Cop in America doing a bad job, again
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Don't ask for other sources then if you've already made your mind up
A tweet is hardly any more evidence than a link provided.
I find it funny how police are given the benefit of doubt in stressful situations for their actions, but the people under arrest are expected to act like upstanding citizens and not act in any way that could cause any alarm.
Of course the guy is going to agree with what the officers have told him, he's just been chased down and handcuffed. His heart is probably racing, his mind is probably thinking the worst, he's not wanting to end up in a bad situation etc. What do you expect him to say or do in that situation? That entire experience would have been traumatic.
If he's not respectful to the cops then that gives the Blue Lives Matter supporters justification for any brutality he may have then faced.
The whole thing is joke and only highlights a complete lack of understanding, communication and empathy to be frank.
But then again, i'm not surprised.
Blue Lives Matter, give me a break.
Of course the guy is going to agree with what the officers have told him, he's just been chased down and handcuffed. His heart is probably racing, his mind is probably thinking the worst, he's not wanting to end up in a bad situation etc. What do you expect him to say or do in that situation? That entire experience would have been traumatic.
If he's not respectful to the cops then that gives the Blue Lives Matter supporters justification for any brutality he may have then faced.
The whole thing is joke and only highlights a complete lack of understanding, communication and empathy to be frank.
But then again, i'm not surprised.
Blue Lives Matter, give me a break.
Don't ask for other sources then if you've already made your mind up
A tweet is hardly any more evidence than a link provided.
I have a tendency who I trust more and I didn't post Bennett's tweet as fact. This is a forum to discuss those things. Which is why I posted it. If you had given me a less biased link in the first place, I would have appreciated it. The body cam of the police officer arresting Bennett is somehow not being released or available, which doesn't help IMO.
So erm... Yeah. I'll wait for more details.
I guess they feel like they have to have their own 'movement'. What does it actually stand for though? Is it alongside BLM? Or opposed to it?
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The fact that a majority of people would not trust the official version by the cops is a definitive proof that the war is already lost.
'Blue Lives Matter' is as horrendously an ill conceived concept as I can think of. Sure, let's equate the guys with the heavy artillery and legal license to use force with an anti-discrimination movement. feck me.
Ideally everyone would wait for more details, but clearly every time an incident happens, everyone condemns the officer before any story comes out. That's happened countless times in here.
And as far as I'm personally concerned, someone saying blue lives matter doesn't take anything away from black lives matter. I'd like everyone to be better off. But that's a discussion that's gonna be pointless having here, so we won't even start down that route and save ourselves the trouble
When I initially heard the Bennett story, given who it was, I thought he had probably exaggerated the situation. The thing that now gives me pause is that the police say they are investigating the incident and then also at the same time place the blame at Bennett's feet? Which is it?
Those things doesn't always become available straight away. There's been times in here when everyone called for an officers head, only for more information to come out and footage released later, and it shows the officer acted as he should have.
Half the people who call for the police to not judge every black person as a criminal and group people together, immediately turn around and paint every officer as racist and bloodthirsty.
If this thread is solely for people to bash police, then so be it. Have someone make that thread mark and I won't waste anyone's time
Opposed to black lives matter of course - which makes no sense because BLM is about police brutality, and wanting to be given equal treatment and a right to a fair trial for everybody, not just black people - and BLM isn't limited to interactions with police either.
So Blue Lives Matter in its very essence is in opposition to that, which is ridiculous.
Also a 'Blue Life' is a job/career that you're not born into, and don't spend your whole life being a part of, and is an option. Being black/a minority isn't an option that you can take the uniform off.
The whole thing is stupidly arrogant, ignorant and offensive.
Those things doesn't always become available straight away. There's been times in here when everyone called for an officers head, only for more information to come out and footage released later, and it shows the officer acted as he should have.
Half the people who call for the police to not judge every black person as a criminal and group people together, immediately turn around and paint every officer as racist and bloodthirsty.
If this thread is solely for people to bash police, then so be it. Have someone make that thread mark and I won't waste anyone's time
Who paints every officer as racist and bloodthirsty?
We highlight instances of officers have shown poor judgement in the heat of the moment, because it happens so frequently and there's a long history of it.
That doesn't negate the fact that the majority police officers do a fantastic job.
And officers go into an active shooter situation, find someone hiding in an area they're clearing, who then takes off running away from them. He's no small guy. Why wouldn't their heart rate also be pounding? The video showed that they weren't pushing guns up against his head and screaming they'll murder him like stated.
You give the benefit of the doubt to everyone except the police. So you're just the extreme on the other side of what you complain about.
It would be incredibly harmful to what he's trying to do with his protest, which is why I have a hard time believing he's exaggerating this or making things up.
I know we often stand on opposite sides here, and honestly, I'm glad we do since it offers that ability to discuss things. Sometimes more vehemently than we should, but just to reiterate a point I've made to you before, I do appreciate your stance and what points you try to make. I just know our experiences will lead us to different perspectives, so I hope you don't think I dismiss what you say without merit!
I haven't spoken on the Bennett case so i'm not sure why you're making assumptions about me giving him the benefit of doubt.
I said the statement about giving benefit of doubt because this is what is used as reasoning by the police officers when an incident like this happens.
"he feared for his life", "it all happened so fast", "its a stressful situation and you only have 1 second to react" etc - all of these reasons are perfectly adequate when someone gets killed by a police officer, but the citizen on the opposite side is expected to act reasonably. If they don't act reasonably then "they should have cooperated" etc.
The whole thing is hypocritical.
If the behaviour of police officer's in a stressful situation is allowed benefit of doubt due to stress, anxiety, confusiong etc. Then the same should apply for the victims.
Until then, we should be hypercritical of the police officer's behaviour also.
The fact that you feel you need to personally defend against attacks is what I was alluding to in our earlier convos. It is what it is but you are doing the same thing you are accusing her of doing. The same thing that the annoying poster accused me of doing.
Bare in mind the police are likely trained whereas the civilians are likely not, you'd also assume a PO may have experience to draw on from similar situations whereas a civilian will be operating on? Nothing more than fear and instinct.
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I thought he was exaggerating this to give more publicity to his protest movement.
All I did was post a link with more information regarding a tweet where someone accused police of all this stuff.
Both of you immediately scoffed at it and dismissed it immediately. I offer an alternate perspective on incidents where there aren't all the details. I also condemn officers who act outside their policy or law.
I know we often stand on opposite sides here, and honestly, I'm glad we do since it offers that ability to discuss things. Sometimes more vehemently than we should, but just to reiterate a point I've made to you before, I do appreciate your stance and what points you try to make. I just know our experiences will lead us to different perspectives, so I hope you don't think I dismiss what you say without merit!
I don't mind our back and forths. Though I will say, I don't understand you posting stories of police officer's feeding sick kids in hospital and stuff in retaliation - as if nobody is aware that most cops are good cops and doing good things.
Personally I think you take criticism of police officers personally, and feel the need to defend almost every situation - which I can understand, it's human nature to get defensive when you feel your 'tribe' is being attacked - I do the same when someone dares tries to attack Beyonce.
I guess the difference is, for me when I see these instances - I'm looking through the perspective of my brother, cousins, friends, and any future kids I may have. So these situations become repetitive trauma almost, a reminder that our lives get discarded like it's nothing and there's not always justice for us, but we have to live on until it happens again and that wound is reopened - and we become another hashtag to add to the collection.
For you, you're looking at what mistakes your colleague may have made, what procedures they should have taken, what actions the victim may have done which may have prompted the police officer to do xyz instead.
It's a completely different perspective, one that doesn't carry the cumulative trauma that we have to carry - and thats why we'll always be on opposing sides of these things, at least in my opinion.
I will say though, I will dismiss anything to do with Blue Lives Matter, as I think the entire movement is a joke and incredibly insulting and I make no qualms about that.
My point is that you seem more likely to accept one side of the argument (for whatever reason) just as you accused her of being more likely to accept the other. It is what it is.
As for me scoffing at your link, what would you have me do? Accept it as fact just because you posted it? From a questionable source at first and missing any video to back up any of the claims.
You should know me better by now
.Well it remains to be seen, but let me ask you this, what does he gain by doing this? There are stories that come out on near enough a weekly basis illustrating the point. Why would he need to do this as opposed to pointing at one of the numerous other incidents? If he has made it up he's a monumental idiot, but let's wait and see.
I agree, let's wait and see. I just find all this timing very coincidental. Also, there's huge publicity generated to his movement this way than if he had talked about other police brutality cases at a press conference.
There is always two sides to every story. Nothing wrong with hearing out, reading about, both sides then passing a judgement based on which story seems more credible. Of course you can also get cases where since each sides is based on that person's perspective of what they saw, felt, heard , etc. that the truth is a bit harder to come by.
The thing we ask in this case, is where there other people behaving in similar ways Bennett did and they got ignored and if they did, then why? If they did not get ignored, got treated the same or very similar way, what does that mean to the story?
Certainly, while we do not know right away what sort of history any individual police officer may have (that usually comes out later), it is understandable that we do wonder about situations like this one or ones that have far worse outcomes.
The thing we ask in this case, is where there other people behaving in similar ways Bennett did and they got ignored and if they did, then why? If they did not get ignored, got treated the same or very similar way, what does that mean to the story?
Certainly, while we do not know right away what sort of history any individual police officer may have (that usually comes out later), it is understandable that we do wonder about situations like this one or ones that have far worse outcomes.
Maybe? But it's huge bad publicity once the video comes out proving that you made it up. Which is why I said he'd be a monumental idiot. Let's see.
What the actual feck? I suppose technically if the guy doesn't have a permit then the ticket is justified, but taking the mans cash too? Shit, that's harsh. A simple "move along" would have sufficed, and there certainly wasn't any need for the patronising "i'm serving the public" bullshit. Feck the police! Even the pretend ones too.
Although, don't feel too sorry for the dude, he's just been given over $30k via the GoFundMe set up for him
Ironically, that ticket could possibly be the best thing that ever happened to him. If the Rent-A-Cop hadn't been such an arse and taken his cash too, it's unlikely he would have been given much sympathy at all.I obviously wasn't being serious.
I know, that's why I didn't delve into one of my long winded posts that I end up with in here.I agree with the cite, although maybe a warning would have sufficed, depending on whether he's been warned before, or how strict they are with that particular enforcement.
The money thing is going overboard, especially as I'm assuming the officer made no attempt to determine what he made from selling, and what he had originally. Hopefully he was at least fully reimbursed, and the funding seems to have taken care of that and then some
Yeah, me too. As I said, he didn't have a permit so it's fair enough and as you say he may have been pulled for this numerous times, although in fairness, the officer didn't state that, so it does appear to be a first offence, which I feel if it was, then yeah, it's harsh. Very harsh. Again, as you and I both said, a simple "move along" would have sufficed and would definitely have avoided this. More worrying is if you read the comments, the officer there has been doxed, which I personally don't agree with, but on top of that, he's been named in person numerous times and has been accused of being a bully and that this type of behaviour isn't unusual for him. If that's the case then he needs to answer some questions.
Thanks for realising I was joking. I nearly went off on one in return as the patronising eye rolling smiley winds me up at the best of times
(thanks @Damien)Yeah, me too. As I said, he didn't have a permit so it's fair enough and as you say he may have been pulled for this numerous times, although in fairness, the officer didn't state that, so it does appear to be a first offence, which I feel if it was, then yeah, it's harsh. Very harsh. Again, as you and I both said, a simple "move along" would have sufficed and would definitely have avoided this. More worrying is if you read the comments, the officer there has been doxed, which I personally don't agree with, but on top of that, he's been named in person numerous times and has been accused of being a bully and that this type of behaviour isn't unusual for him. If that's the case then he needs to answer some questions.
Thanks for realising I was joking. I nearly went off on one in return as the patronising eye rolling smiley winds me up at the best of times
There comes a point where you have to look at the letter of the law as opposed to the spirit of the law, and how officers are interpreting it. Officers are allowed to use discretion, which can be both a good and bad thing. That's where you start seeing issues arise with different officers applying the same law different to different people. It comes into play mostly for us with unlicensed drivers. Some officers cite them and tow their car. I USUALLY cite them, tell them to get to work or wherever they're going, park it, and figure out a ride home. Or to call a licensed driver to come pick up the car. Unless they have a shit ton of prior cites for driving without a license, then they get towed.
You got me off a tangent again there
but yeah, if that officer does have a history of "bullying" people, then at the very least questions should be asked.There comes a point where you have to look at the letter of the law as opposed to the spirit of the law, and how officers are interpreting it. Officers are allowed to use discretion, which can be both a good and bad thing. That's where you start seeing issues arise with different officers applying the same law different to different people. It comes into play mostly for us with unlicensed drivers. Some officers cite them and tow their car. I USUALLY cite them, tell them to get to work or wherever they're going, park it, and figure out a ride home. Or to call a licensed driver to come pick up the car. Unless they have a shit ton of prior cites for driving without a license, then they get towed.
You got me off a tangent again there
That's fair enough and I understand completely where you are coming from there, and also the problems that discretion can cause at times if it's not consistent or if it is prejudiced or perceived to be. I do honestly have the utmost respect for decent police officers and the job they do regardless of where they have to do it.
The recent hurricanes also reminded me of one of the most heart-warming stories I have read on the internet where the New York officer bought a homeless guy some expensive boots and thermal socks during a particularly cold spell, and i'm sure it was just before a storm/hurricane was due to hit. I do feel things like that are often not picked up on or appreciated enough where at times it's far easier to attack the bad cops all the time. However, that's not to say that a lot of the stories of brutality and shootings don't deserve the attention they get, and often maybe even more, but still....... Feck, I've gone off on a tangent now too. Apologies.
That's fair enough and I understand completely where you are coming from there, and also the problems that discretion can cause at times if it's not consistent or if it is prejudiced or perceived to be. I do honestly have the utmost respect for decent police officers and the job they do regardless of where they have to do it.
The recent hurricanes also reminded me of one of the most heart-warming stories I have read on the internet where the New York officer bought a homeless guy some expensive boots and thermal socks during a particularly cold spell, and i'm sure it was just before a storm/hurricane was due to hit. I do feel things like that are often not picked up on or appreciated enough where at times it's far easier to attack the bad cops all the time. However, that's not to say that a lot of the stories of brutality and shootings don't deserve the attention they get, and often maybe even more, but still....... Feck, I've gone off on a tangent now too. Apologies.
Since we're on tangents already....I believe any instance of "cops behaving badly" should be highlighted, addressed, and figured out how to avoid it happening again. I just usually take issue with how people sometimes tend to address all cops. We're human too, we make mistakes. Yes there are bad cops, just like there's bad accountants, fishermen, barristas, etc. obviously cops have a finer line for margin due to what they do, and dealing with people's right and civil liberties, and they should be held to a high standard, and the ones not fit for the job should be removed.
That being said, people seem to sometimes overlook that we get plenty of abuse just for being cops. I won't relate it to it being the same discrimination someone gets for the colour of their skin, but just because I chose to sign up to be an officer, that the abuse is should just be accepted to be a part of the territory. I signed up to try and make a difference and because I want to help. Does that mean I should just accept that people tell me they hope my kids are raped by black people? Just because I put on a uniform, a badge and a gun, doesn't mean I'm immune to making mistakes, and taking things home on my shoulders that I don't tell my family about, because I don't want them to have to try and imagine the things we see and deal with.
Just this weekend we had felony stops on the freeway with traffic flying by, tasers deployed in a hospital after someone high on meth tried to grab an officers gun, a guy with a hole through his leg from his motorcycle crash. Then I still have to be polite and professional to the next person I pull over for going 94 in a 65 that no he can't get a break, and then listen to how it's my fault and I ruined his day/weekend/life.
In my opinion, and yes I'm obviously biased
is that there's so many cops you never hear anything about, that could tell you just as many, if not more, stories about what they have seen and dealt with, and never set a foot wrong. They shouldn't be taken for granted, or even worse, lumped into a "all cops are (insert choice of word here)"./end long tangent that I said I wouldn't go into
Acquitted of all charges
http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/ju...ack-man/ar-AArXhWI?li=BBmkt5R&ocid=spartanntp
Judge's comments:
http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/ju...ack-man/ar-AArXhWI?li=BBmkt5R&ocid=spartanntp
Judge's comments:
Strange outcome imo, based on reading the story in the MSNBC link.
He said he was going to kill him. He did kill him and supposedly planted a gun on him to back up his story about him reaching for a gun. How is he not guilty?
He said he was going to kill him. He did kill him and supposedly planted a gun on him to back up his story about him reaching for a gun. How is he not guilty?
Unfortunately or fortunately or maybe both guilt can not be based on a news article. A judge (in this case) has to weigh the evidence presented by the prosecution and the counter provided by the defense and determine if the prosecution has proven it's case beyond a reasonable doubt.
In theory anyways
Now I am not saying I think the cop is innocent, but that there is a huge difference between what we might see in a news story (which does not have to weigh the evidence) and what is presented in the actual trial.
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This sounds like a tragic case of bad luck, but one tased him, why did the other cop shoot him
You know the way you’re supposed to be ok if you obey their commands?
NSFW / NSFL - if you watch this, you're watching someone die.
So this happened yesterday, or possibly today..not sure with the time difference.
Anyway, what's people's thoughts?
They were wresting on the ground...not grounds to kill someone.
But the kid grabs something from the officer's belt (if you watch a video in the comments you see this)...more of a threat..but then he starts to move away just before he gets shot.
There's a small argument that he was a threat, but there's a much bigger argument that the officer's life wasn't in danger and it could be handled entirely differently.
So this happened yesterday, or possibly today..not sure with the time difference.
Anyway, what's people's thoughts?
They were wresting on the ground...not grounds to kill someone.
But the kid grabs something from the officer's belt (if you watch a video in the comments you see this)...more of a threat..but then he starts to move away just before he gets shot.
There's a small argument that he was a threat, but there's a much bigger argument that the officer's life wasn't in danger and it could be handled entirely differently.
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Is it the radio he grabs?
The officer knew he had his gun, as it's in his hand and I can't think of anything else on his rig that would pose a deadly threat if the young guy got it. Similarly you can see he has a gap between them and he doesn't seem to be holding anything.
Another very very poor one from what I can see so far.