This is what I don’t get - Bissouma plays more like Fred than Rice.
no one is really picking a player that plays like Casemiro or Marquinhos for example.
Declan Rice
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This is what I don’t get - Bissouma plays more like Fred than Rice.
no one is really picking a player that plays like Casemiro or Marquinhos for example.
Sure but whats stopping Rice from picking it up from the cb's and sending it out to the wing? When Sterling gets crowded out on one wing whats stopping Rice from making himself available for a pass to quickly switch play to the other wing, rather than having to go back to your cb's or keeper at which point its not so much switching play as building your attack back up from scratch? Like its a good excuse for Mount to be isolated and not have as much impact as Sterling but it doesn't cut it for the deepest midfielder.
You could say the manager instructed a midfielder to actively avoid touching the ball but that sounds completely mental, so i just dont believe it happened
I don’t know the reason for that, I suspect tactical. The reason I say tactical is because I’ve seen him play long especially left to right at WH
I would agree with that, if we get Rice we probably wont win the league either, a Rennes fan has posted he doesnt think he is ready yet for a full year of EPL. I think the Caf would lose its mind though if we bought Camavinga and he only played 10 games.
Camavinga is 18. I think he looks a special talent so would be absolutely delighted with us signing him but of course we have to be patient.
I think Rice is perfect for United, but everything above £60-70m is madness.
£90m and above should be reserved top tier players (A) or exceptional talent (B). Rice is neither A or B.
Rice possibly enter category A in a couple of years, but it’s also a fair chance Rice ends up on today’s level and becomes a new Henderson or Dier. Good players, but not exactly top tier.
£90m and above should be reserved top tier players (A) or exceptional talent (B). Rice is neither A or B.
Rice possibly enter category A in a couple of years, but it’s also a fair chance Rice ends up on today’s level and becomes a new Henderson or Dier. Good players, but not exactly top tier.
Except they are not easily passable as Fred. They are more sound defensive in front of the back four, which is exactly what we wished Fred was.
But Bissouma doesn’t play in front of the back 4 - he is completely all over the place.
Henderson was crucial to Liverpool’s recent successes
but not as crucial as Mane, Salah and VvD
No but crucial none the less to how they play
agreed despite him being very one dimensional. So would you pay the 70m or whatever price is set for Rice?
Yes.. People often underrate player like Henderson (not me
), but he isn’t a £90m player.Probably not 70m but I’d go to 60m in value of cash + player(s). Would WH take Matic & Lingard for example
60m plus Matic would be acceptable but i don't think Moyes would want Matic. I think if Lingard becomes part of the deal than the initial figure should drop to 45m plus Lingard
Unless we fail to sign Camavinga while West Ham is willing to lower their asking price to around 40m. I just don't see why we would go for Rice at all.
Remember, it took us 2 long years to negotiate price for Sancho from 105m to 73m. Rice at 90m this summer would be completely out of question. But we may still sign him for 40m or less, in 2 or 3 years time.
Remember, it took us 2 long years to negotiate price for Sancho from 105m to 73m. Rice at 90m this summer would be completely out of question. But we may still sign him for 40m or less, in 2 or 3 years time.
For people like me, no. For me to consign Fred or Mctominay to the bench you need to be a significant upgrade. Especially on their strength's whilst having none of their weaknesses.
Would Rice start for Brazil in this Copa America? It’s an interesting thought experiment.
Almost every result there bar 1 was down to our serious compatibility issue sat center half. Having a Rice would not have changed any of those results for the better. For only one of those results happened as a direct consequence of a midfield error....
There is hardly anything between those two. The most damning stat is the through balls attempted. Between the two of them only 1 attempted. Based on this I don't think Dice is the answer at all.
Reclan Dice has many great attributes, but the one I like is the instant chemistry he has with Marry Haguire. He instinctively drops in when Haguire carries the ball forward, like they've playing in same team forever. You can see Haguire is comfortable knowing he has that cover when he breaks forward.His price is obviously an issue, would be great if we could get Hest Wam to drop their price.
Exactly there are lots of small upsides to it
If you adjust for minutes played, the stats may actually move in favour of McT in some cases. This is one situation where the eyeball test seems to have been correct - not much between these two.
feck me we had poster after poster after poster here last season screaming blue murder for Matic doing exactly that. It’s the very basics of a DM.
Nobody had any issue with Matic dropping into the defence when it was needed. The issue is he did it way too much and made it pretty much impossible to get any kind of control with our midfield.
I have no idea how Rice compares in that regard though.
Matic dropped deep but he didn't track runners or get back and make last ditch tackles, that's where his game differs from Rice's. Rice when he drops deep is serving a purpose as in letting Maguire carry the ball forward, Matic was just there anyway. He essentially played as a 3rd centre back creating that large gap between mid and attack that appears when he plays.
Yeah I would rather do that as well but think the club see our midfield conundrum very differently to the fanbase
Do think people under estimate RIce and the progression he has made the last two years and is continuing to make. I think people are mad not seeign him as an uogade on McTominay, he is a far better player.
I am not saying he is the best central midfielder we could sign as there are loads of potential talented options we could target. In terms of signing someone who could slot straight in, understands the league, understands the size of our club and history and would probably be very positie as a character in the dressing room, he is the best option for me.....the important factory though is £80-100m is both too high in itself as a fee and also too high in allowing us to sign a central defender as well this summer, that is why we shouldnt sign him, maybe even if there are significant outgoings. But he would be an excellent signing I feel forgetting the fee
I am not saying he is the best central midfielder we could sign as there are loads of potential talented options we could target. In terms of signing someone who could slot straight in, understands the league, understands the size of our club and history and would probably be very positie as a character in the dressing room, he is the best option for me.....the important factory though is £80-100m is both too high in itself as a fee and also too high in allowing us to sign a central defender as well this summer, that is why we shouldnt sign him, maybe even if there are significant outgoings. But he would be an excellent signing I feel forgetting the fee
It’s just his insane price tag, plus other available options in the market. Let’s say even if West Ham lower their demand significantly to around 40m, I’d still prefer to buy Camavinga or Locatelli as they are simply better footballer.
Almost certainly thought Mount and Rice are very close friends from their time together at Chelsea academy.
He seems close to Shaw and Maguire, though.
If Chelsea gets a 60m bid agreed, I am sure we will match it with Lingard as makeweight.
Is Dice a 60m player? He is not but we got more points per game with Matic in the lineup than without.
Camavinga has a higher ceiling than Rice.
Rice has a higher floor than Cama.
For United.
Depends on what do you value more. As this United team matures, higher floor allows us to maintain more consistency.
Camavinga of course.
The only scenario where I might prefer Rice, is when we decide to extend Pogba contract and play Rice to support Pogba and Bruno, while at the same time we could get him for reasonable price (around 40-50m max). We just need him to sit back and defend, and let Pogba and Bruno do their magic while covering their ass behind. I mean, in case Pogba causally loss the ball in midfield trying out some outrageous, we just need to make sure Rice is there to win the ball back and pass it to the teammates standing next to him. That’s all he is worthy to go for.
In every other scenario though, Camavinga would be my first choice all day all night. He is far more talented and all rounded footballer, with far higher ceiling, and he is younger and cheaper too.
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In theory that should be it, but in reality for us anyway, Bruno and Pogba both go missing for large parts of games, especially in big ones. Often times a great pass or goal will mask a game they've been relatively quiet in. We need another mid who can cover them, as we know both will give the ball away, but we also need that mid to be somewhat comfortable on the ball and to step up when they drift out of games. Haven't seen Camavinga play so can't comment on him, but it sounds like from your analysis, he has a bit if everything. I actually think Rice is better on the ball than most give him credit for, but is it good enough for us to make us better/challenge for league and is it worth the fee his club will want.
Yes. We have Fred and Paqueta to play along Casemiro. The latter is class the other two just good.
Fred and Paqueta (Paqueta scoring a few even) are not having a bad tournament, but is far from being great.
You’d play Casemiro and Rice together, exciting. Wow, you sure you’re Brazilian?
Whenever I see him play I'm never really that impressed. Seems like a more reliable version of playing Scott at DM, that would cost probably like 80m.
I've never understood our supposed interest in him, l think he is very overrated. If he wasn't relatively young and English I honestly don't think we would be interested.
If that meant we wouldn't play Richarlison and Jesus because they track back like crazy allowing more freedom on the attack, sure.
Man, we won championships with Paulinho and Renato Augusto as first choices. In 94 we had Romário and Bebeto in front of non exciting players. The 70 and 82 teams are outliers, Brazil always had an insane amount of attacking talent supported by incredibly restricted players in midfield that allowed the talent to flourish.
OH, have you watched the Copa America?
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