I’d love him here and mount. And kane. It’s felt like city have been sweeping up english talent in recent years. All three have great mentality and are good players with it.
Declan Rice | signs for arsenal
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What? Rodri is fantastic.
If we're getting both Rice and Mount, Mount wouldn't even be a starter. Seems strange to spend so much money on a squad option.
I'd disagree, it usually takes a year to get integrated by Pep in to City's team, Haaland being th
Well we've seen how good Cas is in forward positions, a player like Rice allows for flexibility, Cas is still the DM but Rice covers when he goes forward, there's been a lot of talk in the past that Rice could be a CB in the making, might be a useful cover for Varane when Maguire leaves
He's one of the best midfielders in the world. In a current All Time team - he and De Bruyne are almost guarantees.
Casemiro was noticable in forward positions how often? And please do not count set pieces. What you say is not wrong though. But if we want to add creativity, just bring in a player whose skillset is applicable. I mean, I get it, many people like Rice. He is good, but splashing 100 million on somebody who mostly plays where Casemiro plays, who has been bought just a year ago for another 60 million, isn't smart business at all. Should have went for Rice last summer then if he is so much liked around the decision makers in our club. Really hope, this is just a bullshit rumor - it is as if Woody never went away. And he is executing the Ole's british core strategy... Won't be long until folks will ask the club to pay 35 million to bring in Pickford next.
Sometimes, you just have to live with your decisions - we made a decision to bring in Casemiro for the DM spot. Now live with it. We did just another idiotic move a last summer ending up with two "promising" RW being bought in 2 consecutive years for a grand total of more than 160 million. Doing it like this, a rebuild will never finish.
So who should we buy to play in midfield? It’s like you don’t want us to buy a midfielder by your logic. Rice is a 6/8. Which is what we need.
What do you think De Jong is a 10?
Pushing Casemiro forward during build-up phases should be the move, but I don't know if Declan Rice is the man you want dropping deepest in midfield.
Him and Casemiro are similar archetypes of a player. Rice is a much better ball carrier than Casemiro, but he's also worse defensively in every aspect.
If we sign him, I hope he's a success, but I just don't rate him that highly. I think a top 4 team is his level(which is what we are), but I don't think he's good enough for a team challenging for major honors.
Him and Casemiro are similar archetypes of a player. Rice is a much better ball carrier than Casemiro, but he's also worse defensively in every aspect.
If we sign him, I hope he's a success, but I just don't rate him that highly. I think a top 4 team is his level(which is what we are), but I don't think he's good enough for a team challenging for major honors.
Exactly, it isn’t just as a midfielder that Rice helps with as he can play centre back too and ETH is known to love versatility in his players.
In signing Rice we have a partner for Casemiro, a replacement for Casemiro, a cover centre back and a leader on the pitch which is something we’ve lacked in the squad for years.
Sounds as if 100 million Rise is the only possible solution, isn't it?
I think, we talked in the Kane thread as well. Spunking such a huge amount on one player would be bonkers in my eyes, in our situation. If we have to, do it for Rice instead of Kane but it still isn't a great idea. I'd try to bring in 2 midfielder as of now. A first team player as casemiro partner and a deputy for Casemiro. Best case scenario, is that the deputy is an up and coming talent where the scouts think, he has the potential to take over from Casemiro in one or two years. As I said, when we comitted to Casemiro last year, we comitted to him - splashing one year later on Rice wouldn't be smart. Should have went for him then last summer. I'd take Neves over him plus have some of the cash to go for Caqueret or Bennacer or something of that ilk.
We have not one like for like replacement for our 1st team midfield. As soon as one is out, we have to change the plan because the bench options skillsets differ so much from the 1st teamers. Thats what we should adress. Understand though, that bringing in an exciting young player is more pleasing to the eye but right now, I'd do percentage play. And two players are better than one. Where is all the money coming from anyways? I mean, people want to us to get a striker for 100 million. There will be sales but you cant seriously want to spunk all that on only 2 players?
100m is too much for Rice, but while there is a tendency of too much optimism around player sales, I feel this summer there is some tradable value in some of the players we potentially could pass on: Maguire (or Lindelöf), McTominay (maybe Fred), Henderson, Donny, Martial, Telles, Williams, Bailly (well, not him), Pellistri, Elanga and maybe some of the graduates Laird, McNeill, Fish, Kovar, Savage, Bernard, Hugill, Shoretire ++.
Rice+Kane+Min-jae is doable for around 250.
Yeah, I can't think of a better one for the role he plays.
Regarding Rice, he may not be exactly what we need but I can't imagine he wouldn't improve us a lot. Always liked him. And his versatility would be quite valuable. Just the question of price really.
3 Players for 250 million? And whats with the goalkeeper? If we spend so much, I'd want to see at least 4 players, better 5.
We are coming from far behind. Improving on existing players is a) not a great metric for quality and b) can surely done in a way that forces us to spend so big on single players.
That's not necessarily my wish-list, but I won't rule out the possibility of that being the list, and I'd be quite happy with it. If De Gea signs a new contract, I don't think we'll spend much on a keeper. Maybe Mount and Sabitizer instead of Rice, that makes it 4. Frankly, I think I'd prefer Rice. We need some real quality, we already have the numbers.
Yes but I think the idea was for Fred to be a starter when we signed him. Tbf he actually was a starter for a long time, just not a very reliable onewe spent 50m on Fred
Fred was bought as a starter, he's one of the strangest players I've seen, he's either brilliant or absolutely terrible, he doesn't seem to have anything in between, it's always one or the other
But we want to get rid of the numbers aren't we? I'll happily agree, that I'd prefer Rice to Sabitzer or Mount (don't know too much about him lately) or all our subs right now - but not just because of quality, but because he is stylistically able to switch with Casemiro if necessary. A like for like if you will. We don't have that right now at all, which means, that as soon as one of Bruno-Eriksen-Casemiro is gone, the little bit of play we have, desintegrates even more.
Good to see that Rice is all things to all people, a veritable Rohrshach test.
And if no one had to Google that to see what it is they're lying!
United have to be able to find players of similar talent and a higher potential, for less.
Is United able to offload so many players and generate that much money for transfers?
Rice is a good player, but my goodness...Rice and Mount for 120M+ is criminal.
Would rather do Lavia, Mount, and Rabiot for half that.
Still think United are being used as they are, to drive up the price, wages, and noise. Rice will remain in London, possibly at Arsenal or of course Chelsea.
Is United able to offload so many players and generate that much money for transfers?
Rice is a good player, but my goodness...Rice and Mount for 120M+ is criminal.
Would rather do Lavia, Mount, and Rabiot for half that.
Still think United are being used as they are, to drive up the price, wages, and noise. Rice will remain in London, possibly at Arsenal or of course Chelsea.
The operative words are Mount and criminal!
Given how cash strapped European football is and how cash soaked the PL is, going after the star players of mid table premier league clubs seems like the best way to lose money on transfers. West Hams biggest player, captain and an England International? Whatever he's worth, we'd be charged triple.
Out of the English trio we've been linked with he'd be the best signing of the lot. Rice I'm quite confident in saying will live up to expectations and will be here for a long time if signed. The other two have question marks.
The biggest issue with him as its been for the last few years is his price. Rice at £100m is just a ridiculous use of a limited budget.
The Rice and Casemiro pairing actually makes sense, it gives us more legs in midfield and Rice's ability to drive forward with the ball is something desperately missing in our team.
The short passing could use work but if Arteta wants him that bad, he obviously has a lot to offer there or can be developed to improve there.
The biggest issue with him as its been for the last few years is his price. Rice at £100m is just a ridiculous use of a limited budget.
The Rice and Casemiro pairing actually makes sense, it gives us more legs in midfield and Rice's ability to drive forward with the ball is something desperately missing in our team.
The short passing could use work but if Arteta wants him that bad, he obviously has a lot to offer there or can be developed to improve there.
He is arguably the best DM in the world this season….
Very strange opinion. He's been one of their best players this season.
I hope not. Ive watched him olay for eng and west ham. Hes afraid of the ball when theres traffic
He can be both a partner and a deputy for Casemiro. The problem is the price, him being English and us being United, he will cost too much. If we can afford Kane and Costa, then yea, go for him. If not then go for Rabiot on a free and Lavia as understudy for Cas.
Are you sure that was West Ham and not Villa or Burnley you were watching?
Attribute wise, Rice is a fantastic player. He is strong physically and a force in battles. He can cover a long distance over 90. He has a bit heavy step, but isn’t exactly immobile and he is definitely a factor in aerial duals. He got a really good passing foot and there is nothing wrong with his ball handling.
The big downside from my point of view that he is 24 y/o and have not played a be single game in his life for a team that even remotely want to play like ETH wants his team to play. England tried to play up from the back a few times against Italy. It was so obvious that Southgate had done some soul searching after the WC and went OK let’s try this new thing. Italy has a very flat press. The involved players where Pickford, Shaw, Maguire, Stones, Walker and Rice. It wasn’t pretty.
Brighton is one of the best teams in the world at passing up from the back. Graham Potter beat Arsenal away with Swedish fairytale team Östersund, they also played the pants off Herta Berlin and Arhletic Bilbao. Östersund played up from the back against those teams, and they really had a group of suspect players. At Brighton, Dunk and Webster today can get the job done. Potter worked 4 years with them. And playing up from the back is almost the only thing they worked on.
We have seen McTominay be a complete non factor when played as a No 6. He just throws in the towel and hides behind someone when we are playing up from the back. It’s scary, and not something you can do if you haven’t worked a lot on it. ETH should of course be able to get Rice there. But it’s not optimal that he never have played this way before, in some ways it’s like a new sport.
The big downside from my point of view that he is 24 y/o and have not played a be single game in his life for a team that even remotely want to play like ETH wants his team to play. England tried to play up from the back a few times against Italy. It was so obvious that Southgate had done some soul searching after the WC and went OK let’s try this new thing. Italy has a very flat press. The involved players where Pickford, Shaw, Maguire, Stones, Walker and Rice. It wasn’t pretty.
Brighton is one of the best teams in the world at passing up from the back. Graham Potter beat Arsenal away with Swedish fairytale team Östersund, they also played the pants off Herta Berlin and Arhletic Bilbao. Östersund played up from the back against those teams, and they really had a group of suspect players. At Brighton, Dunk and Webster today can get the job done. Potter worked 4 years with them. And playing up from the back is almost the only thing they worked on.
We have seen McTominay be a complete non factor when played as a No 6. He just throws in the towel and hides behind someone when we are playing up from the back. It’s scary, and not something you can do if you haven’t worked a lot on it. ETH should of course be able to get Rice there. But it’s not optimal that he never have played this way before, in some ways it’s like a new sport.
We are getting Mount and a Rice or Rabiot. So your questions have all been answered and there really isn’t nothing to worry about. Whether you want Neves Le Fee or Lavia. It doesn’t really matter as long as the profiles are met which they will be.
I understand the topic about money but every year we seem to get lied to so I never get why we always worry about our pockets.
Last year we reportedly had a £100m budget and we all speculated if it was net or the full amount. We spent way over that and then we got the usual, we used next summers budget just like we keep hearing every summer.
We have money and always have and whether we have to dip into ‘next summers’ budget again to get Kane and Rice it won’t matter as by December we will definitely be under some form of new ownership with a new shirt sponsor to calm any FFP rules.
I think Rice makes more sense than people think. ETH wants players who cn play in multiple positions. He can play as 8 and carry the ball easily. We have Bruno for crearivity and Casemiro can pass the ball well. Hi is not my first choie 8 but can be a Casemiro cover who can't play all the games and we don't have a player who si even close to be able to play as DM. We ae in CL o the next year will be even more difficult in terms of squad depth. 100M for Rice is insane but I can see why ETH wants him (if the rumors are true of course).
Nothing shrewd about paying £100m+ for an English international who's been highly regarded for years
He'd be a really good signing, though, but I'd still prefer Caicedo who would surely be slightly cheaper, at least, and is younger, and better.
You thought Roy Keane (transfer record at the time?) wasn't shrewd signing?
The way he becomes a temporary 3rd CB by positioning himself in front of his CB’s, cutting the passing lanes through positioning then anticipates for the right time to make the killer tackle that is absolutely clean as a whistle is beautiful to watch.
He has then added the ability to dribble the ball from that CB positioning all the way to CDM, CM, CAM and even ST positioning before making a pass or scoring a goal. He plays like a dangerous YoYo that invites all the energy then cuts it before starting the attack all by himself.
No other CDM does that.
Ten Hag isn’t a Guardiola like Possesion based manager - he likes his team to have the ability to play with the ball and off the ball and will value a player that can turn the opposition attack in to an own teams attack all by himself.
He has then added the ability to dribble the ball from that CB positioning all the way to CDM, CM, CAM and even ST positioning before making a pass or scoring a goal. He plays like a dangerous YoYo that invites all the energy then cuts it before starting the attack all by himself.
No other CDM does that.
Ten Hag isn’t a Guardiola like Possesion based manager - he likes his team to have the ability to play with the ball and off the ball and will value a player that can turn the opposition attack in to an own teams attack all by himself.
Yeah, I think he's quite a unique player with an interesting skillset that Ten Hag could probably make great use of. He'd give a lot of solidity in the defensive third, and more drive moving forward.
I really like him as a player and think he'd do great here. That said, West Ham's valuation is excessive, but it seems like every club is doing that these days.
2 of those players are better and more talented, the other has been laughed at for us buying him at such a price. Odd benchmarks.
Just because it’s odd to you doesn’t make it the truth.
All we know is that quality managers want him and you don’t.
So true.
Sorry but he definitely is a possession based manager. His Ajax side were a possession based side and ideally he will have us playing in a similar way to dominate games. He can’t do that atm as the standard of players just isn’t there. Rice plays in a counter attacking team and excels but the other favourite option Caicedo plays in a possession based team and excels. I know which one I’m picking. I just can’t picture rice excelling in a team that plays the way ETH wants us to play.
No, of course not, he was an obvious signing. he was already the Nottingham POTY, and one of the hottest prospects in the league. Blackburn wanted to pay even more for him than we did.
It's like saying Kane would be a shrewd signing.
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