Appointing Solskjaer was a mistake

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It’s knee jerk to write him off after 6 defeats in 8 just like it was knee jerk to appoint him based on 15 games. We should have waited until the end of the season and evaluated his credentials against other candidates through a proper process. However, we are the most incompetently run football club on the planet in terms of return of investment so it’s not entirely a surprise we’ve fecked it up. Again. There’s also the fact Woodward et al were actually starting to get some stick for their utter incompetence after sacking Jose and Ole came in and brought the feelgood factor back and made everyone forget about that for a while. He is/was the fan’s choice and choosing someone else would have taken a lot of balls even if it was the right decision. Ultimately they went for the easy option, and hopefully it’s the right option but absolutely nothing in his managerial history suggests it is. Regardless, we are where we are now and he must be backed heavily this summer. We spent sod all last summer, so adding the money unspent there to what a club of our size should spend after finishing 6th miles behind their most bitter rivals, Ole should basically have a blank cheque book this summer to do whatever is necessary to get us competing again. I’m not holding my breath though.
 
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Way way too early to say, this is a team assembled by our 4 prevoius managers. I wanted Poch but if he wasn't available then Ole was a good choice.
 
Stretch said:
Agree we don’t necessarily need superstars but we do need talented and effective players with the right attitude. Question is, would these players choose to come to Utd now? Ole doesn’t have manager appeal and we might not have UCL either. I’m very concerned about this. What worries me more is Ole giving players like Young and Jones new deals.
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With young talents I think we have a good chance. Its not horrific to play for United even though we dont have CL. I think most players would love to play for us.

I think we gave them new contacts because we need some of the old guard and its better to sell them rather than let them go for free.
 
sparx99 said:
Yes. My point was that Guardiola lost 4-0 to lesser Everton side in his first season at City. The following summer he made a number of high profile changes to shape the squad to play his style.

In my view what you can see has happened is this:

1. Ole tried to change to a high press attacking style and had initial success. This included a commitment to a Matic, Herrera, Pogba midfield and a Lingard, Rashford, Martial front three.

2. Injuries, Fatigue and Suspensions have both stretched the squad during the busiest time of the season and ruined the form of some of those who have missed games. Disjointed performances during this time is understandable.

3. A slight fear of casting aside veteran players has meant we haven’t stuck with those few things that have been working in recent weeks. Examples include not dropping Matic for McTominay, not dropping Young for Dalot (though Shaw’s suspension made that harder).

The truth is we don’t know how good/bad Ole is until he has time to change some personnel and drill the team in his style of play. This past 2-3 months has just been bouncing game to game trying to get results. The process has necessarily been put aside until the summer.
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Again, do you think Ole can attract the right players to Utd? Do we think he knows what we need? Would players want to come play for him? Does he know who to cull when he’s handed contract extension to players who shouldn’t be handed contract extensions? It really bothers me to be honest
 
Ole isn't the problem, it's the shit decisions our club seem to like making.

Get rid of Jose, bring in Ole but say that there will be no decision made until the end of the season for the full time appointment. Sounds good.

No reinforcements bought in January, which is fine because NO DECISION WILL BE MADE UNTIL THE END OF THE SEASON. Yep, got it. Sounds good.

Ole gets the job full time in March because the results have been good..... Wait...erm, ok. But what happened to the decision being made in the summer? Isn't that why we didn't sign anyone in January? Or is it because we still don't have a DoF, who would be handy so we don't have yet another manager instill their ethos when results are starting to get rocky? Will we even get a DoF? Or will we just get a new crisp sponsor?

Suddenly the results start going the wrong way, and we now have a manager with a long contract. Just like we did when Jose extended his. The board learn lessons slower than a fecking toddler who keeps standing near the oven.
 
I think you guys should have waited until the end of the season to announce and finalise it but meh. Given the options available to you, Ole is not a bad shout at all.

The general point is that the squad, players and infrastructure you have at your club is not that which Manchester United fans deserve. This all needs rebuilding. Having someone who can buy the club some time, ingrain something clearly missing in the players in regards to work ethic and has experience to work on players from a personal perspective is still invaluable.

Saying Ole should get sacked or should not have been appointed is just a knee jerk reaction which your fans are all too famous for. The truth is that successful top class managers are normally successful because they have a good foundation to work with. That foundation does not need to be perfect but it has to be there. You need a squad of adults which want to win. Mourinho's Inter for example.. a great squad, but not the best in the world. They were willing, they worked with him, and they ended up winning everything (after a season). I don't think ANY manager in world football can turn around the current United dressing room and team. You've sadly recruited players akin to a child playing football manager. The personalities in your dressing room lack experience and commitment. Therefore I think Ole is the perfect manager to try and fix that.

The fans will definitely give Ole time, which should in turn give the board the faith to give him time. Most of you won't turn on him when the going gets tough (although this thread).

Putting someone like Poch in this United hot seat with THAT set of players is just not going to amount to much more (just look at Spur's recent form over the past 15 games too).
 
Acquire Me said:
With young talents I think we have a good chance. Its not horrific to play for United even though we dont have CL. I think most players would love to play for us.

I think we gave them new contacts because we need some of the old guard and its better to sell them rather than let them go for free.
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Just remember we won’t be alone competing for young talents. Also, that strategy of renewing to sell at profit seldom works at Utd. Those players tend to stay on.
 
Mr Pigeon said:
Ole isn't the problem, it's the shit decisions our club seem to like making.
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It's definitely not his fault that we've been relying on two over the hill ex-wingers as our first choice fullbacks for the last few years
 
Nytram Shakes said:
We do, we have a problem with culture in the dressing room, we have a problem at board room level, a problem with lack of football knowledge at the top levels of the club, a problem with that Old trafford itself needs some money and investment. We have problems coming out of our ears.

But equally saying we have other problems at the club, doesn't mean we can just ignore who the manager is and say it isnt a problem, it is! If we want to go forward we need to get that part of the club right just like we need to get the rest of issues right and right now and their is more evidence Ole is the wrong man for the job rather then right man.

Ole was brought in as a temporary manager to give the club time to get its ducks in a row properly, he was dramatically under qualified for the job but was brought in to give everyone a lift at the club, and it worked incredibly for a few months, but then it began to wear off, we didn't the wait to see if he could rebound from that, we made a rash decision and gave him the job permanently, something that would likely never have happened if we had waited another couple of weeks. We made a rash decision, admitting when you've made a mistake is part of been a good businessman not mention been an adult, and if we want to get this club back on track we need to start by addressing the clubs past and recent mistakes.
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My only problem with this post is that you judge the manager premature. Life will never be as easy as that. Good things take time. Its like this when you want to have success; you need to spend a lot of time and be patient even if its shit at times. Most people will give up or hunt something else.

With other words; Its far too soon to judge the manager now. You and me dont know anything at this stage.

I get a little pissed when a lot of people on here judge to fast.
 
Amadaeus said:
I m sure those managers would have gotten this Ajax side to the semi finals of the champions league and playing such good football too
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It's funny because I know you were being sarcastic, but basically yes, plenty of coaches could've had a good CL campaign with this current Ajax squad. Peter Bosz made a Europa League final with a squad that player for player had slightly less talent just two years ago.

Frank de Boer before that beat teams like Barcelona, PSG and Manchester City in the group phase of the CL with a squad that cost maybe 25% of their current squad, deploying attacking players who literally weren't even Championship level players. Think of names like Siem de Jong, Tobias Sana, Derek Boerrigter, they knocked City completely out of Europe one year.

Frank de Boer is also the most succesful Ajax manager since Louis van Gaal, and by the way look at how those two performed in England if you want some indication of what it would - probably - be like for Ten Hag.

For what it's worth I'm sure your man Poch based on what he's showed at Spurs could've won the league with City's team last year as well. And Klopp could've done a fine job at Tottenham had he he signed for them instead, and I'm sure Guardiola would've done very well at Liverpool if he'd had the same financial backing Klopp had for that matter. All clearly good managers who know what they're doing, all of them also have better squads than United over the last two years imo.
 
Club badly need a progressive manager post SAF but that knobhead Woodward hired Moyes, LvG, Mourinho, three dinosaurs in a row and now Ole. I refuse to judge Ole now as much as I refused to judge him during his honey moon.
We don't even know what style he wants play, we ran alot in his first 3 or 4 matches then back to sit back and run less recently. We pressed hard against Cardiff, now players just jog back when they lose the ball. We do know he managed fricking Molde and relegated Cardiff though. I doubt Woodward even watched a single Norwegian league game when he hired Ole as caretaker. Such a clown.

Woodward is the mistake, he turns everything ( except commercial things) that he touches into horsecraps. He's the exact opposite of King Midas.
 
Stretch said:
Again, do you think Ole can attract the right players to Utd? Do we think he knows what we need? Would players want to come play for him? Does he know who to cull when he’s handed contract extension to players who shouldn’t be handed contract extensions? It really bothers me to be honest
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Well, put it this way. I think there is only around 3 managers in the world players cite they want to pay for. Guardiola, Klopp and formerly Mourinho. Most players are swayed by the clubs. They want to play for Juventus, Ajax, Real Madrid, Liverpool etc and we remain one of those clubs particularly to British players.

We should have no issue attracting the like of Wan-Bissaka, Declan Rice, Jason Sancho etc. Inevitably, if we are in direct competition with one of those big teams ahead of us currently we’ll struggle to get our targets. I’m not sure having a different manager would make much difference in that regard.

I agree one or two players got extensions which surprised me. However, if we do sign a new CB and a new RB then Young and Jones should only be backup players. We can’t change the entirety of the squad in one summer.

If Valencia, Darmian, Bailly, Rojo leave this summer and we sign a CB and a RB would you not be happy having Young be 3rd choice RB behind new RB and Dalot and 3rd choice LB behind Shaw and Dalot? Jones would also be 4th CB behind new CB, Lindelof and Smalling.
 
Id like to know how many people who are saying ole should be sacked were saying he must be appointed 10 games ago, the blame is with the players and the fact that they are gutless the lot of em, problem is ole just looks lost and totally out of his depth in respect of turning things around, we MUST see a reaction on weds
 
Why are we even judging Ole now? He's only been here for 4 months, and has managed to made us believe that we could actually turn it around in Barca. Ole should be given at least 2-3 seasons to prove his worth. Dont get it why people are judging Ole now when this is not even "his team". Ole inherited this shitload of a team and has managed to work wonders with it. The time to judge Ole will come and it isin't now.
 
Acquire Me said:
My only problem with this post is that you judge the manager premature. Life will never be as easy as that. Good things take time. Its like this when you want to have success; you need to spend a lot of time and be patient even if its shit at times. Most people will give up or hunt something else.

With other words; Its far too soon to judge the manager now. You and me dont know anything at this stage.

I get a little pissed when a lot of people on here judge to fast.
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In normal circumstances I would agree with you, but in this senario people it's too soon to judge seems a bit hypocritical, as the problem is we already judged Ole prematurely when he got the job permanently, we didn't wait to see if it was just a great bounce, whether he was more of a manager then just some one who could lift the players after what was obviously a dreadful time under Mourinho. We didn't wait to see if after that faded was he actually capable of getting things right tactically, lifting them game in game out when things get bad.

Did Ole get the job at Christmas becuase we thought he was the right long term manager to take the club forward and be in charge of the club for years to come? Of course not of he would have got a permeant contract straight off, he was bought in as a stop gap to lift the players and fans becuase he is a beloved player who knew the club. While the club got its ducks in a row. He was deemed by nearly everyone that going by his managerial record he wasn't up to the job.

So I think saying your judging him prematurely at this point is backwards, he got judged him prematurely by him getting the job You can't say it's premature to fire him after a really bad run of results and performances if you don't think it was premature to hire him after a really good run of results.

The truth is he should never have got the contract he did when he did, it was a mistake, we now have now committed to a manager who at Christmas was deemed by most not good enough to get the job permanently. Is a few months later saying ow shit we got a bit a head of ourselves their and made a rash decision such a bad idea?
 
sparx99 said:
Well, put it this way. I think there is only around 3 managers in the world players cite they want to pay for. Guardiola, Klopp and formerly Mourinho. Most players are swayed by the clubs. They want to play for Juventus, Ajax, Real Madrid, Liverpool etc and we remain one of those clubs particularly to British players.

We should have no issue attracting the like of Wan-Bissaka, Declan Rice, Jason Sancho etc. Inevitably, if we are in direct competition with one of those big teams ahead of us currently we’ll struggle to get our targets. I’m not sure having a different manager would make much difference in that regard.

I agree one or two players got extensions which surprised me. However, if we do sign a new CB and a new RB then Young and Jones should only be backup players. We can’t change the entirety of the squad in one summer.

If Valencia, Darmian, Bailly, Rojo leave this summer and we sign a CB and a RB would you not be happy having Young be 3rd choice RB behind new RB and Dalot and 3rd choice LB behind Shaw and Dalot? Jones would also be 4th CB behind new CB, Lindelof and Smalling.
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You’re assuming a lot there. So many if’s. I don’t know if I trust Ole to get the right players. There’s absolutely zero evidence that supports him being good at identifying what we need player wise nor having to clout to land said players. I have a feeling we will be here again next season with mostly mediocre players. And managers do play a role when signing talent. I really hope your assumptions come to fruition else we’re behind another year again
 
JEredDevil said:
Ole should be given at least 2-3 seasons to prove his worth. Dont get it why people are judging Ole now when this is not even "his team". Ole inherited this shitload of a team and has managed to work wonders with it. The time to judge Ole will come and it isin't now.
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you have to be a rival fan :lol:

so when the team wins, Ole is working wonders. when the team loses, its the players fault, its not Ole's team, and he should be given 2-3 seasons
 
Spiersey said:
I think Ole will step down at the end of the season if results don’t improve and a decent replacement can be found. Seems to me like someone who would have the clubs best interests at heart.
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I think you are correct there about Ole. The club has been hijacked by the Glazers and changed from a top football club into a milk cow. Things will get worse as long as they own the club.
 
ghagua said:
Klopp finished with 2 cup final appearances I think (not sure), but both managers had their teams playing good football within weeks. We are getting neither at this stage. No results or good football.
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To be fair, Ole had us playing good football the moment he came in too. Unfortunately, we've not been able to sustain it.

With better players, we could see more consistency from them next season.

We need to give him time, though. Klopp and Pep, despite having a set style didnt pull up any trees in the league straight away.

Ole will need at least three seasons. We need to stick with him that he can build his team.
 
Walters_19_MuFc said:
To be fair, Ole had us playing good football the moment he came in too. Unfortunately, we've not been able to sustain it.

With better players, we could see more consistency from them next season.

We need to give him time, though. Klopp and Pep, despite having a set style didnt pull up any trees in the league straight away.

Ole will need at least three seasons. We need to stick with him that he can build his team.
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I know one person who will be a major stumbling block in any plans Ole may have to improve us.
https://www.manchestereveningnews.c...ews/ed-woodward-manchester-united-can-6373895
 
Imagine if he hadn't appointed Ole.

Would Poch want to leave Spurs at the moment? Debatable. Would Poch leave Spurs if they win the Champions League? No way.

Zidane has gone back to Real and wouldn't of been a great choice anyway and he'd be currently panicking like no ones business trying to find anyone who'd want the job.
 
I look at it very simply. The best managers get the best out of their squads. Is OGS getting the best out of the current team? Overall we'd probably say the answer is no. And I don't go with the argument that the squad has to be all of his players in order to get the best out of them. To get the best out of your management you may need to shape the team and buy your own players but this is over the medium term. I'm worried that we go no reaction at half time today. I'm worried that OGS is struggling in this run. Ultimately we've give the job to an inexperienced manager albeit a legend. That's a gamble.
 
The point remains he hasn't done anything to deserve a permanent job. We could have waited and see how it panned out.
This run is not entirely his fault and bringing Pochettino will not change anything.
The club need restructuring and reevaluation of purpose but still, Ole was not the right choice in my opinion.
 
Seeing so many so called united fans turning on ole like this so soon makes me fecking sick. Have a word with yourselves you bunch of fickle, pathetic cry babies. If you can't see the players rancid attitudes as the problem here, you must be terribly thick. Absolute jokers the lot of you. I am ashamed and embarrasssed to be a red right now. Idiots.
 
Jamie Shawcross said:
Seeing so many so called united fans turning on ole like this so soon makes me fecking sick. Have a word with yourselves you bunch of fickle, pathetic cry babies. If you can't see the players rancid attitudes as the problem here, you must be terribly thick. Absolute jokers the lot of you. I am ashamed and embarrasssed to be a red right now. Idiots.
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Ole is not the problem, Ole always did and always will give his best for United, the problem is that we have an accountant as DOF right now, and it shows when you see some of the players who we have in our squad.
 
Frankly, I am shocked people are still pointing fingers at the manager after all we have seen in recent years.

Do people actually believe Jose Mourinho was clueless? A prick he is but undoubtedly one of the best managers of all time. Even a 'past it' Jose still knows something about club management. We need to look a bit deeper.

Let's wake up, blaming and firing Ole should be the very last resort. Maybe we shouldn't have hired him as permanent manager or maybe we should have. Time is probably the only one that can tell. But clearly, there are bigger issues and bigger problems.

We need to move past the Fergie era. It is gone. God bless him. However, times have changed. The way clubs are run and structured; the way players think and play; the way they accept and work with managers; even the way we fans follow clubs. The club needs a fundamental paradigm shift and I am afraid, those running it either don't realise it or don't know how to bring about the shift.

I personally think calling for Ole's head now is like being overly focused on the bad fruits while ignoring the roots.
 
All things considered hiring Solskjaer was still the right thing to do.

We've tried going the route of hiring premium, proven, successful managers - Mourinho was the very epitome of this. Van Gaal also arguably fit this mould.

The club needs someone right now who lives and breathes United, believes in youth, believes in attacking football.

I believe Ole is a smart enough guy to figure out the right formula for success in time and his comments today are also encouraging because he also seemingly won't let anyone stand in his way of being a success.

My main worry is that he would be a pushover so if he is being honest then his comments are music to my ears.

The only thing we haven't tried yet is hiring a young, exciting manager from outside the club with new ideas but I honestly think right now none of them would be stupid enough to take the job. I also genuinely believe they would also fail because success wouldn't come quick enough and the press and eventually the fans would turn on them within a couple of years.

OGS has his safety net of being a club legend and I genuinely think that will buy him 12 months on top of whatever any other manager would get and make no mistake this rebuild job is going to take years.
 
The problem is he was never the plan, sure most wouldn't even of had him as interim manager either, only unforeseen circumstance brought it about, not well thought out planning, so it's a bit strong some people mocking the ones that just don't have much faith in it working out.
 
Give him time. He’s 8 games in ffs. Sure it could have gone better but I think the players are to blame. How else do you explain going from playing so well to so shite in a matter of a few weeks?
 
TsuWave said:
you have to be a rival fan :lol:

so when the team wins, Ole is working wonders. when the team loses, its the players fault, its not Ole's team, and he should be given 2-3 seasons
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Nah.. have been supporting them since the 90s BUT we gotta be logical here. He's only been here for 4 months without a transfer window and people are saying its a mistake. I think that he has already surpassed all expectations that were set for him in December and that was why he was given the job. Lets not forget that in December, we had virtually given up hope for top 4 and when the UCL draw was made against PSG, how many of us were actually looking forward to it? We were already writing ourselves off when the draw was made. Seems like his downfall was making us believe that we were back at the top again. :confused:

Its like being judged on a project which you had no say whatsoever and suddenly, your boss questions you about it. Even SAF and AW took a few years to impose their philosophy on the clubs and in recent times, Klopp finished his first season in 8th place and Pep was trophyless in his first season with City. Even for Poch, first season with Spurs was fifth and subsequently, bottled it against Leicster and this season there were supposed to be in a 3 horse race and just take a look at where there are now in the league. But yeah, credit has to be given to him for taking spurs to the SF of the champions league.

All I'm saying is we should judge Ole after 2-3 seasons when he is given the same sort of money to spend like LVG and Jose, and when that time comes and we are still in the same shit we are in right now then yeah, Ole would be a mistake. But for now, its way too early to judge him.
 
JMack1234 said:
Imagine if he hadn't appointed Ole.

Would Poch want to leave Spurs at the moment? Debatable. Would Poch leave Spurs if they win the Champions League? No way.

Zidane has gone back to Real and wouldn't of been a great choice anyway and he'd be currently panicking like no ones business trying to find anyone who'd want the job.
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If we'd put everything into getting Poch, got him a top DOF, and promised him a budget to really build his team, then I'd have thought we'd have stood a very good chance, he is very non comital at Spurs.

Plus it would have shown real faith to still go all out for him whilst he was having his rough patch, and Ole was on the winning streak, which would surely have worked in our favour.

Would have been better to have tried and failed, than not tried at all, which I think after Ole strung 4-5 wins together we decided not to do.
 
Still too early to say this was a mistake - we need to wait until the end of next season.

After some decent performances, we're now in our worst run of results in the Premier League era. Signs aren't great, but patience is a virtue.
 
Top clubs usually do not need to have top managers to win things.

My view of Guardiola is that he is a guy who wins bicycle races driving a Ferrari, but for argument's sake, I will agree to consider him a top top manager. Okay, but City have also won the league with Mancini and Pellegrini.

Klopp has resurrected Liverpool (a lot to do with him striking gold with some of his signings); but they came as close to winning the league under Rogers.

Real have won the league with Bernd Schuster in charge.

Barcelona have won the double (treble?) under Frank Rijkaard.

The list goes on and on.

And note that there is a huge gap between winning things and where United currently are.

At one point, you have to ask yourself if all the managers that were appointed were crap, or the problem lies elsewhere.
 
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Hound Dog said:
Top clubs usually do not need to have top managers to win things.

My view of Guardiola is that he is a guy who wins bicycle races driving a Ferrari, but for argument's sake, I will agree to consider him a top top manager. Okay, but City have also won the league with Mancini and Pellegrini.

Klopp has resurrected Liverpool (a lot to do with him striking gold with some of his signings); but they came as close to winning the league under Rogers.

Bayern have won the league with Bernd Schuster in charge.

Barcelona have won the double (treble?) under Frank Rijkaard.

The list goes on and on.

And note that there is a huge gap between winning things and where United currently are.

At one point, you have to ask yourself if all the managers that were appointed were crap, or the problem lies elsewhere.
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The problem is obvious.
 
Im red2 said:
Not looking forward to the transfer window with Ed Woodward still controlling things
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This all day. If there's one thing messing up our squad it's the wages paid to Alexis Sanchez for doing nothing. Woodward is playing fantasy Director of Football on his Playstation and wrecking the club in the process.
 
Infra-red said:
Still too early to say this was a mistake - we need to wait until the end of next season.

After some decent performances, we're now in our worst run of results in the Premier League era. Signs aren't great, but patience is a virtue.
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You could say exactly the same about his appointment in the first place though, I'd argue we should of been more patient in appointing him.
 
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