Boycott The Qatar World Cup?

stevoc said:
Ok fair enough mate, no worries. The likes of ITV and the BBC are sort of damned if they do and damned if they don't thought aren't they. Highlight the issues going on with people in Qatar and some people are annoyed they aren't just concentrating on football. Ignore the issues and others will be upset they aren't using the platform to shine a light on the human rights abuses over there. So I imagine they're they're trying to strike a balance, to be honest at the last World Cup they didn't afford enough coverage to some of the issues surrounding Russia. So personally I think it's good that this time they are speaking out on things, I hope this happens at every World Cup going forward.
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I get your point. But in this case I think they are outraged at things have been proven to be false or exaggerated.

In the future I’d hope if the WC is awarded to a country that then starts a war it gets revoked. But beyond that every country has its issues some worse than others funnily enough usually the ones pointing the finger.

But the next WC is partly in the USA. Before Qatar 2022 started I don’t think anyone would have have wanted US foreign or domestic policy to be mentioned even those from Iraq, Afghanistan, Yemen, Somalia, Pakistan, Libya, Cuba, Congo, Sudan, Syria, Panama, Vietnam, Kuwait, Lebanon, Iran, Laos , Nicaragua etc etc but now people might think “charge everyone the same price, or their fair price”
 
JustAGuest said:
I didn't comment on those parts as it seemed irrelevant to my post about fans being paid by Qatar to do positive PR for them, but I can see the connection if you are implying that the media is lying about it. I'm guessing the point about the LGBT community must be meant for another user.
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It’s very relevant because 99.9% of people in this country’s views and opinions on Qatar are based on what they read/hear in the media. And I’ve just shown that the media have lied about the amount of migrants that died. So what does that say about the majority of peoples opinions about Qatar in this country?

The LGBT was to you. Because that’s a legitimate concern I can understand people having about many parts of the world. I’d have hoped rational country specific advice is what people would have received from the media.
 
The only issue that is relevant is that FIFA accepted a huge bride to award the bid to Qatar.

Once the key officers were removed the obvious decision should have been to award the bid to the country with next highest bid.
Instead FIFA doubled down on the original award.

The entire 'whataboutism' defense is not relevant.

Fans may or may not watch. It is the WC after all.

There is talk that Denmark is considering further action while denying it is planning to quit FIFA.
I hope the action taken is with other countries joining them.
 
AlPistacho said:
It’s very relevant because 99.9% of people in this country’s views and opinions on Qatar are based on what they read/hear in the media. And I’ve just shown that the media have lied about the amount of migrants that died. So what does that say about the majority of peoples opinions about Qatar in this country?

The LGBT was to you. Because that’s a legitimate concern I can understand people having about many parts of the world. I’d have hoped rational country specific advice is what people would have received from the media.
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Which media?
 
AlPistacho said:
It’s very relevant because 99.9% of people in this country’s views and opinions on Qatar are based on what they read/hear in the media. And I’ve just shown that the media have lied about the amount of migrants that died. So what does that say about the majority of peoples opinions about Qatar in this country?

The LGBT was to you. Because that’s a legitimate concern I can understand people having about many parts of the world. I’d have hoped rational country specific advice is what people would have received from the media.
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That Guardian article was misleading but they didn't really lie, Amnesty International put the deaths of migrant workers in Qatar at over 15,000 over a 10 year period (possibly even higher again if workers who die from complications after returning home are included). Those death rates are high for relatively young and healthy adults. Here's a decent article that breaks down the claims of those deaths and fact checks the Guardian article.

https://www.dw.com/en/fact-check-how-many-people-have-died-for-the-qatar-world-cup/a-63763713

The conditions that people are forced to work in in Qatar and the amount of deaths as a result of those working conditions shouldn't be underestimated.
 


This goes some way into explaining why the majority of UEFA didn’t join operation “One Love”… the officials in France, Spain, Portugal and many more countries in Europe do not see things the same way as Germany & England do…
 
tomaldinho1 said:
Which media?
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Claim: "The World Cup in Qatar has cost the lives of 6,500 — even as many as 15,000 — migrant workers."

DW fact check: False

Guardian for the 6500, other news outlets (can’t remember) went 15,000.

People can sugarcoat media deception however they want but those are the facts. The majority of people in this country have been led into hating Qatar by lies/manipulation from the media.
 
Pintu said:


This goes some way into explaining why the majority of UEFA didn’t join operation “One Love”… the officials in France, Spain, Portugal and many more countries in Europe do not see things the same way as Germany & England do…
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The human rights abuses are getting better because they finished building the stadiums. I mean, how fecking stupid does he think people are?
 
AlPistacho said:
Claim: "The World Cup in Qatar has cost the lives of 6,500 — even as many as 15,000 — migrant workers."

DW fact check: False

Guardian for the 6500, other news outlets (can’t remember) went 15,000.

People can sugarcoat media deception however they want but those are the facts. The majority of people in this country have been led into hating Qatar by lies/manipulation from the media.
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Eh, that number is correct according the Qatar government. They just aren't all related to the World Cup. It's not false, it's misleading. Although, since there were mostly no autopsies done, and most deaths listed simply as "natural causes", it's not hard to see the possibility of a cover up. People aren't being led to hate Qatar. They hating the Qatar government all by themselves. Thats kinda what happens when you practice modern slavery and treat minorities as second class citizens.
 
AlPistacho said:
Claim: "The World Cup in Qatar has cost the lives of 6,500 — even as many as 15,000 — migrant workers."

DW fact check: False

Guardian for the 6500, other news outlets (can’t remember) went 15,000.

People can sugarcoat media deception however they want but those are the facts. The majority of people in this country have been led into hating Qatar by lies/manipulation from the media.
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But the DW article confirmed that more than 15,000 workers did die in Qatar over a 10 year period (the actual number is almost certainly higher). Just because they didn't die working specifically on the World Cup project doesn't make it ok that so many died due to the working conditions there. And certainly doesn't absolve Qatar from blame for a lot of those deaths.
 
stevoc said:
But the DW article confirmed that more than 15,000 workers did die in Qatar over a 10 year period (the actual number is almost certainly higher). Just because they didn't die working specifically on the World Cup project doesn't make it ok that so many died due to the working conditions there. And certainly doesn't absolve Qatar from blame for a lot of those deaths.
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Until you have a solid set of statistics on 10 year labor worker deaths in non first world countries, this stat on Qatar is BS. As I've said many times before there are many things to criticize Qatar for, but this labor deaths stuff is nonsense.

If you care so much about working conditions, let the migrant workers into your countries then?
 
The bitter truth for folks living in the west (including myself) is that our lifestyles cannot be sustained without the suffering of someone else in the world. Exploitation is key to the way we live.
 
Pintu said:
Can you point to someone here who said they are ok with Qatar’s human rights abuses?


Regarding modern slavery the US is not really perfect.

8-C1-BD71-A-965-D-4-C1-C-9-C9-A-84-C8-BFE2-D4-D2.jpg


And Mexico the other organiser of 2026

DD311-FDF-1589-4-B38-96-C6-995806-FBDCC1.jpg
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No country is perfect, but not all countries are equally bad. These two pictures you attached show that the United States is at position 158 out of 167. This is quite good, there are only nine countries who are doing better. For example, Canada ranks 166/167, so it is better than the US, and there is only one country with a better rank, Japan (167/167). Iran is 10/167, which means there are 9 countries worse than Iran. The worst country is of course North Korea. Second worse is Eritrea. Qatar actually has a good rank according to this web site, 153/167.

https://www.globalslaveryindex.org/2018/data/maps/#prevalence
 
shamans said:
Until you have a solid set of statistics on 10 year labor worker deaths in non first world countries, this stat on Qatar is BS. As I've said many times before there are many things to criticize Qatar for, but this labor deaths stuff is nonsense.

If you care so much about working conditions, let the migrant workers into your countries then?
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I don’t care. I want them to die in their own countries -the countries I plundered and damned for many years and never ever plan to compensate- I want them to die there working in worse conditions for lower wages…
 
Norman Brownbutter said:
The human rights abuses are getting better because they finished building the stadiums. I mean, how fecking stupid does he think people are?
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Well people seem to be buying the stupid idea that European football associations and MSM care so much about migrants and LGBTQ rights, and that’s the main reason they are trashing Qatar..
 
shamans said:
Until you have a solid set of statistics on 10 year labor worker deaths in non first world countries, this stat on Qatar is BS. As I've said many times before there are many things to criticize Qatar for, but this labor deaths stuff is nonsense.

If you care so much about working conditions, let the migrant workers into your countries then?
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They go to Qatar for work and depending on who they become employed by can often depend on whether they can return or are stuck there. Are you saying that the interviewed workers and their families are lying? These are people who when they die they don't get medical examinations and to die from work exhaustion is considered normal.

But I guess we'll stick by what the Qatar Government tells us because they'll no doubt provide correct information.

To say this issue is nonsense is pretty disturbing.
 
Pintu said:
Well people seem to be buying the stupid idea that European football associations and MSM care so much about migrants and LGBTQ rights, and that’s the main reason they are trashing Qatar..
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No, it isn't. It's no more the reason that people are trashing THE QATAR GOVERNMENT than it will be in 4 years time when people are talking about the civil rights and corruption abuses in America in 4 years time. Because we are already talking about them. The media, the footballers, whoever might be virtue signalling, but the general public is not. Most of us see something wrong and we call bullshit on it. The fact that the World Cup is here now is why it's getting more attention, but it's always gotten attention. Calling bullshit on the actions of the Qatari government is not anything new. It's just amplified because they just invited the world in for a big party.
 
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stevoc said:
But the DW article confirmed that more than 15,000 workers did die in Qatar over a 10 year period (the actual number is almost certainly higher). Just because they didn't die working specifically on the World Cup project doesn't make it ok that so many died due to the working conditions there. And certainly doesn't absolve Qatar from blame for a lot of those deaths.
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15000 foreign workers out of 1.8 million foreign workers died in a 10 year period in Qatar. .

6500 foreign workers out of 1 million foreign workers from South Asian countries died in the same 10 year period. Contrary to what many of you guys might think not all Indians, Pakistanis, Sri Lankans etc in Qatar are labourers. But look at how what accounts for over 50% of the population doesn’t come close to 50% of the deaths in the same 10 year period.
 
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Norman Brownbutter said:
Eh, that number is correct according the Qatar government. They just aren't all related to the World Cup. It's not false, it's misleading. Although, since there were mostly no autopsies done, and most deaths listed simply as "natural causes", it's not hard to see the possibility of a cover up. People aren't being led to hate Qatar. They hating the Qatar government all by themselves. Thats kinda what happens when you practice modern slavery and treat minorities as second class citizens.
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Qatari’s are the minority in Qatar. So not sure what you’re on about.
 
I guess this thread is proof that sportswashing works perfectly. Well done, qatar, mission accomplished.
 
maniak said:
I guess this thread is proof that sportswashing works perfectly. Well done, qatar, mission accomplished.
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I don't think it's that. I've seen no "praise" of Qatar. There is just a big anti-Western sentiment that hates Western moral lecturing.
 
AlPistacho said:
Claim: "The World Cup in Qatar has cost the lives of 6,500 — even as many as 15,000 — migrant workers."

DW fact check: False

Guardian for the 6500, other news outlets (can’t remember) went 15,000.

People can sugarcoat media deception however they want but those are the facts. The majority of people in this country have been led into hating Qatar by lies/manipulation from the media.
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You might want to read the rest of the article you’re quoting…
 
shamans said:
Until you have a solid set of statistics on 10 year labor worker deaths in non first world countries, this stat on Qatar is BS. As I've said many times before there are many things to criticize Qatar for, but this labor deaths stuff is nonsense.
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Do you have any information to back up that these stats are BS and nonsense or is your opinion just based on feeling?

As this is the second time you've responded similarly to one of my posts on this topic, the first time I provided you with information to back up my opinion. Can you do the same?

That 'BS' deaths stat is from official Qatari statistics obtained by Amnesty International. This article goes into detail on these stats and fact checks them, please read it and the other links I gave you before claiming people are posting BS and nonsense.

https://www.dw.com/en/fact-check-how-many-people-have-died-for-the-qatar-world-cup/a-63763713

shamans said:
If you care so much about working conditions, let the migrant workers into your countries then?
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Unlike a lot of people I do care mate and I've no problem with people coming to the UK to work, they'd be treated with a lot more respect and work in much safer conditions. But I'm not in a position to bring 2-3 million construction workers from Asia/Africa to the UK, and sadly even if I could Qatar would just replace them with more people.
 
AlPistacho said:
15000 foreign workers out of 1.8 million foreign workers died in a 10 year period in Qatar. .

6500 foreign workers out of 1 million foreign workers from South Asian countries died in the same 10 year period. Contrary to what many of you guys might think not all Indians, Pakistanis, Sri Lankans etc in Qatar are labourers. But look at how what accounts for over 50% of the population doesn’t come close to 50% of the deaths in the same 10 year period.
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Apologies I don't understand this bit mate?
 
RedSky said:
They go to Qatar for work and depending on who they become employed by can often depend on whether they can return or are stuck there. Are you saying that the interviewed workers and their families are lying? These are people who when they die they don't get medical examinations and to die from work exhaustion is considered normal.

But I guess we'll stick by what the Qatar Government tells us because they'll no doubt provide correct information.

To say this issue is nonsense is pretty disturbing.
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Indeed.
 
VorZakone said:
I don't think it's that. I've seen no "praise" of Qatar. There is just a big anti-Western sentiment that hates Western moral lecturing.
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Maybe not direct praise for the abuses themselves, but there's certainly an implicit praising of qatar's posture of standing up to the hypocritical west. In practice, for the oppressed qataris, the result is the same.
 
How many pages will this thread have by the time Saudi Arabia 2030 rolls around?
 
Levi1 said:
How many pages will this thread have by the time Saudi Arabia 2030 rolls around?
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It seems thatno nation from AFC can host it before 2034 at the earliest. One confederation (in this case AFC) can’t have 2 WC of 3 hosted by its members.

This rule was supposed to guarantee rotation…Now it seems to imply Europe will be hosting 1 in 3 instead of hosting more than half. (10 of the first 18 were played in Western Europe… 4 in South America.. 3 in Central & North America and 1 in Asia)
 
stevoc said:
Do you have any information to back up that these stats are BS and nonsense or is your opinion just based on feeling?

As this is the second time you've responded similarly to one of my posts on this topic, the first time I provided you with information to back up my opinion. Can you do the same?

That 'BS' deaths stat is from official Qatari statistics obtained by Amnesty International. This article goes into detail on these stats and fact checks them, please read it and the other links I gave you before claiming people are posting BS and nonsense.

https://www.dw.com/en/fact-check-how-many-people-have-died-for-the-qatar-world-cup/a-63763713



Unlike a lot of people I do care mate and I've no problem with people coming to the UK to work, they'd be treated with a lot more respect and work in much safer conditions. But I'm not in a position to bring 2-3 million construction workers from Asia/Africa to the UK, and sadly even if I could Qatar would just replace them with more people.
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They are BS because they are not all deaths from inhumane conditions. Weird you link that article there which I just read in full and makes the exact same claim. That the deaths are of total migrant workers and not those working on stadiums as well as no deaths on the stadiums.

You may care and let migrant workers in but the officials complaining about this wouldn't dare to do it. Qatar is doing something to employ South Asians with no opportunity at least and it's disturbing to see us sitting cushy in the west raising a finger while doing nothing for it.

Qatar labor obviously does not have the standards of U.S or England/wester Europe but then how many countries do?

There are a lot of preconceived notions about Qatar and a lot has been propelled because of that. Just like the "slaves" argument
 
maniak said:
I guess this thread is proof that sportswashing works perfectly. Well done, qatar, mission accomplished.
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Nice try but no. For those of us who have lived in the middle east, and acknowledge where qatar lacks there is a lot of obvious western propaganda.

If anything it shows hypocrisy of western nations to me and the power of propaganda.

Boycott Qatar for something that has no proof but won't boycott your cellphone made in China which dont get me started on
 
AlPistacho said:
15000 foreign workers out of 1.8 million foreign workers died in a 10 year period in Qatar. .

6500 foreign workers out of 1 million foreign workers from South Asian countries died in the same 10 year period. Contrary to what many of you guys might think not all Indians, Pakistanis, Sri Lankans etc in Qatar are labourers. But look at how what accounts for over 50% of the population doesn’t come close to 50% of the deaths in the same 10 year period.
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That's exactly what most on here think. That a sheikh is sitting on some horse whipping some poor worker to near death to build the stadium
 
RedSky said:
They go to Qatar for work and depending on who they become employed by can often depend on whether they can return or are stuck there. Are you saying that the interviewed workers and their families are lying? These are people who when they die they don't get medical examinations and to die from work exhaustion is considered normal.

But I guess we'll stick by what the Qatar Government tells us because they'll no doubt provide correct information.

To say this issue is nonsense is pretty disturbing.
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So do you have any proof of this? Even from biased western sources I've not read anything solid.

Have you ever even been to Qatar and how the system works? And if you're gonna say I wouldn't dare step into that shite hole, do you know anyone personally who has? Maybe you could talk to them.

FYI I work in a fancy tech company here in the U.S that you hear on the news a lot. We have a Chinese coworker who is here on a company sponsored visa (not H1B). My manager makes him work like a dog because he can't seek another job here due to visa status and he doesn't wanna go back to china.

Should we boycott the American world cup now due to exploitation?
 
shamans said:
We have a Chinese coworker who is here on a company sponsored visa (not H1B). My manager makes him work like a dog because he can't seek another job here due to visa status and he doesn't wanna go back to china. Should we boycott the American world cup now due to exploitation?
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If your line of work is not directly involved in making the U.S. World Cup happen then there would certainly be less reason to boycott the U.S. for this situation.

It is not good that your colleague "works like a dog." But I don't think "not wanting to go back to China" is as sufficient reason for a situation to go from normal transaction to exploitative one, unless the reason they don't want to go back is "i'll be severely harmed by someone if I do so."
 
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Rhyme Animal said:
Yeah, they were responding specifically to the whataboutism that you and others have gone to great lengths to derail the thread with. You’ve been doing it for pages and seem hell bent on not allowing the topic of the actual thread to be discussed.

If you do actually care about the Human Rights abuses carried out by and now shushed by the qatar regime, and their at best highly questionable status of hosting a WC let alone their behaviour since the WC kicked off - PLEASE, FFS TALK ABOUT THAT. And stop wilfully derailing.
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I don't share the view that every loosely related topic is whataboutery, but if you so desperately want to shut down the discussion of these viewpoints, then report the post instead or don't reply.
 
RedSky said:
That's putting it mildly... being jailed for up to seven years just for being gay isn't what I would call being a "second-class citizen".
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Same way I would describe anyone who's having their civil rights violated. Is there a specific phrase you are looking for?
 
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