[Bestie07]

Doesn't understand he is a DM. Always going for low percentage passes (my fear is that this is tactical), conceding turnovers and putting us on the back foot over and over and over. Also keeps on picking up stupid yellows which is a very bad quality to have in a DM. And yes, he is slow.

 

[Thom Merrilin]

So I am not the only one who thought he didn't have to get a second yellow card for that incident? I don't mind conceding at that point but we can't keep losing our defensive players right now.

It was a silly decision to slide in, for sure.

 

[gaffs]

It was a silly decision to slide in, for sure.

It was daft. He compounded Onana's error.

 

[Thom Merrilin]

Doesn't understand he is a DM. Always going for low percentage passes (my fear is that this is tactical), conceding turnovers and putting us on the back foot over and over and over. Also keeps on picking up stupid yellows which is a very bad quality to have in a DM. And yes, he is slow.

It's definitely tactical he must have played more than a dozen first time balls over the top today. If EtH didn't want that to happen he'd be screaming at Cas to stop.

 

[gaffs]

Doesn't understand he is a DM. Always going for low percentage passes (my fear is that this is tactical), conceding turnovers and putting us on the back foot over and over and over. Also keeps on picking up stupid yellows which is a very bad quality to have in a DM. And yes, he is slow.

I think it is. Ten Hag seems to have given him an expanded role.

 

[Thom Merrilin]

It was daft. He compounded Onana's error.

Yup. I was always told never to go to ground in the box unless you know you'll get the ball 100%. Cas was never reaching that ball.

 

[Valencia Shin Crosses]

No, he's also too slow for that role. See the type of players other teams play in those advanced positions and they are nothing like Casemiro. Goal contributions aren't everything, we need to start looking beyond that.

In my head I'm not so much thinking "advanced" as I am a "free" role. The entire point though was more that him playing as a lone DM won't cut it right now. The carelessness with the ball and lack of duel winning is a huge reason why we look so much more fragile in games than last year.

 

[Valencia Shin Crosses]

Theres a compilation of our goals conceded from cutbacks this season in the EtH thread and you can see that he wasn't even there most of the time. Failed interception/duel is one thing but the way he plays at the moment he is just caught out of position trying to play hero ball all the time, that is not sustainable. We know he can do the basic well, stay in front of the defense, pick up the ball from deep, play it to feet for another midfielder or fullback/winger, dont try to be fancy. I think he has the wrong idea about what he should be doing based on the goals he scored and EtH is indulging him, but we are leaking goals like a sieve as a result of that.

Oh our marking from cutbacks between him and Eriksen is fecking comically bad this season

 

[lsd]

Yup. I was always told never to go to ground in the box unless you know you'll get the ball 100%. Cas was never reaching that ball.

He had to make that challenge and stop what was going to be a goal.

It was take the red card and hopefully they miss the penalty which they did.

Same as Ole a few years back when he had to do the same thing.

 

[tentan]

Needs replacing in the summer.

 

[Thom Merrilin]

He had to make that challenge and stop what was going to be a goal.

It was take the red card and hopefully they miss the penalty which they did.

Same as Ole a few years back when he had to do the same thing.

No guarantee of that. I get your perspective, same idea as the Luis Suarez handball at the world cup. I just disagree.

 

[lsd]

No guarantee of that. I get your perspective, same idea as the Luis Suarez handball at the world cup. I just disagree.

If he doesn't make the tackle he would be slaughtered. Every professional player in his position would know they have to make that tackle knowing it will be a red card.

It's basically a professional foul for a reason

 

[Thom Merrilin]

If he doesn't make the tackle he would be slaughtered. Every professional player in his position would know they have to make that tackle knowing it will be a red card.

It's basically a professional foul for a reason

Varane didn't make that tackle for Zaha's goal but I don't see him being slaughtered.

 

[lsd]

Varane didn't make that tackle for Zaha's goal but I don't see him being slaughtered.

Tonight? Dalot was on Zaha challenging. Why would Varane make a foul on him even if he could?

 

[FerociousCorgis]

He had to make that challenge and stop what was going to be a goal.

It was take the red card and hopefully they miss the penalty which they did.

Same as Ole a few years back when he had to do the same thing.

There was still plenty of time left. It was a daft challenge when you consider he prob could've blocked the shot had he executed a better tackle. All he had to do was be able to take another step or two before sliding, but he's just too slow to make up any ground. Which resulted in him being out for next game and us playing with 10 men for a chunk of the match, and still losing. Even if they score there what we have plenty of time with 11 men to equalize, and worst case he's available for next game. He's been flying around with bad slide tackles all year

 

[Thom Merrilin]

Tonight? Dalot was on Zaha challenging. Why would Varane make a foul on him even if he could?

I didnt pick this up until I saw the replay. Varane was next closest to the ball, he watched Dalot lose the battle to Zaha. If your argument is that it's better to give away a penalty than a goal scoring opportunity then Varane should have tackled Zaha.

 

[V.O.]

Like a few players and maybe the manager, he probably needs to stick to the basics for a bit.

Was like having fecking Gerrard at DM tonight. All Hollywood passes and Roy of the Rovers surges forward.

 

[BarryWinks]

All those years of laughing at Gerrard finally caught up with us.

Pisses me off how much freedom he is allowed with his passes this season, and I say that as someone who absolutely enjoyed his plays last season. This years, it's all first time balls, trying silly disguised passes to players surrounded by opponents, chopped passes when he knows the opponents can break should he miss. Cringe stuff.

 

[SirScholes]

He had to make that challenge and stop what was going to be a goal.

It was take the red card and hopefully they miss the penalty which they did.

Same as Ole a few years back when he had to do the same thing.

That was a free kick not a pen

 

[JB7]

So I am not the only one who thought he didn't have to get a second yellow card for that incident? I don't mind conceding at that point but we can't keep losing our defensive players right now.

Idiotic decision, could see it from the other end of the ground. If we were 2-1 up with 30 seconds to go then fine, but at 2-2 with 15 minutes left I'd rather be 3-2 down with 11 men on the pitch than 2-2 with 10 men on the pitch (and the opposition having a penalty). Particularly him of all players, even while he was off his game, there was a massive gaping hole the through the middle as soon as he went off.

 

[CloneMC16]

How do you know ten hag is not telling them to do this, he wants to be quick in transition, I think they are being instructed to play a quick ball over the top as soon as they get it or win it no matter if it’s risky or if we lose the ball again

He most likely is. If we continue to play this way, ETH will get sacked. It's not a sustainable playstyle for us. Casemiro is being given way too much freedom to play pretty much however he likes. Constant high risk passes that aren't coming off quite often. Positioning himself high up the field and leaving large gaps between him and the rest of the defence. When our counter press fails, we're left with the opposition running at whoever is left in our half. Usually our two CB's and one of the fullbacks. Casemiro is also diving in a lot to try and recover, but it's not working.

 

[ROFLUTION]

The tackle was way too clumsy.

A red card 1-3 times a season is just not good enough. He let’s us down too often and flair and goals wont make up for it. Also had a stinker of a season opener.

 

[Top]

If he doesn't make the tackle he would be slaughtered. Every professional player in his position would know they have to make that tackle knowing it will be a red card.

It's basically a professional foul for a reason

Bullshit

 

[Top]

Always going for low percentage passes (my fear is that this is tactical), conceding turnovers and putting us on the back foot over and over and over.

Yup. Either he is dumb or the manager is dumb.

 

[Beachryan]

Why didn't he notice their number 7 walking right past him several times in the first half? None of the coaching staff?

Then just after we finally go ahead, our DM once again let's a player stroll by, and score. He should have been benched for that alone.

 

[Borys]

Bizarre role he's playing. He's a DM, but also a playmaker who attempts ridiculous number of high risk passes.
However, I do think he is quite good passer, and honestly 1 out of 10 those passes puts us through on goal, and it's one of the very few things that are working for us - if you don't count how many times it generates a turnover that is.

Seems to me like ETH has given up on playing football in any other, more complicated way than "just lump it forward". Those players can do better if used correctly. Casemiro can do better. He's asked to do too much, he should be just sitting deep and starting attacks. He can do it. He's just used in the wrong way now.

I also think he should not be allowed to make sliding tackles. He looks like a walking red card.

 

[Telsim]

Diabolical yesterday. And that was before the incident.

He was never going to give us more than 2 years, let's be honest here. Anything else is pure delusion. Yet we still spent as if we are buying a young, talented DM.

 

[Slevs]

Stop this over the top pass bullshit. Play the simple game, get the ball out wide or play a quick pass to your partner in midfield for the latter to release the forwards.

 

[flameinthesun]

As much as I love him I hope its the last time we buy an ageing star. Its also insane that we haven't invested in a young CM/DM in forever.

 

[MattofManchester]

Even ignoring the weird and constant to smash it forward, the fact he's nowhere near anything when we lose the ball is hurting us immensely.

I can't tell if it's instruction, but this can't be how we're set up to play. He's essentially vacated midfield most of the time because he's so far out of position.

One of the biggest problems at the moment, imo.

 

[OrcaFat]

I assume we will play Amrabat as a lone no6 while Cas is suspended. Not sure we would have seen that in the short term if not for necessity. I’m looking forward to it.

 

[poleglass red]

Even ignoring the weird and constant to smash it forward, the fact he's nowhere near anything when we lose the ball is hurting us immensely.

I can't tell if it's instruction, but this can't be how we're set up to play. He's essentially vacated midfield most of the time because he's so far out of position.

One of the biggest problems at the moment, imo.

The fact we don't have a defender giving him a bollocking for this just shows the complete lack of leadership in this team. At best now, he's an option of the bench,if we are chasing a game and need a goal. Him as a 6 is a liability in that he can't track runners, he's too slow and late to make tackles, and he loses possession regularly in dangerous areas. ETH needs to start showing some balls and dropping him and giving one of the younger lads a go. He publicly criticized Sancho for lack of effort in training, it took Casemiro 7 weeks to shed the excess weight he put on in the off season. I'm a huge fan of his, but that's enough.

 

[spiriticon]

I know Onana fecked him over yesterday but still an experienced player like him should not be diving in on hopeless situations.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Why didn't he notice their number 7 walking right past him several times in the first half? None of the coaching staff?

Then just after we finally go ahead, our DM once again let's a player stroll by, and score. He should have been benched for that alone.

That was absolutely criminal.

The caf is full of backseat managers demanding that Bruno and Rashford are benched. Replacing Casemiro with a DM who actually tracks runners (and doesn't give the ball away constantly) is what really needs to happen to make us a better football team.

 

[jem]

That was absolutely criminal.

The caf is full of backseat managers demanding that Bruno and Rashford are benched. Replacing Casemiro with a DM who actually tracks runners (and doesn't give the ball away constantly) is what really needs to happen to make us a better football team.

I think Bruno should be benched (I actually thought Rashford showed encouraging signs yesterday) but I also agree Casemiro is a huge problem. What happened to the player we saw from October of last year until March of this year is anybody's guess, but this current iteration is nowhere near good enough.

 

[sebsheep]

That was absolutely criminal.

The caf is full of backseat managers demanding that Bruno and Rashford are benched. Replacing Casemiro with a DM who actually tracks runners (and doesn't give the ball away constantly) is what really needs to happen to make us a better football team.

Tbf they've both had poor starts to the season as well.

 

[RuudTom83]

Doesn't understand he is a DM. Always going for low percentage passes (my fear is that this is tactical), conceding turnovers and putting us on the back foot over and over and over. Also keeps on picking up stupid yellows which is a very bad quality to have in a DM. And yes, he is slow.

I felt as he gets older he could adjust his game and become more and more defensive...to offset his decreasing mobility.

But watching him this season, he has been anything but defensive...United are almost playing with 3 attacking midfielders, each of them trying to outdo each other in how many times they can give the ball away.

Which must be partially down to coaching, but I'm sure during the coaching, giving the ball away every 15 seconds is not part of the plan.

 

[Idxomer]

I felt as he gets older he could adjust his game and become more and more defensive...to offset his decreasing mobility.

But watching him this season, he has been anything but defensive...United are almost playing with 3 attacking midfielders, each of them trying to outdo each other in how many times they can give the ball away.

Which must be partially down to coaching, but I'm sure during the coaching, giving the ball away every 15 seconds is not part of the plan.

It's a misjudgement of his qualities from him and the coaches. The same is happening with shifting Bruno to the right. Ten Hag seems to believe any player can adapt to a new style or a position. So far, we've seen Weeghorst at 10, Casemiro as a playmaker, Bruno on the wings, Amarabat as a left-back, Eriksen as a central midfielder and Mount signing to replace him.

That doesn't mean I'm against trying players in new positions or giving them extra responsibilities, but there are obvious cases when the player simply doesn't have it in him to do more and perform at an optimal level.

 

[RuudTom83]

@Idxomer

Good points, and I think trying players in different roles in fine, but maybe having 3-4 players all playing different roles, some change per game, is to no ones surprise a recipe for disaster. Granted some are down to injuries.

Better to stick to 1 experiment at a time.

 

[tomaldinho1]

He had to make that challenge and stop what was going to be a goal.

It was take the red card and hopefully they miss the penalty which they did.

Same as Ole a few years back when he had to do the same thing.

It was the 77th minute and 2-2 in a CL group game No2.

Ole's red was in the last minute when we were in a title race with Arsenal and had to win.

Context rarely appears on this forum, but it is important.