Club Sale | It’s done!

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In these M&A getting a foot in the door was the hardest part, now that Sir Brexit is in he can work the individual Glazers behind the scene, and with 4 of them gagging to sell it’s only a matter of time until he gets a blocking minority, then a majority, provided the willingness is there.

He might be content with just 25% if we are back on the right track, and I can live with that even if it means profits for the Glazers. However, if the budgetary constraints or their continued ownership impedes the sporting side under INEOS, I have no doubt he will muscle thêm out. A self made capitalist doesn’t commit a tenth of his wealth just for shits and giggles.
 
I now get all the shares of control and who has what power and the main thing I take out of it is that regardless of the fact we all want the parasites out Ratcliffe simply isn’t a stupid man, this is a self made billionaire with a huge company that turns over 50 times what United does and has made more profit in a year that United have ever turned over in a year whilst Ratcliffe has been involved in takeovers bigger than United also.

It should be clear that this initial 25% is just Ratcliffe getting his foot in the door and he’s managed to get control of the footballing side of the business which is where we’ve been shocking for a decade, we’ve been brilliant on the commercial side and bringing revenue streams in has never been a problem for the club even with the parasites involved.

For every investment into the infrastructure Ratcliffe gains more of a percentage of the club so by this time next year will own 30% or possibly more as he’s apparently made an offer to buy the whole 31% that’s listed on the stock exchange, it’s also quite clear the setting up of Trawlers Limited is to avoid the dual ownership problem but you can bet your life Ineos will be massively involved through loopholes and any investment in infrastructure doesn’t get included in FFP so slowly Ratcliffe can gain more control by having Trawlers/Ineos rebuilding/modernising the stadium and training ground as well as possibly the land around the stadium.

In regards to the argument of ‘what if Ratcliffe wants x amount for transfers whilst the parasites only want to give x amount’ I’m sure I’ve read by respected journalists that Ratcliffe would put the maximum allowed personal investment (£30 million ?) into the club each year to help with FFP and cash flow but what we spend each year hasn’t really been the problem, it’s how we’ve spent it and who on that’s been shocking.

It’s clear that Ratcliffe will bring in Blanc and Brailsford as CEO and Director Of Performance respectively then it looks like the plan is Mitchell as Head Of Recruitment and Ashworth as Director Of Football who are amongst the best in those positions and which gives us a brilliant and modern footballing structure rather than seeing money men with zero footballing knowledge like Woodward and Arnold or people completely out of their depth like Murtough millions to waste on big names at the end of their career or big names to sell shirts instead of a balanced squad with hungry players with potential to be world class like we’d always been.

Is 25% ideal ? No as we all want the parasites gone for good BUT this isn’t and won’t be a continuation of how things have been for the past 10 years as Ratcliffe is a very intelligent man who’ll surround himself with other very intelligent footballing people to make sure the mistakes of the past 10 years are no longer repeated and I wouldn’t be surprised if we saw some people from the past brought back in roles either, it won’t be a quick fix and maybe not even obvious by the end of next season BUT it’s a start and for that we should be happy as we’re now almost certainly at the start of seeing the parasites being phased out seeing as four want to leave and Ratcliffe at 70 isn’t doing this to make money.
 
TrebleChamp99 said:
Merry Christmas everyone,

Just a reminder that the 300m being invested comes with more shares.

Jim knows the club needs more than 300m to turn it around and has a huge pot of gold.

As time goes on and they need more funds they can plug that into club for the exchange of more shares.

Its essentially a honey trap for the glazers,

“we need more budget for the transfer window so we’re investing 300m more, but that comes at a cost to shares”
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The Glazers turn around and say.... "no."
 
InfiniteBoredom said:
In these M&A getting a foot in the door was the hardest part, now that Sir Brexit is in he can work the individual Glazers behind the scene, and with 4 of them gagging to sell it’s only a matter of time until he gets a blocking minority, then a majority, provided the willingness is there.

He might be content with just 25% if we are back on the right track, and I can live with that even if it means profits for the Glazers. However, if the budgetary constraints or their continued ownership impedes the sporting side under INEOS, I have no doubt he will muscle thêm out. A self made capitalist doesn’t commit a tenth of his wealth just for shits and giggles.
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Spot on, let’s also not diminish the fact that he is the single sole majority shareholder and supposedly the current glazer family don’t see eye to eye.

Shouldn't be too difficult for them to be convinced to cash in for more.

They’ve only made 500m between 7 of them plenty more on the table.
 
Gavinb33 said:
The board will set the finances and they will be what they will be what they will be, spending on transfers the last 10 years hasn't been an issue it's how the money has been spent thats the issue
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As I said, now we have people trying to justify this and be happy with this arrangement. Would you have taken this at the start of the process? If not, why is everyone so keen to somehow justify this as a brand new start. SJR will probably do a better job than the Glazers on the footballing side, but are we fine with the Glazers sticking around like a bad smell, knowing they are ultimately still the owners of the club. SJR is basically a stakeholder who is going to now have to worry about ensuring the Glazers align themselves with his strategy for the football side of things.
 
The more I think about it, was a route to 100% ownership even possible as part of the deal? If they're willing to slowly sell to him but it's dependent on the market and value of the club, how can you even write that into an agreement? It's probably impossible to predict when they want to sell until that time comes, so giving him first option is probably the only way of committing to it.

If I'm wrong then tell me how you think they could have done it? People were seemingly expecting set dates for it to happen, but what is the basis of those dates? I just don't see how it could be done in a way that both parties would be able to commit to it. Glazers can't put a date on it as the club still may be worth the same amount or even less. I think it's just a case of "we think eventually the club will be worth x amount, when we get to that position then we'll sell" and Ratcliffe obviously isn't going to pay a crazy amount now if it's not yet near that value. Hence the first option.
 
WPMUFC said:


Oh this is going to be a wonderful relationship. Glazers made 500m to allow someone else to take the blame.

Can't wait for the leaks to move from the players to the boardroom when the Ineos side requests 150m for a window and the other half goes "it'll be 75m actually".

I wish I could make half a billion to shift blame. :lol:
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Exactly.

Glazers pocket more money than will be invested in the club & people are still pretending to themselves this is anything other than moving the deck chairs around on the Titanic.

We’re still fecked with FFP botg domestic & Uefa whilst the debt remains. SjR gets to play the world’s most expensive game of football manager. Manchester United football club? Oh well someone new has ‘football control’, you know of a fecking football club. $300mil not £300mil doesn’t even touch the sides given the hole the Glazers have put us in.
 
I am glad that someone else will be in charge for football stuff and i am very optimistic with rumours about Blanc and new DoF.
But about future sale; Jim only gets first option when/if Glazers decide to sell. Where are those who believed in that BS how there will be a guarantee in contract which will force Glazers to sell in next few years?
Now, with new cash flow, they can stay for years. Jim basically saved them.
 
AFC NimbleThumb said:
Exactly.

Glazers pocket more money than will be invested in the club & people are still pretending to themselves this is anything other than moving the deck chairs around on the Titanic.

We’re still fecked with FFP botg domestic & Uefa whilst the debt remains. SjR gets to play the world’s most expensive game of football manager. Manchester United football club? Oh well someone new has ‘football control’, you know of a fecking football club. $300mil not £300mil doesn’t even touch the sides given the hole the Glazers have put us in.
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A full takeover wouldn't affect FFP,

Not sure why the need to moan, we finally have someone in charge of creating a proper footballing structure at the club. Something we have been missing for years.
 
InfiniteBoredom said:
In these M&A getting a foot in the door was the hardest part, now that Sir Brexit is in he can work the individual Glazers behind the scene, and with 4 of them gagging to sell it’s only a matter of time until he gets a blocking minority, then a majority, provided the willingness is there.
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So it’s not ‘only a matter of time’ then.

People still pretending this deal was ever about full ownership. Watching people who created a fictitious outcome further lie to themselves about this situation is comical.

SjR doesn’t need full ownership he’s paid pennies [to him] for a chance to play real life FM. He’s 71. The Glazers are going nowhere & this move was Glazer first not United first.
 
I’m choosing to be mildly optimistic about this. At least having someone new in charge of the footballing side might bring about some positive changes, e.g. better recruitment.
 
pocco said:
The more I think about it, was a route to 100% ownership even possible as part of the deal? If they're willing to slowly sell to him but it's dependent on the market and value of the club, how can you even write that into an agreement? It's probably impossible to predict when they want to sell until that time comes, so giving him first option is probably the only way of committing to it.

If I'm wrong then tell me how you think they could have done it? People were seemingly expecting set dates for it to happen, but what is the basis of those dates? I just don't see how it could be done in a way that both parties would be able to commit to it. Glazers can't put a date on it as the club still may be worth the same amount or even less. I think it's just a case of "we think eventually the club will be worth x amount, when we get to that position then we'll sell" and Ratcliffe obviously isn't going to pay a crazy amount now if it's not yet near that value. Hence the first option.
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You're right, it was never possible. Which is what several people on here were repeating - there is no roadmap to 100% ownership. Glazers and Jim are both content with this arrangement.
 
Cole9 said:
I’m choosing to be mildly optimistic about this. At least having someone new in charge of the footballing side might bring about some positive changes, e.g. better recruitment.
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This where I am at, anybody but the glazers touching anything on the football side is a good thing for me. Joel and Avram pretending to be big lads when they look like rich kids playing with something daddy built and making a mess of it.

I really think some people just haven’t grasped how bad the glazers have been for us and impacted the state of the first team.
 
Champ said:
A full takeover wouldn't affect FFP,

Not sure why the need to moan, we finally have someone in charge of creating a proper footballing structure at the club. Something we have been missing for years.
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In the immediacy no, of course not [you know that’s not what I meant though but disingenuous is the flavour of the day] but would a full takeover removing the debt with some investment address the incompetence of the Glazers better & affect FFP across the course of say the next 5 years more than this? Of course it does.

Right now we get someone coming round the house straightening the pictures on the wall whilst the actual infrastructure improvements will cost more than a mere $300mil whilst the Glazers get half a billion.

When’s the last time you saw one of the world’s more successful clubs celebrating ‘football structure’? You don’t cause it’s some overblown twaddle. Hiring experienced people to do jobs is par for the course, we’ve been run so badly people are happy that we’ll finally have the bare minimum.

‘A full takeover wouldn't affect FFP’ :rolleyes:
 
AFC NimbleThumb said:
So it’s not ‘only a matter of time’ then.

People still pretending this deal was ever about full ownership. Watching people who created a fictitious outcome further lie to themselves about this situation is comical.

SjR doesn’t need full ownership he’s paid pennies [to him] for a chance to play real life FM. He’s 71. The Glazers are going nowhere & this move was Glazer first not United first.
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Did you miss the part where I said he might be happy with 25% if it works?

Unlike you dreamers, I live in the real world. The reality of the situation is since the PLC was sold to Malcolm Glazer, the club is their personal property and there’s feck all you or I or any average Utd fan can do to change that, the process to wrestle it away from them won’t be easy and any move that dilutes their control is a good thing, and never let the perfect be the enemy of the good.
 
InfiniteBoredom said:
Did you miss the part where I said he might be happy with 25% if it works?
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No I read that part for the utter nonsense it was kind of like the second part of this post & ignored it.

Enjoy your Christmas.

Turkeys voting for Christmas having this happen on Christmas Eve really is ironic.
 
Someone said:
I think the sale saga is far from over. The Glazers are basically waiting for someone to meet their valuation of the club. Jim gets first refusal when that happens, but nothing stops this from happening next month.
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What would happen say if they did start wanting to sell more shares? Is it at the price SJR has bought these at or could they set a higher price. Then what is SJR isn't willing to pay that, but someone else is. Could it lead to big problem further along?
 
Munkehboi said:
At least we have some expertise in the footballing side of the business. In reality this may be the best outcome. Guess we were a bit naive thinking the leeches would leave. At least they will relinquish the footballing side to Sir Jim's team. On paper they all look very promising. Had a read up on some and Jean Claude Blanc stands out. Plus he looks way more handsome and smoother than Richard Arnold!
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Yeah you would have a glass of fine wine with him, not a pint in the local.
 
Merry Christmas everyone, what a lovely present but a bit like all Christmas’s you never get what you really wanted but hay ho!
 
AFC NimbleThumb said:
Exactly.

Glazers pocket more money than will be invested in the club & people are still pretending to themselves this is anything other than moving the deck chairs around on the Titanic.

We’re still fecked with FFP botg domestic & Uefa whilst the debt remains. SjR gets to play the world’s most expensive game of football manager. Manchester United football club? Oh well someone new has ‘football control’, you know of a fecking football club. $300mil not £300mil doesn’t even touch the sides given the hole the Glazers have put us in.
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It's a step for the future.
We have been the highest spending club in the last 13 years and the issue with the Glazers is that they spent the money on idiotic players & managers with no strategy.

Supposedly, this is what Jim's team is going to fix, so a bit less fecking moaning and more supporting wouldn't trouble anyone.
 
InfiniteBoredom said:
Did you miss the part where I said he might be happy with 25% if it works?

Unlike you dreamers, I live in the real world. The reality of the situation is since the PLC was sold to Malcolm Glazer, the club is their personal property and there’s feck all you or I or any average Utd fan can do to change that, the process to wrestle it away from them won’t be easy and any move that dilutes their control is a good thing, and never let the perfect be the enemy of the good.
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The only sensible post so far.
Of course conveniently ignored by everyone is the finer detail from Mike Keegan that this should be considered the first step as you can’t effectively write into a contract that you will eventually buy up a public ally listed company as you’d have to make agreements with each class A share holder.

Common sense prevails.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
What would happen say if they did start wanting to sell more shares? Is it at the price SJR has bought these at or could they set a higher price. Then what is SJR isn't willing to pay that, but someone else is. Could it lead to big problem further along?
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This is the reason that I never believed in a path to 100% ownership being agreed during this process.

What if the shares are worth three times more in 2-3 years? The Glazers would never agree a future figure now with that in mind.

What if the shares are worth three times less in 2-3 years? No businessman is going to agree a future figure today when the price could substantially drop. It’s a business risk that no company would take.

I’m fully behind a Ratcliffe/Ineos full takeover. But what we’ve got is what I deemed the worst possible outcome.

Minimal investment (understandable from Ratcliffe without full ownership). No debt removal. No money to fully upgrade OT and Carrington.

The only winners in all of this are the Glazers. We are probably now stuck with them indefinitely.
 
I am mildly optimistic. Football control is now in the hands of a team of very competent people at the very least. From what I’m heard about the Ineos sporting group, they are meticulous with their analytics so you can definitely guarantee that players that aren’t up to snuff will be kicked out quickly

the issue is whether the Glazers will sanction replacements - however I will say that financially you can’t say they haven’t invested in playing staff. It’s just been on all the wrong people
 
Previously the Glazer mob would go to the NYSE for cash.

However when they reached the magic 67% that avenue was blocked.

67% being the number of shares required by a non Glazer to take full control of the club.

We reasonably thought that the Glazers would ask for a large sum to give up the control element.

However we are being told that each share, A and B, is being valued at the same sum and no other sum is being paid to the mob.

So rather than take a sum for control the Glazers are trying to engineer a change to the structure of the club whereby they can now sell class B shares to whoever they choose and those shares stay as class B shares.

Obviously, this way they can still sell full control to a third party if things don't work out with Sir Jim.

So now this deal will go to the shareholders for a vote. No doubt the Glazers will win that vote.

The question is what will happen next. Will action be taken by A class shareholders, who are aggrieved at losing out on a bumper sale.

Previously it was mentioned that there is only an action of dissent to make a complaint in the Cayman Island Law, who knows?

However the original sale at the NYSE provided a prospective shareholders with one set of rules and now they are fundamentally changing those rules, in essence, unilaterally.

Unfortunately things may run a little longer?
 
RedBanker said:
Think deeply why?

Do you really think majority stakeholders are not gonna meddle in the Football operations of a Football business?

Both the above are connected. In time you will see how.

This is the beginning of the end.
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I applaud your optimism. Have a lovely Christmas.
 
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