Club Sale | It’s done!

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Lies:

You were freely just saying that Ratcliff is using debt to buy us when that wasn't reported.


No, as I've said many times (as have the credible articles). Ratcliff is NOT PAYING OFF THE DEBT. INEOS will lift the debt from Manchester United and place it on the holding company to manage, and they have stated they plan not to add any extra debt on top.



Correct it most likely would be this. Ie no new debt to buy the club and no new debt added on. Just a better management of the debt that exists.

Well if he does that with his current offer i'll take it all back but this isn't the same deal as that one which was reported weeks ago at the stage 1 bid. He'd be an absolutely mad man to take a 600m+ debt off of Manchester United whilst only holding a 51% stake in the club.

At that same stage we had no idea that he was willing to work with the Glazers either so
 
I can’t see Ratcliffe/INEOS cosying up with the Glazers as much as some people believe. They could say to the Glazers that they don’t believe the share value is going to increase as much as they think it will over the next few years, and offer them a premium price on more Glazer shares now.

But I agree with the sentiment that the Ratcliffe/INEOS bid is not as transparent as Qatar’s and more details need to come up from their end about it. Maybe details have been short because they’re exploring all kind of avenues like the above I mentioned and don’t want to nail down things they say with certainty.

It’s easier for Qatar because they have near unlimited wealth and can just drop all kinds of dreams for the fans, whilst INEOS has to be a bit more tactful about it because they are still a business at the end of the day.
 
Well if he does that with his current offer i'll take it all back but this isn't the same deal as that one which was reported weeks ago at the stage 1 bid. He'd be an absolutely mad man to take a 600m+ debt off of Manchester United whilst only holding a 51% stake in the club.

At that same stage we had no idea that he was willing to work with the Glazers either so
One thing I'm surprised the pro-Ratcliffe bunch haven't caught on (I'm certainly not one of them) is how even as far back as August last year, Ratcliffe talked about potentially buying himself into the club gradually to a majority stake.

I would not be surprised if his Glazers stay offer has some buyout clauses if the club (and their remaining shares) reach a certain valuation. I'm sure he won't want to pay off the Glazers at 10bn but probably at 6/7 or 8 max because he'd want the remainder for himself if he's the only one investing.
 
I can’t see Ratcliffe/INEOS cosying up with the Glazers as much as some people believe. They could say to the Glazers that they don’t believe the share value is going to increase as much as they think it will over the next few years, and offer them a premium price on more Glazer shares now.

But I agree with the sentiment that the Ratcliffe/INEOS bid is not as transparent as Qatar’s and more details need to come up from their end about it. Maybe details have been short because they’re exploring all kind of avenues like the above I mentioned and don’t want to nail down things they say with certainty.

It’s easier for Qatar because they have near unlimited wealth and can just drop all kinds of dreams for the fans, whilst INEOS has to be a bit more tactful about it because they are still a business at the end of the day.
Good post, agree with your thoughts.
 
I can’t see Ratcliffe/INEOS cosying up with the Glazers as much as some people believe. They could say to the Glazers that they don’t believe the share value is going to increase as much as they think it will over the next few years, and offer them a premium price on more Glazer shares now.

But I agree with the sentiment that the Ratcliffe/INEOS bid is not as transparent as Qatar’s and more details need to come up from their end about it. Maybe details have been short because they’re exploring all kind of avenues like the above I mentioned and don’t want to nail down things they say with certainty.

It’s easier for Qatar because they have near unlimited wealth and can just drop all kinds of dreams for the fans, whilst INEOS has to be a bit more tactful about it because they are still a business at the end of the day.
None of the bids are transparent, its just some leaks and PR. Like you mentioned Jassim's team have played the PR game very well but as with the reports that came out yesterday, their PR might have been a bit misleading.
 
What are the other options if those two are unwilling to sell?

None beyond the scenario which has been discussed before: the other four force through a restructuring of the ownership model/the shares-to-votes ratio, making it possible for a new owner to gain control even with Avram/Joel refusing to sell their shares.

But we don't know if this can be done (legally/as per the current model).

Other than that, someone could - of course - offer so much that A/J will take it and piss off. But they can't be forced to sell.
 
I can’t see Ratcliffe/INEOS cosying up with the Glazers as much as some people believe. They could say to the Glazers that they don’t believe the share value is going to increase as much as they think it will over the next few years, and offer them a premium price on more Glazer shares now.

But I agree with the sentiment that the Ratcliffe/INEOS bid is not as transparent as Qatar’s and more details need to come up from their end about it. Maybe details have been short because they’re exploring all kind of avenues like the above I mentioned and don’t want to nail down things they say with certainty.

It’s easier for Qatar because they have near unlimited wealth and can just drop all kinds of dreams for the fans, whilst INEOS has to be a bit more tactful about it because they are still a business at the end of the day.
Not sure I’d call the Qatar bid ‘transparent’ exactly
 
One thing I'm surprised the pro-Ratcliffe bunch haven't caught on (I'm certainly not one of them) is how even as far back as August last year, Ratcliffe talked about potentially buying himself into the club gradually to a majority stake.

I would not be surprised if his Glazers stay offer has some buyout clauses if the club (and their remaining shares) reach a certain valuation. I'm sure he won't want to pay off the Glazers at 10bn but probably at 6/7 or 8 max because he'd want the remainder for himself if he's the only one investing.
Not exactly this, but Castles reported something similar, that the Joel and Avram would be offered a premium if they sell in 1 year and (I believe) a little less of a premium if they sell in 2 years. If they don't sell by then, the premium offer is gone.

So if true, the situation is this. Joel and Avram refuse to sell now short of their full valuation if the 6bn (at 69%, divided by 6 Glazers, thats almost 700m each). The other 4 Glazers do want to sell below that amount (at a 5bn valuation, that would be 575m each). But neither SJR nor SJ can offer J&A 700m, while offering the other 4 575m at the same time. So they give the other 4 the 575m now, but then J&A will get their 700m (perhaps even more) if they leave in 1-2 years. If they don't accept that, their shares will realistically be worth closer to what the NYSE valuation is.

*The amounts per sibling listed above are not exact, as some have sold off shares in the past and therefore own different percentages. For the sake of ease, I just calculated based on the the average, if they all owned the same amount.

**Obviously, this is based on reports which isn't necessarily factual, so it's just with the caveat of IF Castles report is true.
 
He literally picked it up because it was thrown at him and then looked like he was handing it over to someone. Nothing in it at all
 
They literally cut the clip early to stop it from showing him handing it back
 
The best green and gold moment was Beckham putting on the scarf in the AC Milan match
 
I’ve no doubt that they have the actual money to outbid INEOS, but as they have repeatedly stated - they won’t bid recklessly to buy the club. If they did it would have significant knock on effects for future purchases, and that’s bad business.
Bad business is having United in the clutch if their hands and then outbid by a 70 year old whose worth a fraction of their combined wealth?
 
Bad business is having United in the clutch if their hands and then outbid by a 70 year old whose worth a fraction of their combined wealth?
Having money doesn't mean there is no limit to what you're willing to pay for an asset.
 
Bad business is having United in the clutch if their hands and then outbid by a 70 year old whose worth a fraction of their combined wealth?
Problem is when the owners are greedy fecks who are even more interested in having an income of Manchester United for years to come.
 
What are the chances Jassim's dad saw utd's books and pulled the plug on the deal:nervous:
 
The club needs a complete renew. I’ve come to terms with Qatar now as basically I don’t want anymore leaches.

Not ideal but Jim will be worse. The fans will not take to him. That’s a given. He’s not a horse I would back.

A 70 year old owning us is ridiculous when we should be looking to build towards the future.

Jim will become public enemy number 1 here in time if he wins.
 
What are the chances Jassim's dad saw utd's books and pulled the plug on the deal:nervous:
"But daaaaaaaaaad..."

"No, Jassim. I'm putting my foot down. You got a PS5 for your birthday and promised you wouldn't ask for anything else this year."
 
The club needs a complete renew. I’ve come to terms with Qatar now as basically I don’t want anymore leaches.

Not ideal but Jim will be worse. The fans will not take to him. That’s a given. He’s not a horse I would back.

A 70 year old owning us is ridiculous when we should be looking to build towards the future.

Jim will become public enemy number 1 here in time if he wins.
Shouldn’t you be on the pitch at Anfield? :wenger:
 
The club needs a complete renew. I’ve come to terms with Qatar now as basically I don’t want anymore leaches.

Not ideal but Jim will be worse. The fans will not take to him. That’s a given. He’s not a horse I would back.

A 70 year old owning us is ridiculous when we should be looking to build towards the future.

Jim will become public enemy number 1 here in time if he wins.
Not sure how his age matters. Ultimately he is a proven investor in sports teams and an actual fan.
 
So we're going to be stuck with the Glazers in a lesser capacity, and be majority owned by Ratcliffe who has a poor record at his current football clubs.

:(

I know some people don't want Qatar, but their offer is infinitely better. There's no comparison. Seems like that isn't happening though.
 
Knighton?

Bingo

If Daddy pulled support it doesn't mean they just pull out right away. They can save a little face by pushing the narrative that they had the much better bid but the Glazers were too greedy.
 
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