Arsenal 2023/24 - Born to be runner up

SilentWitness said:
:lol: I'm not hurt at all. I just find it weird that you're acting like it was the best performance ever when it was nothing more than decent.

In the previous game we played against you we pressed like our life depended on it and gave you no space. Today we were happy to soak up pressure and tried to restrict the types of chances you had which we did well. The game plan wasn't to hit you on the counter like we did in the last game. It was more to just stay in the game and try and nick it at the end or from a set piece/lack of concentration.

You won, it was good to get that result but it wasn't a win for the ages.
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We haven't won at Goodison since 2017. So it kind of feels like a win for the ages. :D
 
Pogue Mahone said:
They’re an absolute fecking curse on this website over the last year or so. As prolific and indestructible as cockroaches. And even less enjoyable to interact with.
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Hear hear. At least with the resident Scouse and even Chelsea fans it's pretty amicable banter. These gooners are just insufferable. The moment they look half decent they all collectively morph into that annoying little cnut from school who would give it the big un everytime they'd win in anything competitive. About as graceful as a fart in a sauna.
 
Fecking Arsenal fans, man. Literally won feck all last season, bottled the league, bombed out of all the cups relatively early to focus on said league, and they now all think they're hot shit.
 
I don't think they have been that good this season. For so much hype around them you will feel as if they won treble not city. They have spent more money than most teams again but I can bet their top 4 finish would be considered a success.
 
It was boring to watch, but so clever to analyze. Great tactical performance. We are braveless than last season that’s for sure but you see it’s a will from the manager.
 
Garnacho's Shoelaces said:
Arsenal have looked unconvincing in each of their wins so far against Forest, Palace, Everton and us. Each of those results could easily have been defeats. I don't think they'll offer much this season and their league position is very flattering.
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Arsenal would've had to kick the ball in their own goal to lose today, no way Everton were going to do it.
 
Zen said:
They've definitely gone backwards. Not sure how this is questionable. But maybe the directive is a slower start...
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Yup, Playing good football does not win titles otherwise last year we should have won. Also if we win against Spurs next week points wise we have a better start than last year.
Honestly this looks like a one horse race currently but if anything Pep has showed us Its peaking early does not help.
We have regressed in many areas, we don't start games as strongly. The passing is not as fast/decisive. But now we are more in control for the whole 90mins. Last year we would score maybe 2 goals in 25mins and then would drop off massively as that cannot be sustained.
 
https://understat.com/league/EPL

We're still 2nd on xP and xGA.. even if people think we have been unconvincing.

Our issue seems to be going forward atm. Saka looks tired or maybe injured, Havertz was a dud. And we need Jesus back properly.
 
Nish115 said:
https://understat.com/league/EPL

We're still 2nd on xP and xGA.. even if people think we have been unconvincing.

Our issue seems to be going forward atm. Saka looks tired or maybe injured, Havertz was a dud. And we need Jesus back properly.
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We’re 4th on xP and xGA and we’re the laughing stock of the entire league. I’m just saying.
 
WeePat said:
We’re 4th on xP and xGA and we’re the laughing stock of the entire league. I’m just saying.
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You should be, you've had the easiest run in of the league. Your biggest issue is the lack of goals.
 
Wonder if PSV can give then a game the coming week. They're in fantastic form. But I think Arse are a bit too much for 'em.
 
Nish115 said:
You should be, you've had the easiest run in of the league. Your biggest issue is the lack of goals.
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Okay fair enough, that’s true :lol:

I was just saying, for a lot of people you don’t pass the eye test just yet this season, even if the underlying metrics are very encouraging for you. Same as it is for us.
 
Tbf to them they are winning and getting points. It's a good habit to have even when not at your best. First ten games, if you end up with 25+ points you're in with a shout.

I do think from the five games,
Four on paper should be three points (they won three and drew one)
And the other could be any result (they won)

Interesting to see if they continue playing like this with CL games and tougher games in the next four
 
KirkDuyt said:
Wonder if PSV can give then a game the coming week. They're in fantastic form. But I think Arse are a bit too much for 'em.
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I really think they will, i don't think we'll lose but a draw would not be surprising at all. Arteta is probably going to put Havertz back in but Jesus might start.
Martinelli out and Saka being in average form we will struggle. Could see a 1-0 or 1-1. We start with the most important game of the group so there will be some nerves.
 
BusbyMalone said:
Fecking Arsenal fans, man. Literally won feck all last season, bottled the league, bombed out of all the cups relatively early to focus on said league, and they now all think they're hot shit.
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That’s what makes their end of season meltdown interesting. The only team to win everything by Christmas with no trophies to show for it.
 
ESR10 said:
It was boring to watch, but so clever to analyze. Great tactical performance. We are braveless than last season that’s for sure but you see it’s a will from the manager.
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I agree. I think what's most impressive about this performance (not just the result) was that our midfield was Rice, Odegaard and Vieira vs Onana, Decoure and Gueye. On paper that looks lightweight and I thought we'd miss Partey. But perhaps for the first time since Partey arrived, our midfield didn't massively drop off in his absence. Rice so far has settled in better and quicker than I thought he would.
 
AshRK said:
I don't think they have been that good this season. For so much hype around them you will feel as if they won treble not city. They have spent more money than most teams again but I can bet their top 4 finish would be considered a success.
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I think another top 3 finish would be a success. This is their first season in the CL for several years, they've a young team and last season is currently an anomaly, they need to make it a habit.

Regarding the hype, you're right but that's because City are so boring. It was the same when Liverpool competed with City. They'd finish comfortably second but would be treated as the best team in the world because no-one gives a shit about City.
 
Tyrion said:
I think another top 3 finish would be a success. This is their first season in the CL for several years, they've a young team and last season is currently an anomaly, they need to make it a habit.

Regarding the hype, you're right but that's because City are so boring. It was the same when Liverpool competed with City. They'd finish comfortably second but would be treated as the best team in the world because no-one gives a shit about City.
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Liverpool were much much better than arsenal. I can understand the hype they received but arsenal, I am just not sure. Liverpool competed against City and also competed in the CL. Arsenal gave up all competition and got their asses handed by City when both met. And also it's not like they are working on tight budget. They have spent crazy amount and should be judged accordingly.
 
They're good but what peak Liverpool had was Mane, Firmino and Salah, all on top form. Saka is the only one in their front line that has the same ability as those.

And of course they had Alisson, and a non broken Van Djik, and a stromg supporting cast. Arsenal are better than they once were, but they got lucky with not spending big on Mudryk and instead getting Trossard, they needed that luck again to really improve the first 11. Instead they signed Rice and Havertz for £160m.
 
Tyrion said:
I think another top 3 finish would be a success. This is their first season in the CL for several years, they've a young team and last season is currently an anomaly, they need to make it a habit.

Regarding the hype, you're right but that's because City are so boring. It was the same when Liverpool competed with City. They'd finish comfortably second but would be treated as the best team in the world because no-one gives a shit about City.
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Mind boggling revisionism. :wenger: :lol: :rolleyes: :wenger:
 
AshRK said:
Liverpool were much much better than arsenal. I can understand the hype they received but arsenal, I am just not sure. Liverpool competed against City and also competed in the CL. Arsenal gave up all competition and got their asses handed by City when both met. And also it's not like they are working on tight budget. They have spent crazy amount and should be judged accordingly.
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Who cares about their fans. I'd still rather them than Liverpool and City anyway. Let them win the epl and have them thinking they're the best thing since sliced bread. As long as City don't win 4 in a row and it stops the Scousers it's a good thing.
 
AshRK said:
Liverpool were much much better than arsenal. I can understand the hype they received but arsenal, I am just not sure. Liverpool competed against City and also competed in the CL. Arsenal gave up all competition and got their asses handed by City when both met. And also it's not like they are working on tight budget. They have spent crazy amount and should be judged accordingly.
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I think our owners and fans would be happy with us remaining competitive in the league (top 4, a title challenge would be ideal) and going deep in CL. Hard to gauge what's to be expected in CL as we haven't been in the comp for so long. ATM it just feels good to see the tweets from UEFA, that feels like a win already
 
We have fairly methodically gotten our points so far without looking that great. This was a big one considering how poorly we have done in this fixture in recent years. We are still not quite clicking though, that much is obvious.

Spurs should be a good test. I am not sure Vieira is the solution in midfield. He looks to have gotten a little tougher physically, but I think he did look better than Havertz overall. This was a pretty physical Everton midffield today and he came through it for the most part ok I am still wondering if this is the right league for him. More to come hopefully..
 
That wasn't the best performance, but we played our socks off 3 out of 5 times at Goodison the last few years and got zilch, so there's that.

Steady gains. I think Arteta will be pleased to navigate some potential early banana skins (though Fulham rankles). The next 5 games should give us fair indicator whether we're in a faux title challenge or there to make up top four numbers.
 
SilentWitness said:
:lol: I'm not hurt at all. I just find it weird that you're acting like it was the best performance ever when it was nothing more than decent.

In the previous game we played against you we pressed like our life depended on it and gave you no space. Today we were happy to soak up pressure and tried to restrict the types of chances you had which we did well. The game plan wasn't to hit you on the counter like we did in the last game. It was more to just stay in the game and try and nick it at the end or from a set piece/lack of concentration.

You won, it was good to get that result but it wasn't a win for the ages.
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So you decided to not press us and pressure us as you have done for years, to great success, at Goodison, because you wanted to stay in the game.

I don’t understand that. Why play such a physical team, built for counter attacks, with players like Vieira, Trossard and Odegaard in midfield and not press them and physically dominate them?

The reason you couldn’t press Arsenal is because you couldn’t get into positions to trap Arsenal players and force them into mistakes. Not because you decided not to. And that’s because Arsenal controlled all the key aspects of the game, namely possession, tempo, field tilt.

It was a dominant performance in and out of possession from Arsenal. Akin to Fulham and Brentford away games but without the cohesion in attack of 22/23, and that will come with time. Credit to your defending as it held for a long time though.
That’s it really… End of story.
 
Zagoon said:
So you decided to not press us and pressure us as you have done for years, to great success, at Goodison, because you wanted to stay in the game.

I don’t understand that. Why play such a physical team, built for counter attacks, with players like Vieira, Trossard and Odegaard in midfield and not press them and physically dominate them?

The reason you couldn’t press Arsenal is because you couldn’t get into positions to trap Arsenal players and force them into mistakes. Not because you decided not to. And that’s because Arsenal controlled all the key aspects of the game, namely possession, tempo, field tilt.

It was a dominant performance in and out of possession from Arsenal. Akin to Fulham and Brentford away games but without the cohesion in attack of 22/23, and that will come with time. Credit to your defending as it held for a long time though.
That’s it really… End of story.
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I explained why in the next sentence. Our plan was to restrict you and the types of chances you had which we did well in the first half. We didn't need to press with that tactic.

We didn't care about possession. The tactic was to restrict and nick a goal if possible.
 
Reading this thread you would think Arsenal are second from the bottom or something. Ok they have not hit the heights of last season but this season is just starting out. Most teams take a while to hit their stride, not everyone is the well oiled machine that is City.

Should do Spurs at home next match in the PL, when was the last time Spurs actually got a win at Arsenal? 10 years?
 
AshRK said:
I don't think they have been that good this season. For so much hype around them you will feel as if they won treble not city. They have spent more money than most teams again but I can bet their top 4 finish would be considered a success.
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With a domestic pot and a decent CL run, yes pretty much. Without that, no.
 
Scroto Baggins said:
Reading this thread you would think Arsenal are second from the bottom or something. Ok they have not hit the heights of last season but this season is just starting out. Most teams take a while to hit their stride, not everyone is the well oiled machine that is City.

Should do Spurs at home next match in the PL, when was the last time Spurs actually got a win at Arsenal? 10 years?
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They have had a very easy start to the season and not looked convincing.

It's not a crazy idea that they might struggle Vs stronger teams.
 
Daydreamer said:
I’d like to see a title challenge and the QF of the CL or further.
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Title challenge is pretty subjective I guess. When's the earliest you can be out of contention and have it still said that you've 'challenged' ?

What does being out of contention actually look like (you're usually way out of it before it becomes mathematically impossible) ?

That's why I didn't include it as a goal, it's just hard to measure.

I agree that it needs to be QF in the CL to be considered a respectable run.
 
WeePat said:
Okay fair enough, that’s true :lol:

I was just saying, for a lot of people you don’t pass the eye test just yet this season, even if the underlying metrics are very encouraging for you. Same as it is for us.
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In terms of results id agree, in terms of dominating performances I'm not sure I would. I feel we dominated nearly all our games bar Utd. You would expect us to dominate Fulham and Forest at home of course, but we went to Palace and Everton now and completely dominated nearly the full game (up until the sending off at Palace of course).

I think that's quite pleasing for me. We might not be quite clicking up front yet, but I'm sure when Jesus gets back starting that will come. Beat Spurs at home next week and we are a point better off than after the first 6 games last season. Unfortunately given City's ominous early form I feel we are fighting for 2nd again.
 
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