Murtough isn't the same level as Ratcliffe in case you didn't know. Not even Arnold is the same level as Ratcliffe.
Ratcliffe can walk in and throw out the pair of them for Michael Edwards or Paul Mitchell for example, along with an alternative CEO.
Club Sale | It’s done!
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Ratcliffe can walk in and throw out the pair of them for Michael Edwards or Paul Mitchell for example, along with an alternative CEO.
Yes
In contrast to want some on here, I won't claim to know what would happen but my opinion is that dividend taking is done for the foreseeable because that'll be part of the investment stipulations.
And even if they did take dividends in the past, all shareholders, B and A, would have got a proportional pay-out, so the Glazers never got the full amount (even if they effectively voted for them to be paid).
Can Qatar match the Glazer's valuation for the rest 75% 
Broken pencil
A PR play is more likely. Always late to bidding, making multiple offers after what you claimed was a final offer, constant "promises of fancy toys" and stuff they would do that the Glazers don't care about.
I don't care to hear about what Ratcliffe plans to do because anything anyone says is just talk to appease fans. Actions will speak for it ultimately. Saying they'll do "a, b or c" during a bidding process is pretty irrelevant as there is nothing to hold you to actually do it. I want to hear we'll be managed smartly with a modern structure and in a sustainable way, with the goal of eventually leading the way across all departments. Don't want to hear we'll invest x millions in the squad. As we already do that, unsuccessfully.
I am not a pro Ineos to be honest. I see what they are currently doing in Nice and it was an horrible sporting policy since they took over.
People in Nice are not competent and I am not really sure how they will implement a correct one at United.
Also, my big question is how the deal is structured. If I am correct the Glazers own around 69% of the club, have all the power and have all the dividends.
If Ratcliffe has 25% of the club now, will it be 100% in 3 years or 75% only and will keep 25% for the Glazers to be still in the club and getting the dividens (knowing that they will have around 75% of 5B too).
Nevertheless, my fear is both in the sporting direction (who will come replacing Arnold and Murtough) and how the big changes (such as Old Trafford, Carrington, first team, academy etc) will be decided too.
Jassim was the best because he would have wiped out the debt, the glazers etc, but Ratcliffe is still a question mark
People in Nice are not competent and I am not really sure how they will implement a correct one at United.
Also, my big question is how the deal is structured. If I am correct the Glazers own around 69% of the club, have all the power and have all the dividends.
If Ratcliffe has 25% of the club now, will it be 100% in 3 years or 75% only and will keep 25% for the Glazers to be still in the club and getting the dividens (knowing that they will have around 75% of 5B too).
Nevertheless, my fear is both in the sporting direction (who will come replacing Arnold and Murtough) and how the big changes (such as Old Trafford, Carrington, first team, academy etc) will be decided too.
Jassim was the best because he would have wiped out the debt, the glazers etc, but Ratcliffe is still a question mark
Ya. Glazers are like take the club and save it Sir Jim. We just needed the 25%. Take all of it and do whatever you want.
If he's got sporting control only, he still doesn't have full (or even majority) control over the purse strings.
How this is hard to grasp for some of you is beyond me. Basically, look at Arsenal with Kroenke and Usmanov.
Ratcliffe and Glazers might get on well now but there's no guarantee these guys won't fall out in a year and then the club is stuck in limbo.
None of this is that far-fetched or delusional, it's realistic.
Hopefully by the end of the week we will be a bit more familiar with the details given the requirements of the process and obligations to the stock exchange.
The process
The process
- It was commenced by the club. The Raine Group acted on behalf of the club and not the Glazers.
- The club will need to formally end that process, we assume this will follow the forthcoming board meeting.
- The directors are technically supposed to act in the best interest of the club and not for their personal interests. Obviously, the Glazers have their personal interests at heart however they cannot be seen to be openly acting out of self-interest.
- You would assume that the directors would need to explain why the Sir Jim deal is in the best deal for the club and in so doing for the shareholders.
- The main details of the deal would need to be released accordingly there cannot be any suggestion that there is a side deal for Sir Jim to do something extra in the future.
- No doubt they will need to explain, in some manner, to the Class A investor groups why they turned down a better deal from Jassim, however, you can guess that they will say that the alternative Jassim bid would never have seen the light of day because the largest shareholders would not be agreeable.
- If it is a deal to purchase the whole of the club, a structured purchase over a number of years, as per some wiser forum members, Woziak, and Gaffs, who referenced an American lawyer commenting in the Athletic that the argument of dissent becomes material.
- It will be interesting to see how the investor groups respond.
- If they are receiving 1 billion, then that could be divided by them in whichever way they choose. It may be that Joel doesn't take any money now etc.
- They also lose their ability to give to a new buyer overall control, 67%. It will no longer be available to a prospective purchaser accordingly they will be looking for compensation for the loss of that element. For this reason there must be a longer term agreement with Sir Jim?
- The only real motivation for investing is to see a return and not waiting for a stadium to be rebuilt. The return on the table is less appetising than the one that has been turned down, no doubt they will examine the director's duties and examine if there was any, obvious, conflict of interests.
- Hopefully has some money in his back pocket to upgrade the facilities in addition to the team. If he does clear the debts it will only be replaced by new debt payable to him, no way is he simply just giving away money when he doesn't own the club in its entirety. What is of interest will he charge or will he provide some sort of discount.
- We're told he has withdrawn. In withdrawing he has essentially ended the process however will the club return to him if the proposed deal is not as good as we believe.
- You would assume that he has spoken to the Class A investors and has been told there is little leverage for them to pursue legal action?
Jassim and the 92 foundation were never anything more than a Twitter campaign, imo.
I responded you specifically about you saying " To most united fans he has a dream job and they don’t like it", and I made it clear I was responding specifically what you were saying as I said "Just to respond directly to this point". I'm not arsed about getting further into what club he supports or has supported, for arguments sake of this specific conversation point let's agree he is a lifelong United fan.
You then said "He gets paid to talk about United. Who wouldn’t want to do that as a lifelong United fan?", and I responded that I wouldn't want that if it came at the cost of going to games, which it clearly does in his case as his content revolves around him watching the games and talking while watching. You can disagree with that, as can anyone else, that is up to you or them. That's not saying me, you, Gary Neville or anyone else is more or less of a fan, it's just my personal view which was a direct answer to your question.
Out the frying pan into the fire?
Depends on the tax situation and what those other conditions are tbh. If it's 5bn now (with all tax concerns sorted) vs 5bn over 5 years, yeah that 5bn now is better. If it's 1.5bn now at a valuation of 6bn total and 6bn in 3 years at a renewed 8bn valuation, then not so much.
Some analysts suggests a resurgent Man Utd could be worth as much as 10bn when the American market is really tapped into. Supposedly this is what made the Glazers want to pull out of selling. I would assume Ratcliffe has agreed a maximum valuation that is lower than that, but I'm quite sure it's not a flat 6bn valuation on time of full sale.
It's probably been stated previously but I suspect that it's a just a way to allow both Ineos and the Glazers to get what they want respectively at a pace and price that each want. Ineos is an actual business they can't bleed that much cash in a Football club without damaging the investment capabilities of the business that actually makes money while the Glazers wanted more money for their shares.
Ineos put themselves in a position where they can buy the club chunk by chunk from the inside.
Ineos put themselves in a position where they can buy the club chunk by chunk from the inside.
Agreed for the most part. But the fact that they leaked $1.5b immediately available for club infrastructure, area, squad I etc I think is something that they would not have said if it wasn’t true.
Obviously the Glazer's going altogether is the preferred outcome. However the damage of the Glazers has been equal parts financial leeching and operational ineptitude. Even if only half of that equation changes, that's still a step in the right direction, if the alternative is the status quo.
If anyone gets brainwashed that easily, lets just be thankful they'll following the United Stand then and not the new version of the Davidians
I actually seen a tictok of that, it was angry ginge who was on the united stand who thought that. Turned out it was his brother or cousin that was at Watford.
Anyway lets move on, we're about to get a conclusion of the non-takeover takeover. The United Stand and Goldbridge are really not that important and I think it's important we don't sidetrack the point of this thread much longer
Everyone wins, except the fans, the club and the club's sporting fortunes.
Feels like a proper political deal.
Jim fixed it for us
Taking out dividends when the "company" bleeds with debt and infrastructure need a massive upgrade seems like a really bad business solution.
Im not a business man, just a simple man who drinks beer and yell at the tv. So i might not get it.
I'd rather everyone pulled out. We're at our financial limits, the Glazers wouldn't be able to hold onto United for too many years longer and would be in a weaker position when having to put the club up for sale again. This is why I can't stand the INEOS bid, we could be looking at the Glazers having a strangle hold on our club for a further 10 years or more. They can talk about how they plan to buy them out by 2026 and all that, but unless Sir Jim worked a flanker and have some sort of cast iron obligations that the Glazers have to sell by a certain time, what's to force them to sell in the future?
I personally couldn't think of a worse case scenario that what we have right now
For this you beed the club to do well. And we have been poor for a very long time and will further fade under the Glazers
I would be very surprised if that isn't the case.
My point is that if he’s minority owner and full owner I doubt whether any transfer will be ratified between the two clubs especially with Khelafi on the board, repercussions incoming !
No argument from me on that, that was just commentary on what happened in the past which is a total disgrace and should be banned under PL rules.
You have no idea about that.
The more you analyse the Qatar bid, the more it starts to feel like smoke and mirrors.
They used social media to push their future for the club. It seems like they tapped up certain ex players too (Rio, Becks) to push their so called vision.
That's not the way serious business people operate.
If Qatar were really convinced they could have either matched Sir Jim's offer or made an offer for full control that would have blown Sir Jim out of the water. They decided not too, so it's better for everyone now if we move on and forget about them.
That’s all nonsense though. No clubs is shooting up in value unless it’s taken over as a small club and grown. Reminder, only Chelsea in the history of football has been sold past the 1b barrier
Just excuses to stay on.
People are being overwhelmingly negative. Ratcliffe is a smart guy, and this is a means to an end to get the Glazers out.
Insulting them and paying 2-3x the club value is not sensible business, and was never going to happen.
Anything that takes away some control from the Glazers is a good thing - the club has plenty of money available, it's just been woefully mismanaged.
A big bonus is that we now don't become a sportswashing operation for a backwards regime. Same way nobody really cares what Man City do, they are just fake, dull and generic.
Insulting them and paying 2-3x the club value is not sensible business, and was never going to happen.
Anything that takes away some control from the Glazers is a good thing - the club has plenty of money available, it's just been woefully mismanaged.
A big bonus is that we now don't become a sportswashing operation for a backwards regime. Same way nobody really cares what Man City do, they are just fake, dull and generic.
I still cant believe people actually pay to watch him watch games in some bizarre vicarious support. People don’t even know how to have real emotions or reactions without some dickhead influencer telling them how
I would hate to be him or anyone like him
He could come in through the hole in the roof, mission impossible stylee because let’s face it to get this club back to where it should be is going to be pretty impossible with the Glazers still stinking up the place.Does he need a key? You could probably get into old Trafford with a plastic card swiped down between the door frame and door
Yup, it just doesn't make sense to me.
From my past experience, having 'no idea' never really turns out well for those concerned.
You can, of course, keep hoping for the best but the rich people and their lackeys do not care about the well-being of the normal people and I somehow doubt that central rule is going to change in this particular case.
Please teach us about emotions and how to live life.
Some of you really are the living embodiment of irony.
Lot of wishful thinking again. There is zero proof that Ratcliffe will now be given control of how all the money will be used.
Hell, we don't even know if Ratcliffe is any better than Glazers at running a football club.
Surprised the stock went as low as $15 in the last 12 hours (Pre Market admittedly) - I knew there would be a dip but not to that degree
He doesn’t wind me up. His name isn’t even Mark. I actually find it hilarious how much some of you hang into his words. He reads the Daily Mail on a Monday morning and repeats it on his crap YouTube channel.
I don’t like any of the fan channels though - saying that, I’m not 16 years old so I’m not their target demographic.
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