You get more negative coverage and you get more positive coverage. It's the nature of getting a lot more coverage.
I can't watch a game on BT or Sky without there being at least 1 Man United supporter either as an expert or co-commentator.
Ben Chilwell to Chelsea
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You get more negative coverage and you get more positive coverage. It's the nature of getting a lot more coverage.
I can't watch a game on BT or Sky without there being at least 1 Man United supporter either as an expert or co-commentator.
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Just seen it
Yeah anyone claiming they’ve been brilliant for years needs their head checked.
Completely agree I’m all caught up now on the thread.It’s fine to say they have done well in the market this summer. It’s when people extrapolate that and make out that they are a reference point for great transfer business in general that it becomes ridiculous. This Marina bird is the most hyped person on the planet
Still think Barkley for £15m is harsh to be thrown in with Kepa for £70m
Recency bias ha
Over the past decade they have been better overall. Nothing to do with recency bias.
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It’s probably just because United were the dominant team in the 00s it used to be (And still is) Liverpool commentary.
Chelsea don’t have club legends that aren’t in management other than Cole and a few others (who has been getting his fair share of punditry)
You must be watching different coverage to me if you think we get a great deal of positive analysis.
Ferdinand and Evra are cheerleaders, I will give you that, but the likes of Neville, Scholes and Keane have always been happy to chuck us under the bus for a controversial soundbite, although they’ve considerably toned it down for their mate Ole.
And don’t even get me started on someone like Ince, who doesn’t conceal his disdain at all.
It’s got to the point where I deleted all social media and rarely tune in either side of the match itself, all of which leads to football being a more enjoyable experience.
I only get wound up when I consume my last remaining vice – the Caf!
Mourinho and Conte both had meltdowns relating to a failure to strengthen off the back of title wins. They have made some good signings and some terrible ones too. That said, they are being positioned as some sort of transfer market masters. Just look at some of their ‘Ins’ during the past five years, much of which is complete dross.
Just seen it
Yeah anyone claiming they’ve been brilliant for years needs their head checked.
Completely agree I’m all caught up now on the thread.
Still think Barkley for £15m is harsh to be thrown in with Kepa for £70m
Yep, I understand your point about Barkley. He’s a pretty average player but fine for £15m and does a job as a squaddie.
Yeah, I understand why it is.
It just makes me confused to see people moan about negative coverage when I see some "experts" saying things that would make Paddy Crerand on MUTV think "tone down the bias a little".
Or no-one offers Chilwell higher wages than Chelsea, and he decides to sit and run his contract out and leave on a free.
As a Leicester fan, if we get Tagliafico for cheaper, then it's great business, because it strengthens our biggest weakness in our back 4. If there was any player I was 'happy' to lose from our starting XI, it was Chilwell (Ok, maybe Perez first and then Chilwell, but still...). He's got good stamina, but given his performances I think he's been quite overrated, which is why I think we've been fairly happy to sell - had it been Ricardo, I reckon you'd be looking at closer to a £100m price tag.
Tbf, whenever Leicester sell a player, their fans come out and say that he is the most expendable component in their team. It was the same last summer with Maguire.
Nah.
Maguire wasn't the most expendable component in the team - I don't remember anyone saying that, at the time. I imagine what people will have said is that Maguire wasn't our best CB. And they'd have been right, because in their time together, Evans had been the superior player. Though considering we had Soyuncu waiting in the wings (who is probably as good as Maguire, if not better), then with the benefit of hindsight, he was fairly expendable after all.
It's clearly not true for all players though. We knew we'd never be able to replace Kante, or Mahrez - they were huge, huge losses, but was out of our control. If we'd lost Vardy earlier (like when he nearly went to Arsenal) then we'd have had a fit. But for the most part - Drinkwater, Maguire, Chilwell - it's players that we can get a good price for, that we're confident that we can replace with someone of at least equal quality.
If you have a look at the Leicester forums, most aren't too bothered about Chilwell going. If it was Ricky P or Soyuncu going, there would be a meltdown. Not that Chilwell's a bad player - he's fairly reliable in defense, if uninspiring in attack, and he's good at getting up and down the pitch. But he's not an exceptional talent, and if he weren't English then I'm not sure clubs would be giving him a second glance.
"I never fancied her anyway" - guy who just got dumped.
I watched Leicester a fair bit in the second half of last season and Soyuncu’s form completely nosedived. The notion that he’s superior to Maguire is laughable. Evans was a good player at United but didn’t have the backbone to succeed when someone like Vidic or Ferdinand wasn’t there to clean up after him. I don’t massively rate Maguire but he gets a lot of shit considering he’s a big reason we have sharpened up defensively and build from the back more effectively.
Anyway, what is beyond debate is that Leicester are very effective at cultivating players, selling for great money and then reinvesting and starting the cycle all over again. Save for a lull after your title win, I’d say your transfer work has been very good overall.
Pretty sure I said signings and sales. They are miles ahead of us in both in the past decade. Thats just the facts.
No one called them perfect. Better than us though yes.
They had a brief spell where they stopped spending alot a couple years back. However even then their sales and ability to negotiate good fees never deteriorated. Which was the point being made, they are better negotiators period
He is making no progress with this move. Moving from small team to another.
Talk about damning with feint praise. Being better than United does not equate to good. I would say Chelsea have been more miss than hit in the past decade.
Tbf, Chelsea are one of the most successful English teams in the past twenty years. The no history argument doesn’t really wash anymore.
50 million for Chilwell is crazy. Very average player. Loads of hype when it comes to Chelsea’s signings as they are guaranteed to give them instant success. I highly doubt that.
Their top 5 most expensive signings have been comfortably worse than ours. Kepa, Morata, Pulisic, Jorginho, and Fernando Torres.
Sure, but by that same token our top 5 sales beat yours comfortably in terms of extracting maximal value for a distressed asset: Hazard, Diego Costa, Oscar, Morata, & David Luiz.
I agree that Soyuncu's form was definitely poorer in the second half (though you have to take into consideration that in the second half of the season N'didi was out injured for a while, and then when he came back, Ricardo and Chilwell both got injured, so we had an unsettled defensive unit). Still, Leicester only conceded 5 more goals than United, even considering how decimated our defense ended up being for the last 10 games or so.
That first half of the season from him was better than anything I've seen from Maguire though. Having watched both of them in a Leicester team, with the same defensive partners, the idea that he's superior to Maguire isn't laughable at all. I wouldn't say there's a lot between the two, but Soyuncu has something that Maguire doesn't, and that's pace in abundance. For what it's worth, I really liked Maguire as a player - and I'd be more gutted about him going than Chilwell - but I don't think him leaving made us any weaker.
As for Evans, I think if you're comparing him to Rio or Vidic, then he's on a hiding to nothing. He's clearly not that quality, but how many defenders in the league are of that quality these days? But he's a bit more mature now since his United days, and while he may not be world class, he's been our best CB ever since his arrival.
I agree from Chelsea perspective there is a lot to say for both options, also taking into account the home grown factor .. But for Leicester getting a top player like Tagliafico back after selling Chill well, with such a price difference... Incredible good business for Leicester as they were gonna lose Chill well anyway very likely and not even losing quality on the pitch
You seem to be mixing success of the players with ability to negotiate both sales and purchases. They havent been hit and miss with that, especially on player sales
Player success has nothing to do with ability to negotiate a deal. They are better negotiators, they get better purchase prices and get more money in when offloading deadwood.
There are some outliers like Kepa which was a ridiculous purchase based on the fee. However overall in the past decade they wipe the flaw with us especially on player sales. Emelano and Marina just miles better than Woodward and his team, thats just plain to see
Lampard wanted chilwell and board backed him. Chelsea must be tired of recent signings of cheaper full backs from other European leagues like zapacosta,emerson.
With Lampard wanted him and A.Cole rated him highly made the choice for marina to sign chilwell though paying extra 10-15 mn for his service.
With Lampard wanted him and A.Cole rated him highly made the choice for marina to sign chilwell though paying extra 10-15 mn for his service.
I personally don’t think you can decouple the ability or success of a player from the negotiation aspect. Take Zappacosta for example – €28m plus bonuses, for a totally ordinary full back who is no longer at the club. Do Chelsea deserve credit for having wrapped up that deal with ease? The selling club probably couldn’t believe their luck.
On the player sales point, even though it’s trendy to shit on United, we have noticeably improved in this respect, which is why so much deadwood has been dumped, with hopefully more to come. The likes of Di Maria and Lukaku didn’t work out, but we pretty much recouped our money for both, while we also drove a brilliant fee for Schneiderlin and got Sanchez out the club recently. Of course, all of this will be summarily ignored.
You're mixing two separate debates.
- Leicester managing to buy Tagliafico after failing to keep hold of Chilwell is good business. BUT,
- Leicester selling a young 23-year-old English Chilwell playing in the English League for 45 m(+5) in return for a 28-year-old player Argentine Tagliafico playing in the Dutch League for 25m isn't impressive from a pure business perspective as Tagliafico won't have any resale value.
On a separate note, I think Chilwell is pretty average and overrated, like most English players. The problem is that he will continue to fetch good money even if Chelsea decide to sell him in a few years' time, simply because he is English and is playing in the Premier League.
How many 27/28 year-old English players playing in top Premier League clubs (Chilwell at the end of this Chelsea contract) you know of have run down their contracts and left on a free? If a club allows a 27/28 year old player in the peak of his career to leave on a free, he is almost certainly not good enough to play in the Premier League, anyway.
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So much deadwood has been dumped? Cool. Thats great but it doesnt change the fact Chelsea have been miles better at this, so I do not get your point here.
You can point to poor players on both clubs sides in terms if signings.The scouts manager pick the players. The recruitment team gets the deals done. That recruitment side of Chelsea clearly works a lot better than United was the point.
You’re making statements but not backing them up. Pointless debate.
we don't need resale value from Tagliafico, Luke Thomas is rated every bit as highly as Chilwell was at the same stage, we need someone ready to go from the off whilst Thomas continues to develop then he becomes first choice in a couple of years
Chillwell is sh*te !! Why will we pay 50m for him when greats like Regulion and Tagliafico are available for 20m? Sometimes I really don't get this club. Marina is a fraud! Watch him flop totally this season. I expect 20g + 20assists. I think we'll struggle to get 10m for him once we realise he's crap.
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Considering we got double what we paid for Diego Costa from the same club we bought him from after he'd been publicly pushed out of the squad by the manager, I'd say it's pretty clear we're well ahead of just about anyone in terms of player sales.
We got our fee back for Morata, we sold 29 year old Hazard with one year left on his deal for 130m (and counting), more than doubled our money on Oscar, etc. It's really not controversial to suggest Chelsea are arguably the best in the world at this particular aspect of squad management.
you expect 20 goals and 20 assists from a full back? that's insane
Common theme amongst these terrible signings, too, and a lesson we've clearly learned from judging by this summer. Morata, Zappa, Drinkwater, and Kepa were all panic buys we settled for near the end of the transfer window after missing out on other targets (or getting fecked over by Courtois).
When our club gets business done early and go for our #1 targets they're brilliant. This summer reminds me of 2014 when we got Cesc, Costa, and Felipe Luis. Identified specific weaknesses and addressed them with high quality.
I'm just a silly little guy who has no idea how a fullback flops
Agree - Luke Thomas looks like a great replacement. Would be better than Ben in couple of years. Lewis also would be a great buy for 15m.
like I say we need someone ready to go from the off, not really sure that's Lewis, also his young age is a potential road block for Thomas, 27/28 year old coming in is pretty much a perfect scenario, ideally we would have kept Chilwell for another couple of years
I can’t be arsed to debate with people who are so brazenly selective with the facts they use to support their argument. At no stage whatsoever have I suggested Chelsea have failed to do good transfer business. I have simply consistently pointed out that for a club with a much vaunted approach to squad management, it’s funny how many dud transfers you have made in the past decade. There are countless examples, but if you wish to disregard them in favour of a one eyed view of the world then all power to you.
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