New guy has a free hit, at least its only 9 games into the league. OK it should have been done earlier. New guy I'm hoping can get this lot on the training ground and get some sort of shape out of them.
Does anyone have doubts that a new manager will be able to fix this?
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We’ve been burned far too many times for me to have genuine confidence in whoever we bring in - even if they are are the most highly sought in the game, like Amorim.
I’m hopeful, but that’s truly it. Despite our atrocious start to the season, I still believe we conducted ourselves well in the transfer window. I’m positive De Ligt will succeed and money spent on him represents far better value than £70m on the likes of Branthwaite.
If we can continue to act like a big club, not get bullied in the market and make more shrewd moves, supplemented by a competent manager, then we can possibly turn this around.
Who knows though? Could just be more of the same old shit.
I’m hopeful, but that’s truly it. Despite our atrocious start to the season, I still believe we conducted ourselves well in the transfer window. I’m positive De Ligt will succeed and money spent on him represents far better value than £70m on the likes of Branthwaite.
If we can continue to act like a big club, not get bullied in the market and make more shrewd moves, supplemented by a competent manager, then we can possibly turn this around.
Who knows though? Could just be more of the same old shit.
If Rashford is a mainstay again…he’s toast in time…
I have little doubt that the new manager will oversee better performances from the team.
I don't know if a new manager can fix the club, but I know that someday we'll stumble on someone who will.
We need to accept that it's ok to go through several managers to find someone suitable. Football isn't like any other business where things work if you hire the right people. There's a massive humane element. I could be having a bad day at work with a shitty manager and still get shit done. Footballers need much more than that, and a manager could succeed with a group of players and fail with another.
In that sense I feel that hiring ETH wasn't a bad decision at the time, same with Mourinho and Van gaal. We went with good managers who succeeded with other clubs. Our mistake was our inability to realize that it wasn't working early enough. All the top clubs go through good managers, but they rarely have the patience we seem to have. With Amorim it seems that we've made a really good decision, but we need to set high expectations with him. We need to see better performances, and we need to see players improving. Good managers get the best out of the available players. And of course we'll back him, but we can't be going into next season wishing for a top 6 finish.
We need to accept that it's ok to go through several managers to find someone suitable. Football isn't like any other business where things work if you hire the right people. There's a massive humane element. I could be having a bad day at work with a shitty manager and still get shit done. Footballers need much more than that, and a manager could succeed with a group of players and fail with another.
In that sense I feel that hiring ETH wasn't a bad decision at the time, same with Mourinho and Van gaal. We went with good managers who succeeded with other clubs. Our mistake was our inability to realize that it wasn't working early enough. All the top clubs go through good managers, but they rarely have the patience we seem to have. With Amorim it seems that we've made a really good decision, but we need to set high expectations with him. We need to see better performances, and we need to see players improving. Good managers get the best out of the available players. And of course we'll back him, but we can't be going into next season wishing for a top 6 finish.
History tells us that someday a man will come to the club and make it successful again. It happened with Sir Matt and Sir Alex. Will it be Ruben? Who on earth knows.
I definitely am.
The interesting thing I picked up from the ETH announcement was he was listed as "First Team Manager", whilst Ruud van Nistelrooy was listed as "Interim Head Coach". If we wasn't at that stage already, we're officially away from a Sir Matt Busby or Sir Alex Ferguson type that manages the whole club and using the modern system of a Head Coach and then all of the back office, Technical Director and Head of Sports types sort out player recruitment and retention amongst other things. It will certainly be of interest what position Ruben Amorim is given when the appointment takes place. I suspect it will be First Team Head Coach or something along those lines.
The remainder of this season is a free hit for Ruben's Reds. He's coming in three months into a season to a coaching set up that he's unlikely to make mass change to until the summer. I cannot foresee there being mass layoff's for the coaching staff, perhaps one or two but no complete overhaul immediately. Then there's the playing squad. Lets be honest here, it's not very good. You've got a real mixture of a playing squad to work with. You've clearly got some talent amongst it but you've also got players plagued by injury (Shaw, Malacia, Martinez, Mount), players that have suffered with form (Rashford, Antony, Onana, Dalot) and a mix of younger players with potential that need to realise their potential (Hojlund, Zirkzee, Diallo, Mainoo). We spent big in the summer on Yoro, Zirkzee, Mazraoui, De Ligt and Ugarte and the January transfer window really isn't that active, I cannot see us making any permanent transfers in January and so, Amorim has to work with what he has got. In some ways and I don't want to sound like I am backing ETH or wanted him to stay but in some ways, we're just going over old ground in the sense that this Manchester United team needs quality injected into it and a number of players to be offloaded, which we have found hard in the past. We need the likes of Brailsford and Wilcox to deliver a team that suits the manager, this time Amorim and his preferred tactic, 3-4-3. I'm not sure presently how suitable some of our players are for that system but we've got the rest of this season to find out.
The interesting thing I picked up from the ETH announcement was he was listed as "First Team Manager", whilst Ruud van Nistelrooy was listed as "Interim Head Coach". If we wasn't at that stage already, we're officially away from a Sir Matt Busby or Sir Alex Ferguson type that manages the whole club and using the modern system of a Head Coach and then all of the back office, Technical Director and Head of Sports types sort out player recruitment and retention amongst other things. It will certainly be of interest what position Ruben Amorim is given when the appointment takes place. I suspect it will be First Team Head Coach or something along those lines.
The remainder of this season is a free hit for Ruben's Reds. He's coming in three months into a season to a coaching set up that he's unlikely to make mass change to until the summer. I cannot foresee there being mass layoff's for the coaching staff, perhaps one or two but no complete overhaul immediately. Then there's the playing squad. Lets be honest here, it's not very good. You've got a real mixture of a playing squad to work with. You've clearly got some talent amongst it but you've also got players plagued by injury (Shaw, Malacia, Martinez, Mount), players that have suffered with form (Rashford, Antony, Onana, Dalot) and a mix of younger players with potential that need to realise their potential (Hojlund, Zirkzee, Diallo, Mainoo). We spent big in the summer on Yoro, Zirkzee, Mazraoui, De Ligt and Ugarte and the January transfer window really isn't that active, I cannot see us making any permanent transfers in January and so, Amorim has to work with what he has got. In some ways and I don't want to sound like I am backing ETH or wanted him to stay but in some ways, we're just going over old ground in the sense that this Manchester United team needs quality injected into it and a number of players to be offloaded, which we have found hard in the past. We need the likes of Brailsford and Wilcox to deliver a team that suits the manager, this time Amorim and his preferred tactic, 3-4-3. I'm not sure presently how suitable some of our players are for that system but we've got the rest of this season to find out.
As long as he is his own man and doesnt think he has to pick Rashford/Bruno because they are big names at the club, for example, we might be alright.
No way. The issue was always the manager, at least partially. Rangnick was a complete mess, he isn't a coach material. Solskjaer ditto. They simply don't have the personality to coach a big team. LvG's bad attitude didn't help either, he seemed tired of coaching anyway. Jose... He has waaaaay to big ego, he just couldn't keep up with the time. He couldn't comprehend that times are changing, he has to deal with the top players differently. Although he at least noticed what's wrong with the squad, or certain players. And then ten Hag. Firstly, he is completely clueless, apparently he knows only one formation which worked with Ajax but he didn't notice that he has different players now. Also the way he dealt with Sancho who became one of Chelsea's best players was ridiculous. Not to mention the scrap players he brought to the club so he was a disaster on many levels. Under his tenure the club spent about 300-400 million of his preferred players to be 14th on the table. Why partially then? Because with players like Rashford (Amad, Zirkzee, Malacia, Lindelöf, Maguire, Antony and so on) no manager will be able to create a top team out of United. The club has bad culture. I remember Jose told in an interview that he wanted to get rid of 3 players but he could not. One of them was Rashford who's apparently the "holy cow" of United, regardless of his poor form, bad attitude, poor performances ha has to play. Horrible. So I don't expect too much from Amorim (or anyone who arrives) this season as the squad if full of scrap, if this squad worth 860 million i'll eat my hat for sure.
How can anyone not have doubts at this point?
If not this one, then the next one. If not that one, then the next one after that surely?
More seriously, this is the first appointment of the new regime. Will be very interested to see how it works.
More seriously, this is the first appointment of the new regime. Will be very interested to see how it works.
There’s no sure things in life however surely we can’t get worse than the last 18 months, stylistically and with results on the pitch.
The bar right now is as low as it could be so there will be minimal pressure on Ruben Amorin, however we must remember he’s unproven in the PL, how will he cope with PL intensity, will he make substitutes in game that change the result, what is his man management skills like, how good is English(pretty sure it’s almost A1) but all these areas of his management skills will be under intense scrutiny?
The bar right now is as low as it could be so there will be minimal pressure on Ruben Amorin, however we must remember he’s unproven in the PL, how will he cope with PL intensity, will he make substitutes in game that change the result, what is his man management skills like, how good is English(pretty sure it’s almost A1) but all these areas of his management skills will be under intense scrutiny?
I think whoever the new manager is should start by instillng a mentally in the way(hate to say it) klopp did at lfc,ie a togetherness,if you listen to former players they all refer to utd as"we" even the likes of Keane,Beckham stam rvn who were booted out of utd do,there ain't much he can do in January because they allowed ETH to behave like a kid in a sweet shop buying ex ajax players so start with the basics and move on from there.
I am sure we will bounce back under the new manager, with some players suddenly finding form. But do I have confidence in us getting back to the top over coming years? No.
Unfortunately ETH has filled the squad with even more deadwood and average players, once again Amorim will need to be given £500m over the next 3-4 windows to rebuild the team. If we can focus on bringing more young players the calibre of Yoro then maybe Amorim has a chance where others failed.
I think we need to wait and see how much "deadwood" there really is. We've seen it before - players looking terrible only to suddenly find some good form with a new manager. I wouldn't be surprised to see a couple of players do that kind of thing under Amorim, if his coaching actually pans out that is
They really can
I think a new manager will. I think EtH suffered the fate of essentially what was the last of the failed board-level leadership post SAF - the Glazers plus Ed/Arnold - who were all staggeringly clueless.
Ineos will be way more competent (feck it, many on here would be), the signings going forward should essentially be of much better quality/fit (tactics, skill and culture wise)- with minimal input/influence from the manager, who should just get on with coaching.
Ineos will be way more competent (feck it, many on here would be), the signings going forward should essentially be of much better quality/fit (tactics, skill and culture wise)- with minimal input/influence from the manager, who should just get on with coaching.
Yes of course there are huge doubts, if it’s Amourin hes a gamble, completely untested at this level and can he cope with the burden of the poison chalice.
If all injuries would magically go away and the rotten attitude shown by some players would disappear, then I might be optimistic. Most of the permanent managers post Fergie had merit, and at the time I felt they were the right option for us. I understand why the club wants Amorim to lead the team, but he has to deal with a lot of background stuff too. The last ten years have been one horror show after another. I'm not confident, at all. So hopefully I can only be positively surprised. But... It's clear to all that we (yet again) need:
Same players and I really don't expect much more than hovering around mid table unless the players learn to not shit themselves when they have chances to score.
I really hope to be proven wrong.
I really hope to be proven wrong.
Yep exactly that. Mount, Antony, Zirkzee will all need to be offloaded. And I don’t think Martinez and De Ligt can play in a high line.
It’s gonna be a painful process and im not expecting CL qualification for the next two seasons so in that sense yeah there are doubts. But im much happier going forward with Amorim than I was with Ten Haag in the summer of 22. For me his Cv is better.
I'm very happy with the appointment of Amorim, and I'm excited to see what he brings to the table. That being said, I'm also incredibly worried that we still have the same players in the squad that have seen 5 and now 6 different managers (it won't be difficult for you to work out who I'm talking about) and they are what I consider to be the deep rooted, toxic issue with this club. This certain player has been through all of these managers and is still here, thriving, and is the highest paid. He has a massive part to play in the dressing room and I genuinely believe that his voice is incredibly respected and valued, as it should be for a player of his experience at the club, but with that comes a power that hinders the club.
This player has to be removed from the club if we want to progress and push on to the likes of Pool and Arsenal. He HAS to be sold. Along with the other face that has been here for 5 managers tenures. I won't name these players, I think it's pretty easy to decipher who they are.
This player has to be removed from the club if we want to progress and push on to the likes of Pool and Arsenal. He HAS to be sold. Along with the other face that has been here for 5 managers tenures. I won't name these players, I think it's pretty easy to decipher who they are.
There are no guarantees whichever manager comes in but INEOS has setup a solid foundation by bringing in better personnel in the administration and changing the structure, we also have a young core group of players in Yoro, Mainoo, Ugarte (not that young but young enough), Garnacho, Amad and a couple of others who can be used as the backbone to build the team upon. I feel the quality of our players and bench has also improved compared to our previous managers.
I just hope the new manager doesn't continue making the same mistakes as Ten Hag did, such as giving some underperforming players a longer leash than others, trying to force tactics that clearly don't work, etc.
I just hope the new manager doesn't continue making the same mistakes as Ten Hag did, such as giving some underperforming players a longer leash than others, trying to force tactics that clearly don't work, etc.
Mourinho not world class ? Have a day off mate
LVG too
Ole, yeah, a disaster waiting to happen with him
Mourinho has been world class yes, i stated he was in decline.
Was he world class when we hired him? Absolutely not. Was he an appointment that was always going to end in disaster? Absolutely.
LVG was a veteran of the management game when we hired him - his best years long gone.
We hired the name, not based on current managerial ability.
Anyone not having doubts is mad, call me pessimistic if you want but I don't think we'll win anything big with Amorim. He seems to be the next big thing, but so was ten Hag. This club is rotten and there are many fixes needed before competing again one manager is not going to suddenly turns us into a great team.
Correct.