Still funny?
Are Bruno and Rashford a problem?
- Thread starter The Oracle
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Still funny?
I think as we transition to a more possession-based side who are looking to control the tempo of games we'll certainly have to fade Rashford out because he's too unpredictable, too sloppy and too inconsistent.
I think Bruno can continue to be a part of the side but I'd like to see us looking to bring someone younger in who is perhaps less of a high-risk, high-reward type of CAM.
I think Bruno can continue to be a part of the side but I'd like to see us looking to bring someone younger in who is perhaps less of a high-risk, high-reward type of CAM.
Bruno is top class. Rashford is a spent force.
They're two players who thrived in an Ole-ball/counter-attacking system who are now sticking out awkwardly in a team that seems to now suddenly want to be a technical, high press, possession based team.
Rashford's skill (when he is on form) is in terrorising full backs with his pace and his finishing, not in fast paced intricate passing so contributes little in build up. Bruno is kind of capable of the technical stuff but too eager to try daft shit and give the ball away allowing the opposition to counter.
I feel like the 'best transition team in the world' stuff has been quietly dropped with the change in football hierarchy. This has led to a refocus on technical players like Amad, Maz, Zirkzee and even Eriksen with players like Rashford and Bruno suddenly standing out awkwardly.
Rashford's skill (when he is on form) is in terrorising full backs with his pace and his finishing, not in fast paced intricate passing so contributes little in build up. Bruno is kind of capable of the technical stuff but too eager to try daft shit and give the ball away allowing the opposition to counter.
I feel like the 'best transition team in the world' stuff has been quietly dropped with the change in football hierarchy. This has led to a refocus on technical players like Amad, Maz, Zirkzee and even Eriksen with players like Rashford and Bruno suddenly standing out awkwardly.
This. And thank the gods, it was about time we evolved our playing style.
Next step: Get rid of Bruno and Rashford and get a proper striker (Hojlund is NOT it), and the new era can finally begin.
They both are world class at their best. Bruno obviously has world class performances more often than Rashford. That said, when they are not performing they are absolutely terrible. Bruno couldn’t hit the ball even if his life depended on it. Best not say to much about Rashford.
There’s always a place for a Rashford style player in a possession based team. City have both Haaland and Doku who are far more limited in their passing than Rashford. In reality, Rashford is at his best when he’s able to play fast paced link up with other forwards.
He’d have had a field day with the starting set up on Saturday (as he did against Southampton). Unfortunately, ETH decided to rest him for this one, and we struggled to convert our chances without him.
Rashford is important to them team and can play in possession based football. In addition, we have only 3 good wingers (Rashford, Amad, Garnacho) in RW and LW. Rashford has a good start this season. Palace game was not on him. ETH killed the game with the subs.
Bruno was really bad. He should be dropped for next game. Try Mount at the position. Ugarte, Mainoo, Eriksen, Mount could work. Let's try something new and maybe we may stumble on a solution.
Bruno was really bad. He should be dropped for next game. Try Mount at the position. Ugarte, Mainoo, Eriksen, Mount could work. Let's try something new and maybe we may stumble on a solution.
That's quite a wild take.
Rashford isn't similar in style to neither Doku nor Haaland at all though? One is a top class dribbler and 1v1 threat (one of the best on the planet) and the other is the best pure goalscorer the league has possibly ever seen. Rashford at this point has more in common with someone like Son, except he's not as consistent of a finisher.
Sell both. As soon as words like 'form' and 'confidence' are used, you have already lost the argument. They are our equivalent of Ozil and Sanchez. Or if you prefer, Ozil and Aubameyang.
so wild so many fans still think that Rashford deserves a starting spot in a team aspiring for title challenges. He simply is too soft and too patchy to earn a spot in any top teams. Many mid players can whip in a few good crosses and score a dozen nice goals every season, these don't make a player top class.
The sentimentalism to academy players has gone too far.
The sentimentalism to academy players has gone too far.
Third season and we still play a reactive sitback smash and grab style of play at home vs an average Spurs side
When you hang your hat on Rashford and Bruno in your team, what more can you expect? It's all they know
When you hang your hat on Rashford and Bruno in your team, what more can you expect? It's all they know
Yes. They are a problem
I hate to say it but Garnacho will also stand out awkwardly in this system
There’s certainly room for a ‘Doku’ in the squad but neither Rashford or Garnacho offer quite Doku’s passing ability in possession, so I don’t think either will work long term. At least Garnacho is still developing and on reasonable wages, Rashy and Bruno are not
Before this season, I’d have said yes to Rashford and no to Bruno.
As of now, yes to both.
As of now, yes to both.
Yes two of the most overrated players ever
apart from being annoyed by their consistently poor performance, I am more baffled by how comes our coaches, ETH and some of our fans fail to see they are problems to our play?
I'm wondering whether there's a huge problem between Rashford and Bruno. Mitten talks about different factions, we all know how professional Bruno tries to be off the pitch and how lax Rashford and his former dressing room best mate were/are, the pay thing over summer was probably Bruno stamping his feet about Rashford's salary compared to his attitude and performances, the only good half of football the team have played this season was Palace when Rashford was benched, Bruno loses his head today after watching Rashford let VDV take the ball unchallenged, leading to a goal again after Twenty.
Maybe speculation but it adds up for me.
I always thought Sancho and Van de Beek were awkward fits in Ole’s team as it was based around fast breaks while those two work better playing quick interchanges.
It always seemed strange that ETH having worked with Van de Beek wouldn’t have used him more in that way but he seemed to hitch himself to Bruno and Rashford. Though he never seemed physically upto the standard of the PL.
As for Garnacho I still think he is capable of playing in a more possession based system. Lots of less talented players have been part of those kind of teams.
Similarly, Bruno didn’t play against Barnsley and everything flowed much better. Obviously lesser opposition but given how we have struggled against those sides it was such a vibrant game in contrast.
Good point, and that's also the best Rashford has played this season.
Personally, they're two of four I'd bomb out regardless of perceived financial cost, but there is clearly a very toxic element in the dressing room and I wouldn't be surprised if it's centered around these two.
They are problems because of the importance they are given. Look at the drama made after Rashford was dropped. He’s been crap for 8 months, ok he scored 3 goals. But he was dropped for two players who have been in better form and are younger. Which is supposedly the United way. Yet the media and pundits made a huge drama about.
I think if Rashford and Bruno were just viewed as any other part of the Squad. No drama when they don’t start then they’d be great to have. But as things stand they are a huge hindrance. The best value they offer is the potential transfer fee we could get for them.
Being forced to start both get in the way of better, often younger players. Also having players who are not playing well start every match lowers the standard.
I think if Rashford and Bruno were just viewed as any other part of the Squad. No drama when they don’t start then they’d be great to have. But as things stand they are a huge hindrance. The best value they offer is the potential transfer fee we could get for them.
Being forced to start both get in the way of better, often younger players. Also having players who are not playing well start every match lowers the standard.
How did you come up with that conclusion? I’ve seen consistent attempt at medium to high lines, slow building from the back, possession around the opponents perimeter without penetration, too many gaps between defense and midfield, where each have led to turnovers and counters against us.
Instead of sitting back to absorb pressure, we’re often chasing back to defend as opponents run easily up through the middle. Maybe it’s when we fatigue from that, that we end up sitting back to defend as we hang onto a narrow lead, a draw, and more lately in a losing position. So in this part, I can see what you mean but I haven’t seen us employ those tactics other than very occasional times.
I didn't see any attempt to take the game towards the opposition in the sense of controlling the ball. All of our best moments came when Spurs turned the ball over and we were able to play the ball into Rashford and Garnacho into space. This is what I mean by reactive smash and grab football. You're hoping for the opposition to make a mistake in your half and to exploit it on the counter rather than being proactive and taking the game to the opposition. We see the latter to an extent vs poorer teams (not very well because of the profile of our players and we sometimes get punished as you mentioned) but vs better teams we always concede the control. To do so vs what is a poor Spurs side missing their best player at home is not acceptable for me.
Yeah, and we have a huge emphasis on being aggressive when going for individual duels in defence. It is different to the way Jose and Ole structured the team (I don't mean that as a positive) and EtH wants us to be doing these reckless actions because he wants us to play high up, wants us to win the ball quickly and launch a quick attack. The problem is that it's just terrible.
One of the clips from the highlights yesterday sums it up: Mazraoui goes in for a duel to nick the ball quickly, loses, and then De Ligt comes in to try and win the ball straight after, loses another duel, and suddenly our right back and right centre back are completely out of the game and there's an ocean of space for Spurs to run into. This isn't tight defending, it's suicidal.
Also cup match, but last season against Crystal Palace in Carabao Cup, we were superb, again without him.
No doubt Bruno is one of our better players, but he causes our biggest tactical problems because he does not look after the ball and the formation to accommodate him leaves us with an exposed midfield. He’s also very clearly on the decline.
We won’t be able to truly move on from the Glazer regime until we move on from Bruno and Rashford, but the pair of them are sitting on fat new contracts…
We won’t be able to truly move on from the Glazer regime until we move on from Bruno and Rashford, but the pair of them are sitting on fat new contracts…
These two are probably the two players that will form the sword that Ten Hag will commit career suicide on
And then probably the next manager. For whatever the mental reason is that they both start nearly every single game that they are fit for
And then probably the next manager. For whatever the mental reason is that they both start nearly every single game that they are fit for
Still a resounding yes.
feck yeah.
When I heard Bruno's 3 match ban had been lifted my first reaction was disappointment. Not really fair on him but there you are.
I get the feeling they’re both too set in their ways to adapt to anything that isn’t counterattacking football. Bruno is going to be the epitome of ‘you can’t teach an old dog new tricks’ and Rashford just looks like someone who’d rather be anywhere else most of the time.
I was so excited to see us play without him for those 3 games. Sigh…
Yep and until we lose them both we will never really appreciate how much of a problem they were.
Bruno is a problem as he is the captain. And apparently it is an unwritten rule for managers that you do not drop your captain, even if they are underperforming for a while. We saw it with Maguire, and now the same goes for Bruno. And that's the manager to blame. For this stupid reason, Ten Hag always ends up with Bruno in the line-up, even with change in tactics and substitutions he will find a way to keep Bruno in the game. In normal circumstances substituting Mount or another 10 for Bruno would be the most logic thing to do, however instead of this he takes out a wingplayer and move Bruno to that position instead. So instead of fixing the problem, he shift the problem to another position.
Bruno definitely is a good player to have in the squad, but he should not been seen as keyplayer and therefore being undroppable.
Bruno definitely is a good player to have in the squad, but he should not been seen as keyplayer and therefore being undroppable.
The thing is the club clearly doesn't think so, no attempt to push out rashford whatsoever and doled out an extention to Bruno.
Surprise surprise. Bruno gets sent off twice in 2 games and we immediately look like a much better team without him.
He strikes me like the De Gea of CMs, gives the ball away needlessly so many times and puts unecessary pressure on our team.
It's no surprise that in the 3 stints this season where he hasn't played, we immediately go up a level. He has to go.
He strikes me like the De Gea of CMs, gives the ball away needlessly so many times and puts unecessary pressure on our team.
It's no surprise that in the 3 stints this season where he hasn't played, we immediately go up a level. He has to go.
I really hope Amiron has the character and backing to move both Rahford and Bruno on. They’re obviously both capable of moments but we’re not going anywhere as a team with these two as the main men. And with their status and contacts neither are going to accept being squad players without kicking up an almighty fuss.
If he does the opposite, and try’s to build a team around them, then he’s absolutely doomed from the start. Top level earners, with top level egos but without the top level performances.
If he does the opposite, and try’s to build a team around them, then he’s absolutely doomed from the start. Top level earners, with top level egos but without the top level performances.
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