Totally agree, perfect for what's needed or Koulibaly even Maguire has too many mistakes in his game!
Centre Back... Who do we go for?
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Totally agree, perfect for what's needed or Koulibaly even Maguire has too many mistakes in his game!
Bit early to be saying that. Jaap was one of the all time great defenders.
the cost is pretty much irrelevant these days, the market is inflated and will charge accordingly. Take Liverpool, their defence was a joke last season. They over paid on VVD and we all laughed at the outrageous price they paid. But he was exactly what they needed, and the difference he has made to their backline is night and day. Overpriced as feck but they lacked a leader, due to their attacking game they needed a defender comfortable on the ball and strong in the air. He ticked all those boxes for them and the change was almost immediate. Some of us are too fixated on buying just simply the best defender out there. A) they aren't always attainable, we've heard stories from the likes of Herandez, Simeone and Boateng how they knocked us back. B) we did that with Pogba, ie bought what we thought was the best player out there for that position. He wasn't what we needed, we needed someone who can control a game. We need to buy for what we need and not because we think this or that person is the best at their position. We need exactly what Liverpool needed last season, good on the ball, organiser and strong in the air. If 70 mill is the going rate, then so be it. We basically paid that for Bailly and Lindelof combinded anyway.
The cost is relevant because it prevents purchases in other areas, unless you think we have an unlimited budget in a window. Especially if the player is a mistake and we can't get rid, hence why I said expensive mistake.
Yes we didn pay that for 2 players, who if you believe the manager now are also mistakes. We have to actually sell those players at some point, we also have Smalling and Jones and even Rojo who we haven't been able to shift in 3 summers.
I am happy for us to spend 70m on a CB, I am not happy for us to spend 70m on a CB who isn't any better than what we have, and that is my genuine belief he isn't better.
He would get thrown about left, right and centre in the PL. Have you seen PSG's new kit pictures. He looks as lightweight as neymar. Bailly is quick, aggressive and assertive. Yet he is the only player ive seen that gets shorter as he jumps. We need a strong defender who's good in the air and decent on the ball. Alderweireld was the obvious choice. Varane is a dream that will never happen. Skriniar is an option.
central defence is one of the key areas we need to improve. Jose doesn't have confidence in the defenders we have. We played 2 defensive mids v Burnley to give them protection. The fact that 3 high profile central defenders have made public they knocked us back shows how much we pursued that. The only other area we really need to immediately address is right wing. a club our size could have addressed that in one window, plus we've a fair few players we could sell, esp in central defence to fund such buys.How can anyone say Maguire isn't better than what we have. He is better on the ball, he is better in the air, he is better in the tackle than anyone we have. Plus he knows how to organise those around him. We don't have anyone who can do that. In an era of the high press, our defenders are prone, due to most of them crumbling under the slightest bit of pressure. Who would you suggest. I can name better defenders that Maguire myself, but for what we need he would fit seemlessly. As I said I don't esp rate VVD but he was exactly what Liverpool needed. Buy what we need, not the shiniest new toy.
He yet to show he can improve a defence imo. England were not very good defensively at the world cup and neither were Leicester last season.
I have no issue with us spending money on a CB, I would have loved us to sign Alderweireld last season.
I also recognise though that we had one of the best defensive records in the league last season and the season before that and also the season before that. I also recognise that players like Jones, Bailly and Smalling in a United shirt have show very good defensive displays, better than I have seen from Maguire. I agree though he is good on the ball, I just don't think hes a very good defender.
If it wasn't for Shaws recovery I would have said that fullback was our weakest area. I think if we would have secured a RW or fullbacks that could deliver quality into the box we could have improved significantly this season upon last season with the same set of CBs.
I agree the CBs we have are very poor. We have quantity not quality. Jones has to go. As does one of Rojo and Smalling. However, it is not about shiny toys. Maguire had one average season in a team that sits back and a good world cup surrounded by 4 other defenders and a DM. He is not the player that will make a huge difference. And its laughable you think he is better in the tackle than Bailly or even Smalling. The only positive Maguire brings is he can stay fit and he can pass the ball. Apart from that he is as agile as a freight train. It isn't wrong for fans to demand better and it seems Jose wanted better too. Most the gossip came from his agent to get him a new deal. Our targets were players like Alderweireld, Boateng and Godin and it should stay that way. Would Maguire get a game at City? No. So utd shouldn't have scraps left over and B rate players. To get to the top you need readymade top quality players and youth with potential to be great. Slabhead is neither .
don't fall into that mindset that we had a great defense because of the numbers. The shots on goals last season paint a more accurate pic, we had something like 50 more shots on our goal than Liverpool who for most of the season had a terrible defence and shite keeper.Our record has been better than it should have been in recent seasons for one reason- De Gea. I agree I was worried about full back going into this season, but Jose obviously saw the progress Shaw as making. We also have Dalot to feature to put pressure on Valencia. All the central defenders you mention can have good days, but they lack consistency and they are all prone to making rash mistakes. Look at Maguire when he plays for England, he's constantly telling players where to be and move. He would actually make any of the players you mention better. Bailly to me can look the 2nd coming one day, and then the next like a sunday league pub player, same with Jones and Smalling. It's about creating partnerships, we are moving it appears to a more attacking systems it appears. The days of Jones and Smalling hitting hopeful long balls to Lukaku needs to change. A centre half with ability on the ball improves the whole team. Its about availability and who wants to come and play for us. From what I hear he was open to it as where his club if we paid the over inflated price.
I haven't but I also don't think we are as bad at defending as is being mad out.
I also think our biggest issue is scoring goals not conceding them. Jones and Smalling can play passes to Pogba Fred, Pereira, Matic in midfield, or to the fullbacks they don't have to hit long balls to Lukaku unless their manager tells them to do so. Bailly is comfortable enough on the ball also.
Yes it would be great if we could upgrade to have a very good ball player back there, but first and foremost they have to be a very good defender.
Funny thing is we had Blind who could have easily slotted into a back 3 for us to offer more ability on the ball from the CBs
Agreed, it amazes me how we even won some of our games with performances like this. We were fortunate we were clinical.
Skip to 3:00. We are just shite under pressure.
I have a feeling we’ll go for Cahill in January.
Not saying whether that is a good or bad thing, it’s just a feeling.
Not saying whether that is a good or bad thing, it’s just a feeling.
The question, as Shakespeare once asked, is 2CB's? or not 2 CB's?
When you look at it Jones needs selling, Rojo would already be gone to Everton if not for wages and Bailly seems to have fallen completely out of favour while Lindelof needs Fellaini to act as his bodyguard. Other than Smalling they all have big question marks over them.
When you look at it Jones needs selling, Rojo would already be gone to Everton if not for wages and Bailly seems to have fallen completely out of favour while Lindelof needs Fellaini to act as his bodyguard. Other than Smalling they all have big question marks over them.
One is a must, and the second depends on how many we can ship for me. Realistically, Rojo, Jones, Lindelöf and Bailly could all realistically leave without hurting us.
We will see how Tuanzebe gets on at Villa this season, but I’d love to see a senior CB like Skriniar brought in, and if we can afford it, De Ligt too.
3 need to go - Jones, Rojo and Lindeolf
Then we need to buy 2 and also recall Tunazebe
Then we need to buy 2 and also recall Tunazebe
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Varane, Umiti or Pavon
I think by the end of this season we will have a clearer idea on where Bailly is heading too. 3 seasons is enough time to sort your shit out.
benjamin pavard or dayot upemecano
Skriniar.
That's a good shout. He's made it clear he wants to leave and Mourinho knows him well.
This would be my choice. He's going to be one of the best CBs in a few seasons.
How is Varane a realistic target? Playing for arguably one of the biggest clubs in world football on the biggest stage. Who would swap that for the shite served at OT? He doesn't strike me as the kind to take 500k and be happy unlike others we have poached.
Cahill would be just more money pissed away, he's no better than Smalling and no leader either.
Agreed, in an ideal world Rojo, Jones and Lindelof would go, we'd fix Bailly, keep Smalling, buy Skrinniar and one from Alderweireld/de Ligt/Pavard and bring Axel back as the 5th option as with our injury luck he'll get games.
Yesterday PSV - Ajax was a good show of how important De Ligt is for Ajax. He was out injured and Ajax got battered 3-0.
Ajax' moron coach Ten Hag put 2 midfielders (Blind and Frenkie de Jong) in defense. I honestly think a striker has never won this many headers without breaking a sweat than Luuk de Jong yesterday.
Might also be a good indication that saying they can dominate against Bayern as well is a bit much. Cocky sods.
Ajax' moron coach Ten Hag put 2 midfielders (Blind and Frenkie de Jong) in defense. I honestly think a striker has never won this many headers without breaking a sweat than Luuk de Jong yesterday.
Might also be a good indication that saying they can dominate against Bayern as well is a bit much. Cocky sods.
We should have snapped Lenglet up before Barca. Anyone know how he’s doing there?
Christian Pavon as a cb would be a bold move!
He got sent of yesterday,but they are trying to ease him in.
Wasn't he sent off last night? I like Pavard personally, we should definitely take a look.
Got a red card yesterday for elbowing Girona's player, still need to watch him more to draw a conclusion I think
Very bad. Sent off in his 1 start and 2 sub appearances
In the mess we’re in, difficulty getting somebody who ticks boxes mid season, I can see it happening. Not a long term solution but probably better than all our centre backs.
Matthijs de Ligt looks like a real deal. I think he has potential to be hit the top level as a CB. I saw him again Bayern Munich yesterday. Looked like he is lacking the top speed, but at the same time its not easy to pass him. I think he handle Lewandoski and Bayern Munich players really good yesterday. To be 19 and play at the top level, i think you get to have really huge potential in you. And i like he is using his whole body as a defend, like his arms as long as it allow by the referee. And on the ball, he is more than good enough with the ball as a CB.
So I would recommend United to buy him as yours next CB. This is a new upcoming promising CB United shall not miss on. Because like i said. He has the potential to hit the top level as a CB. United shall go for him. I would definitive buy him if i was owner/manager of one of the top club in Europe. Maybe in the January transfer window, because i think more top clubs will go after him in next summer transfer window. I think he is more than ready to play regular for a top 3/4 club in the biggest league.
Koulibaly and Alderwereld. Bring back Tuanzebe and Fosu Mensah. Sell the current lot apart from Baily.
I certainly don't like David Luiz, and he isn't top class by any means. But he is very very good on the ball, and he can be dominant on his days.. I think it would be interesting to see him partnered with Smalling. He will fit right in with the mess we have going on right now too tho
Probably not a wise idea
Probably not a wise ideaStill think Koulibaly is the best available, he would suit England perfectly and he's a left sided CB which we need.
I agree he looks very good
He would be perfect. Big, strong, good on the ball, plays on the left and plenty of experience at the top. Though, we are looking at close to 100 Euros if we want to get him.
Yeah wouldn't be cheap, but i'd rather spend that than mess around spending 30/40 on people like Lindelof.
Let's just pay what it costs and get a great player. We need to start targeting exact players rather than 3/4 on a list.
Koulibaly is young. His value will not decrease over the time of his contract. It might even increase; see Pogba for example.
Its a financially much better deal than to spend 75m on Aldeweireld and having to see is value deterioate seriously every year due to his age.
100m on a young player like Koulibaly is more a cashflow issue than a cost issue, which is was people tend to focus on strangely enough.
Its the same with Lindelöf, we will easily recuperate what we bought him for if we choose to sell him in todays market. He is young as well and with some PL-experience his value will not have deterioated.
Focusing on players like Willian and Aldeweireld with the transfer fees that are flouting about is insane financially. There are much better ways to spend that money. Im with the club on that if the conflict with Mourinho on that issue is even real.
De Ligt.
Reminds me of Rio. Worth whatever he’d cost. Captains Ajax at a young age, a natural leader which our defence sorely lacks, and can actually pass a ball.
If we can get Alderweireld for 25m in the summer I’d get De Ligt and Toby in. Move on any of our CBs - can’t say any of them are indispensible.
Reminds me of Rio. Worth whatever he’d cost. Captains Ajax at a young age, a natural leader which our defence sorely lacks, and can actually pass a ball.
If we can get Alderweireld for 25m in the summer I’d get De Ligt and Toby in. Move on any of our CBs - can’t say any of them are indispensible.
Debatable. I can't see anybody buying him for 35+ right now. Apart from that though I agree, we need the players more than the money.