We were trying to sign him, which is contradictory to your "we refuse to sign foreigners" bs.
He isnt here now is he
I don't see the problem even if we were trying to sign British players if they fit the bill.
CB - We wanted someone who knows the league and is proven Maguire is
RB - I dont see a better RB in the market than AWB
LW - James was a prospect that United have always bought them kind of players in the past.
It's not like we bought players who are crap.
Again, players who fit the bill and refuse to sign foreign players is different. It's not that we turned into Bilbao.
Well, this is maybe for another topic but you mentioned Fred. Give Fred equal chance like we give to domestic players and it is (maybe) different story. There is huge difference in our patience with domestic players and foreign. Martial/Rashford, Fred/McT, Blind/Jones, Cleverley/Anderson, Lingard/Depay are just some examples.That is my point. I don't think we have refused to sign foreign players. We just needed to hit the reset switch, get back some identity which was getting lost.
You can already see the difference between Maguire, AWB, James and say a Fred
Well, this is maybe for another topic but you mentioned Fred. Give Fred equal chance like we give to domestic players and it is (maybe) different story. There is huge difference in our patience with domestic players and foreign. Martial/Rashford, Fred/McT, Blind/Jones, Cleverley/Anderson, Lingard/Depay are just some examples.
Exactly my point. Foreign players come with price tag and i accept that. But last few years we went too far with protection of domestic players and with that we became too harsh with foreigners. Fred played well when Ole was interim and then 2 bad games he is out. Depay started great then came bad form and he never got another real chance. It is hard for any player( despite how strong he is in his head) to play under that pressure. One bad game and you are out and after month on the bench they get one game to prove themselves. Martial and Rashford under Jose played nearly in the same form. Martial lost his spot after every bad game but Rashford and Lingard played and played and played. Blind finished first Jose's season great but next year he was again down in packing order behind Jones and Smalling.I agree but that is to do with our fan group. The difference in the players you have mentioned is Martial, Fred, Depay all came with big reputations and price tags.
As a fan you are always going to give a homegrown player more leway than one singed for millions.
Martial has been given alot of slack, he is just frustrating because we know he has the talent.
Rashford seems like he needs to be pulled back a peg or two.
Fred needs a run of 5 games not one in one out.
Exactly my point. Foreign players come with price tag and i accept that. But last few years we went too far with protection of domestic players and with that we became too harsh with foreigners. Fred played well when Ole was interim and then 2 bad games he is out. Depay started great then came bad form and he never got another real chance. It is hard for any player( despite how strong he is in his head) to play under that pressure. One bad game and you are out and after month on the bench they get one game to prove themselves. Martial and Rashford under Jose played nearly in the same form. Martial lost his spot after every bad game but Rashford and Lingard played and played and played. Blind finished first Jose's season great but next year he was again down in packing order behind Jones and Smalling.
Alexis was complete flop, not arguing that but after he lost his place in squad, he never got real chance again. Game then ynd there and that is it. And by real chance i mean like you said. 5,6 games in a row.
It is pressure on managers by our board. Even Mourinho adapted on that. Our managers know that they will get points with fans and board if they play domestic players.
Exactly my point. Foreign players come with price tag and i accept that. But last few years we went too far with protection of domestic players and with that we became too harsh with foreigners. Fred played well when Ole was interim and then 2 bad games he is out. Depay started great then came bad form and he never got another real chance. It is hard for any player( despite how strong he is in his head) to play under that pressure. One bad game and you are out and after month on the bench they get one game to prove themselves. Martial and Rashford under Jose played nearly in the same form. Martial lost his spot after every bad game but Rashford and Lingard played and played and played. Blind finished first Jose's season great but next year he was again down in packing order behind Jones and Smalling.
Alexis was complete flop, not arguing that but after he lost his place in squad, he never got real chance again. Game then ynd there and that is it. And by real chance i mean like you said. 5,6 games in a row.
It is pressure on managers by our board. Even Mourinho adapted on that. Our managers know that they will get points with fans and board if they play domestic players.
Because Fellaini doesn't belong in a United squad - he's dire. And Herrera for all of his effort, didn't have any great output. McTominay has contributed no less than Herrera would have.How does selling two midfielders, one who was a regular starter and the second who was highly effective and offered something different, without replacing either make sense? The best teams have the best midfield, or at least a midfield that functions with chemistry.
Clearly the effort wasn't where it would have been had he been British.We were trying to sign him, which is contradictory to your "we refuse to sign foreigners" bs.
Because Fellaini doesn't belong in a United squad - he's dire. And Herrera for all of his effort, didn't have any great output. McTominay has contributed no less than Herrera would have.
The midfield is very thin though, yes. It's not where it should be...yet! I'm saying every thing he has done so far makes sense. Jobs not done. The right midfielders will hopefully be added in time. There's no point padding out the squad with players who are gettable. better to wait and get your first choices. Patience.
I don't see the problem even if we were trying to sign British players if they fit the bill.
CB - We wanted someone who knows the league and is proven Maguire is
RB - I dont see a better RB in the market than AWB
LW - James was a prospect that United have always bought them kind of players in the past.
It's not like we bought players who are crap.
There is no value in the British market and the talent is not good enough to get us where we want to be.I don't see the problem even if we were trying to sign British players if they fit the bill.
CB - We wanted someone who knows the league and is proven Maguire is
RB - I dont see a better RB in the market than AWB
LW - James was a prospect that United have always bought them kind of players in the past.
It's not like we bought players who are crap.
There is no value in the British market and the talent is not good enough to get us where we want to be.
I think its inevitable that we lose Pogba, he is a world class player and there's nothing we can realistically do to put ourselves in the position of immediate success that I imagine he wants. This rebuild, at least how what we call it, will last if all goes well for at least 2-3 years before we can start really challenging City and Liverpool, I don't think Pogba has the patience to wait for it, damn I wouldn't.Meanwhile we’re just waiting for Paul Pogba to abandon ship. Patience.
We talk a great deal about the manager on this forum, however, few threads are directed at the coaching and supporting staff. ( Yes I know that Ole has brought some of his own staff in ) but should they not be scrutinised for their performance and advice. I assume that Ole takes advice from his team when deciding who will play and the tactics for the game on how his squad have performed in training. If that feed back is poor then that certainly affects his team selection and tactics.
For example lets us look back on Lukaku, he certainly bulked up in his last twelve months with us and in my opinion this effected his performance. Now was this on the advice of the staff at OT., if not then the question arises did they not put into a training plan to rectify the problem or did Lukaku ignore their instructions. Either way were the staff informing the manager of their concerns.
I appreciate as fans we will not have an insight into that part of the club to enable us to draw a conclusion.
There is no value in the British market and the talent is not good enough to get us where we want to be.
Clearly you are jumping to conclusions without making the minimum effort to understand why Dybala wasn't signed by us or Spurs.Clearly the effort wasn't where it would have been had he been British.
I'll be happy when Pogba abandons ship, I'd happily send him on his way on a lifeboat. We have too much to address so it obviously wasn't possible in the summer - far too much needing done all at once. But ideally, I would have cashed in on him and rebuilt the midfield. Yeah patience, as the state we are in there is no quick fix.Meanwhile we’re just waiting for Paul Pogba to abandon ship. Patience.
The manager has to earn the right to deserve a 2nd full season at a club like United.Moyes wasn’t given a 2nd season and that was the right call..,If we keep playing like this for the rest of the season and if we fail to finish 4th,Ole will be gone...This thread seems to have gone off topic but when it comes to Ole we need to give him time. A manager needs two full seasons IMO before you can really judge him. Maguire, Wan-Bisakka and James look like good signings. Another window or two and we'll start to get there.
Ole was the obvious choice..... more people wanted him than didnt. He lifted the club after the Mourinho self implosion
Now his lack of experience and a lack of investment sees people questioning him, i for one thinks he needs more time...
Im talking British talent, not the prem market. There is no value there. Its not about signing players that would improve us. I mean our first 11 has the likes of Scotty McT, Lindelof and Lingard in it, there are alot of players better than this lot. We need to find players that are capable to perform at the elite level.The "British market", isn't that transfers between British clubs? theres value there, Liverpool have proven that....
As for strictly British/Homegrown talent, theres lots available that would improve United.
We need to find value, otherwise we'll never get out of the mess we find ourselves in. Im mostly talking about British tax by the way. These players cost a premium and arent even that good.Yes, that great word no value. The reason English clubs demand a higher fee is because they don't need to sell.
But I guess there is alot of value around Europe where Felix is worth £100m
The problem with buying players from the continent is they take a while to adapt to the Premier League, clubs would rather take a £80m proven English CB over a £60m CB playing in Portugal.
Im talking British talent, not the prem market. There is no value there. Its not about signing players that would improve us. I mean our first 11 has the likes of Scotty McT, Lindelof and Lingard in it, there are alot of players better than this lot. We need to find players that are capable to perform at the elite level.
You don't really believe it's Ole's problem do you?I know he is getting praised for getting rid of players, but why? He has brought in zero replacements in midfield and attack. We are in a worse position than we were last season.
Midfield
- We have lost Herrera and Fellaini with no replacements.
- Pogba and Matic are almost certainly gone next season.
- Fred is not playing - if this goes on, he will probably also want to leave.
This could potentially leave us with a midfield of McTominay, Pereira and Lingard next summer. We may have to sign four midfielders in one window since those three are nothing but squad players, at best, along with a backup. Honestly, I don't think McTominay is any better than Fellaini - really don't see anything there with him.
Attack
- Sold Lukaku and Sanchez with no real replacements.
- Daniel James looks good/decent.
- Signed no right-winger, again. Supposedly we are waiting on Sancho, which is just stupid for the position the team is in.
- Relying on Rashford and Martial, who have only managed double figures once in the league: last season. Even that was scraping it with ten goals each.
We need to sign a proper, established right-winger. On top of that, we will probably need to sign a striker because I do not see any of our players scoring a sufficient amount of goals.
Defence
- Signed Maguire and Bissaka, which is good.
- Stupidly sold our second-best centre back in Smalling, so we now have to rely on three injury-prone defenders as backups (Jones, Bailly and Rojo)
- We will also need to play Lindelof in the first team, who is not great.
We may be in a position where we need to sign another first-team centre back and a backup to them since the ones we have are just not reliable.
Goalkeeper
- De Gea may not sign a contract
We could possibly need a new goalkeeper if Henderson does not prove to be good enough.
The failure to sign a sufficient number of players this season, whilst getting rid of other players, has put the team in a position where they need to sign a lot of players next season. Potentially: 1 Goalkeeper, 2 Centre backs (1 backup and 1 first team), four midfielders (1 DM, 1 AM, 1 CM and a backup who can hopefully play more than one position), 1 Right Winger and 1 Striker. So, we are now in a position where we could potentially need to sign 9 players next season.
Great Job!
If we really wanted Dybala he'd be here. We spent 80 million quid for a defender and yet couldn't find 15 million for image rights? really?People are taking this "British" strategy too much to heart.
Ole / Mike aren't against signing other nationality players by any means, hence we were linked with Dybala and Eriksen strongly at the end of the window.
If the right player with the right attitude shows up from England I think that will be the preference but I don't think its absolutely set in stone its only British players we will now sign going forward.
People are taking this "British" strategy too much to heart.
Ole / Mike aren't against signing other nationality players by any means, hence we were linked with Dybala and Eriksen strongly at the end of the window.
If the right player with the right attitude shows up from England I think that will be the preference but I don't think its absolutely set in stone its only British players we will now sign going forward.
Spurs are skint and we know why.Clearly you are jumping to conclusions without making the minimum effort to understand why Dybala wasn't signed by us or Spurs.
If we really wanted Dybala he'd be here. We spent 80 million quid for a defender and yet couldn't find 15 million for image rights? really?
Spurs are skint and we know why.
Obviously. I mentioned them cause @Mihai mentioned them. You were quoted in the post by mistake.Because of the stadium build primarily.
I've no idea why your mentioning Spurs though.
You don't really believe it's Ole's problem do you?
He can only encourage the players that the scouts have put before him, IF they agree to want to come to Man Utd. Players like Dybala for example don't want to come to us at the moment. We are not successful enough to draw the " top names ". Add to this the fact that Ed is awful at providing worthy contracts and these are just 2 of our issues.
Ole is a scapegoat but he appears to have a vision, hence making the very good purchases we have made, that says to me he can see good players who will perform. He does need to up his game regarding coaching as there are obviously issues with our performances as he only seems to have a plan A, but he definitely needs to have a lot more shooting practices and drills as we dominate games but don't finish them off.
The goal ratio for us has been shocking for a few years now, pre-OGS too so he can't be blamed for that either. He does have to adjust his game planning, I don't disagree with that but I do disagree that he is to blame for shite transfers. Our issues run so much deeper than just him. I, for one, believe that he can change things for the better, with the right players who want to play for us and as long as he can offer a vision for future players and they fit in well, he may well succeed and prove the many doubters wrong.
Im talking British talent, not the prem market. There is no value there. Its not about signing players that would improve us. I mean our first 11 has the likes of Scotty McT, Lindelof and Lingard in it, there are alot of players better than this lot. We need to find players that are capable to perform at the elite level.
We need to find value, otherwise we'll never get out of the mess we find ourselves in. Im mostly talking about British tax by the way. These players cost a premium and arent even that good.
Thought that was an outlandish purchase by Atletico but that really isnt the norm. Recent history has taught us that it doesn't matter whether you sign a so called prem proven player or not, they can still fail. Lukaku, Sanchez and Shaw were all considered prem proven and all turned into expensive failures. So much for being proven.
His wins since officially becoming manager:I support Ole, but then, I read that he has only 3 wins since he signed as our manager. Is that true?
We do need to find good deals, this is where having someone for the role will help us. At the moment there is a British premium and then there is Manutd premium because of Ed Woodward.
Alexis and Lukaku are not British players, but the problem is when we do find a bit of value and sign £15m James, alot of fans are like what a championship player. But I would rather sign him than Sanchez, Dybala, Lukaku, etc because he wants to play for the club.
Agreed we cannot sign 4 of them in one window because we need quality but I am guessing every fan knows what we lack so the club should?
We should be scouting CM, RW, DM, LB from now until April and then start talking to agents and get an early deal.
If we really wanted Dybala he'd be here. We spent 80 million quid for a defender and yet couldn't find 15 million for image rights? really?
Spurs are skint and we know why.
