Spending 100 mil on new signing while asking everyone to take pay cut. Really low from a supposedly big organization.
Barcelona: Charged with corruption .... again!
- Thread starter The Boy
- Start date
[QUOTE="FCBarcelona, post: 29173593, member: 102505".
of course, and barça has to pay all the money the contracts say.
barça would have been relegated if that wasn't true.
it is better not to open the "morality" door, because you might ending not very well there.
[/QUOTE]
Chelsea have been monetarily neutral for the most part for years now. It could be argued that we were better off without most of Romans “impulse splurges”. I feel like we are treading over old ground here, but it has been pretty well established Roman is not “friends” with Putin. Roman has not broken any laws, and his finances were proven above board over 12 times in various international courts. You may not like oil, but this isnt a Greta Thunberg convention. Chelsea has ALWAYS done right by their players, wether you like the owner or not. And he kept it listed as accumulated debt, under a holding company, for benefits related to British tax laws among other factors. It is a bit complicated for people who think Barca are doing well.
Chelsea had been on extremely good financial footing for years, and the strength of their academy and intelligence in the market have been at the heart of that.
Gandalf is right: Barca making decisions that are un precedented for any club. How much the players are making is irrelevant, or whether the team feels they deserve it is irrelevant. If you owe the player you pay them. What happens to the players your bringing in now if the club feels they aren’t playing up too ok the contract and they have financial trouble? Barcelona can never be trusted by anyone again. Might as well replace that badge with a chocolate ice cream emoji. We are talking about them agreeing to take wages for games already played spread out over later dates. They did it to help you, and the club is trying to screw them. That makes you the dark stain on sports
and yes, your Goldman Sachs loan at least is 3 percent.
The level of complicit propaganda with Barca and the Barca press is … astounding, almost creepy. Up there with with the North Korean bubble.
Barca IS the bad guy here.I think they realize that. They just seem to think that winning will cause everyone not to notice.
And again, remember: when Barca sues over Super league backouts , that will automatically allow for extra discovery, discovery that WILL get out over the role Barca played in the formation of destroying traditional European football to escape a drowning league they helped strangle to begin with.
That will make you a financially distressed team that further mortgaged your future, took advantage of its own players in a predatory way, told them through Jordi Cruyff that they should accept it because Barca was more important than them…. Like a cult, tried to destroy the landscape of European football with the Super league, then sued everyone else’s favorite teams for not going along with it in the end.
And they think trophies will fix all that?
Things are gonna get bad.
of course, and barça has to pay all the money the contracts say.
barça would have been relegated if that wasn't true.
it is better not to open the "morality" door, because you might ending not very well there.
[/QUOTE]
Chelsea have been monetarily neutral for the most part for years now. It could be argued that we were better off without most of Romans “impulse splurges”. I feel like we are treading over old ground here, but it has been pretty well established Roman is not “friends” with Putin. Roman has not broken any laws, and his finances were proven above board over 12 times in various international courts. You may not like oil, but this isnt a Greta Thunberg convention. Chelsea has ALWAYS done right by their players, wether you like the owner or not. And he kept it listed as accumulated debt, under a holding company, for benefits related to British tax laws among other factors. It is a bit complicated for people who think Barca are doing well.
Chelsea had been on extremely good financial footing for years, and the strength of their academy and intelligence in the market have been at the heart of that.
Gandalf is right: Barca making decisions that are un precedented for any club. How much the players are making is irrelevant, or whether the team feels they deserve it is irrelevant. If you owe the player you pay them. What happens to the players your bringing in now if the club feels they aren’t playing up too ok the contract and they have financial trouble? Barcelona can never be trusted by anyone again. Might as well replace that badge with a chocolate ice cream emoji. We are talking about them agreeing to take wages for games already played spread out over later dates. They did it to help you, and the club is trying to screw them. That makes you the dark stain on sports
and yes, your Goldman Sachs loan at least is 3 percent.
The level of complicit propaganda with Barca and the Barca press is … astounding, almost creepy. Up there with with the North Korean bubble.
Barca IS the bad guy here.I think they realize that. They just seem to think that winning will cause everyone not to notice.
And again, remember: when Barca sues over Super league backouts , that will automatically allow for extra discovery, discovery that WILL get out over the role Barca played in the formation of destroying traditional European football to escape a drowning league they helped strangle to begin with.
That will make you a financially distressed team that further mortgaged your future, took advantage of its own players in a predatory way, told them through Jordi Cruyff that they should accept it because Barca was more important than them…. Like a cult, tried to destroy the landscape of European football with the Super league, then sued everyone else’s favorite teams for not going along with it in the end.
And they think trophies will fix all that?
Things are gonna get bad.
Chelsea have been monetarily neutral for the most part for years now. It could be argued that we were better off without most of Romans “impulse splurges”. I feel like we are treading over old ground here, but it has been pretty well established Roman is not “friends” with Putin. Roman has not broken any laws, and his finances were proven above board over 12 times in various international courts. You may not like oil, but this isnt a Greta Thunberg convention. Chelsea has ALWAYS done right by their players, wether you like the owner or not. And he kept it listed as accumulated debt, under a holding company, for benefits related to British tax laws among other factors. It is a bit complicated for people who think Barca are doing well.
Chelsea had been on extremely good financial footing for years, and the strength of their academy and intelligence in the market have been at the heart of that.
Gandalf is right: Barca making decisions that are un precedented for any club. How much the players are making is irrelevant, or whether the team feels they deserve it is irrelevant. If you owe the player you pay them. What happens to the players your bringing in now if the club feels they aren’t playing up too ok the contract and they have financial trouble? Barcelona can never be trusted by anyone again. Might as well replace that badge with a chocolate ice cream emoji. We are talking about them agreeing to take wages for games already played spread out over later dates. They did it to help you, and the club is trying to screw them. That makes you the dark stain on sports
and yes, your Goldman Sachs loan at least is 3 percent.
The level of complicit propaganda with Barca and the Barca press is … astounding, almost creepy. Up there with with the North Korean bubble.
Barca IS the bad guy here.I think they realize that. They just seem to think that winning will cause everyone not to notice.
And again, remember: when Barca sues over Super league backouts , that will automatically allow for extra discovery, discovery that WILL get out over the role Barca played in the formation of destroying traditional European football to escape a drowning league they helped strangle to begin with.
That will make you a financially distressed team that further mortgaged your future, took advantage of its own players in a predatory way, told them through Jordi Cruyff that they should accept it because Barca was more important than them…. Like a cult, tried to destroy the landscape of European football with the Super league, then sued everyone else’s favorite teams for not going along with it in the end.
And they think trophies will fix all that?
Things are gonna get bad.
[/QUOTE]
The Super League is the way historical clubs like Barca, Real Madrid and Juventus can make more money to compete with all these new rich clubs that get money from outside the football business. Chelsea, Manchester City, Newcastle, PSG, etc.
Those are the clubs who are financially cheating. If UEFA wasn't so corrupt and really did something about this financial doping the SL won't be needed. How could a club with no history like PSG pay 222 million for Neymar? 180 for Mbappe? How can a team with very few followers like Manchester City afford the kind of squad they have?
It really bugs me that the SL is so heavily criticized but nobody does anything to avoid financial doping. UEFA fair play is a myth.
As much as I dislike Real Madrid I was partially satisfied when they eliminated 3 oil clubs in a row.
How many of those can they actually register for La Liga?
I think all of them after raising ~600m ..
IMO Barcelona are signing or two too many players.
Including their own fecking out of contract player as a signing
And someone signed for the B team, nutters.
A team struggling to pay current players next season on their current contract have managed to bring in 4 new players on big wages, one of them soon 34, one of them the lesser of two free Chelsea defenders (their rivals took the better one), and one a winger from 17th placed Leeds United.
Let’s just spin it as genius though and pretend that in 2018 they didn’t spend less money and bring in:
Athur, Malcolm (see Raphinha), Lenglet (see Christensen), Vidal, Emerson.
They’ve made one very good signing is all, and he’s 34 soon.
Their 2014-15 window was absolutely miles better with Suarez, Stigen, Rakatic all coming in with others for around 160m.
Last edited:
There has to be a rule somewhere on amortising this over a period of time rather than showing it all in profit and loss. Surely you can't sell 25% of the revenue that's due over next several decades and say it's a profit? If you can, that's just delaying the misery.
i’m 30 years time i doubt any one of us will even remember that barcelona existed as a football club, so there’s little point debating it all.
I don't think so. If they reall collapse I think they will be remembered as a tragic case for a long time.
How does it feel being time itself?
spoiler alert:
They won't collapse entirely. If things turn really bad someone will come along and bail them out or they'll sell off the club.
Chelsea had a debt to Abramovich of €2,000M+.
The owner decided to forgive that debt and that's it, but that's a brutal management disaster.
And the loan is at an interest of 1.98%.
Including their own fecking out of contract player as a signing
And someone signed for the B team, nutters.
A team struggling to pay current players next season on their current contract have managed to bring in 4 new players on big wages, one of them soon 34, one of them the lesser of two free Chelsea defenders (their rivals took the better one), and one a winger from 17th placed Leeds United.
Let’s just spin it as genius though and pretend that in 2018 they didn’t spend less money and bring in:
Athur, Malcolm (see Raphinha), Lenglet (see Christensen), Vidal, Emerson.
They’ve made one very good signing is all, and he’s 34 soon.
Their 2014-15 window was absolutely miles better with Suarez, Stigen, Rakatic all coming in with others for around 160m.
Yes, this transfer market is being very bad for Barcelona.
And the best thing that could ever happen to them is they fail in the league and get knocked out of the UCL early.
Really want to see what other future assets they can pull out of the bag before the banks say enough is enough.
Horrible greedy club has a gluttony problem.
Really want to see what other future assets they can pull out of the bag before the banks say enough is enough.
Horrible greedy club has a gluttony problem.
Have fun waiting mate. I'm sure Uli Hoeness has a free space next to him. He is waiting for that for nearly 20 years now.
Big ask, though, even for a mega rich owner. Essentially, they are now in over €2bn worth of debt with the levers.
Chelsea are on good financial footing because £1.5bn of loans have been written off. Without risk free borrowing, they’d be nowhere.
Barca currently don't have owners in the sense that you're thinking of as far as I know. So whatever money they'd get for selling (parts of) the club would remain with the club.
Yes, but the club cannot own itself; it is still owned by the members, meaning they could take the compensation due for the sale of Barcelona. If it gets reinvested, that is still a decision to be taken by the members.
If it is only a minor holding, it will likely be reinvested. But, if they are forced to sell a major holding in the future, the compensation money will probably not go into the club itself.
Last edited:
Are you sure that's how it works? Because at least in Germany the clubs indeed own their own assets. Being a member means you get a vote, but it doesn't mean you own a piece of the club. I assume it's the same in Spain.
"monetarily neutral"... when the debt to your dear friend of criminal war who financed your club stealing it from its country was around 2bn. Every single year you lost a lot of money. You only got bloody (literal) loans from your super oligarc. You are not different to the likes of City, PSG or Newcastle. Well, they actually didn't spend as much money as your bloody former owner, who has been expelled from your country for being very close to a criminal war.
Roman Abramovich, one of the world’s richest men, was finally subjected to sanctions by the UK government after ministers accused him of having “clear connections” to Vladimir Putin’s regime and being among a group of businessmen who had “blood on their hands”.
After weeks of pressure to act more aggressively against the oligarchs who have made the UK their home, Boris Johnson said Abramovich had been targeted because of his links to Putin. “You have to have clear evidence that they are connected to the Putin regime, and that has been established. That’s why we are going ahead with the sanctions that we are,” he said.
The foreign secretary, Liz Truss, also insisted that oligarchs would “have no place in our economy or society”. She said: “With their close links to Putin, they are complicit in his aggression. The blood of the Ukrainian people is on their hands. They should hang their heads in shame.”
Defend him all you want. Without innocent blood, Chelsea would be a mid table team, no academy, nothing. you like it or not.And this is a Greta Thunberg convention since you are all talking about morality and the "poor" players than received all the money that their contracts say (barça would be relegated otherwise) buuuut barça shouldn't try to sell them or whatever, or pay money not stipulated in the contracts because the contract was changed during COVID. Basically, you only seem to respect contracts when it fits you. When it doesn't you start talking about morality and blah blah blah.
GS loan is at 1.98% as it was announced by the club itself. But yeah, if you think it has to be 3% because potato, as you please it is 3%, no matter every source including Barça financials says it was 1.98%.
Barça press is BS, and if you knew it better it is 100% guided by lobby interests. The "entorno". Spoiler alert: most of it does not like Laporta. You obviously don't follow "Barça press" and you don't speak Spanish and you just read translated tweets so your opinion is, at the very least, very biased.
I don't give a f*** about SuperLeague. Of course, if a contract was signed and it had some clauses they have to be honored. Again, you only seem to be ok with some contracts, the ones you like. Your bloody (as I posted, your government opinion) club started the destruction of the traditional European Football. Premier League is the worldwide leader of dictators and criminals ownership. An enormous whitewashing machine. So, don't dare talking about the destruction of tradition.
Barça future is not, by any means, on danger due to the "levers". Actually LaLiga signed a WAY WORSE contract with CVC. Levers contracts are WAY, WAY, WAY, WAY better than the predatory contracts that LaLiga (and most of the clubs aside Barça and Madrid) signed.
He created a holding company just for that debt, which he never planned on having the club pay. It was accumulated since 2004, nearly TWENTY years, and categorizing it as debt gave him financial benefits. You are talking about two completely different situations.
Barcelona has accumulated MORE debt than that over just 4 to 5 years from people who expect it to be repaid. It is the reason you strangled the financial stability of your league, and the reason you orchestrated the “Super League”.
You have made yourself the enemy of the footballing world AND destitute. The story will play out that way over the next one to two years. Your club had a chance to avoid that by turning more to your academies, creating a structured plan to repay your debt.
But the “levers” means you have committed to your Super league lawsuits and hoping that if you can win enough trophies people will just ignore it.
It is a plan that reeks of the clueless and profound arrogance that has come to be Barcelonas signature.
Roman isn’t Putins friend. Romans ACTUAL friend was killed with a metal garrotte in a shower when Putin was forcing him and Roman to sell their oil company… but idk if that qualifies then as “friends” per se. And the official reason Abramovich was sanctioned: the statement that Avraz was supplying armor for Russian tanks was proven not to be true. Avraz is currently considering legal action, because it turns out the only armor grade steel theyve ever produced was for AMERICA. In fact, he is technically more responsible for providing armor to the Ukrainians via the new mobile artillery platforms than ever helping Putins Russian state.
"monetarily neutral"... when the debt to your dear friend of criminal war who financed your club stealing it from its country was around 2bn. Every single year you lost a lot of money. You only got bloody (literal) loans from your super oligarc. You are not different to the likes of City, PSG or Newcastle. Well, they actually didn't spend as much money as your bloody former owner, who has been expelled from your country for being very close to a criminal war.
Roman Abramovich, one of the world’s richest men, was finally subjected to sanctions by the UK government after ministers accused him of having “clear connections” to Vladimir Putin’s regime and being among a group of businessmen who had “blood on their hands”.
After weeks of pressure to act more aggressively against the oligarchs who have made the UK their home, Boris Johnson said Abramovich had been targeted because of his links to Putin. “You have to have clear evidence that they are connected to the Putin regime, and that has been established. That’s why we are going ahead with the sanctions that we are,” he said.
The foreign secretary, Liz Truss, also insisted that oligarchs would “have no place in our economy or society”. She said: “With their close links to Putin, they are complicit in his aggression. The blood of the Ukrainian people is on their hands. They should hang their heads in shame.”
And this is a Greta Thunberg convention since you are all talking about morality and the "poor" players than received all the money that their contracts say (barça would be relegated otherwise) buuuut barça shouldn't try to sell them or whatever, or pay money not stipulated in the contracts because the contract was changed during COVID. Basically, you only seem to respect contracts when it fits you. When it doesn't you start talking about morality and blah blah blah.
GS loan is at 1.98% as it was announced by the club itself. But yeah, if you think it has to be 3% because potato, as you please it is 3%, no matter every source including Barça financials says it was 1.98%.
Barça press is BS, and if you knew it better it is 100% guided by lobby interests. The "entorno". Spoiler alert: most of it does not like Laporta. You obviously don't follow "Barça press" and you don't speak Spanish and you just read translated tweets so your opinion is, at the very least, very biased.
I don't give a f*** about SuperLeague. Of course, if a contract was signed and it had some clauses they have to be honored. Again, you only seem to be ok with some contracts, the ones you like. Your bloody (as I posted, your government opinion) club started the destruction of the traditional European Football. Premier League is the worldwide leader of dictators and criminals ownership. An enormous whitewashing machine. So, don't dare talking about the destruction of tradition.
Barça future is not, by any means, on danger due to the "levers". Actually LaLiga signed a WAY WORSE contract with CVC. Levers contracts are WAY, WAY, WAY, WAY better than the predatory contracts that LaLiga (and most of the clubs aside Barça and Madrid) signed.
But hey, covering up just about anything, including child sex abuse , and ignoring realities that don’t suit your narrative is kinda Barcelona’s thing, right?
Paging Albert Benaiges… paging Albert Benaiges…..
Good for him. It doesn’t matter how the debt was managed or who it benefitted. Your portrayal of the incredibly well run Chelsea is a fabrication. They lost money hand over fist because they spent money they didn’t have. The only reason Chelsea weren’t spent into oblivion is because that debt was written off.
it is recognized by chelsea itself, erdogan, peskov and even zelensky that they have been talking with abramovich about the russian invasion... but no... 0 ties with putin... hahahahaha. just a random russian citizen who happened to negotiate with the leading actors of the war.
and you are a sick person. 200 messages and at least 80% just to bash barça.
however, saying that the club is covering child abuse crosses several lines. especially because it is completely false. barcelona fired him right after it was notified about an investigation, and barça has always collaborated with the police in the investigation, as it it stated in every single pice of information you can find.
by the way, it is "funny" that you mentioned child abuse when chelsea recently tried to buy the silence of abused men, offering 50k pounds. chelsea only made a public statement when it was caught.
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2018/may/17/chelsea-payout-sexual-abuse-victim
Chelsea have become the first club to issue a payout to an alleged victim since the full extent of football’s sex abuse scandal was exposed but risk drawing criticism for not making the compensation deal public.
so yeah, aside from getting money of criminal wars, it seems that the only team who has been caught trying to hide sexual abuse of minors is your beloved chelsea.
what was that about ignoring realities that don’t suit narratives?
Let’s stick to football eh?
Financials aside at the moment, Barca are a better team than Chelsea - bigger, better supported, better squad, bigger/better stadium, more pedigree, 'eritage etc.
Last edited:
I'm all about piling into Barcelona, but Chelsea fans should generally stay out. Your club was bought for and ran by a crook for 20 years - he was so bad that Mr Boris had to force him to sell the club. Let's not re-write history here, Chelsea were the original financial dopers, and Chelsea was just a vehicle for Roman to launder his reputation.
Barcelona by contrast are a giant of the game that is facing some financial problems due to mis-administration. They'll be fine long term, they're too relevant an institution in Spain to fail.
I am not getting involved in this ridiculousness but let’s not pretend that they weren’t going through a phase of mediocrity before 2004 either. Historically bigger yes but what they are now also grew from the same period we did.
Barcelona has always been a big team from Spain and Europe. Like any club has had better and worse moments.
To be able to speak you have to learn the history of the club.
Yeah no chance. Feck that. Barca fans don’t politely stay out when Chelsea are the focus of the pile on. This is a silly tat for tat that I have no interest in getting involved with but the idea that Chelsea fan should sit on the fence here because …. reasons is, with respect, a bit bollocks.
I mean they were always one of the big two in Spain and had considerable success in Europe (European Cup, Cup Winners Cup etc). Their growth was not predicated on a sugar daddy of questionable origin, it was organic and based on the fruits of their academy. Xavi, Iniesta, Puyol, Messi, Valdes, Eto'o, Busquets, Bojan, Pedro, Thiago etc were all youth products costing next to nothing.
I just find it hilarious Chelsea fans complaining about Barcelona's 'immoral behavior' when 80% of them wouldn't support Chelsea had it not been for Roman's immoral and ill-gotten wealth. Because in Yeltsin and Putin's Russia you can just accumulate that kind of wealth by just being a smart businessman amirite?
I knew Barca has a big pull, but I think I underestimated it. The fact that big players are willing to join, with all the obvious problems, and big players are willing to be paid less to stay, under a rookie manager with no real guarantees of success, or even financial stability, in the near future, is blowing my mind.
People are hypocrites. Fans are people. Hardly a big revelation there. If there is a pile on involving a team Chelsea fans do not like Chelsea fans will naturally join in. It’s not like what Barca are doing isn’t worthy of criticism. The idea that Chelsea fans specifically should be quiet about it is just silly.
Last edited:
Brown envelopes flying around I bet
Depends on how you look at it. RA brought Chelsea for £140m and then loaded £1.5bn of debt, that he always said he was going to turn into equity and was only declaring as debt in order to avoid taxes. He then sold the club for £4.25bn or £3bn (approx) plus the committed investment. So, he almost doubled his money (if you take the £3bn figure.)
That is what needs to be looked at. It is all great saying, 'well Chelsea were £1.5bn in debt' as they really weren't; all that was really happening was that an individual investor was pumping his own money into his own asset in order to stimulate growth (as he always said the money would be switched to equity.)
This is miles away from what Barca are doing as they're loading genuine debt as they are selling assets (future revenue for 40% of their projected value, minimum) and are taking on loans, underwritten in USD when their income is in EUR, from people such as Sachs.
Barca's only hope of paying off this debt is the Super League. If they lose that, they will either have to turn to an Oil Daddy themselves or go bust.
No way does winning La Liga and the CL (two things they probably won't do anyway) covers their debt obligations in a high interest environment and where the FED is pumping up the value of USD to attempt to lower the cost of imports for it's population.
Don't they owe Messi money still? If so, how does that work out? Pay him eventually or give him a % in the club?
Could they not sell Frenkie and owe him still?
Could they not sell Frenkie and owe him still?
All clubs since 2003, the year in which Abramovich bought Chelsea, they have risen in value.
Having a debt of €2,000M+ net in 19 years is a management horror.
Barcelona will earn €40M less per year. That's all.
Right now the salary bill is €560M, if it drops to €400M as is the club's intention, Barcelona will be €100M+ profitable.
Barcelona had 2 options, not to sign in many years and gradually become a less attractive club for players and earn much less money or do what they are doing now.