Yes I am saying that the pitch being a bit longer or shorter won't make that much difference.
it will be a neutral stadium, so will be like playing lots of cup semi finals.
Could they void the PL due to the Coronavirus? | No | Resuming June 17th
- Thread starter Tarrou
- Start date
Yes I am saying that the pitch being a bit longer or shorter won't make that much difference.
it will be a neutral stadium, so will be like playing lots of cup semi finals.
The most basic point is this: let's bring football back behind closed doors but all it takes is one player from one team testing positive. So lets say United play Norwich. One player tests positive and now both clubs have to quarantine all their players and staff. What happens then? Do we tell them to play their under 14s and accept the season as 'fair'? There is literally no way to safely finish this season in a safe way at all. You can't announce champions but ignore the teams that should have been promoted either.
This is nothing to do with screwing Liverpool out of the title (they have been the best and deserve it) but unfortunately in the current climate there is literally no 'fair' way to conclude the League. Let's say that the League starts and a Liverpool player tests positive so now Liverpool have to play their under 12s team while miraculously City stay virus free and end up winning the League. Is that fair on Liverpool? You might normally say that's crazy but in the current climate what do you do when inevitably a player of some team tests positive?
The only solution is to void the season (because if Liverpool are champions then the Championship teams are pissed) and exclude European competition for a season or have things how they are now and Liverpool win the title and the 'promotion' teams are promoted but have more League games and more relegation spots with still no European competition and then next years top 4 make Europe (with no scum City of course because they're banned).
This is nothing to do with screwing Liverpool out of the title (they have been the best and deserve it) but unfortunately in the current climate there is literally no 'fair' way to conclude the League. Let's say that the League starts and a Liverpool player tests positive so now Liverpool have to play their under 12s team while miraculously City stay virus free and end up winning the League. Is that fair on Liverpool? You might normally say that's crazy but in the current climate what do you do when inevitably a player of some team tests positive?
The only solution is to void the season (because if Liverpool are champions then the Championship teams are pissed) and exclude European competition for a season or have things how they are now and Liverpool win the title and the 'promotion' teams are promoted but have more League games and more relegation spots with still no European competition and then next years top 4 make Europe (with no scum City of course because they're banned).
What if 3 extends to 4, or 5, or 6? Where is your cutoff? What if all three GKs go ill, can I go out to buy another one? Frankly its a bit embarrassing for Germany. If those three test positive and have been training with the team what if more are infected and already spreading it around. They can't possibly know for certain for two or three days the extent of the current infections. It is almost certain to happen now.
The problem is that one player testing positive means that a whole team should be put into lockdown. As in one player is enough to shut down a whole club. There is no way to do this.
@Dumbstar so the PL opens but one of your players tests positive so your whole first team and coaches have to quarantine. So while your in extended quarantine your under 12s team loses all matches and a virus free City pips you to the League title. How do you feel? Is that a 'valid' title for City?
Sounds crazy normally doesn't it? However that is what we live in now isn't it? Especially with 'let's finish the season' without any vaacine?
well thats not whats going to happen clearly, if they are really bringing it back. its not like they will just let this prospect go over their heads
You created an argument to suggest he was saying that nothing should start until a vaccine was in place. Then answered that argument you created with a statement on the economy. When that wasn't what he said. Hence you created a straw man.
No they hope to do what Germany have done. Find the people infected and quarantine them. Then in another 5 days they might find another 3 due to incubation periods, etc, then in another 5 days another 3 etc......
The teams right now do not even do real team training with duels. It usually is up to 7 players together on the pitch at the same time keeping distance to each other (so I do not think it always is 6 feet). I do not even think that the chance to spread in such a circumstance is that big...
According to the newspapers it is 2 players and one physio. Nobody until now knows more of it.
-------------------------------
What have teams before Corona done when a player had the flu? Sometimes it caught not just one player but some of them at the same time.
So what do they do when a player tests positive?
well they quarantine him, not the whole 2 teams invovled..
So then one team gets quarantined and have to play their next best team for the next two weeks? or do they get to delay games so then this season goes on for the next two years or so?
What if Liverpool before the first return game have a player who tests positive but City don't? Do Liverpool field a team of youths but City can play their first team?
I didnt say they will quarantine the whole team, just the infected player. It will be like he's off injured.
of course this only works with extensive real time testing. the clubs who had large amount of players infected (Espanyol?) were before they were pre testing people.
Really depends on the circumstances. First I would try to find out where and when he might have gotten it. Most players do not have much contact right now - mainly just with their families. I think that teams right now rely a lot on the behaviour of their players off the pitch - and of that of their closest contacts.
If you e.g. take the security concept of the German DFL there is not many chances that the players can spread it. They have to wear masks in the busses and on the commute - have to keep distance whenever possible - and even if their is contact on the pitch it is never that long and direct. And it is between people that get tested every week...
Yes, there is a chance - but there is a lot less chance than the usual citizen has that right now works in an office, a production plant, a shop...
Last edited:
The whole reason that this this is a 'pandemic' that has shut down countries is exactly because it can spread so well in minimal contact situations. All evidence as far as I know, I could be wrong) is that it's not the death rate thats the huge problem but how infectious it is. That means there is a huge problem for sports.
@paraguayo @Blackwidow appreciate the responses and they make sense. I guess I'm just weary of starting 'entertainment' again before we really know what we're faced with. However in the circumstances you depict then I'd be happy to go ahead with bringing the Leagues back. God knows it's be nice to have football again! Suppose like everything right now it depends on the data we can collect.
I had no idea about this but Montpellier had a 23 year old player, Junior Sambia in the ICU in an induced coma some days ago due to Covid-19. Is that something that may have finally made the French League change their stance? Since the PL only seems to look at the $$$, will the threat of a lawsuit from a footballer's death be something that may make them finally change their stance?
This is dangerous. If it’s a team’s best player they might try to play through the phase before it gets bad.
The PL could of course afford to pay for independent daily testing, but will it happen?
Also there seems to have been stories of people testing negative despite having the symptoms then testing positive down the line, but there may be better testing available now.
well I think they would know how terrible idea it is
This is a huge mistake
So it would have to be players registered to play in the PL but yes it could end up being all U16 or something. Not sure that would work for any team, Sheffield Utd, Man Utd or West Ham, etc. But it is what it is, and City would have won the league.
Personally, I no longer want the season to resume. I have seen how crap this virus is and it's not worth the risk. We still don't fully understand it. They should just hand us the title on PPG.
Genuine questions to you all, forget football for one second. Just so this is clear and obvious, you're aware right, that lots of non-essential businesses are going to be reopening over the course of the next month? Who will be having these same conversations? Other big money making businesses like, for instance Mcdonalds, Burger King, Primark etc and then when you trickle further down those who make a fraction of that profit, barbers, tattooist, personal trainers etc. You know that with all these jobs you can take precautions but it is impossible to completely social distance? You're aware that these people are going to be working again right? You're aware that if these people start down the lines of 'What if's' they'll basically never be able to leave their homes? If one/two/three person(s) who works in these industries tests positive it doesn't mean you have to hysterically panic and self isolate every single person working in that industry? You're aware that is completely unsustainable right? We are in the damage control phase, that is what the last six weeks have been, now we'll be moving on to the next phase, that involves coming up with ideas and plans to continue with life whilst limiting spread as much as you can, it is not going to be perfect and yes there will be 'what if's' but if you obsess over what if's you will drive yourself mad and basically never leave your house. And many of those ideas are going to be hilariously shit (playing matches at neutral venues) but that is how it has to be. It's unprecedented times but what I would say is surely an industry like the Premier League will have the resource to actually manage and handle the risk better than a lot of others? for instance, will Mcdonalds test all their staff? If you're deeply concerned about the safety of footballers and their families, this should allay these fears.
That doesn’t really make sense. The only way this one player can be tested positive is by undergoing a test to determine whether he is positive or negative. That test had two possible outcomes. If he then tests positive, the sensible thing would be to simply test the rest of the squad rather than quarantine them. You don’t quarantine people who have no disease. If the rest of the squad test negative, do you then isolate them? You only need to isolate people who test positive. The idea of isolating everyone around them is for a time where testing is not available. Otherwise there would be little benefit to society of all of these tests being available.
anything you say is tainted by being an asshole frankly.
as we have said before, store staff, workers in offices will find social distancing much easier than footballers, you can wear ppe, etc. also the difference between you and a footballer is a) the virus affecting you will not likely affect your whole future, b)your office is probably not reliant on a small percentage of people being able to work all at the same time.
people keep saying it’s the same as going into an office ignoring the blatant differences.
testing is not daily or instant, certainly not in this country anyway.
I agree you would not quarantine a whole squad, but if you have been in contact you won’t immediately test positive even if you have it as far as I understand the testing.
If they open up everything I have no problem playing football. One rule for everyone. Just because we like our sport doesn’t mean football is above anything.
Then new problems accures. Contracts, transfer window, home/away, TheFa cup, time and calender, European compitition and so on.
You are talking lot about aware. Yes, we are aware that you didn’t show any sympathy or empathy towards those who might have lost / or knew someone that sadly passed away. You said people were just afraid of their own shadows for not wanting to play. Not that classy, isn’t it?
Well from what I gather, the proposal is for tests to be done 2 or 3 times a week, so I’m guessing the results come back fairly quickly.
Says "just so this is clear" then writes a wall of (incredibly douchey) text. Jog on Leroy. No one's gonna respond to you acting like that.
If realism and logic makes me an arsehole so be it...
In theory in might seem easier, but try working in a fast food kitchen all day with a mask around your face, or in a barber shop and see how long you last before you pull it off. I went into a five guys a week ago and they had about six members of staff cooking in close proximity and they were sweating and not a single one had a mask on.
The point you seem to have dodged/missed is that footballers are ALL GOING to be tested with the plans the PL have. Which means infected players wont be playing so the risk of spread reduces. Like I said will all Mcdonalds staff be tested? will everyone who walks into a barber shop or tattoo parlour be tested? feck no.
I did not once say its the same as going into an office because most office jobs can be done at home. " the virus affecting you will not likely affect your whole future". Are we really still doing this? pretending everyone is at equal risk? This whole discussion is completely pointless if we're still acting as if this virus effects everyone equally.
What the actual feck are you on about? When did I say that? Christ, resorting to making things up?
These last few pages have just been hysterical 'what if' scenarios? and the constant running down of the PL (which includes Manchester United and all its staff and players, not trying to be an arsehole or douche by pointing this out but our club are involved in these discussions) trying to make the best out of a shite situation. Then you've got people like @90 + 5min who resort to phantom quotes to try and make you appear unsympathetic because apparently you're not allowed to suggest a return to a semblance of normality without being labelled as such. As if this is not literally a thread designated to discussing the future of football.
And in reference to the above comment below is Bruno Fernandes...… So presumably based on comments being made on recent pages, Bruno should be getting ripped apart. I'll wait......….
Last edited:
It makes a huge difference. I can’t remember who it was, I think Alan Shearer, but whoever it was described just how important playing at home was to instinctive football. He’d use certain features of the stadium as way-markers, if he had his back to goal he’d know exactly the space and width behind him over each shoulder, if he was beating the offside trap, he could focus on the line of the last man and know from looking at the side of the pitch and exactly where he was in relation to the goal so if he got the ball, he could ping and early shot with confidence and catch the keeper out.
German league already had their first setback with 3 players at Cologne testing positive. People are relaxed about it because there's no games for a few weeks yet. What happens if another team get confirmed cases in another 3 weeks and so on? And Germany don't have it anywhere near as bad as we do here.
It's just not going to work.
It's just not going to work.
At this stage, PPG just seems the most appropriate. Yeah it’s unfair for relegation and champions league places, but we are not dealing with normal times. I mean West Ham literally used illegal players to stay up in the past, shit happens.So it would have to be players registered to play in the PL but yes it could end up being all U16 or something. Not sure that would work for any team, Sheffield Utd, Man Utd or West Ham, etc. But it is what it is, and City would have won the league.
Personally, I no longer want the season to resume. I have seen how crap this virus is and it's not worth the risk. We still don't fully understand it. They should just hand us the title on PPG.
Unless that players
1. Never trains with his teammates
2. Never be in the same space with everyone else
3. Never train together
4. Never play together with anyone
Yes, then you quarantine him. Otherwise you tell the whole team to self quarantine, not asking them to continue playing football.
I can see the league restarting in the summer. Fair or not, money talks.
I think once this German restarts flops badly that'll basically be the nail in the coffin of the PL starting up again and finishing the season. Honestly a big part of me believes the PL know there's no chance (they're not stupid) but have to be seen to be trying for legal reasons.
What will Roy Hodgson do? Isn’t he a vulnerable person?
From you. 2 pages ago.
It’s amazing, since you posted this, every one of the ‘groups’ you referenced has made a post in this thread
Its weird, there’s a lot more rational/logical discussion in the actual covid-19 thread. This thread seems full of people who’d be afraid of their own shadows.
There is no need for me to be lying. So people who are afraid or who might have lost someone to this and don’t think it is ok to play are being afraid of their shadows.
Fernandes want to play. Good for him. Lots of players want to play. That doesn’t mean it is the best thing. There are milions of children who want to go to school. There are milions of people wanting to go to nightclubs and bars. That doesn’t mean it is ok in current situation. Everything has its time and place.
You are allowed to suggest return to normality and football but you got to be prepared for some questioning. Whoever you might be. And Fernandes would also be questioned.
Here is some more problems that I wrote to you in previous post that you can think about. If football starts in a month and society opens up. Try now to be logical as you have mentioned before. Contracts ending, transfer window, home/away advantage, TheFa cup, time and calender, European compitition and so on. There will be tons of problems ahead. Like it would be closing the season.
In Cologne's case, only the two players and the physio who tested positive are in self isolation. Rest of the team continues to train as normal.
I know what a straw man is. This was not my quesrion.
So three players of german team Cologne have tested positive to Covid-19.
Should they play without them - is that fair?
Should they play them with risks to other teams, people etc ?
Sky and BT have the FA by the ba**s and that's why the league has to continue in the UK with all the risks flying around.
Should they play without them - is that fair?
Should they play them with risks to other teams, people etc ?
Sky and BT have the FA by the ba**s and that's why the league has to continue in the UK with all the risks flying around.