- Joined
- May 22, 2016
- Messages
- 15
He didnt win the world cup on his own. What a load of rubbish.Since when was football an individual sport?
OK maybe I exaggerated a little. Maradona was the closest thing to a one man team I've ever seen.
He didnt win the world cup on his own. What a load of rubbish.Since when was football an individual sport?
Mate you will never win an argument against a Messi fanboy.OK maybe I exaggerated a little. Maradona was the closest thing to a one man team I've ever seen.
I'm not a fanboyMate you will never win an argument against a Messi fanboy.
For me until he does it on the biggest stage of them all he isn't the best we have ever seen. The same goes for Ronaldo.
No, the fact that the best manager ever has a different opinion on the topic makes it pretty clear that it's not a foregone conclusion that this thread title implies.why? so because he prefers a certain player to another it makes him right? He has never coached Messi and has no allegeance to him so why would he say he is better?
Fixed.Sir Alex knows Ronaldo best
Could =/= willFixed.
Sir Alex also thought Jones could be our best ever player. Maybe that's also wasn't a foregone conclusion at the time. I mean it's really been nail-biting on that one. I think it has been close.
Nothing wrong thinking Ronaldo is best but to use a manager preferring him as a reason to justify it, is petty.No, the fact that the best manager ever has a different opinion on the topic makes it pretty clear that it's not a foregone conclusion that this thread title implies.
He makes mistakes, is the obvious point. Jones was never going to be our greatest ever player.Could =/= will
As I've pointed out before, Sir Alex cannot be expected to see into the future that Jones will be spending most of his United career in the treatment room.
So you're sayinng everything Fergie says is right?Could =/= will
As I've pointed out before, Sir Alex cannot be expected to see into the future that Jones will be spending most of his United career in the treatment room.
ExactlyHe makes mistakes, is the obvious point. Jones was never going to be our greatest ever player.
That's not even the point here. If someone quoted Xavi's opinion, widely regarded as one of the greatest midfielders the game has seen, on the pair of them, it would (rightfully) be treated as a joke. SAF loves Ronaldo. His opinion on this topic is meaningless. As would be Pep's.
Mate you will never win an argument against a Messi fanboy.
For me until he does it on the biggest stage of them all he isn't the best we have ever seen. The same goes for Ronaldo.
Just like how your little mighty mite plays international footy.I'm not a fanboy
Too many rubbish posters these days
No, I'm saying Sir Alex knows a thing or two about footballers and who's the best.So you're sayinng everything Fergie says is right?
So Schurrle and Gotze are men and Messi is a boy?Agreed. That's what wins the argument for me. Doing the business at international level separates the men from the boys..
Sir Alex coached Ronaldo for 6 years. Obviously he's not going to upset Ronaldo. Don't take value into what managers say. It's all PR and doing each other a favor.No, I'm saying Sir Alex knows a thing or two about footballers and who's the best.
That's the not-quite-dead-and-buried Stoke argument reappearing. It was bollocks then and bollocks now.Ronaldo is better already, proven across multiple leagues , not a one man army.
Whilst most people who claim Messi's best are related to Barcelona or Argentina...Sir Alex coached Ronaldo for 6 years. Obviously he's not going to upset Ronaldo. Don't take value into what managers say. It's all PR and doing each other a favor.
Huh?Whilst most people who claim Messi's best are related to Barcelona or Argentina...
Huh ?Just like how your little mighty mite plays international footy.
So Schurrle and Gotze are men and Messi is a boy?
Whilst most people who claim Messi's best are related to Barcelona or Argentina...
My problem with this line of argument is it suggests a player from an unfancied country can never be the greatest, regardless of what he is actually capable of.On a world cup level, yes. If you want to take every word literally.
My argument is that Maradona will go down as a greater player than Messi because of what he did at international level. Simple.
Messi's club achievements far outshine Maradona's international achievements. And it's not because of Barca because he himself makes Barca good. Real's team was always great on paper since Ronaldo moved there yet Messi's club achievements are far better than Ronaldo's with Real for example.On a world cup level, yes. If you want to take every word literally.
My argument is that Maradona will go down as a greater player than Messi because of what he did at international level. Simple.
It's not simple because it's all subjectiveOn a world cup level, yes. If you want to take every word literally.
My argument is that Maradona will go down as a greater player than Messi because of what he did at international level. Simple.
You based this on the vast data available or just your personal opinion?Not really. The vast majority of neutrals will remember Messi as the better player.
Are you seriously going down that route? The likes of Xavi, Iniesta, Busquests, etc are no better than the Real team?Messi's club achievements far outshine Maradona's international achievements. And it's not because of Barca because he himself makes Barca good. Real's team was always great on paper since Ronaldo moved there yet Messi's club achievements are far better than Ronaldo's with Real for example.
You prefer Ronaldo like others....Some prefer Messi...whats your problem exactly?You based this on the vast data available or just your personal opinion?
Are they that much better to justify Barca winning 5 league titles and Real only 1 since Ronaldo's move to Real? Messi was the main force behind Barca's success.Are you seriously going down that route? The likes of Xavi, Iniesta, Busquests, etc are no better than the Real team?
My problem is that this thread title implies that Messi is better is a foregone conclusion which it clearly isn't.You prefer Ronaldo like others....Some prefer Messi...whats your problem exactly?
How about the fact that most of them minus Messi won 2 Euros and 1 WC?Are they that much better to justify Barca winning 5 league titles and Real only 1 since Ronaldo's move to Real? Messi was the main force behind Barca's success.
I agree with you inasmuch as the fact that it is debatable suggests this current top level - be it Messi or Ronaldo, depending on your personal opinion - can be improved upon. If two people can reach a similar level within a single generation, why cant someone else reach a higher level at some point in the future?My problem is that this thread title implies that Messi is better is a foregone conclusion which it clearly isn't.
AgreedI agree with you inasmuch as the fact that it is debatable suggests this current top level - be it Messi or Ronaldo, depending on your personal opinion - can be improved upon. If two people can reach a similar level within a single generation, why cant someone else reach a higher level at some point in the future?
In a way "healthy" means "average". For example is a person who is 2.1m tall wants to be an athlete he needs special supplements, diet because his height causes other deficiencies in his body, like with bones and stuff. Messi got HGH in much higher dosages than a body would produce, together with football training back then it resulted no doubt in much improvement of his leg muscles, lower body strength. So it was not just about the height, this medicine did help him to become a better footballer, there can be no doubt about it. I am not saying it's doping or something, but he was aided by current medicine and had he played in other, older era that simply would not be an option.Hold on, you do realise Messi got HGH due to deficiency in GH? He got the treatment because healthy individuals grow normally whereas he didn't, hence he got the GH he needed to grow. Even with treatment he is still below average weight and build. This shouldn't even be a point of contention.
Spock, well it does not really Messi or football, but since computer able to generate a data (beauty) from 0s and 1s it's clearly not subjective.@Vilev wrote:
No, that's your mistake. Beauty is actually an objective thing, it's about symmetry, proportions, etc. It's actually can be easily checked on a computer that as you know simply does not possess any subjectivity in principle and can generate faces that would be considered beautiful.
Rubbish. Beauty is not objective in any sense of the word. It is inherently subjective, but it is real nonetheless. Reasonable minds can differ on who between Kate Upton and Giselle Bundschen is more "beautiful". Beauty cannot be measured or analyzed scientifically to allow one to conclude, scientifically, that Kate or Giselle is more beautiful than the other.