Cristiano Ronaldo
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I don't think he's there yet, but it's inevitable that he ends up in that greatest of all time tier imo. Like Brwned already mentioned, Messi's individual abilities turned a great team into one of the best of all time, the last 2 years clearly showed that he's the most important player in that team and the game vs PSG was one of those rare magic moments, in which the presence of one player changed the whole game, even though he could hardly run.
I don't think it's fair to say he rarely shows up for Argentina anymore. His performances in the nationalteam were great in recent years, he's topscorer in the world cup qualification and he's the one who makes that team tick.
I'm not a fan of judging a player's standing in the history books before his career is over, it makes even less sense when a player is only in his mid-twenties. And like I already said, Ronaldo still has time to make it to that greatest of all time tier. But the last step for Ronaldo isn't scoring another 20 hattricks against average teams.
Maradona would struggle to do what Ronaldo has been doing the last 3-5 years. He's just not human. Cristiano can do everything.
The most complete attacker of all time. Easily.
What are you talking about? The whole point is that Ronaldo can't do everything
All time eh? So you saw pele, best and Di stefano?
Brwned hates Ronaldo, he's the only player on here I can't take his opinion seriously on.
I asked him how many licks it took to finish a tootsie pop, did he know, did he feck.
Useless cnut. Said he'd research it, still waiting......
The vast majority of people consider him a nearly top tier player, and I suppose you could say given his early career that he may well have gone on to be the exception to that but I don't think he did enough in the end to make it up there. I do wonder whether this Ronaldo will surpass him by the end of his career. Seems likely I guess.
Unless I'm being "whooshed", what absolute horseshit. He isn't even the most complete attacker of his generation.
If Wiki is spot on then he has 206 goals in 204 games for Real. Incredible record.
Who's Madrid's top scorer?
Who's Madrid's top scorer?
Wiki is correct. They said that stat yesterday on Fox after he scored that amazing goal yesterday.
Raul with 323 according to Wikipedia. Ronaldo's goals to games ratio blows everyone bar Puskas away, though.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Real_Madrid_C.F._records_and_statistics#Goalscorers
Though he's opinion in this thread seems quite reasonable Cina!
Messi? And it's not even close.
Unless most complete is just about the physical part of the game and ignores things like vision and playmaking which clearly is a way more important part of attacking than something like heading.
I take complete to mean everything including physical aspects of the game. I think that in this regard there really can't be a question, Ronaldo IS more complete than Messi, but that isn't to say that Ronaldo is BETTER than Messi. In the areas Messi excels, he is untouchable in this generation, or probably the last 3 or 4 generations and Messi is no slouch physically either though much smaller in stature.
If anything it speaks more about Messi that Messi is considered almost universally as the greatest player of this generation, when he is competing with a guy like Ronaldo who is one of the greatest physical specimens (and he trains his ass off on top of that) of his generation. Ronaldo is a freak athlete who works hard as hell. Messi is just that good.
I'd agree with a lot of that. Ronaldo is probably the best athlete we've ever seen in football. He may also be the most driven player I've ever seen, with a ridiculous desire to be the best that borders on egomania (in a good way). Everything Ronaldo has become is down to that, he made himself into one of the greats.
Messi, on the other hand, is supremely gifted. Obviously he's a seriously driven professional too, but it's almost hard to imagine how Messi wouldn't have been a great with the unbelievable talent he has. The truth is it probably doesn't matter what Ronaldo does or if he keeps on improving year after year (as he has done throughout his career), he'll never be able to overcome that gap in pure natural talent. As you said, that's probably the most complimentary thing you could say about Messi, along with the fact that he's making the most of that talent.
No player will ever be "complete", these two are as close as you can come though. Debating it beyond that is a bit fruitless as it would have been impossible for Ronaldo to develop that extra talent Messi has, or for Messi to develop the physical prowess Ronaldo has. They're both freaks really, just in different ways.
Just read an interview with Mike Phelan in the latest Scandinavian United Supporters Club magazine and he hinted, very strongly, that Ronaldo would have returned if Sir Alex and David Gill had stayed on.
"I'm not mentioning any names, but it had been a marquee signing. One of the absolutely best in the world. It was something that the manager spoke about, the owners and David Gill was all for pushing it through as well. There aren't many players like that out there, and I think everyone can see who we're talking about. We didn't see any need to make wholesale changes in the squad, which is why Sir Alex and I had been looking for one major signing. Such a marquee signing gives the whole dressing room a boost, like we saw with Robin van Persie last season."
"I'm not mentioning any names, but it had been a marquee signing. One of the absolutely best in the world. It was something that the manager spoke about, the owners and David Gill was all for pushing it through as well. There aren't many players like that out there, and I think everyone can see who we're talking about. We didn't see any need to make wholesale changes in the squad, which is why Sir Alex and I had been looking for one major signing. Such a marquee signing gives the whole dressing room a boost, like we saw with Robin van Persie last season."
Sounds like bollocks to be honest, Ronaldo wasn't going to leave Madrid this summer.
However, I do think the chances of Ronaldo returning have reduced significantly with no SAF... I imagine that would have been one of the main reasons to return for him, considering the way he talks about him.
However, I do think the chances of Ronaldo returning have reduced significantly with no SAF... I imagine that would have been one of the main reasons to return for him, considering the way he talks about him.
Its all Fergie's fault.
Was Bale
Yep
The funniest part about this to me is it seems like yet again they had no interest in signing a midfielder.
So true. Feck the midfield when you have attackers like RvP, Rooney, Ronaldo/Bale, Kagawa, Nani
Well i don't want Ronaldo anymore anyway because peterstorey says he's not world class.
A what?
Well i don't want Ronaldo anymore anyway because peterstorey says he's not world class.
Tell me he is kidding there right?
Pete's a master WUM but he's calling Vidic out as "never been world class" either. So I am not too sure there bud...
Just say to him they haven't had any world class players for 10 years now and see how that goes down.
He's in the "world class" thread if you looking for him. No point in having that debate. That's just a terrible opinion from Pete.
Balu is echoing some of my feelings towards Ronaldo, also too often in the bigger games for me he doesn't show up. He will carry the day against the mediocre teams but when Madrid need him to put the team on his back he struggles. An amazing goalscorer but that isn't enough for me.
People are far too kind to Pete, he'll throw in the occasional wind up but he's been spouting shite about how Ronaldo has declined since 06/07 for years, I think he's just genuinely clueless.
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Yeah, some if his wind ups are genuinely silly and obvious. Either that or he's just really daft in some instances - though when he's arsed he speaks a ton of sense so i do think he's a WUM.
Yeah, some if his wind ups are genuinely silly and obvious. Either that or he's just really daft in some instances - though when he's arsed he speaks a ton of sense so i do think he's a WUM.
Flat track bully?
Too an extent, not that he never turns up in big games but too often he is on the edge of them. A player as good as him should be in the thick of it. Last season was no exception.
Thats some BS right there, he has scored six times in Real last six games against Barça , he scored the winning goal against Barça in the Copa Del Rey final, he scored the goal in last years final's loss to Atletico, scored 5 goals in last seasons knock out stages of the CL including one that sent United out of the competition and was the competition top scorer, the year before he score Real's two goals in the second game against Bayern in the CL semi final to tie the two legs, i could go on and on like his header in the final against Chelsea or that cracking goal against Porto to sent United through etc.... Now he has one quiet game against Atletico and all of a sudden some idiots are trying to dig a myth that was burried a long time ago. He could score ten goals in one game against Barça and some people would still complain about one time where he didnt track back or one time he made a bad choice. He has scored 208 goals in 205 appearances for Madrid that includes goals against any kind of team, weak teams, medium teams and top teams he has scored against all of them and in every competition, but there will always be haters no mater what , the is kid great at what he does, hes good looking, hes rich, he has had great success with the ladies and hes arrogant about it all and that leads to jealousy from some people , either way hes laughing all the way to the bank.
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