What does it say about our coaching and goalkeeping coaching over the years?
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What does it say about our coaching and goalkeeping coaching over the years?
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Are you referring to his cat like reflexes? I’m sure he’ll appreciate the support!
Again cats are well known for excellent reactions and landing on their feet I’m sure De Gea will have another month of solid performances before the next round of insults.
If the club/manager were ruthless he wouldn’t be at the club anymore, let along still be first choice on a big fat contract.
De Gea looked to have the bit between his teeth at the start of the season, but overall his performances have just ended up nowhere near what is required at United. His save stats this season are frankly poor for a team at the top. Fbref has him at -0.03 vs expected goals ie he's slightly worse than bang average. He's taking 4% of crosses successfully (Nick Pope, presumably the best in the league at this, is taking 13%). His distribution feels a bit more effective than in previous years, but its hardly a strength. He had at least stopped making mistakes this season, but then we get last night.
He was definitely nudged for the first goal last night, but come on, even in the modern game you need keepers stronger than that. For the second goal, well, the best you can say is he isn't the only one with egg on his face.
This has been a problem since 2018 now. I don't know if Henderson is the answer, but if this form continues, I don't think De Gea should expect to start in goal next season.
He was definitely nudged for the first goal last night, but come on, even in the modern game you need keepers stronger than that. For the second goal, well, the best you can say is he isn't the only one with egg on his face.
This has been a problem since 2018 now. I don't know if Henderson is the answer, but if this form continues, I don't think De Gea should expect to start in goal next season.
Just when we thought he may have turned a corner. He’s the epitome of a coward.
I'm referring to him being terrified of any physical challenge and the team conceding goals regularly as a result.
Nailed it with that comment. He is literally the Rooney '13 saga incarnate. A past it player that should have been let go a couple years back.
Instead we break the wage structure for him only for his performances to fall off a cliff.
It's poetry. It rhymes.
We definitely need an upgrade on De Gea, if we have ambitions of making a real title challenge. Someone who can command his box, will come for crosses and is a good passer.
Who that is I've no idea but I don't think it's Henderson unfortunately.
Who that is I've no idea but I don't think it's Henderson unfortunately.
He was pushed by another Sheffield player for the first goal. Plus I think Axel did not jump high enough to clear the ball.
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So why use derogatory language to make that point? Why not just say he seems terrified of physical challenges?
Is there a more feeble, and meek-looking keeper around?
That attempt at a punch was pathetic. He should've come out and wiped the lot of them out. He's not going to give a pen away unless he literally kicks someone in the face. The refs are so protective of keepers, he could've literally come out, took out about 5 or 6 players before getting to the ball, and everything would've been fine.
As we saw with the goal we had disallowed, the keeper coming out to claim the ball will always get the decision when a player even goes near them. The guy is just so weak
That attempt at a punch was pathetic. He should've come out and wiped the lot of them out. He's not going to give a pen away unless he literally kicks someone in the face. The refs are so protective of keepers, he could've literally come out, took out about 5 or 6 players before getting to the ball, and everything would've been fine.
As we saw with the goal we had disallowed, the keeper coming out to claim the ball will always get the decision when a player even goes near them. The guy is just so weak
Because it's accurate language for what he is.
Why use four words when one will suffice, if you dont like pussy, then coward. Its what he is, he is a bottle job.
Bizarre claims. he gets a heavy push in the back when he's about to jump for the ball. Has nothing to do with not wiping the lot of them out.
Leave off.
"A heavy push in the back" Give me a break
If he was even slightly more commanding in that situation he would've claimed the ball. He's too meek. Let's not act like this is the first and only example of him being reluctant to come out and claim the ball. That kind of diffidence is one of the main reasons why we look so vulnerable on set- plays, and corners in particular. He shows none of the assertiveness that you would want in a keeper in these situations.
In this day and age that is clearly a foul but feck me DeGea is a wet blanket. He’s never going to be that dominating keeper is he. He should just be going and wiping out everyone there. It’s just a really poor part of his game that doesn’t seem to have developed much since his arrival and that Blackburn game where they just brutalised him.
Giving me flashbacks to that that PSG game where he can easily catch it but decides to punch it but somehow flaps at it keeping us under preasure.
Giving me flashbacks to that that PSG game where he can easily catch it but decides to punch it but somehow flaps at it keeping us under preasure.
It should probably have been given, but it was no where near a heavy push. He had to go blood and thunder for that ball. I don't think I have seen a goalkeeper punished while going for a high ball in the box for a while now.
With the ball dropping right on the six-yard box, as a goalkeeper, he had to go with as much conviction as possible which would give him a better chance at getting to the ball, and any slight coming together, the decision would go in the keeper's favour any day of the week.
I don't think the contact was enough to put him off anyway, but his meek attempt at coming for the ball meant the contact wasn't obvious, I didn't even notice Sharp initially untill I saw the replays. He was just far too weak, and Bryan beat him to it.
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Exactly. He had Maguire, Tuanzebe and a Sheffield player in front of him when he received the ball. His first thought was probably to not smash it into them and have it ricochet into the goal, so he side-footed it. Perhaps more power would've been appropriate, but the idea was sound.
There was not enough time for him to swing his leg. I've seen much worse clearances. Looked to me like Maguire couldn't get the ball under control. Shouldn't be giving the ball to the keeper in that manner.Exactly. He had Maguire, Tuanzebe and a Sheffield player in front of him when he received the ball. His first thought was probably to not smash it into them and have it ricochet into the goal, so he side-footed it. Perhaps more power would've been appropriate, but the idea was sound.
I agree. Maguire intercepted a cross which then went towards De Gea who had to rapidly decide what to do. De Gea had very little time to react and made the right decision IMO.
He was also fouled for the first goal which VAR should've ruled out.
I'm not sure why De Gea's taking so much flack for yesterday's result.
I think we're doing De Gea's footballing ability a bit of a disservice if we don't think he can easily kick and clear that ball harder and safely.
As his natural reflexes go with increasing age, he will become one of the worst keepers in the league. Already I feel he isn't as agile as he was 5 years ago.
We have to be ruthless when that time comes, because he simply does not look like he is bothered about improving on other aspects of his goalkeeping. I thought SAF and co trained him to be more brave aerially in his first couple of seasons. He seems to have forgotten all that, and more.
We have to be ruthless when that time comes, because he simply does not look like he is bothered about improving on other aspects of his goalkeeping. I thought SAF and co trained him to be more brave aerially in his first couple of seasons. He seems to have forgotten all that, and more.
If I could choose one player to transfer out of the entire squad, it would be De Gea
clearly many posters here with an agenda for DDG to be receiving the crap he has from some posters. Cracks me up. Literally everyone moaning about VAR not calling back the first goal as a player literally two hands a goalie in the air off his trajectory. Then you can clearly see multiple players in front of ddg forcing a side foot clear out of danger. I can only imagine if he had tried to clear with power and had smashed it in off a player in front of him. Could you imagine the vitrol he would get here? People would be calling him brain dead. People seem to be acting like henderson has just been a beast in goal when he has been spelling DDG, when the truth is he has looked pretty damn scared at times in his games.
Again, if you have forward momentum and you're about to jump for something and someone suddenly barges into your back, it's going to have a fair bit of effect.
It has nothing to do with not going for the ball and everything to do with basic physics.
His half-arsed clearance bofore the second goal was comical.
Surely DDG can only improve from here knowing and seeing all the messages here?
5x Team of the season in premier league. I wonder if anyone surpass that?
5x Team of the season in premier league. I wonder if anyone surpass that?
I don't think its an agenda to be criticising De Dea, his performances this season have been at best mediocre. Among first choice goalkeepers he's ranked 15th from 20 at preventing expected goals, 18th at taking crosses and 16th when it comes to coming out early. His passing is fair but no-one could call it a major strength and he's never been a good organiser of the defence. Statistically speaking, he's among the worst 4 or 5 keepers in the league.
https://fbref.com/en/comps/9/keepersadv/Premier-League-Stats
Now granted there's a certain aspect to football that's hard to define with stats. I agree that Henderson for example looks uncertain in net when he's played at United, compared to Sheffield where was superb, and that's what comes from the pressure of being at United. But when De Gea starts making mistakes on top of his overall poor performances, what exactly is De Gea bringing to the table that someone else can't?
It also true to say that this has been an issue since the 2018 World Cup, so I don't think its fickle fans turning on him at the first sign of a dip in form. At the end of the day, we want to be the best club in the league, and that means having players in every position who, at the very least, stand comparison with the best around. De Gea is far away from that right now.
Jaysus. Those are grim stats. And there isn’t a stat for presence and authority. Which is where he’s probably weakest of all.
Always thought Pope and Martinez were the best two in the league, but looks like Areola has been very good. Doesn't look too good for De Gea. We concede so many, and you've got to ask, what does he actually do?
Too early to consider the next season. But, I would like us to give Henderson a run of games as no.1 starting from the next game.
I get the idea that often he simply doesn't have support from his shaky defenders, but he's slowly becoming experienced goalkeeper and needs to finally start acting like one.
Highly doubtful something will happen in the summer in that department. We're gonna have to stick to Dave and Dean.
Highly doubtful something will happen in the summer in that department. We're gonna have to stick to Dave and Dean.
It takes a good GK not to panic with the ball on his feet. He was shielded by 2 players and had the time to do something better.
The first goal was just a half arsed push, that's why he didn't say a thing.
We need serious Gk with presence in goal, we can't challenge if he can't deal with crosses even to save his life. What's worse, he has -0.03 expected goals. So what he actually offers for this 350k week?
Well, De Gea can make saves that others can't make?
And he is still agile and fast even though he's getting older. He's the best at making leg saves as well.
And he is getting better at coming out of his line now. Do you want to replace De Gea with a younger and more inexperienced keeper?
Stats query:
I know with the xG prevented stats I look at, they're an absolute number. In other words if you concede more shots, you will do better. For a more accurate look at how goalkeepers are actually performing you'd need to look at it as a ratio of shots conceded. Otherwise keepers for top teams with lower number of shots will seem to underperform, so you end up with the likes of Ederson and Allison also looking like more average goalkeepers than they actually are while goalkeepers for teams who concede a lot of shots (Burnley, say) look better.
Are the stats you're quoting adjusted for that? Or are they basic xG prevented? If it's the former then it really is bad. If it's the latter then it's somewhat misleading.
On Fbref the stat is performance relative to xGA. In particular its xGA minus the number of goals conceded. So if you're expected to concede 20 goals and you only concede 15, you get a score of +5. If you're expected to concede 35 goals and only concede 30, its also +5. So in this respect the number of shots makes no difference to the ranking.
The link does have a ranking of pure xGA, and as you'd expect the goalie playing for the worst defence (Sam Johstone at West Brom) has the highest xGA, because they get battered every week. But he's actually conceding fewer goals than his xGA would predict, so in terms of shot stopping, he's above average - 6th in the league in fact, despite conceding the most goals. De Gea has a score of -0.3, which means that he's marginally worse than an "average" keeper.
But say Goalkeeper A is expected to concede 20 and concedes 10, giving him a score of +10. Meanwhile Goalkeeper B is expected to concede 10 and concedes 4, giving him a score of +6.
On face value Goalkeeper A has outperformed Goalkeeper B by +4. But in reality Goalkeeper B has prevented 60% of the xG he faced compared to Goalkeeper A's 50%, so is in fact performing better relative to the goal threat he's facing.
So what am I missing in terms of how the stats adjust for the differing levels of opportunity to prevent goals?
Edit: just to be clear I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm just wondering what's throwing me.
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Certainly doesn’t speak well at all of either.
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