fecking hell someone really has something to prove.
Bad Berba's Back
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fecking hell someone really has something to prove.
My lips are sealed.
But it would probably be wise to tone it down a bit
Yeah, I know. For some reason anger/frustration is easier to spill under the influence, shit heads being a natural target.
Thing is, people like pee sock annoy me all year, I'm too polite and when I'm drunk I go overboard. What can you do? Be moderately drunk and tell people off? It's a hard balance.
you could go and get some counselling
In fairness to PPSock, he's actually got a valid point and loads of people jumped on him without really engaging him on it. Maybe he could have expressed it better but I really doubt any genuine United fan would be bitter that Berba rattled in five today.
Berba's goal stats are not going to tell the whole story when he has rattled in five against Blackburn and a hat-trick against the dippers. Personally I don't think the last couple of years are of much relevance to Berba now, we have got a different side now and it's how we are shaping up this season that matters.
Even since the games since Liverpool I think Berba's still been good in some games and that his actual performance level has stepped up a notch. I think we have found a better role in the team for him this season and he's mixing up the dropping deep with playing higher up the pitch better than he ever has before.
I thought he played well against Stoke, Rangers, Valencia and has been much more involved generally this season than last. Even games like the City when when he did not have alot to feed off I thought he did alright and played his role for the side well enough. Only really the Villa and Spurs games where I thought he was well below par and the Villa game was another match when no one really played well.
For me, Berbatov been alongisde Nani, one of United's two best attacking players this season. There's still plenty of unanswered questions, particilarly with Rooney back, and I still don't know if he would be Fergie's best eleven for the Big four and champions league games as if we played 4-3-3, it would still be Rooney upfront everytime for me. I'm still more than encouraged with his start to the season though and he's helped us amass more points than he has lost, for sure.
BTW - Pally was well settled with United after a season and was part of the Cup Winner's cup winning side at the end of his second, so there's no real contrast with Berba at all.
Berba's goal stats are not going to tell the whole story when he has rattled in five against Blackburn and a hat-trick against the dippers. Personally I don't think the last couple of years are of much relevance to Berba now, we have got a different side now and it's how we are shaping up this season that matters.
Even since the games since Liverpool I think Berba's still been good in some games and that his actual performance level has stepped up a notch. I think we have found a better role in the team for him this season and he's mixing up the dropping deep with playing higher up the pitch better than he ever has before.
I thought he played well against Stoke, Rangers, Valencia and has been much more involved generally this season than last. Even games like the City when when he did not have alot to feed off I thought he did alright and played his role for the side well enough. Only really the Villa and Spurs games where I thought he was well below par and the Villa game was another match when no one really played well.
For me, Berbatov been alongisde Nani, one of United's two best attacking players this season. There's still plenty of unanswered questions, particilarly with Rooney back, and I still don't know if he would be Fergie's best eleven for the Big four and champions league games as if we played 4-3-3, it would still be Rooney upfront everytime for me. I'm still more than encouraged with his start to the season though and he's helped us amass more points than he has lost, for sure.
BTW - Pally was well settled with United after a season and was part of the Cup Winner's cup winning side at the end of his second, so there's no real contrast with Berba at all.
Sorry, you annoy me when I'm sober too. I respect intelligence, and although my posts thus far in this thread has been nothing of the sort I feel your sentiments have been strangely deserving of ridicule. You just don't deserve better. I would never say anything like this to a person on the forum I respected, but you continuously make me want to plant my boot in your face for some reason.
I understand your point to a certain extent but I think it's born of low expectations, he's been so poor for the past couple of seasons that any sign of quality from him is seen as a positive. We have to remember that he cost £30m, turns 30 in January and we have macheda and hernandez waiting for game time to help them develop.
Of course I'm not bitter that he scored 5 today and I've said time and again that I hope he proves me wrong.
Glad I can help, I'll leave you with your drink and anger then
There's no way I'm gonna read all that. Diego made the scousers cry, for Berba there's a different standard clearly. Let's ignore all evidence that the team does better with Berba in the side, let's ignore what he contributes besides goals. As Ronaldo would have said, it's all polemic when it comes to Berba. I see evidence of his class most of his games, honestly I struggle to see why he's so vilified.
Thanks, you're a sweetie.
The three terrible performances that he's had this season have been Spurs, Bursaspor away and Aston Villa. We managed to beat Spurs and Bursaspor, so the only leg you have to stand on in saying that we've dropped points because of his performances would be the Villa game. But who had a good game in that match? Our best players were two substitutes - Macheda and Obertan. Pretty much every single player that started was below par but let's just scapegoat someone because it's the easy thing to do.
Since I'm bored and have no life, let's go through the games this season where we've dropped points and see how many of those can be attributed to Berbatov.
v Fulham - We didn't deserve to win in all honesty, as we were poor. Berbatov was as good as any of our players on the day. If you're being an ultra critical cnut, which you seem to be, then Nani should've wrapped the game up with the penalty but it's one of those things, and he's been one of our best players this season anyway.
v Everton - He was very good alone up-front. The dropped points were because of our poor defending - it was a pretty good performance from the team until we took our foot off the pedal and sat back too much.
v Bolton - Again, not a game we deserved to win and we were lucky to get a point. Berbatov was decent but we didn't look too threatening going forward and were pretty troubled at the back.
v Sunderland - Didn't start, came off the bench and looked threatening.
v West Brom - Set up Nani - great link up between the two for the goal. He missed a sitter as well iirc but it was strange how we managed to draw that game. Bizarre.
v City - He was very good, with little service. We created feck all in any case.
v Aston Villa - He was terrible, as were the whole side.
So if you're going to criticise him, you could do so on the basis that he missed a sitter against West Brom while it was 1-0 but then later set up Nani to make it 2 well before the break and an awful game against Villa. Doesn't seem like much now does it? You're probably looking at his career at United so far as a whole instead of just this season but he's clearly looking like he's applying himself more and is more settled. If you'd just said that you were being skeptical then you wouldn't have just created a two page debate with that post of yours. Unless you were attention seeking, which in case you've caught a lot of us hook, line and sinker.
Also,
that quote is stupid, as we needed the three goals against Liverpool otherwise we'd have dropped points. He also got the opening goal today, which is something that he's been berated for in the past and unless you are incredibly stupid, you wont need me to explain to you how important the opening goal is in a match.
I am judging him on more than this season but I'd say I'm far beyond sceptical at the minute.
the quote isn't stupid, the point is that apart from those 2 great performances this season he's scored 4 goals in 15 matches where he's played consistently as our main striker.
He started off the season very well and I was desperate for him to push on but once again it just hasn't happened and I can't see how he's going to do it, with Rooney back, Hernandez straining at the leash and Macheda waiting in the wings.
RAWK reject?
So he's not and never was worth £30m, some people need to get over that fact. He's good, and now he's going to score in probably the same AMOUNT of games but probably get 20+, people are going to be unhappy.....and people are going to be unhappy if he just scores 1 in those games, guy can't win. He's never been a scorer every other game, this was known prior to his arrival and still is.
feck off, that's taken entirely out of context. He's a proven pee stain, you a follower?
p_ps_sock, you're coming across a bit silly here - you half sound as if you wish he would carry the team and half sound as if you think he's rubbish anyway. I've just given you a list of games where we have dropped points, and he has had one terrible performance in amongst those games and been pretty respectable in the others. His game isn't all about goals - he has a lot more to offer creatively and has shown that in most games this season - just have a look at his third goal to see what kind of stuff he can offer, wonderful in the build up. He clearly looks better with a partner, and Rooney is by far the best person for him to link up with at this moment in time. Hernandez is still adapting his all round game, though he does look sharp in front of goal. He is more of a "main striker" than Berbatov - Berbatov is more of a 10/9.5 than a no.9. And Macheda is a good prospect but looks more of a threat coming off the bench than starting a game. Starting those two ahead of Berbatov would mean we'd lose out in our build up play - as we seem to be looking to play Rooney as a pure no.9. Playing Hernandez/Macheda behind him would be a waste.
If you think that Macheda, Hernandez, and Berbatov are all similar types of strikers then we might as well end this debate now.
If you think that Macheda, Hernandez, and Berbatov are all similar types of strikers then we might as well end this debate now.
It seems as if Berba has 2 modes - average and amazing. He really needs to perform in between at that 'very good' level pretty much every game. It's easy to claim him being "awesome" today and "proving everybody wrong" but it just goes to show you how much he underperforms most weeks. If only he could cut down on the average performances (which are far too often), he could be a true great.
Berbatov is actually just amazing, his game play is just beautiful, the way the game seems to slow down around him is magnificent. I know people tend to slate him for not going at 200MPH but personally I can't help but admire the way he does that. His close control, the sheer balance of the man and his finesse is what makes him class. Not to mention his passing, phoar! I know strikers will always be judged on goals but when it comes to Berba that's a little unfair because his role isn't really the goal scorer, he's very much a creator who chips in every now and again. His first two seasons here he didn't really hit the heights we expected but he wasn't exactly as bad as the 'berbahaters' make out. This season on the other hand has seen him take his game where we need it to be. The way he's playing can only be a good thing for us and the very fact that people are still criticising his performances this season worries me about the mental health of certain members of the caf. Criticise him for his first two seasons all you like, but if the man carries on as he'd done since the WC I think all will be forgiven.
To me it's pretty obvious he won't be a genius in every game, Cantona wasn't either..
I despise Berba-haters. For fecks sake just stfu and enjoy the Berb.
I still mildly dislike Berba in all honesty, his ability was never in question mind you. I don't like body language and constant critique of team mates that's all. IIRC he's improved this part of his game over the last three games, here's hoping.
I'm guessing you don't like Nani's body language and critique of team mates either then. Or Rooneys. Or Evras. Or etc.
Oh, and the fact that you admit to disliking one of our own players, when he's really done absolutely nothing wrong, scares me.
Nani can be a right bellend at times, although I've never seen him have a go at team mates. Evra? Never seen him do anything of that sort, how dare you! Maybe I put it wrong, I don't dislike Berba per se, I dislike some of his attributes so to speak. As for 'absolutely nothing wrong', that's highly subjective, imo I can't think of a less inspiring player in our squad to have alongside me.
He doesn't need to inspire, because on his day he himself is inspired... An overhead kick off the crossbar against Pool... jayzuz... I opened my heart for Mickey Owen the moment he knocked that slim chance in against City... to me moments like that'll go a long way...
If people are bothered about a couple of shoddy months making his goalscoring ratio fall to something like 0.30 then people need to reconsider. A: he's never been considered the one who'll score week in week out.
and B: Ole landed pretty close to a goal every three games, so why can that kind of a stat be used to batter Berba? :|
Not really getting into this debate, because I like Berba, but Ole spent most of his United career being a sub.
Not to mention Ole cost 1.5 mil to the 30m+ Berba cost. Talk about value for money....
Dear Lord give me strength
We saw a huge improvement with the Rooney and Berbatov combo today with some great passing and understanding between them and now there are people coming out and saying we should sell Berbatov in Jan ?
Seriously, avoid posting if your high on something.
Seriously, avoid posting if your high on something.
Mods, please do something about this. This poster is a disgrace and IMO should not be allowed to post on these boards.
Yeah, but today he RAN. All over the pitch. He didn't seem to stop and it's probably why he ended up with 5 goals.
If he put in as much effort every game as he did today he'd be unstoppable.
How can you possibly not get banned for a comment like this?
If it was that divisive, why does he seem so popular with the rest of the team? I've seen others use this "berating teammates" criticism of him and it never quite makes sense to me, surely the ones that will be put off by this would be the teammates, so why don't they show the slightest hint of annoyance at it? He's just a perfectionist who holds himself and others to very high standards, I'm sure they can take it. Ronaldo was far more histrionic in his reactions.
They were getting that way at the end of last season.
what do you mean? and why would it be different now?
You know what really impressed me about Berbatov today? It wasn't the fact he got 5, it was the creative interaction between Rooney, Nani and himself, and was the energy and hunger he showed to get involved .
Rooney is obviously the real key to our fluidity, without him Berbatov grows frustrated and becomes petulant toward his teammates, particularly Nani, we've all seen it and felt uncomfortable. But when Wayne's there to link it all up it's a different front three all together. Berbatov was a joy to watch today and it really felt like we were watching Manchester United again.
Rooney is obviously the real key to our fluidity, without him Berbatov grows frustrated and becomes petulant toward his teammates, particularly Nani, we've all seen it and felt uncomfortable. But when Wayne's there to link it all up it's a different front three all together. Berbatov was a joy to watch today and it really felt like we were watching Manchester United again.
Red Norse has 2 days to sleep it off.
Im sorry, but there is just no way anyone can complain about this. Its a facht!
He's scoring goals.
Too true... Even if strikers are generally underperforming a bit... For starters he's not exactly had much cheaper goals than some of the ones that have landed square in Tevez's lap. (flip... is that what you do with genitive if it ends on z? seems a bit wrong)
Him being the Premier League top scorer (sole top scorer, to be precise) means he ought to have some slack and that comments like "he's been shit this season" ought to be modified a wee bit... even if nearly half of them came in one match... Also, you don't get to take any of the Pool goals away because we needed each one.
His third goal was unfecking real.
I had a dream today, unbelievable one, Berba has scored 5 goals in a game.
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