I guess its just what we expect of him now. The days of him beating his defender and putting a good cross in are gone. But if you want someone who is solid and can defend at fall back there are few better in our squad. (Even with his mistake against Asnl)
25
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 35
- Clean sheets
- 12
- Goals
- 0
- Assists
- 5
- Yellow cards
- 4
The amount of players who should only be back-ups next season means that we're not even going to have a first team at this rate.
true, but if you asked me which one of our current first team regulars should be a backup next season, I'd say Valencia every single time.
The only other 2 I'd have as near definite backups would be Fellaini and Young.
Except he wasn't solid, he looked OK when we were dominating teams possession wise because we had very little defending to do. He was guilty of some very poor defending through the season and big lapses in concentration.
I think for the most part he was. Its easy to have a distorted view by a few mistakes through the season but on the whole there was a reason why he kept Rafael out of the side
Perhaps, although its equally likely to have a distorted view based on teams overall performance and not on individual ones. He kept Rafael out because Rafael couldn't keep himself fit and LVG thought consistency was the key at the end of the season. Still, this has been discussed to death with two clear camps.
Can't cross for anything which isn't good enough for a winger or a RB, but he was fine defensively.
Will be a decent back up RB next season. Also didn't LVG refer to him as 'the best player in the Arsenal game making a mistake' in his end of the season awards speech?
Can't cross, doesn't take on players anymore despite his searing pace, not great in the air and defensively suspect. Apart from that he's grand.
Yes I noticed that as well.
He did. Highly rated by SAF, LvG and Pep Guardiola. What is it people are missing in their assessment of his value to the squad?
Lots of my mates rate him. I always say he isn't that good and we are looking for replacements and they laugh.
One of the first decisions from Louie when he arrived was to offer him a contract. It wasn't a bad decision since Rafael is in recovery state but with first legit RB signing coming here he's benched and then maybe rotated in the cups.
The good news is he never complains about one thing therefore he's staying as a depth player who can easily get solid amount of games in case of injury storm.
You just know we're going to play him at some point no matter what.
The good news is he never complains about one thing therefore he's staying as a depth player who can easily get solid amount of games in case of injury storm.
You just know we're going to play him at some point no matter what.
The rating by Ferguson was from when he played without fear and at the same time had the tag of Mr. Reliable and will do the job asked. Pep's backing was also when Valencia was having one of this best season. The times when he was tearing Ashley Cole a new one. As far as LVG goes, LVG likes players that do what he asks and are reliable.
As supporters though I'd say most of us are looking for the Tony V. and not turn back Tony. And obviously there are quite a few that still are upset he was bought to fill the right wing spot after Ronaldo and demand an almost like for like replacement even though he has given us very good service.
I also do think people just don't value the players like the Valencia's Parks, O'Sheas etc - who are not glamorous but, are integral to a teams success during the year. I think he gives us a great squad option but, would nice if at this point he wasn't the shoe in first XI option.
Who do you think are Barca's and Real Madrid's version of Valencia/John O'Shea?
Some valid points. I tend to condemn his worst critics as butthurt Ronaldo fanbois. It'll be interesting to see if he'll improve after having the screws removed from his leg.
Who did Madrid have coming off the bench against Juve to save them? Chicharito - a player deemed surplus to us this season. The grass is not always greener. Barca in their recent history have had one of the greatest players and two of the best central midfielders of the generation playing behind him. However, even they looked wanting in games when some of their role players could not step up.
You come across as one of those that simply expect a world XI for every team and if they are not then they are just not good enough. When in truth great teams are made by a combination of great players and by role players such as the Busquets, Pedros and the likes. United's problem right now has not been the likes of Valencia does not belong but, more that the players we expect great things from have not delivered - the likes Rooney, RVP, Falcao, ADM. Valencia has done the job more or less that has been expected out of him. Which is why managers keep playing him.
I think you're taking the piss if you really think Busquets is just a role player.
So just to clarify, you don't know.
I should come across as someone who thinks Manchester United should be competing with Barca and Madrid, not accepting mediocrity within our squad. Quite simply the reason why you couldn't give me the Barca version of O'Shea or Valencia is because they haven't got one. Busquets is the best defensive midfielder of his generation, Pedro just a few weeks ago scored a spectacular overhead kick, these are players of real quality who are technically brilliant.
This 'do a job' mentality has to stop, its small time.
Under Guardiola and Villanova it was Adriano, Bayern it's Rode, for Chelsea Ramires, City has Milner.
I think he did a good job defensively this season actually. Sure, there were times his positioning cost us a goal but this happens to recognised full-backs aswell. It just gets magnified when it happens to somebody playing out of their natural position.
Going forward though, his crossing is a serious frustration. Especially when playing behind Mata who drifts inside.
Going forward though, his crossing is a serious frustration. Especially when playing behind Mata who drifts inside.
Really? You think they are acceptable comparisons? Adriano and Rode or Valencia and O'Shea...
I'm not sure if I'm supposed to answer but Valencia and O'Shea played at a higher level.
Yet Fergie dominated domestically and was second only to one of the best teams ever in Europe with John O'Shea an almost guaranteed starter when fit. Go figure.
Isn't that Mathieu bloke basically the Barca equivalent of John O'shea anyway? Regardless I don't think a comparison between O'Shea and Valencia is apt. While Valencia is willing to be versatile and play full back he is shaky there and makes us vulnerable. Sheasy would guarantee you defensive solidity if not much else, but a guarantee of defensive solidity was splendid for a versatile squad player.
And Obertan played at a higher level than Matt Le Tissier.
Rode is 24 and is considered by many to be Schweinsteigers heir.
Cleverley was also a pivotal player under Fergie toward the end of his career, should we bring him back as well? Think we should avoid continued comparisons to O'Shea anyway as its derailing the thread and he was at least very versatile (which AV isnt).
So again who are Barca's and Madrid current Valencia?
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Valencia and O'Shea have individually played at a high level, I'm not talking about the environment but about their performances.The Valencia of a bygone era was brilliant, he isn't even close to that now. I think we should leave O'Shea out of this as its derailing the thread a little and he at least has the skill of being extremely versatile. Valencia isn't that. He's an average full back and a mediocre winger. He shouldnt be anywhere near the starting XI if we have serious aspirations of challenging in Europe.
What needs to stop is the thought that the only way to compete is having world XI players through the team when that is not the case and not something that can be maintained unless bank rolled - by a bank. Madrid tried their galacticos that has failed. City, PSG have been met with the same fate.
So Pedro scored a spectacular free kick, that makes him brilliant? No what has made him so good is that he has done the job along side some great players. It's why Barca keep buying other forwards even though they have him - because while he is not the best he is a very good player much like Valencia that helps make a team.
What is small time is people like you that tend to not give players like Valencia their due. No one is saying he is what we should build our team around but, he is not the type of player we want to be without either. Players like him is what has made United great over the years along side some exceptional players.
Who said that he should be in our starting eleven? He had a good season in a position alien to him, that's worthy of praises, there is no subliminal message.
Think he did quite well in some of the big games, Anfield, City at home. Sure he went to sleep on occasion too but Zabaleta for example, slept through most of the season. He's a good guy that's done an alien job to a 7/10 standard, in most games. I just don't see where the upgrade is coming from. I don't believe Alves will come & Clyne doesn't grab me as a particular upgrade defensively or, Coleman either. Maybe there is a 'find' out there in Europe somewhere.
I used to be a massive Valencia fan but I'm past the point of trying to defend him. To go from a Man Utd number 7 and player of the year to a stop gap fullback is one of the biggest declines I can remember. Rooney gets stick for not being up there with Messi whilst you still have people who continually set the bar lower and lower for Valencia.
I'll give him the benefit of the doubt as a RB but he's dodgy positional and is very guilty of ball watching. And I think his lack of willingness to overlap at pace is stopping us breaking down teams. Arsenal had their full backs bombing beyond the ball at pace creating space on the weekend. Valencia is too content to backup the play, slow it down & not aggressively attack the space Mata leaves for him. Means we have no penetration on the right. Compare that to Blind at LB and Shaw vs Chelsea and the link up play with Young.
I'll give him the benefit of the doubt as a RB but he's dodgy positional and is very guilty of ball watching. And I think his lack of willingness to overlap at pace is stopping us breaking down teams. Arsenal had their full backs bombing beyond the ball at pace creating space on the weekend. Valencia is too content to backup the play, slow it down & not aggressively attack the space Mata leaves for him. Means we have no penetration on the right. Compare that to Blind at LB and Shaw vs Chelsea and the link up play with Young.
Arbeloa for Real. Far worse than Valencia and O'Shea.
It's nice to have mind readers around the place.
I've heard LVG say he was our best player (as in MOTM) on a couple of occasions so I doubt it was just about him keeping fit.
A fit RafaelWho's the answer to the RB quandry?
He should really commit to his new role and try to learn more and improve over the summer. There's a world class Right back in there somewhere but he's too new to the role to already show that on a consistent basis. His defensive awareness is still iffy and honestly his crossing just needs to come back to where it was before.
No, its common sense. He made no unforced changes to his starting XI for about 6 games despite keys players returning from injury.
He said it after the game when Valencia literally gave the ball to Welbeck to make it 2-1, he was protecting his player.
Why is the bar being lowered again for Valencia? And this isn't an alien position, he's played there for years (he played there under Fergie) and its now considered his actual position.
Really? Because concurrently Madrid and Barca are without their 'do a job' players in their current starting XI and still no one has been able to name one in their current sides.
Pedro isn't in the side because he's behind Suarez, Messi and Neymar they keep buying forwards because they want to improve, he's still a fantastic player but they have strength in depth. Pedro isn't a converted right back who can do a job further forward, that's the difference.
You really seem to be misinterpreting support players as average players. The fact you compared Valencia to Busquets says it all really.
Even at the awards function? There is defending and then there is going overboard with it.