great signing. It would allow us to play Bruno higher or them together and we'd have much more creativity.

 

[Freak]

Think Ederson would add some much needed physicality to our midfield but he will be expensive. An alternative could be Hackney from Middlesborough, who would suit the profile of players Ineos seem to be targetting.

Ugarte and Collyer for the defensive midfield role
Mainoo and Hackney for the B2B progressive midfield role
Sekou Kone to step up and be part of the mix too

 

[GueRed]

iirc Ederson was more of an attacking midfielder at Salernitana..
He has learnt to be a bit more disciplined at Atalanta and has transformed more into a box to box type.

Watched quite a bit of him in the last couple of years. I like him.
for someone unproven in the Premier League he might be a bit too expensive though.

 

[aeh1991]

Ederson seems like a versatile and wellrounded cm to me. He is good in defence and is a strong ballwiinner, and has decent vision and passing and overall good control of the ball. The type of player we need in midfield imo. As few big flaws as possible.

I rate him a bit differently. I agree that he's quite well rounded. However, he is not that fast and he lacks creativity and physique. A good rotational player for max. €30m, but not for €60m. I'd rather buy someone like Hugo Larsson for that money to plan long term.

 

[sherrinford]

I rate him a bit differently. I agree that he's quite well rounded. However, he is not that fast and he lacks creativity and physique. A good rotational player for max. €30m, but not for €60m. I'd rather buy someone like Hugo Larsson for that money to plan long term.

Ederson absolutely does not lack physique. A supreme athlete.

 

[JE-365]

I’m still 50:50 whether he will be the right signing.

But I notice that Amorim has started to deploy diamond structure where he wants one of his double pivot to play deep playmaker role (Bruno or sometime Casemiro because Casemiro lacks of mobility to play box to box) and one of his double pivot to play the box to box role (Ugarte). I think Ederson will suit the box to box role much more than Ugarte because Ederson has goal threat in him (scored 6 league goals last season and 3 league goals so far this season).

Ideally, Baleba would be my preference because he has great physicality (speed, strength, and duel) and better on the ball than Ederson. Despite of being 179cm, he has better aerial duel than Ederson. But we know Baleba is almost like unrealistic due to price tag.

 

[Wrecking ralf]

The only player I'd want over Ederson would be Stiller. His passing range is brilliant, is decent in the tackle, can carry the ball well too.

A little search shows that Stiller is slightly better than both Ederson and Larsson with progressive carries %, but his take on % is much higher.

Passing stats have their completed passes pretty close, but the amount attempted is much higher for Stiller in shirt, medium and long range passes with him being either 1st of 2nd best completion % in all ranges.

One area Stiller is lower is attempting shots, but he has more assists than the other 2 this season.

Defensive actions are in Edersons favour as he had attempted and won more challenges but the stats aren't a million miles away between all 3.

Summarising that, it seems to show 3 different players, with Stiller being the one I'd prefer given out midfield needs. Adding Ugarte to the mix shows he has better tackling stats than all 3. Attempting and completing more challenges. My opinion is adding Ederson to that midfield pairing while being formidable in a tackling sense, doesn't help us progress the ball ad much as we need. Yes bringing both in would be amazing but if we're limited to one, I think Stiller is the one that takes us to the next level. His passing range in the middle of the park as well as being able to progress the play and take a man on is something we don't have currently. Bruno has been moved further back to help, and done well, but he's not the type of player we need there in the long run, given his habit of losing possession.

We'd have that playmaker spraying passes with accuracy, progressing the play and being sound defensively so all the hard work isn't lumped onto Ugarte. Add into the mix that his value seems to be in the 50-60 mil range, I think it's a no brainer.

 

[aeh1991]

The only player I'd want over Ederson would be Stiller. His passing range is brilliant, is decent in the tackle, can carry the ball well too.

A little search shows that Stiller is slightly better than both Ederson and Larsson with progressive carries %, but his take on % is much higher.

Passing stats have their completed passes pretty close, but the amount attempted is much higher for Stiller in shirt, medium and long range passes with him being either 1st of 2nd best completion % in all ranges.

One area Stiller is lower is attempting shots, but he has more assists than the other 2 this season.

Defensive actions are in Edersons favour as he had attempted and won more challenges but the stats aren't a million miles away between all 3.

Summarising that, it seems to show 3 different players, with Stiller being the one I'd prefer given out midfield needs. Adding Ugarte to the mix shows he has better tackling stats than all 3. Attempting and completing more challenges. My opinion is adding Ederson to that midfield pairing while being formidable in a tackling sense, doesn't help us progress the ball ad much as we need. Yes bringing both in would be amazing but if we're limited to one, I think Stiller is the one that takes us to the next level. His passing range in the middle of the park as well as being able to progress the play and take a man on is something we don't have currently. Bruno has been moved further back to help, and done well, but he's not the type of player we need there in the long run, given his habit of losing possession.

We'd have that playmaker spraying passes with accuracy, progressing the play and being sound defensively so all the hard work isn't lumped onto Ugarte. Add into the mix that his value seems to be in the 50-60 mil range, I think it's a no brainer.

Sounds promising but isn't Stiller the slowest of the three? I am still unsure if he'd cope with the pace here.

 

[Wrecking ralf]

Sounds promising but isn't Stiller the slowest of the three? I am still unsure if he'd cope with the pace here.

Yeah slightly slower, but ive always preferred positioning and work rate over top speed. The Bundesliga stats show he covers more ground than Larsson and also wins more aerial duels. So he'd be able to make up for the lack of pure speed by being in the right position and not having to chase back. Given the fact Amorim wants us to press as a unit too, and the fact we have 3 defenders and Ugarte potentially behind him, he'd be covered without needing to be involved in a foot race.

I couldn't find the overall distance covered for Ederson but I'd imagine its higher than Stiller and Larsson given the player he is. My feeling is we have runners in Ugarte and Collyer so it's not exactly leg work that we're needing in out midfield.

 

[didz]

iirc Ederson was more of an attacking midfielder at Salernitana..
He has learnt to be a bit more disciplined at Atalanta and has transformed more into a box to box type.

Watched quite a bit of him in the last couple of years. I like him.
for someone unproven in the Premier League he might be a bit too expensive though.

Bit like Herrera, who Ederson kind of reminds me of a little.

 

[Gordon S]

I rate him a bit differently. I agree that he's quite well rounded. However, he is not that fast and he lacks creativity and physique. A good rotational player for max. €30m, but not for €60m. I'd rather buy someone like Hugo Larsson for that money to plan long term.

I think Hugo is an interesting player i hope we have on our radar, but i don’t see him as faster, stronger and more creative than Ederson.

 

[aeh1991]

I think Hugo is an interesting player i hope we have on our radar, but i don’t see him as faster, stronger and more creative than Ederson.

In my opinion, he's more agile and more creative than Ederson. He could be moulded into a DLP. Also 6 years younger than the Brazilian.

 

[DJ_21]

I think Hugo is an interesting player i hope we have on our radar, but i don’t see him as faster, stronger and more creative than Ederson.

Are we looking for creativity in this type of player? If the plan is to play Bruno CM then we need someone similar to Ugarte who can cover and replace Casemiro. Bruno can be the creative cm but then we also need tons of creativity from our AMs and wing backs.

 

[gajender]

Are we looking for creativity in this type of player? If the plan is to play Bruno CM then we need someone similar to Ugarte who can cover and replace Casemiro. Bruno can be the creative cm but then we also need tons of creativity from our AMs and wing backs.

I don't believe anything is set in stone with Amorim at the moment , depending on how we progress as a team by end of the season what we need can change drastically .

 

[Gordon S]

Are we looking for creativity in this type of player? If the plan is to play Bruno CM then we need someone similar to Ugarte who can cover and replace Casemiro. Bruno can be the creative cm but then we also need tons of creativity from our AMs and wing backs.

Creativity is probably not the most important part for this player, but certainly not unimportant either. We can see what difference it makes when we have two out of Casemiro, Eriksen and Bruno there, it makes a difference to our attacking play. Ederson seems to be comfortable enough going forward to not force Bruno to carry all the creative responsibilty by himself.

 

[jesperjaap]

Functional team player that would be over priced and not really improve us personally, think he is decent but not cheap and doesnt progress us for the value

 

[Kingslayer18]

Functional team player that would be over priced and not really improve us personally, think he is decent but not cheap and doesnt progress us for the value

I think he’s better than a functional team player. He’s an elite B2B midfielder, becomes our best midfielder at a drop. Other top tier clubs are looking at him, and it is widely accepted he will leave Atalanta in the summer. However I don’t know if Amorim is looking for a B2B player next to Ugarte or a deep lying playmaker. If we’re loooking for a DLP, then he’s not the best fit but as a 2way player in midfield, not much better that are attainable.