Funny I haven't bought this up as was busy defending my team (and honestly, was expecting one of the neutrals to), but how do people think Busquets would perform against Zico here?
Auction Draft SF : GSTQ vs. Enigma/Don Alfredo
- Thread starter Indnyc
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That Barca played a high line and would squeeze out space for Zico. But then if you need a player who can do magic with sniff of space, then it's Zico.
Thanks for the insight. I agree that the basic principle of tiki taka would still apply here and they would try to cut the ball to him but when Zico does get the ball (which he will), I wanted to know how do people rate Busquets's ability to deal with him.
@GodShaveTheQueen @Enigma_87 guys both of you need to calm down a bit
I understand it’s a semi final and both of you have worked really hard to get great teams but the meaningless tone will not get us anywhere and most likely put off neutrals.
I understand it’s a semi final and both of you have worked really hard to get great teams but the meaningless tone will not get us anywhere and most likely put off neutrals.
I agree and I would like to apologize to Team Dogma (not for what I said about the unethical style of discussing, I stand by it just like they probably do too), but for the excessive name calling after getting pissed off.
I don't expect an apology from them, consider me moved on. Happy to resume the discussion (I didn't stop it in the first place) with them if they would like to (which I am guessing won't happen in this game at least which is fine too).
I'll take a break I guess for a few hours and join back.
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I agree of course and that's why I ended up the debate on page 2. I can accept picking holes in the opposition teams and tactics, but the name calling was bit to much for me and really put me off, let alone for neutral perspective. I'm happy to step down and let Don Alfredo to take over.
So close to a meltdown and Indnyc ruis it. 
That's true however we need to first ask how they will work together and then analyse the opposition. It is of course possible that on their own they wouldn't work that well but give the opponent do rather well
It all the depends on the press stopping Zico having any time on the ball. If he can get hold of it regularly then I think you would probably win on the counter however Engima's CBs are an excellent fit for the system and are of excellent quality
While I would definitely give them a fighting chance against Ro-Ro, when you add Zico and Busquets into the equation, it's not really balanced any more, no?
Keeping the press aside, when Zico does manage to run at the defense, surely not everything can be left to the CB duo against Zi-Ro-Ro no matter how good they are stylistically.
You'd think the CB's might expect way more than decent cover from the DM when the trio does run at them
The thing about Pep's juego de posicion is that its fundamentals are every player acting as one single unit and playing with extreme discipline and control. I simply can't see Best fitting into that system at all. Out of the the top 10 GOAT wingers I'd definitely pick Best absolute last for a Pep tiki-taka system. I'd even prefer Garrincha in this system over Best. I just don't see his play style gelling with the Pep style. I can picture him getting monumentally frustrated with the ultra patient sideways passing of Xaviestaquets. I don't really see Best relating to this type of organized play at all:
Positional Play is a model of constructed play, it is premeditated, thought about, studied and worked out in detail. the interpreters of this model need to know the catalog of movements that need to be executed in depth. As in any piece of music, one same score gives rise to many different interpretations: faster, slower, more harmonious… more or less a concrete interpretation that you like, but what should be kept in any case is that the tune is similar to the original. Positional Play is a musical score played by each team who practice it at their own pace, but it is essential to generate superiorities behind each line of the opponent pressure. -Marti Perarnau
Additionally I don't see Best's personality fitting in with Xaviestaquets at all. even less than Cruyff. I feel like best illustration of how Best would react to playing with Xaviestauets would be like Zlatan. I feel like this is how Best would react to being on a Pep side with that midfield:
it was like being back at school. None of the lads acted like superstars, which was strange... Xavi, Iniesta, the whole gang – they were like schoolboys. The best footballers in the world stood there with their heads bowed, and I didn't understand any of it. - Zlatan
Zico still influenced the game against GOAT tier man marker in Gentile whom I rate a tier above Busquets defensively. He really wouldn't have a problem with a Busquets-Xavi press at all. He's like Messi really with the close control and low center of gravity.
Going for GSTQ. I think the Best, Cruyff and Xaviesta combo is off a bit. They could create some magic but since they are playing more direct than they would under Pep their possession stats will be lower which is a problem as pulling off that crazy press relies a lot on extreme posession otherwise you simply don't have the stamina for it. Even if they can still do it somewhat I think it's a problem when you have Zico lurking. As such I think there will be enough times that the ball turns over and Ro-Z-Ro vs Busquets, Figueroa, Chumpitaz, and Abidal will mean goals for GSTQ. If Engima had players more suited to more direct play than Iniesta and Busquets things could be different.
I think the press can work to some extent but Zico will get around it some times even if it was executed perfectly. I think it won't be executed perfectly, see above, so have gone for GSTQ
It shouldn’t be a question, because there’s only one answer. It’s about how well will the whole midfield unit will starve him of the ball. Still, from your team Zico is probably the likeliest matchwinner.
Have read up on the thread and man, what a sad state of affairs. Just sucking out any joy that was left in the draft matches (not that much to be fair).
We have chosen an ambitious playing style with a highly interesting group of players, the voters don't like it - that's okay. In my mind it is still glorious, partly because I put more value on different dynamics than the average voter and partly because every parent thinks his own child is the smartest.
Normally I always have fun at writing long posts to explain the tactics and dynamics behind the team, but today is not the day for that
I bow out and will leave this gem here
We have chosen an ambitious playing style with a highly interesting group of players, the voters don't like it - that's okay. In my mind it is still glorious, partly because I put more value on different dynamics than the average voter and partly because every parent thinks his own child is the smartest.
Normally I always have fun at writing long posts to explain the tactics and dynamics behind the team, but today is not the day for that
I bow out and will leave this gem here
Ha, play all game unethically, run away when questioned on completely wrong football claims and then act like saints when called out.
The basic ethic any draft game demands is you don't change your opinion of a player irrespective of him being on your team or the opposition. Only one team followed that ethic in this game. You can question tactics all you want but dissing the players because they are not shiny enough or calling them free pass is not how long time drafters should behave.
Neutrals who have read the thread would know who was trying to suck any meaning or joy out of the draft game.
Sorry Indnyc for bringing this up again.
The basic ethic any draft game demands is you don't change your opinion of a player irrespective of him being on your team or the opposition. Only one team followed that ethic in this game. You can question tactics all you want but dissing the players because they are not shiny enough or calling them free pass is not how long time drafters should behave.
Neutrals who have read the thread would know who was trying to suck any meaning or joy out of the draft game.
Sorry Indnyc for bringing this up again.
I’ve very rarely changed my opinion on a player around here and took part in many of these - most people know it.
My opinion was based on your tactics and aspects of ones game and as you said it’s there for everyone to see. Not once in the thread I’ve labelled Leandro or Silva the things you accuse me of.
I’m not sure what unethical things you keep on banging about but I guess winning this one is the most important thing to you.
Anyhow discussions like this suck the joy out of draft games and made so many older drafters quit it altogether.
I don’t wish to continue this conversation as it is futile and I’m putting you on ignore. You can continue with name calling if you like.
My opinion was based on your tactics and aspects of ones game and as you said it’s there for everyone to see. Not once in the thread I’ve labelled Leandro or Silva the things you accuse me of.
I’m not sure what unethical things you keep on banging about but I guess winning this one is the most important thing to you.
Anyhow discussions like this suck the joy out of draft games and made so many older drafters quit it altogether.
I don’t wish to continue this conversation as it is futile and I’m putting you on ignore. You can continue with name calling if you like.
In a game against Gio when Mauro was in the opposition
In a game against EAP when Mauro was in his own team
In the current game when Mauro is again in the opposition
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Free pass? To a player who won a final from midfield against a Total Voetbal juggernaut? Who assisted the winning goal?
How much of Bonhof have you watched?
You shouldn't have replied if you didn't wish to continue. Been consistent with your post crap and run away theme in the game.
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Don't think those comments contradict each other, he never said he wasn't good on the ball he just didn't fancy him in your system. Happens all the time.
In a game against Gio when Mauro was in the opposition
In a game against EAP when Mauro was in his own team
In the current game when Mauro is again in the opposition
Hey guys, getting a few reports from this thread. Please keep the discussion civil.
Thanks.
Thanks.
Al right, received a PM that my posts were reported.
Guess, I'll stay off. @Indnyc , sorry but I probably won't make an appearance for the final.
Guess, I'll stay off. @Indnyc , sorry but I probably won't make an appearance for the final.
Fair enough, people can change their views and I like to give people the benefit of the doubt especially someone like Enigma_87 who's been around for ages and is normally is consistent in his views. End of the day it's just a draft game and we should be having fun.
GSTQ I don’t think you should skip the final. End of the day you’re deservedly there.
I personally can’t see too much issue or name calling with the thread, not enough for reporting anyway.
Drafts are bound to get heated after someone spends time on something they like and think works.
I’ve only won 2 games ( keeper value the once, tuppet votes the other) but I thought I should win most of my matches haha. There’s nothing worse than losing to players over tactics imo but I see the value of certain players.
I you should just have a end of game handshake and move on.
I personally can’t see too much issue or name calling with the thread, not enough for reporting anyway.
Drafts are bound to get heated after someone spends time on something they like and think works.
I’ve only won 2 games ( keeper value the once, tuppet votes the other
) but I thought I should win most of my matches haha. There’s nothing worse than losing to players over tactics imo but I see the value of certain players.I you should just have a end of game handshake and move on.
I have quickly read the 3 pages and I can see I have influenced @GodShaveTheQueen in terms of style so I have found my successor in a certain way!
Wow. What happened? Offensive posts in a thread game in a draft section are less problematic than in any other thread on RedCafe
Yeah, but it's the boundless energy of newcomers.
GSTQ joined RedCafe last October so it's one of his first drafts. Look at my 1st game in the mains.
6 pages to defend Di Maria/Neymar/Ozil... Now, I'm bored of my team after one page of discussion.
https://www.redcafe.net/threads/la-...-mjj-vivajanuzaj-vs-downcast-kirkduyt.415538/
My last Draft Career peak here was against you: 6 pages... and it was to defend... Zico
https://www.redcafe.net/threads/the...t-round-1-2mufc0-vs-invictus-ecstatic.434713/
All things considered and as you know, I am not in a position to judge if the discussion is fair or not ; I just prefer to blame @The White Pele and @oneniltothearsenal
GSTQ/DonEnigma are nervous about that game today but tomorrow everything will be forgotten
Wow. What happened? Offensive posts in a thread game in a draft section are less problematic than in any other thread on RedCafe
Yeah, but it's the boundless energy of newcomers.
GSTQ joined RedCafe last October so it's one of his first drafts. Look at my 1st game in the mains.
6 pages to defend Di Maria/Neymar/Ozil... Now, I'm bored of my team after one page of discussion.
https://www.redcafe.net/threads/la-...-mjj-vivajanuzaj-vs-downcast-kirkduyt.415538/
My last Draft Career peak here was against you: 6 pages... and it was to defend... Zico
https://www.redcafe.net/threads/the...t-round-1-2mufc0-vs-invictus-ecstatic.434713/
All things considered and as you know, I am not in a position to judge if the discussion is fair or not ; I just prefer to blame @The White Pele and @oneniltothearsenal
GSTQ/DonEnigma are nervous about that game today but tomorrow everything will be forgotten
GSTQ I don’t think you should skip the final. End of the day you’re deservedly there.
I personally can’t see too much issue or name calling with the thread, not enough for reporting anyway.
Drafts are bound to get heated after someone spends time on something they like and think works.
I’ve only won 2 games ( keeper value the once, tuppet votes the other
I you should just have a end of game handshake and move on.
What's a name calling? Tagging somebody?
Insulting someone.
Indeed. It was a bit of heated handbags, nothing more
To me GTSQ had the all aggressive and bullish approach from the off. The recycled double posting of his own quotes, condescending tone, borderline accusations of me being unethical(for what?), repeated quotes that I know nothing about players I've picked this very draft, all summarized with offensive tone through every reply and quote at an extend that I lost all interest in defending our team or actually getting into something constructive.
I've been around these drafts for about 4 years, been 10 years member on this board, and despite some heated debates in some games I don't think I had any personal issues with any member around here and always tried to be fair to everybody or help the community as much as I can.
Everybody tends to oversell his own players, team and ideas and gets carried away - I'm no different. The thing I probably value most is consistency in views and I've always tried to be like that. Of course some views change - as our knowledge evolves, but everyone that has paired with me or knows me 90% have always been consistent with it and stuck to my guns around here.
The game itself - Bonhof is someone I've never picked before and I just don't rate as high as others. Mauro Silva and Leandro - every opinion I've stated around here was based on the formation and current tactics, not bash the players as individuals. If other members find that unethical - fair enough.
Anyhow that's me done with draft participation for a while, maybe I just can't keep with the boundless energy of newcomers as @Ecstatic mentioned and would rather try to use the spare time for the compilations section or help running it if someone needs it.
I don't want to get into the details of the thread. All my point is, in the grand scheme of things it's nothing that bad.
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