Champions League Round of 16 fixtures
- Thread starter Sojiro
- Start date
Except, you could probably turn that score around in a video game if you're at least somewhat decent at it, and a FIFA game probably doesn't last for weeks.
But yeah, other than that it's exactly like it.
Something that occurred to me a few months ago that has subsequently come to pass.
Arsenal and indeed many of our other rivals like to bash the rich clubs about their sugar daddies and lottery money etc, but in truth who is actually playing the game for footballing reasons?
When Arsenal took on Olympiacos in their final group game they had the chance to go above Schalke if they won and Schalke drew or lost.
Because they were/are chasing 4th and had a league game the following weekend, and Arsenal were already qualified for the knockouts, Wenger fielded a weak team.
They subsequently lost the game 2-1 and Schalke drew 2-2 meaning they could have finished top with a win. I said at the time, I bet that comes back to bite him, and it has.
However that doesn't seem to matter to Wenger or the board or whoever is running this show, because as long as they get 4th place every season 6 group games and 1 or 2 knockout rounds thats enough.
So I ask, who is actually treating the whole thing like football? Arsenal who are not actually bothered about the competitions, just making sure they are in them next season. Or Chelsea who put everything into winning it last season?
Some may say that we are the reason they are in that position, but us alone are not the reason for this, after all United have had no problems, and Spurs have managed well enough. Arsenal/Arsene treat the competitions like businesses. The domestic cups don't matter, all that matters is a top four finish and 6,8, or maybe 10 if they are lucky champions league games. What a depressing scenario.
Arsenal and indeed many of our other rivals like to bash the rich clubs about their sugar daddies and lottery money etc, but in truth who is actually playing the game for footballing reasons?
When Arsenal took on Olympiacos in their final group game they had the chance to go above Schalke if they won and Schalke drew or lost.
Because they were/are chasing 4th and had a league game the following weekend, and Arsenal were already qualified for the knockouts, Wenger fielded a weak team.
They subsequently lost the game 2-1 and Schalke drew 2-2 meaning they could have finished top with a win. I said at the time, I bet that comes back to bite him, and it has.
However that doesn't seem to matter to Wenger or the board or whoever is running this show, because as long as they get 4th place every season 6 group games and 1 or 2 knockout rounds thats enough.
So I ask, who is actually treating the whole thing like football? Arsenal who are not actually bothered about the competitions, just making sure they are in them next season. Or Chelsea who put everything into winning it last season?
Some may say that we are the reason they are in that position, but us alone are not the reason for this, after all United have had no problems, and Spurs have managed well enough. Arsenal/Arsene treat the competitions like businesses. The domestic cups don't matter, all that matters is a top four finish and 6,8, or maybe 10 if they are lucky champions league games. What a depressing scenario.
Point well made, and their finishing 2nd increased our chance of getting Real Madrid in the last 16.
So you'll play full strength team in the Europa league 3 days before our FA cup tie ?
Good good.
(Assuming you go through in both that is. )
I've hinted at those points regarding the lack of effort of teams like Tottenham to win stuff like the Europa League. It's a club that (accordingly to what other poster said) hasn't won anything better than a Carling Cup for some 20 years.
History is made of trophies, not of 4th places. It's understandable now, given how the football world works these days, but I think it will look a bit stupid some 30 years from now.
History is made of trophies, not of 4th places. It's understandable now, given how the football world works these days, but I think it will look a bit stupid some 30 years from now.
Try explaining that to those idiotic City fans who moan and moan about their Uefa coefficient and refuse to take the Europa League seriously.
Try explaining that to those idiotic City fans who moan and moan about their Uefa coefficient and refuse to take the Europa League seriously.
You're joking but I actually registered on their forum to tell them that on a specific thread they had moaning about their UEFA coefficient.
its all money nowadays.
The United I grew up supporting is fast disappearing. It is becoming a money making machine.
Sure I will support them always....if only because it will be very hard to accept the state of the game now is controlling the direction in which we are headed.
I feel certain its a matter of time before some huge corporation or super rich individual buys us over.
The United I grew up supporting is fast disappearing. It is becoming a money making machine.
Sure I will support them always....if only because it will be very hard to accept the state of the game now is controlling the direction in which we are headed.
I feel certain its a matter of time before some huge corporation or super rich individual buys us over.
I hope not
There are variables of course, I am treating the competitions you want to win as the EPL, CL and maybe the FA cup.
I have no problem if Wenger wants to rest his players in the carling cup when they have important game at the weekend.
But to rest them in an important CL game because of 4th place, which resulted in them getting Bayern instead of what could have been Galatasaray ( albiet meaning them facing up to Drogba again
) shows that they are more concerned about getting into the same competition by effectively throwing or disregarding the current campaign.Europa league I can understand people blooding younger players into Europe, its an awkward time of the week, they're often away to teams in eastern Europe and theres a lot of them. 4th place is more important than that, but not the champions league itself.
I was half serious, I really don't understand why it's so hard for City fans to grasp the concept of Uefa coefficients, winning the PL does not give them any points towards it.
Most of them fail to comprehend that...
Nah, quite a few of them seem to think they should be ahead of the likes of Porto because they're the Champions of the best league in the world and are super-uber-rich.
Exactly, they also fail to notice that the German champions who topped their group were actually in pot 4.
What have Arsenal and Oscar Pitorious got in common ? It doesn't matter if they've got two legs or not they're both fecked !
Wow didnt realise that, thought Ajax might have been the pot 4 team. When was the last time a Pot 4 team topped their group at all, let alone a group of death?
Well topping the group was not really in their hands so resting players for the league game wasn't that bad an idea.
Well let's put it like that Bayern beat Arsenal comfortably with 3-1 at the Emirates without even showing their A game.
I think tonight was more a showcase of how bad Arsenal are atm than what Bayern is really capable of.
I think tonight was more a showcase of how bad Arsenal are atm than what Bayern is really capable of.
Wasn't in their hands, but it was still quite a good possibility.
Montpellier were at home and werent completely hopeless, and Arsenal only need Schalke not to win.
I don't think you can excuse resting players for a CL tie which still means something. Ultimately it has led to them being paired with the last competitions second best team.
And how poor the PL has become.
Not least forgetting, Arsenal still have a shout of the top four.
How?
Arsenal are frigging 5th. I'm sure that United, City or Chelsea would do a hell of a lot worse to the team sitting in 5th place in the Bundesliga.
How great is the Bundesliga?
Might I say, I don't watch it, but Leverkusen looked bloody toothless against Benfica, and they were fielding a very close-to-best XI, and were clearly interested in winning that match.
Bayern is superb, Dortmund look great, but below that there isn't that much evidence for what most of those teams are capable. Other than Schalke a couple of seasons ago and the obvious Bayern has anyone done anything of note in the CL?
Might I say, I don't watch it, but Leverkusen looked bloody toothless against Benfica, and they were fielding a very close-to-best XI, and were clearly interested in winning that match.
Bayern is superb, Dortmund look great, but below that there isn't that much evidence for what most of those teams are capable. Other than Schalke a couple of seasons ago and the obvious Bayern has anyone done anything of note in the CL?
Bayern and Dortmund. I maintain that the Bundesliga as a whole is not up there with EPL and La Liga. It is improving, though.
So no real surprises thus far, hopefully the quarters throws up some better ties.
Freiburg ?
My first point relates to the second one I tried to make. If Arsenal on the basis of tonight's performance are only a few points off qualifying for the CL again next season, what does it say about the league generally? Whereas before you had four strong teams, now you have a mix-match.
I didn't mean the Bundesliga had improved. Just there has been a noticable decline in English football the last few seasons when you base it on European performances.
It's crazy how many people think quality of league = quality of top team or top 2/3 teams.
Well, it wasn't like the 5th place team where Arsenal are right now won the whole freaking competition last time around. Oh Wait....
Bundesliga is still the 3rd best league in the world, comfortably ahead of Serie A.
Haven't had a winner from there in quite a while mind. Despite being losing finalists in 3 out of their past 4.
What's this based on ?
I would say they are pretty close right now. Serie A has slightly better quality teams mid table and towards the bottom than the Bundesliga.
I've never been a fan of Serie A but that's surely stretching it a bit. I'd wager Italian teams downwards from the fourth place or so don't look too shabby in comparison with their German counterparts.
It's crazy how many people think quality of league = quality of top team or top 2/3 teams.
Well you'd have a point if it was a one off occurrence, but continued dominance of a league in the Champions League suggests something.
And Italy has been disappointing in Europe recently.
Which league is this exactly ? And what does it suggest ?
If PSG win the CL this season, what would it suggest ?
Well.. none at the moment. I've not seen dominance of Europe by a particular league since the Premier League had it's run from 2004 till 2009 ish. La Liga is close, the way it's clubs are doing in the UEFA cup and Champions League.
If PSG win the CL this season, it says nothing about their league. Where are the other clubs from France? Can PSG keep it up? Those questions are key.
Based on the UEFA co-efficient.
Italy are on 61.314
Germany are on 75.471
England are on 78.535
Spain have now overtaken us on 84.596
Germanys lead over Italy is pretty big.
Scary thought of us falling below Italy and only having 3 champions league places.
Arsene would not be happy!
So, if PSG can keep it up then it would mean French league is amongst the top ones ?
And who else except Barca has been there from Spain in the CL in recent times ? Their clubs do well in the Europa league yeah, but they take it more seriously than English clubs. Chelsea for example are pretty likely to rest players for a FA cup tie against us in the next round of the Europa league.
Italy has plenty of good teams. Juventus, Milan, Napoli, Lazio, Fiorentina, Inter and Roma are all competitive, I don't think any other league has 6 or 7 teams who could realistically maintain a title challenge in any given season. It also has plenty of quality beneath that with less known sides like Catania, Cagliari and Udinese ready to surprise. Serie A has become underrated lately - it's not as good as it was in 90s when it was clearly the best league in the world by some distance but it's still a damn good league. They'll be left with only Juventus in QFs but England will have one team at that stage at best.
By the way, I just realised that currently Bayern, PSG and Juventus are strong favourites in their ties, United and Porto also have to be favourites given the results of first legs and in tomorrow games Galatasaray and Barcelona should be favs. If Shakhtar managed to beat Dortmund in the 2nd leg we might have teams from 8 countries in quarter-finals, all favourites to win their respective leagues this season. How cool would that be?
By the way, I just realised that currently Bayern, PSG and Juventus are strong favourites in their ties, United and Porto also have to be favourites given the results of first legs and in tomorrow games Galatasaray and Barcelona should be favs. If Shakhtar managed to beat Dortmund in the 2nd leg we might have teams from 8 countries in quarter-finals, all favourites to win their respective leagues this season. How cool would that be?
Spain are potentially quite weak in Europe this season, with Real madrid at a disadvantage and both Valencia and Malaga both suffering defeats in their first legs.
In the Europa its not a lot different with Atletico 0-2 down after their home tie, although Levante look certain to go through.
That made me laugh. Lies and Statistics!Somehow English football has managed to stay pretty much 1st or 2nd in the last few years, despite doing relatively crap in the Champions League and actually crap in the Europa League. It helps that no English team ever looses all 6 of their Europa League games, and they almost all get through the playoff rounds.
But we are requiring more and more, one team to go nearly all the way. United 2011, Chelsea 2012.
We'll be 3rd by 2016 in my opinion.
Im not sure that Gala should be favourites, Schlake are not mugs.