Climate Change | UN Report: Code Red for humanity

SilentWitness said:
How many of you lads that are crying about the extinction of animals eat meat?
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I eat meat but I've drastically cut down my consumption from probably every day of the week to two or three days, in the last few years.

Eating meat is a natural way of life across Earth across almost every species in the food chain so it's hardly relevant, the problem is that we as humans eat and waste too much meat. It's a prime example of something we live beyond our means with. Meat consumption can continue in the future but we need to drastically cut down on it, like with all other climate influencing aspects.

It's also a silly argument seeing as the animals we eat are the ones least likely to go extinct :lol:
 
Massive Spanner said:
It's also a silly argument seeing as the animals we eat are the ones least likely to go extinct :lol:
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I dunno. I've always found the I don't have a problem with eating animal x but i'll happily eat animal y argument weird. Same now with the I care about a random rare hummingbird going extinct but I don't care about the slaughter of millions of cows and pigs.

Anyway, once again colonialism is being overlooked aswell as meat consumption.
 
syrian_scholes said:
What's the point of making her feel so scared that she has to cry and say stuff like they ruined her childhood, I mean really why give such responsibilities to a kid, and I've seen with war the power of using kids to your agenda and I think it's unethical.
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Yes. Understand. What I am saying is that it is the children of this world who are choosing to protest. They are doing it for the right reasons; because they have no confidence in the world leaders.
I do worry for Greta and she must be supported in what she is doing. There are people who will do anything and everything to break her. Why. Because they are scared of what she stands for. It is time for the Green movements including extinction rebellion to give her the support that she needs to allow her to champion the climate change movement.
 
SilentWitness said:
I dunno. I've always found the I don't have a problem with eating animal x but i'll happily eat animal y argument weird. Same now with the I care about a random rare hummingbird going extinct but I don't care about the slaughter of millions of cows and pigs.

Anyway, once again colonialism is being overlooked aswell as meat consumption.
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I don't particularly disagree with this thought but I simply don't see how it's relevant to the broader issue. We all know we need to cut down drastically on meat consumption regardless of animals going extinct. Likewise there's nothing wrong with it being upsetting to know that so many of these animals are going extinct, regardless of whether you partake in a natural facet of human existence.
 
Vidic_In_Moscow said:
Just saw it again on TV. She's absolutely fallen to bits. There's no place for that. Her parents have failed her nobody else. If everyone acted the way she did we all might as well get it over with and kill ourselves now as there is simply no hope in anything and nothing to live for.

"You have stolen my dreams and my childhood" Jesus Christ get a grip, take this young girl away from the limelight before it's too late.

Maybe I'm just not blessed to be with 'the science' or too stoopid to understand it durr but you have to be more optimistic than that.
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her parents should be proud. she is an amazing human being.

if we keep doing what we are doing, there is no hope. read the science. there is NO optimism unless we change our behaviour.

the fact you think she's just in this for the limelight really shows how little you know, what am embarrassing post this is.

11101 said:
We've been at the beginning of one for the last 20 years. At least.

I remember being told in school that Amsterdam would be under water by now. No doubt action needs to be taken but the seriousness has always been hugely exaggerated by a variety of pressure groups, and are we really now going down the road of allowing Greta Thurnberg, a child, to set government policy?
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read the science. the fact you don't think climate change is serious tells me you haven't read it enough.

Cait Sith said:
She can mentally break down infront of TV all she wants. Nothing is going to change dramatically because you'd have to abandon capitalism for real changes and it's not going to happen.
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so we should just not care and feck the world then? capitalism responds to the demands of the people. we have to start somewhere.
 
Buster15 said:
Yes. Understand. What I am saying is that it is the children of this world who are choosing to protest. They are doing it for the right reasons; because they have no confidence in the world leaders.
I do worry for Greta and she must be supported in what she is doing. There are people who will do anything and everything to break her. Why. Because they are scared of what she stands for. It is time for the Green movements including extinction rebellion to give her the support that she needs to allow her to champion the climate change movement.
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But the thing is she is a child still, it's not fair to place so much responsibility on her, the green movements should have been the one giving the speech, not let her go through such emotional distress, it's not fair.
 
syrian_scholes said:
But the thing is she is a child still, it's not fair to place so much responsibility on her, the green movements should have been the one giving the speech, not let her go through such emotional distress, it's not fair.
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she's not in distress because of the pressure or responsibility on her, she's in distress because adults are killing the planet.
 
syrian_scholes said:
But the thing is she is a child still, it's not fair to place so much responsibility on her, the green movements should have been the one giving the speech, not let her go through such emotional distress, it's not fair.
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This is a difficult one. Yes I do understand that she has been put in a terribly high pressure position. It is almost like her against the politicians and big business. And as I have mentioned they will do their utmost to break her and rubbish her image.
But on the other hand she has become the figurehead, around which millions of young people have rallied around.
I don’t think that it will have affected her that much but now is the time for her to be given the vital support necessary to allow her to continue her brilliant work.
 
syrian_scholes said:
What's the point of making her feel so scared that she has to cry and say stuff like they ruined her childhood, I mean really why give such responsibilities to a kid, and I've seen with war the power of using kids to your agenda and I think it's unethical.
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Until just now I wasn't aware that Greta Thunberg has been diagnosed with Asperger's syndrome and various other mental disorders. This probably explains the bolded part of your post and her behaviour in general.

I would say it's probably not a great idea to make an underaged kid that might be struggling with mental illness the poster child of the environmental lobby and expose her to the public pressure and backlash of hundreds of million if not billions of people.
 
SilentWitness said:
Same now with the I care about a random rare hummingbird going extinct but I don't care about the slaughter of millions of cows and pigs.
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But you said it yourself. They're rare. That's the whole point right? If they're killed off completely there's no turning the clock back and undoing our errors.

Cait Sith said:
Good luck with solar energy.
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I think you don't know much about solar energy. It doesn't matter if its cloudy or rainy, multiple different wavelengths of light still pentrate through clouds and make the panel work. You don't need direct sunlight and in fact the panels themselves aren't very effecient in very hot climates. It's a snowy climate thats the main issue as the snow can cover the panel completely and damage them. Hence they're best used in temperate climates.
 
syrian_scholes said:
But the thing is she is a child still, it's not fair to place so much responsibility on her, the green movements should have been the one giving the speech, not let her go through such emotional distress, it's not fair.
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She's 16 not 8. It's a bit patronising to say a 16 year old can't make their own decisions on this, she believes strongly in her views but should stay at home because she's just 16?

She shouldn't have to be up there as our governments should be taking action and adults should be protesting but most of the population is apathetic at best or ignorant/idiotic at worst so why shouldn't young adults take action, because it makes the rest of us feel bad?
 
syrian_scholes said:
But the thing is she is a child still, it's not fair to place so much responsibility on her, the green movements should have been the one giving the speech, not let her go through such emotional distress, it's not fair.
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It hasn't been placed on her... She sees nobody picking up the responsibility, and therefore has taken it upon herself.

People who think she's been thrust into this have no clue.
 
Smores said:
Cows aren't going extinct the last time i checked.
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That's missing the point, the meat industry has one of the largest carbon footprints of all industries.

Not that I think he's got a point by trying to undermine credibility to draw attention away from irrefutable facts...
 
Eriku said:
That's missing the point, the meat industry has one of the largest carbon footprints of all industries.

Not that I think he's got a point by trying to undermine credibility to draw attention away from irrefutable facts...
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Smores said:
Cows aren't going extinct the last time i checked.
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RedSky said:
But you said it yourself. They're rare. That's the whole point right? If they're killed off completely there's no turning the clock back and undoing our errors.
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I'm completely for changes in our environmental impacts. I just think that if you're going to look at one component you need to look at all of them. I don't see how people can be environmentalists without being concerned about colonialism and being a vegetarian/vegan and vice versa. All are linked.
 
Eriku said:
That's missing the point, the meat industry has one of the largest carbon footprints of all industries.

Not that I think he's got a point by trying to undermine credibility to draw attention away from irrefutable facts...
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Yeah but that's a general point rather than the two specific being related. We as a household now do 2 meat free days but I've flown 8 flights in last 6 months so really it makes no difference. Individual actions are a very very small slice of the solution it might make us feel like we're doing something but it's just that for self satisfaction.
 
stepic said:
you literally said that 'the seriousness has always been hugely exaggerated by a variety of pressure groups'.

the seriousness is evident from the science.
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'Seriousness is exaggerated' does not mean 'not serious'. That should be obvious.


Besides, the falling birth rate will do more for climate change than anything we could actively do.
 
Smores said:
She's 16 not 8. It's a bit patronising to say a 16 year old can't make their own decisions on this, she believes strongly in her views but should stay at home because she's just 16?

She shouldn't have to be up there as our governments should be taking action and adults should be protesting but most of the population is apathetic at best or ignorant/idiotic at worst so why shouldn't young adults take action, because it makes the rest of us feel bad?
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First of all I didn't say she should stay at home and not say anything, I do think what she said is brave and I admire her for it, but I also think it's unethical to make a a 16 y.o girl suffer and whatever the circumstances she should get help to be able to enjoy life no matter what imo, it's all well and good to have opinions, it's not okay to let it drive a 16 y.o to depression.
Eriku said:
It hasn't been placed on her... She sees nobody picking up the responsibility, and therefore has taken it upon herself.

People who think she's been thrust into this have no clue.
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I never said she's been thrust into this but of course tell me more about how I have no clue because I disagree with making her suffer, not with the point she is making.

I'm just expressing an opinion here and I'm entitled to without someone calling me clueless because they disagree.
 
syrian_scholes said:
First of all I didn't say she should stay at home and not say anything, I do think what she said is brave and I admire her for it, but I also think it's unethical to make a a 16 y.o girl suffer and whatever the circumstances she should get help to be able to enjoy life no matter what imo, it's all well and good to have opinions, it's not okay to let it drive a 16 y.o to depression.

I never said she's been thrust into this but of course tell me more about how I have no clue because I disagree with making her suffer, not with the point she is making.

I'm just expressing an opinion here and I'm entitled to without someone calling me clueless because they disagree.
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You talk as if someone's been driving her to depression. It's the situation that does it, and if you would like for that to change, figure out how the feck to solve climate change. You're getting the horse before the cart.

I knew I'd come to regret the clueless line, I usually try to be very moderate in how I reply to people, but I just can't believe the way people are framing this. Sorry about that.
 
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Smores said:
Yeah but that's a general point rather than the two specific being related. We as a household now do 2 meat free days but I've flown 8 flights in last 6 months so really it makes no difference. Individual actions are a very very small slice of the solution it might make us feel like we're doing something but it's just that for self satisfaction.
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Sure, but consumer behavior drives markets to a certain extent... one can't just insist on governments and coporations doing their bit, they won't unless pressured.
 
11101 said:
'Seriousness is exaggerated' does not mean 'not serious'. That should be obvious.


Besides, the falling birth rate will do more for climate change than anything we could actively do.
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semantics. the science tells us that we need to treat this with the utmost seriousness, that's all that matters.

yes, that will help. but it still won't be enough if we keep burning fossil fuels and chopping down rain forests every day.
 
I really don't know enough about the climate change to hold a discussion with someone more informed but it's absolutely wonderful to see how a 16 year old girl with Asperger syndrome rattles so many middle-aged men. I hope my daughter is as driven and intelligent as this young lady at her age.
 
Denis79 said:
I really don't know enough about the climate change to hold a discussion with someone more informed but it's absolutely wonderful to see how a 16 year old girl with Asperger syndrome rattles so many middle-aged men. I hope my daughter is as driven and intelligent as this young lady at her age.
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This exactly, i doubt any youngsters around her age feel sorry for her she seems to be an inspiration to them
 
syrian_scholes said:
but I also think it's unethical to make a a 16 y.o girl suffer and whatever the circumstances she should get help to be able to enjoy life no matter what imo, it's all well and good to have opinions, it's not okay to let it drive a 16 y.o to depression.
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it's unethical to destroy a planet that children like Greta won't be able to grow up and live in. that's the bigger point, a point that she herself is making. the stakes are far higher than Greta's personal emotional wellbeing, and she will be the first one to tell you that.
 
stepic said:
semantics. the science tells us that we need to treat this with the utmost seriousness, that's all that matters.

yes, that will help. but it still won't be enough if we keep burning fossil fuels and chopping down rain forests every day.
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Are you a scientist then reading the raw data? Or are you just reading the interpretations of it? Because those have been saying the world is going to end for decades. After a while you begin to realise we have a little more rope than we think.
 
11101 said:
Are you a scientist then reading the raw data? Or are you just reading the interpretations of it? Because those have been saying the world is going to end for decades. After a while you begin to realise we have a little more rope than we think.
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Wrong. The latest climate data shows that the rate of change is accelerating.
We were first warned of the problem in the 1980's. Well over 30 years ago.
And during that time humanity has been making the problem significantly worse. And during that time the increase in CO2 output has continued to increase.
So. My question to you is why do you think we have a little more rope than we think when the overwhelming scientific data says the opposite.
 
11101 said:
Are you a scientist then reading the raw data? Or are you just reading the interpretations of it? Because those have been saying the world is going to end for decades. After a while you begin to realise we have a little more rope than we think.
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to be clear: are you saying that scientists have been saying the world should have already ended by now? (incorrect) or that they have been warning us for decades about the dire consequences for the planet if we don't change? (correct)
 
11101 said:
We've been at the beginning of one for the last 20 years. At least.

I remember being told in school that Amsterdam would be under water by now. No doubt action needs to be taken but the seriousness has always been hugely exaggerated by a variety of pressure groups, and are we really now going down the road of allowing Greta Thurnberg, a child, to set government policy?
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What are you on about? Scientists have repeatedly underestimated how quickly various effects of climate change would happen.
 
Wibble said:
If she is an idiot for speaking truth what does that make the rest of us?

And dismissing her as an idiot on the basis of her being a young girl is just a symptom of what is wrong with the world.

Can't win, so don't try.
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She's an idiot because her grandstanding is just that. She's not giving practical and workable solutions. She's not providing any answers, she's just shouting with righteous indignation. She's yelling at democratically elected people who can be hired and fired by their populace if said populace disagree on their climate stance. She has the right to want change, but other people have to right to say "you're either not proposing anything or not proposing anything workable". This is obvious of course because she's an idiot, not a scientist actively researching green technologies or an engineer building them... Just a 16 year old girl.

She's essentially stating either a) Oh my god you should be ashamed of yourselves for having sex as this is resulting in the spreading of STI's or b) no-one should have sex as that's the only way to limit the spreading of STI's. Neither is a position that holds any practical weight.

The non-idiots are the ones practically changing the world to reduce these effects, whilst not implying that a return to the stone ages is the answer. The scientists developing electric cars and artificial lab grown meat for example.

That's before even considering the fact that her presence causes a huge carbon footprint in and of itself.
 
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