David de Gea | 2011-14 Performances

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finneh said:
If De Gea had barely made any mistakes he would never have gotten the reputation. Now that he has the reputation it will take a top class season to shake the tag. He is improving, but is still leaving himself open to criticism every so often, criticism that will sell papers. It took a fair few years for Vidic to be recognised as the defender he was, despite only a dodgy coupld of months.

I don't see anywhere where Kie has written him off. It's the same in the Welbeck thread though, you say anything apart from gushing praise about a talented young player and you get shot down as if you're suggesting he is useless and should never be seen in a United shirt again
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It all started with that Dzeko goal in the Charity Shield from about 25 yards. The media said he couldn't handle long shots. I remember the first few games players (van der Vaart in particular) were firing shot from all angles. From then on every small error has been blown up and managers have pinpointed him as a weakness, especially from corners where the opposition will push him around and surround him. This would not have done his adaption to the English game any easier.
 
adam118 said:
It all started with that Dzeko goal in the Charity Shield from about 25 years. The media said he couldn't handle long shots. I remember the first few games players (van der Vaart in particular) were firing shot from all angles. From then on every small error has been blown up and managers have pinpointed him as a weakness, especially from corners where the opposition will push him around and surround him. This would not have done his adaption to the English game any easier.
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It started even before he scored that goal, and then once that happened it just gave them more fuel and since then he's shown that he has coped well from long shots overall.
 
He's a very good keeper with immense potential - I highly doubt SAF is getting rid.

I don't get all the media hype about him being sold off. It's as if the media simply want to stir up the pot and create a story from nothing.
 
lets see how he is in 2-3 years, i will bet anyone that he would still be our number 1.
 
Orton said:
Well, de Gea has been here for a year and a half, so this extended period of time thing you keep banging on about, he hasn't even been at United for an extended period of time. Unless you make up a random time span just to cover your tracks. It's obvious he is improving, yet you seem more interested in slating the kid rather than looking at the positives. Ivanovic has proved himself, because he's been at Chelsea for over 5 years and is a mainstay in the team. De Gea had a career before United, where he was known as one of, if not the best young keeper in Europe. Why do you think so many goalkeepers current and past think the same? Give him a few more years before you try write him off completely and put every goal we concede down to some non existent error you see in your head.
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If he doesn't make any mistakes for a year and a half I'll consider that an extended period of time without making any mistakes.

If we have to wait a few more years before he is consistent and good enough to actually convince people he's a top class goalkeeper then we should get shot of him now, his contract only has a few more years to run, we don't want to be in a position where he finally makes it as a top class goalkeeper then walks out on us. I'd hope that in a year's time or by the start of next season he's improved enough that he gets recognised as being very good, if it's going to take several years then it's just not worth it.

Orton said:
So this "3 or 4" mistakes in so many games is not good enough for a United keeper, is not writing a player off? He comes in here after every game bringing up the same stuff, then some. He claims de Gea parries the ball into danger too much and has the cheek to use City's first goal as an example of this. It's beyond ridiculous at times.

I certainly don't think de Gea is perfect, but looking for things that aren't even there is too much. The media were on his back from day 1, and that much is obvious. Look at David Luiz, he was getting gushing praise at the start of his Chelsea career because he scored a couple of goals and could play a bit, yet despite that he was a calamitous disaster in his supposed position on the football pitch. De Gea got the reputation after 1 competitive game, then they started to bring up this shots from the outside of the box thing from his time at Atlético. Regardless of how he played, the reputation stuck with him from his first match.
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Do you think he wouldn't be a better goalkeeper if he parried the ball into less dangerous places?

Your second paragraph is interesting, you seem to be admonishing the media for using his career at Atletico where he conceded a lot of goals from outside the box as part of their analysis of his ability from shots outside the box, yet earlier you used his previous career as "the best young goalkeeper in Europe" as something the media should be taking into account. Which is it? Should we take into account his time at other clubs or not?

His reputation for being dodgy on long shots quickly evaporated by the way, his failings aerially quickly overtook it as De Gea's biggest flaw.

ciderman9000000 said:
Kie:

a) Do you believe that we are indeed looking for a new keeper?
b) Do you think we should be looking for a new keeper?
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I believe we're always looking for possible ways to improve the team in every position, and so we should be.
 
kietotheworld said:
If he doesn't make any mistakes for a year and a half I'll consider that an extended period of time without making any mistakes.

If we have to wait a few more years before he is consistent and good enough to actually convince people he's a top class goalkeeper then we should get shot of him now, his contract only has a few more years to run, we don't want to be in a position where he finally makes it as a top class goalkeeper then walks out on us. I'd hope that in a year's time or by the start of next season he's improved enough that he gets recognised as being very good, if it's going to take several years then it's just not worth it.



Do you think he wouldn't be a better goalkeeper if he parried the ball into less dangerous places?

Your second paragraph is interesting, you seem to be admonishing the media for using his career at Atletico where he conceded a lot of goals from outside the box as part of their analysis of his ability from shots outside the box, yet earlier you used his previous career as "the best young goalkeeper in Europe" as something the media should be taking into account. Which is it? Should we take into account his time at other clubs or not?

His reputation for being dodgy on long shots quickly evaporated by the way, his failings aerially quickly overtook it as De Gea's biggest flaw.



I believe we're always looking for possible ways to improve the team in every position, and so we should be.
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Well he's in the team now, and doing pretty well plus we are 7 points clear. Clearly doing something right, no? He's much improved this season, and most people can see it. He came here as a 20 year old, and anyone expecting near perfection straight away are deluded. No goalkeeper in the world will go a year and a half without 1 mistake.

That's because they used it against him when it didn't really mean anything. You watch the goals against and 9/10 of them were unstoppable shots. It was a baseless assumption from the media that he was weak on long shots, they just clinged on to it after Dzeko scored in the pre season friendly.
 
am i the only person who got bored with all this gossips sending him off, us finding a replacement, Fergie not being happy with him? It's all bollocks, we know that. what's the point in recycling this? with current level of performances there is no way we are selling him. full stop.
 
ciderman9000000 said:
A complete dodge.

Answer the questions properly.
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It's not a dodge, I feel that if a better player than De Gea was available at good value we'd go in for him. I think it's pretty unlikely we'll get one this month, but I certainly wouldn't rule it out. If he carries on like he has been doing and doesn't improve I'd expect a new goalkeeper to be brought in in summer. 2 full seasons should be enough.

Orton said:
Well he's in the team now, and doing pretty well plus we are 7 points clear. Clearly doing something right, no? He's much improved this season, and most people can see it. He came here as a 20 year old, and anyone expecting near perfection straight away are deluded. No goalkeeper in the world will go a year and a half without 1 mistake.

That's because they used it against him when it didn't really mean anything. You watch the goals against and 9/10 of them were unstoppable shots. It was a baseless assumption from the media, they just clinged on to it after Dzeko scored in the pre season friendly.
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Doing pretty well? We're conceding goals like I've never known before. It's pretty clear there's something very wrong in our defence, despite the attack being able to bail them out time and again. By your logic our League position must also prove Lindegaard is amazing, he's played nearly as many games as De Gea.

Nobody was expecting perfection, but anyone who was expecting what we did get obviously didn't rate him very highly.

It wasn't a baseless assumption, it had a pretty strong basis in all the goals he'd conceded in La Liga and his performances in his first two games in England. As I say though, the media talking about his long shot failings very quickly evaporated.
 
kietotheworld said:
If he carries on like he has been doing and doesn't improve I'd expect a new goalkeeper to be brought in in summer.
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That statement couldn't be more contradictory; unless you don't believe him to have improved since joining the league?

You're taking harsh criticism to retarded levels, the fact that you feel justified saying the above is indicative of how much crap you're dealing out for no reason.
 
We purchased this highly rated young spaniard on the basis of him 'becoming' a world class player. I'm sure Sir Alex expected more from him originally but I'm sure he's happy with his obvious development from original struggles.

New club, new teammates, new language, new country, new culture.

His defence has sold him very short at times this season, but as things sharpen up he will keep more clean sheets and develop that personality with age.

I don't expect him to be with us when he actually hits his peak, but I'm happy for that to be a completely empty assumption with De Gea here for as long as his career lasts.

It's taken a while for things to settle down, but donuts and wisdom teeth aside he's had a steady development path. The price tag really puts on unnecessary pressure...but the premium was necessary to secure his services.
 
kietotheworld said:
It's not a dodge, I feel that if a better player than De Gea was available at good value we'd go in for him. I think it's pretty unlikely we'll get one this month, but I certainly wouldn't rule it out. If he carries on like he has been doing and doesn't improve I'd expect a new goalkeeper to be brought in in summer. 2 full seasons should be enough.



Doing pretty well? We're conceding goals like I've never known before. It's pretty clear there's something very wrong in our defence, despite the attack being able to bail them out time and again. By your logic our League position must also prove Lindegaard is amazing, he's played nearly as many games as De Gea.

Nobody was expecting perfection, but anyone who was expecting what we did get obviously didn't rate him very highly.

It wasn't a baseless assumption, it had a pretty strong basis in all the goals he'd conceded in La Liga and his performances in his first two games in England. As I say though, the media talking about his long shot failings very quickly evaporated.
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We are conceding a lot of goals, but there are a number of factors involved in that. The goalkeeper isn't really one of them, and of all our games this season neither keeper has cost us any points. We almost lost at Reading though when Lindegaard looked a mess. De Gea's worst performance of the season was at Newcastle, and we kept a clean sheet that day.

So because he conceded so many from outside the box, it meant he was weak? You need to look at other variables to why a team concede from there. Atletico used to concede a lot of goals from anywhere, and If the shot is unsaveable it doesn't make him weak at dealing with them. It evaporated because It was never true.
 
Orton said:
We are conceding a lot of goals, but there are a number of factors involved in that. The goalkeeper isn't really one of them, and of all our games this season neither keeper has cost us any points. We almost lost at Reading though when Lindegaard looked a mess. De Gea's worst performance of the season was at Newcastle, and we kept a clean sheet that day.

So because he conceded so many from outside the box, it meant he was weak? You need to look at other variables to why a team concede from there. Atletico used to concede a lot of goals from anywhere, and If the shot is unsaveable it doesn't make him weak at dealing with them. It evaporated because It was never true.
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Why do you switch from conceding a lot of goals to costing us points? We are conceding a lot of goals and the goalkeeper has to take some responsibility for that, not only with the obvious mistakes that he makes but with the organisation of the defence.

If a goalkeeper concedes a lot of goals form shots outside the box then it suggests he's weak when it comes to shots outside the box. Saying that he's weak in that area is not baseless, it has a very solid basis. This doesn't necessarily mean it's true, but it's not unfair to say it.

Orton said:
He's 22. I take it he's peaked already.
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I certainly hope not.
 
kietotheworld said:
Doesn't improve any further.
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Yes, but you said "If he carries on like he has been doing and doesn't improve..."

You can't have it both ways: either he carries on improving or he doesn't improve; he can't carry on as he has been doing without improving, because improving is exactly what he has been doing ever since joining the club.
 
ciderman9000000 said:
Yes, but you said "If he carries on like he has been doing and doesn't improve..."

You can't have it both ways: either he carries on improving or he doesn't improve; he can't carry on as he has been doing without improving, because improving is exactly what he has been doing ever since joining the club.
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If he carries on playing at the level he's been playing at this season, though it represents an improvement over last season, I expect he'll be replaced.

ciderman9000000 said:
Of course it's unfair if it isn't true.
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It's fair to say a player is weak in a particular area if there's a lot of evidence to suggest he is.
 
kietotheworld said:
Why do you switch from conceding a lot of goals to costing us points? We are conceding a lot of goals and the goalkeeper has to take some responsibility for that, not only with the obvious mistakes that he makes but with the organisation of the defence.

If a goalkeeper concedes a lot of goals form shots outside the box then it suggests he's weak when it comes to shots outside the box. Saying that he's weak in that area is not baseless, it has a very solid basis. This doesn't necessarily mean it's true, but it's not unfair to say it.



I certainly hope not.
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It doesn't suggest anything unless you actually watched the games or seen the goals, therefore assuming he is weak without actually knowing how he was beaten. It was just another stick to beat him with after the Dzeko goal. Why do you think he got tagged "Gomes without the shot stopping" after a couple of games? Do you think any of those guys watched him regularly for Atletico?

I'm sure the goalkeeper will take some responsibility, but numerous times this year the defence have let him down. Mainly down to the lack of our best defender for the most part, and Rio getting on a bit. Back in 2008 we hardly conceded goals, but then we hardly gave the opposition a sniff either. Vidic and Rio were the best centre backs in the world back then. Teams have a go at us more, and it's evident that our defence isn't what it once was. You can't just say we've conceded x amount so the keeper isn't good enough.
 
I can't believe people actually want rid. What other 22 year old keeper is even close to DDG's level right now, maybe Szczesny and even then I wouldn't consider swapping the two. Yeah he makes the occasional mistake but so does basically every keeper no matter how good. And you would certainly think that Sir Alex knew there would be a few rough moments along the way with such a young keeper. DDG is/was a long term project, even considering getting rid of him would be madness.
 
Orton said:
It doesn't suggest anything unless you actually watched the games or seen the goals, therefore assuming he is weak without actually knowing how he was beaten. It was just another stick to beat him with after the Dzeko goal. Why do you think he got tagged "Gomes without the shot stopping" after a couple of games? Do you think any of those guys watched him regularly for Atletico?

I'm sure the goalkeeper will take some responsibility, but numerous times this year the defence have let him down. Mainly down to the lack of our best defender for the most part, and Rio getting on a bit. Back in 2008 we hardly conceded goals, but then we hardly gave the opposition a sniff either. Vidic and Rio were the best centre backs in the world back then. Teams have a go at us more, and it's evident that our defence isn't what it once was. You can't just say we've conceded x amount so the keeper isn't good enough.
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One man who dislikes Ferguson said he was that, it was isolated, nobody else said that about him. I doubt those people regularly watched him for Atletico, there's only a finite amount of time available to journalists, they have to go off statistics and what they read from other journalists, much like we do - I'd wager you didn't regularly watch him for Atletico, but you still touted him as the best young goalkeeper in Europe on the basis of his performances for them.

No, you obviously can't be as simple as "we've conceded x amount so the keeper isn't good enough" but you can't just disregard it completely wither.
 
gza the genius said:
I can't believe people actually want rid. What other 22 year old keeper is even close to DDG's level right now, maybe Szczesny and even then I wouldn't consider swapping the two. Yeah he makes the occasional mistake but so does basically every keeper no matter how good. And you would certainly think that Sir Alex knew there would be a few rough moments along the way with such a young keeper. DDG is/was a long term project, even considering getting rid of him would be madness.
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Thibaut Courtois, Bernd Leno and Marc-André Ter Stegen all look pretty handy, and 2 years younger.
 
Blair said:
Thibaut Courtois, Bernd Leno and Marc-André Ter Stegen all look pretty handy, and 2 years younger.
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De Gea looked just as good as those mentioned for Athletico. Completely different kettle of fish playing for United.
 
kietotheworld said:
One man who dislikes Ferguson said he was that, it was isolated, nobody else said that about him. I doubt those people regularly watched him for Atletico, there's only a finite amount of time available to journalists, they have to go off statistics and what they read from other journalists, much like we do - I'd wager you didn't regularly watch him for Atletico, but you still touted him as the best young goalkeeper in Europe on the basis of his performances for them.

No, you obviously can't be as simple as "we've conceded x amount so the keeper isn't good enough" but you can't just disregard it completely wither.
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I watched almost all of de Gea's games for Atletico. No, no British based journalist would have the time for that, but before they go out and write off a player so quickly they should do a bit of research, not just looking at stats but watch some games, some highlights even then maybe they could give a better description of the player other than basing it on a pre season friendly and 1 league game. Notice the Spanish based journalists would laugh at the suggestions of de Gea not being good enough, and they watched him plenty.
 
Blair said:
Yeah De Gea was also very good for Athletico.

But those who say he's only 22 and nobody young comes close are wrong. I am a big DDG fan though.
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Courtois will be massive, and softened the blow massively for Atleti fans after losing ddg. I don't know how much longer he will be willing to wait in the wings at Chelsea. Cech still has a few years in him yet, but Courtois' performances are getting better.
 
Blair said:
Yeah De Gea was also very good for Athletico.

But those who say he's only 22 and nobody young comes close are wrong. I am a big DDG fan though.
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You pick one and stick with them is part of my point though, getting rid of DDG would just mean our new keeper will get out under the exact same spotlight and the media will be just as critical. DDG is doing very well for a 22 year old keeper at one of the biggest clubs in the world and the only thing that will improve him is playing time.

Not that you in particular were suggesting we get rid or anything, just in general.
 
Orton said:
Courtois will be massive, and softened the blow massively for Atleti fans after losing ddg. I don't know how much longer he will be willing to wait in the wings at Chelsea. Cech still has a few years in him yet, but Courtois' performances are getting better.
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From the few times I have seen Courtois this season, if he replaced Cech next year as Chelsea's number 1 they wouldn't go far wrong. He's brilliant.
 
Blair said:
From the few times I have seen Courtois this season, if he replaced Cech next year as Chelsea's number 1 they wouldn't go far wrong. He's brilliant.
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Before De Gea came here, there were several keepers that looked good, the slightly older Akinfeev, Neur, De Gea, Curtois and some other fella cannot remember his name... strangely enough I rate Curtois the highest out of them all... mind you look at Asenjo (Who he replaced) who looked sure fit to be WC before his injury....
 
I haven't read the thread lately due to the amount of rubbish being posted but is de Gea really under so much scrutiny from many posters on here?! He hasn't been that bad surely? When he came here and played his first few games I admit I had my doubts, but to give him so much stick now when he has been pretty good? Unbelievable.
 
Vato1979 said:
I haven't read the thread lately due to the amount of rubbish bing posted but is de Gea really under so much scrutiny from many posters on here?! He hasn't been that bad surely? When he came here and played his first few games I admit I had my doubts, but to give him so much stick now when he has been pretty good? Unbelievable.
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Some are obsessed with him, i find it weird.

He's been very good imo and considering his age, am glad we have him.
 
Vato1979 said:
I haven't read the thread lately due to the amount of rubbish bing posted but is de Gea really under so much scrutiny from many posters on here?! He hasn't been that bad surely? When he came here and played his first few games I admit I had my doubts, but to give him so much stick now when he has been pretty good? Unbelievable.
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Just shows how bad some people in this thread are when a Real Madrid fan is saying their expectations are too high ;)
 
I think the lad is doing great and progressing well. He is going to be a top, top keeper IMO.
 
adam118 said:
A goalkeeper peaking at Man Utd at 22 is insane!
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Well, things do happen. Remember Alex Manninger? He was brilliant for Arsenal in their double winning season in 1998. He was 20 or 21, sure to have a bright future, but that was as good as it got. He's had a nice career after that, but not nearly as good as it was supposed to be.

But that's hardly the norm, of course. De Gea is doing very well and he will be ace.
 
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