Bruno Fernandes against the Premier League Top 6 sides

Bruno Fernandes is careless in possession against almost every team. Apart from being a huge risk taker, he is prone to giving it away cheaply. That's just a flaw in his game and was highlighted before we signed him.
The reason why this flaw is highlighted in big games is simple. He has far leas touches. So a much higher percentage of his passes fall into the category people are complaining about.
The comparisons with KDB are flawed imo. De Bruyne is a huge risk taker but isn't careless with the ball. There's a big difference imo. How many times has Bruno given the ball away in our own half this season...quite a lot.
Saying all that, Bruno is a fantastic player. Ole just has to work on him so he takes better care of the ball. It is killing us in big games cause we can't build or sustain attacks.
He's not the only culprit mind you.
I have no problem with him taking risks but his carelessness needs sorting out.
 
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The way some of you are going on about Bruno make it seem like he turned into Bellion overnight ffs.

He's been the heartbeat of this team since last year and without him we'd have been lucky to finish in the Top 4. Cop on.
 
bosnian_red said:
Its a pretty meaningless stat of course, but its as good as there is for judging how a player does in big games. There's so much variability within a season on who is in the top 6 at a certain time, and even as you say, Sheffield United were up there with a good run last year but will now be relegated. There's an established top 6 that year after year tends to be the actual top 6, with the occasional exception but generally gets pretty close anyway.

And yes there are other hard games like Everton away or Leicester away. That doesn't make them bigger games than playing Arsenal/Chelsea/Spurs/Liverpool or City though. There's more pressure on these games, more people watching around the world, more focus on it and generally more intensity to them.
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They are harder if theyre better teams though?
It used to be top 4 record then Chelsea and Utd started dropping out and Leicester popped up so it became top 6.
Its a curious stat diluted to nothing at this stage.
Theres always pressure at Utd. Look at this place after a draw at Anfield. Pressure for top 4, pressure for title etc. Playing an average Chelsea over an excellent Everton doesnt change that.
It just doesnt take the evolution of clubs into account. We are in a title race, every match has pressure.
A lot of people told me Chelsea were miles ahead of us this season, they were fighting City and Liverpool for the title.
This stat is like stopping the analysis of this season right there on day 1 of the season and saying its harder to get points off Chelsea than us regardless of how we are doing. The actual quality of the sides doesnt matter.
 
cyril C said:
When every pass is 99% certainty, how creative this can be? How much space do you think a target man will get? Can you imagine a Top 6 team coming to a game without a game plan that mark out your target man?

As you stated, Bruno is doing a good job against the Rest 14, which is the most critical requirement for getting Bruno on board. Against Top 6 team or any big games, first of all you don't assume your opponent would sleep on the job, you need your entire team to play at 7 or above, you need more than 1 players to shine such that someone will contribute while Bruno is marked out.
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could we not have said the same about lukaku? That was everyone’s big complaint about him that he was only bullying the smaller teams and padding his stats
 
cyberman said:
Goal and assist Leicester, 2 goals and assist v Everton, goal v Spurs.. What am i missing?
In fact he has scored or assisted against 7 of the current top 10 this season
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TMDaines said:
It’s pretty established who the Big 6 sides are unless you are being facetious. Leicester finishing fifth last season and Everton having a decent first half to this season doesn’t really affect that.
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what he says below. The big 6 used to be fixed as the sides competing for the 4 CL places. It has changed now so your metric is a bit faulty. Still don't know why Arsenal are being used as a barometer. Chelsea are currently mid table. Surely games against the sides/rivals for your position are the most important as opposed to reminiscing of the days when anyone could make the CL?
cyberman said:
I genuinley didnt realise.
This season does affect things, the top 6 is the best top 6 in the league. To the point City have the grand total of 0 wins v the top 6.
Why is Chelsea harder to play against then Everton? Arsenal over Villa?
It makes no sense.
Traditional top 6 is a useless stat to bring up to be honest. Chelsea and Arsenal are not among the best top 6 sides in the league.
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indeed.
 
Ali Dia said:
could we not have said the same about lukaku? That was everyone’s big complaint about him that he was only bullying the smaller teams and padding his stats
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Lukaku had how many years? How long has Bruno had?

I guess some fans won't recall the assist V City or Chelsea last season because it doesnt suit the agenda.

Goals / assists can only be counted if its in open play.
 
Regulus Arcturus Black said:
Let’s be honest here, whatever your thoughts on Martial, Rashford, Fernandes, Cavani etc, the way we set up in big games is simply kick and rush football.
It must be very difficult for all our forward players in these games.

I can understand pragmatism, but at the same time I’ve seen us go toe to toe with PSG this year and have no problems in doing so (until we lost a man). I won’t complain because we are in a great position in the league but I think long term we have to be prepared to go at teams in the big games.
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This is the real issue. A glance at the Liverpool team sheet made it blindingly obvious that defence is their current weak spot but we barely targeted it. Containing and countering worked well in the big games last season but hasn't worked at all this year. Ole needs to be a bit bolder in these matches in future. If he is, we'll see more from Bruno in them.
 
I never want to hear someone bring up Lukaku's record against the top 6 without bringing up Bruno's. Romelu Fernandes.
 
romufc said:
Lukaku had how many years? How long has Bruno had?

I guess some fans won't recall the assist V City or Chelsea last season because it doesnt suit the agenda.

Goals / assists can only be counted if its in open play.
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Lampard, Gerrard used to win matches against big rivals via a FK or penalty to my memory. They don't count if its Bruno I guess. Harry Kane has settled matches via penalties. It takes nerve to step up. don't matter though nowadays
 
Stacks said:
Lampard, Gerrard used to win matches against big rivals via a FK or penalty to my memory. They don't count if its Bruno I guess. Harry Kane has settled matches via penalties. It takes nerve to step up. don't matter though nowadays
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How many FK or corner goals did Drogba score to win games for Chelsea?

Wasn't everyone creaming over Harry Kane golden boot at the world cup, 1 open play goal was it? don't see anyone complaining then.

If people who are turning on Bruno, go look at our performances pre Bruno, go have a look at chances created in the league. The answer will be simple.

The same people complaining about Bruno's passing accuracy will also tell me McTominay plays too many safe passes and backwards that's why his passing is higher.
 
WR10 said:
He's a gambler. It's why Pep turned him down. When your team (United of past 5 years) is notorious for not taking risks, you want a gambler on the team.

When you have limited possession, you don't want a gambler.

In big games, we have limited possession and he more often than not wastes our possessions on his ego.


It's ok though because he makes the difference against the remaining 14 teams in the league.
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Well put. It's a game of fine margins for Bruno. When it comes down to it, we're a different animal with him in the team.

On his day, one of his long shots could fly in the top corner, or an ambitious through ball lands perfectly for Rashford, and he's lauded.

It's who he is, and we can't have it both ways. You need a player like that in your team though. The challenge now is for Ole to find a way for us to impose ourselves more in big games so that Bruno sees more of the ball.
 
His decision making, when to take a chance or not, is definitely an area for improvement. Some people wanted us to try a higher line against Liverpool but I’d say that’s impossible when a midfielder loses the ball as often as he did. Before we try to dominate the best teams, we need to establish some kind possession and calmness with the ball. His creativity is the reason we now finally win against teams with the bus parked but against Liverpool, a chance pass means they get back possession and can attack wave after wave and we get no organised time with the ball.
 
kopviolator said:
The right place was probably a wrong choice of words. But I wonder if his charital works are affecting his mindset or conflicting with his footballing schedule. Not criticism on my part btw
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Fair enough, but from what I can tell, he seems able to separate the two - and he has had some good runs of form since the first lockdown. I think he's just maddeningly inconsistent as ever.
 
Adisa said:
Bruno Fernandes is careless in possession against almost every team. Apart from being a huge risk taker, he is prone to giving it away cheaply. That's just a flaw in his game and was highlighted before we signed him.
The reason why this flaw is highlighted in big games is simple. He has far leas touches. So a much higher percentage of his passes fall into the category people are complaining about.
The comparisons with KDB are flawed imo. De Bruyne is a huge risk taker but isn't careless with the ball. There's a big difference imo. How many times has Bruno given the ball away in our own half this season...quite a lot.
Saying all that, Bruno is a fantastic player. Ole just has to work on him so he takes better care of the ball. It is killing us in big games cause we can't build or sustain attacks.
He's not the only culprit mind you.
I have no problem with him taking risks but his carelessness needs sorting out.
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fair
 
Chief123 said:
Your best players don’t necessarily always have their best games against the best teams.

Mane, Salah and Firmino have only ever scored 1 goal each against us. Salah has literally been a passenger against Luke Shaw every time. That doesn’t mean they have been shit players. Big games are generally tight and limited in chances.

Bruno has a ridiculous amount of goals and assists without taking into account the amount he would have if our players actually finished the really easy ones.
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People are critiquing his general play not the goals and assist he scored. Those players you listed are more invisible rather than getting dispossessed 19 times in one game. Why dont you guys ever focus on general play rather than penalties?
 
Adisa said:
Bruno Fernandes is careless in possession against almost every team. Apart from being a huge risk taker, he is prone to giving it away cheaply. That's just a flaw in his game and was highlighted before we signed him.
The reason why this flaw is highlighted in big games is simple. He has far leas touches. So a much higher percentage of his passes fall into the category people are complaining about.
The comparisons with KDB are flawed imo. De Bruyne is a huge risk taker but isn't careless with the ball. There's a big difference imo. How many times has Bruno given the ball away in our own half this season...quite a lot.
Saying all that, Bruno is a fantastic player. Ole just has to work on him so he takes better care of the ball. It is killing us in big games cause we can't build or sustain attacks.
He's not the only culprit mind you.
I have no problem with him taking risks but his carelessness needs sorting out.
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Great analysis. Ive noticed he is very immobile on the ball which is the difference between him and De bruyne. Debruyne can power run with the ball and dribble one or two players while bruno cant. If you watch bruno closely you will see that sometimes he crosses from a standstill.

I think a quick solution may be a prolonged rest for him. Its my only explanation for why more times he doesn't run with the ball and other times he does. Maybe he is reserving energy or something.
 
jem said:
Fair enough, but from what I can tell, he seems able to separate the two - and he has had some good runs of form since the first lockdown. I think he's just maddeningly inconsistent as ever.
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Yes, I'm not saying he can't separate the two but players have been critisized harshly before for their "side projects" or branding work. In the end, if it is all well balanced there should be no problem. But the possibility may exist that his commitments weigh on his mind or affect his preparations. Having said that, there are of course things more important than football.
 
Canadianred17 said:
I never want to hear someone bring up Lukaku's record against the top 6 without bringing up Bruno's. Romelu Fernandes.
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Idiot post.


The stats don't even match up.



Fantasy big six...............must be like another trophy ya need to win :lol: :lol: :lol:
 
Slevs said:
Yeah lets start Perreira there or someone who doesn't lose the ball a lot and doesn't take risks.

Who should start then?
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Ozil. Doesn’t lose the ball and takes risks.

He must cost a bomb though because obviously players that can pass well in the final third have to lose the ball a lot.

It’s like strikers that score a lot of goals. They must naturally miss a lot too from taking so many risks like shooting.

Basically it’s a timid excuse. He needs to look after the ball better. But the way we play doesn’t help.
 
Is this really what we are doing now? Negative threads about Bruno? Half of you lot don't deserve this club.
 
Adisa said:
Bruno Fernandes is careless in possession against almost every team. Apart from being a huge risk taker, he is prone to giving it away cheaply. That's just a flaw in his game and was highlighted before we signed him.
The reason why this flaw is highlighted in big games is simple. He has far leas touches. So a much higher percentage of his passes fall into the category people are complaining about.
The comparisons with KDB are flawed imo. De Bruyne is a huge risk taker but isn't careless with the ball. There's a big difference imo. How many times has Bruno given the ball away in our own half this season...quite a lot.
Saying all that, Bruno is a fantastic player. Ole just has to work on him so he takes better care of the ball. It is killing us in big games cause we can't build or sustain attacks.
He's not the only culprit mind you.
I have no problem with him taking risks but his carelessness needs sorting out.
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100%
 
Sky the cretins gave him a 3 yesterday and the worst player on the pitch :wenger:

I thought given how cagey the game was Bruno was fine, in typical Bruno fashion he was almost the match winner as well
 
Ekeke said:
De Bruyne was a gambler before City signed him too. Pep calmed him down. So thats not it
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KDB was always a great passer, only thing that changed was his position on the pitch. Before Pep, he played out wide a lot so obviously his pass completion would be lower. KDB is still a risky passer, but it just shows his quality that he's able to continue to be risky and have around 82% PS.

Bruno can make fantastic passes but the number of attempts he needs to pull this off is too many for a No.10 in my opinion. I certainly agree with the poster that said Pep would not be a fan at all.
 
Bruno Fernandes will never be part of a possession-based football team and that's okay.
 
Adisa said:
Bruno Fernandes is careless in possession against almost every team. Apart from being a huge risk taker, he is prone to giving it away cheaply. That's just a flaw in his game and was highlighted before we signed him.
The reason why this flaw is highlighted in big games is simple. He has far leas touches. So a much higher percentage of his passes fall into the category people are complaining about.
The comparisons with KDB are flawed imo. De Bruyne is a huge risk taker but isn't careless with the ball. There's a big difference imo. How many times has Bruno given the ball away in our own half this season...quite a lot.
Saying all that, Bruno is a fantastic player. Ole just has to work on him so he takes better care of the ball. It is killing us in big games cause we can't build or sustain attacks.
He's not the only culprit mind you.
I have no problem with him taking risks but his carelessness needs sorting out.
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Couldn't have said it better.

It's made even more frustrating due to Bruno being our main attacking outlet. If moves break down with him, then our attack is pretty much fecked. It's one of the reasons I'm not really a fan of No.10s anymore.

If Ole cannot sort this out, he either needs to bring Bruno off the pitch much earlier than the 89th minute or consider not starting him. I hope they are both able to find a solution though.
 
El Jefe said:
Couldn't have said it better.

It's made even more frustrating due to Bruno being our main attacking outlet. If moves break down with him, then our attack is pretty much fecked. It's one of the reasons I'm not really a fan of No.10s anymore.

If Ole cannot sort this out, he either needs to bring Bruno off the pitch much earlier than the 89th minute or consider not starting him. I hope they are both able to find a solution though.
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I don't think benching is an option. He's our main creative spark. I think we just have to stomach his flaws for now. I don't even think he deserves being dropped either.
 
eire-red said:
Well put. It's a game of fine margins for Bruno. When it comes down to it, we're a different animal with him in the team.

On his day, one of his long shots could fly in the top corner, or an ambitious through ball lands perfectly for Rashford, and he's lauded.

It's who he is, and we can't have it both ways. You need a player like that in your team though. The challenge now is for Ole to find a way for us to impose ourselves more in big games so that Bruno sees more of the ball.
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No the challenge is for Ole to continuously emphasize to him when and where to take those risks. Bruno himself has to realize within the flow of the game how to adjust his own style as well. If we are struggling to get into the oppositions half, then the first time we break successfully Bruno decides to have a go from 30 yards out, then it's just as bad of a decision as when Rashford runs himself into an alley. But if we are camped in a team's half, then by all means Bruno should pull out all of his tricks needed to break down a team.

If Bruno himself can't see the difference between the two situations though, then he'll always be at a level slightly below the true top players in the world. Personally, I don't think he's this ignorant, but I do think it's a bit of ego and that feeling that as our talisman he has to be the one to create the defining moment, and that causes the stupid giveaways.
 
I wouldn’t worry. He’s high risk, high reward. He will win more points than he loses.

Our manager can’t manage against any of the top 6. That’s more concerning.
 
holdsteady said:
The way some of you are going on about Bruno make it seem like he turned into Bellion overnight ffs.

He's been the heartbeat of this team since last year and without him we'd have been lucky to finish in the Top 4. Cop on.
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Spot on. Big part of the reason Pogba went to shit was because he stopped taking risks because the fans got on his back when it wasn't going his way. Sincerely hope the same doesn't happen to our boy Bruno.
 
The Original said:
You are simply showing that we have improved as a team, but what does this have to do with why Bruno loses the ball? He's not the reason we had more (and marginally so) possession in yesterday's game.
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You are simply looking at it completely wrong. It wasn’t his best game yesterday but we can accept that. You accept that we have improved as a team. The biggest reason to our improvement is Bruno. He is not perfect. Accept the rough with the smooth.
 
charlenefan said:
Sky the cretins gave him a 3 yesterday and the worst player on the pitch :wenger:

I thought given how cagey the game was Bruno was fine, in typical Bruno fashion he was almost the match winner as well
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3 is fair. How would you have rated him? I can only remember the free kick being the only good thing he did.
 
KennyBurner said:
Great analysis. Ive noticed he is very immobile on the ball which is the difference between him and De bruyne. Debruyne can power run with the ball and dribble one or two players while bruno cant. If you watch bruno closely you will see that sometimes he crosses from a standstill.

I think a quick solution may be a prolonged rest for him. Its my only explanation for why more times he doesn't run with the ball and other times he does. Maybe he is reserving energy or something.
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This post just highlights your naivety and lack of understanding of his game. You are suggesting a prolonged rest will mean he will come back and start running with the ball more? Seriously? Do you even realise that’s not his game and never has been. In his whole time with us, he has never been a player who is going to skip past players with the ball. He is not de Bruyne. He is Bruno. His game has always been about finding the killer pass as quick as possible often with a first time pass. He’s not suddenly going to become a dribbler with a prolonged rest.
 
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