Andre Onana made another mistake. Ohnono.

Status
Not open for further replies.
We can't have a GK where any shot from opponent will make you worry. We used to have Schmeichel, VDS and DDG who was very reliable.

We can't keep worrying about GK mistakes every other game. It's too many for this level. I have more confidence even with Henderson. We can count on him to make routine save and not to worry about every shot.

We need a GK and not an outfield player at the posts. His shot stopping, his positioning and even in the air are dodgy.
 
Kostov said:
Yes it was thanks to Onana that Gvardiol and Ortega made a total feck up gifted us a goal and then made Walker to forget to defend. :wenger:

All that in 24% possession of the ball that we enjoyed, yeah Onana definitely contributed to much of that with his 49% pass completion, compared to 49% of DDG last year. :wenger:

Lots of posters on here driving the same narrative, but you take the biscuit easily,.
Click to expand...
I'm seeing this a lot and while i think there's no denying that in terms of long range passing it hasn't been as good as we thought it would be there is a huge difference between how both keepers receive the ball and how they pass short range. DDG gave off serious 'don't give me the ball' vibes, Onana for the most part exudes confidence with the ball at his feet, and his first touch is great. That's been the best part of having a new keeper for me and I noticed it particularly from the game against Arsenal early in the season.

No one should be denying there are some serious concerns about other areas to his game though. For me personally, i'd like to see us get a very good back up keeper to give him some competition next season as the jury is still out if he can be United's number one for years to come.
 
Onana doesn't have the composure and consistency to be our #1 long-term.

We need a new GK to challenge Onana. Someone cheap-ish so we can invest in more important positions.. I personally would have gone for Keylor Navas last season since Raya was already headed to Arsenal. Navas is incredibly underrated possibly because of his size. He showed that he still had it at Forest.
 
Irwin99 said:
I'm seeing this a lot and while i think there's no denying that in terms of long range passing it hasn't been as good as we thought it would be there is a huge difference between how both keepers receive the ball and how they pass short range. DDG gave off serious 'don't give me the ball' vibes, Onana for the most part exudes confidence with the ball at his feet, and his first touch is great. That's been the best part of having a new keeper for me and I noticed it particularly from the game against Arsenal early in the season.

No one should be denying there are some serious concerns about other areas to his game though. For me personally, i'd like to see us get a very good back up keeper to give him some competition next season as the jury is still out if he can be United's number one for years to come.
Click to expand...
I certainly not deny that Onana is more comfortable in possession, it’s the overrating part that is annoying. As i pointed out exact same completion rate and 2 more passes than DDG last year. Onana had feck all to do with how well we played, gave his best to feck it up at the end that is agreed.
 
Pronewbie said:
Onana doesn't have the composure and consistency to be our #1 long-term.

We need a new GK to challenge Onana. Someone cheap-ish so we can invest in more important positions.. I personally would have gone for Keylor Navas last season since Raya was already headed to Arsenal. Navas is incredibly underrated possibly because of his size. He showed that he still had it at Forest.
Click to expand...
I agree with the bolded part. While cheapish would be great, if we have to spend then let it be so. GK is one position where you absolutely need consistency and a pair of safe hands.
 
The only reason I'd keep him is because I don't like writing players off after 1 season. I like to see players get 2 seasons to prove themselves.

But yeah, this season has been about as bad as it realistically could have been. So many mistakes, so many soft goals conceded that he could have saved. And worse than that, he seems to have some real technical weakness in his shot stopping that means it's likely going to be a long term issue.

Remember the final straw for De Gea was conceding 2 soft goals in the FA Cup final last year that a top keeper should save. And Onana follows that up this year by conceding an even softer goal in the cup final.

I do think at points he's been harshly judged whereby people are blaming him for every single shot that goes in. But overall a pretty bad season.
 
Dominos said:
The only reason I'd keep him is because I don't like writing players off after 1 season. I like to see players get 2 seasons to prove themselves.

But yeah, this season has been about as bad as it realistically could have been. So many mistakes, so many soft goals conceded that he could have saved. And worse than that, he seems to have some real technical weakness in his shot stopping that means it's likely going to be a long term issue.

Remember the final straw for De Gea was conceding 2 soft goals in the FA Cup final last year that a top keeper should save. And Onana follows that up this year by conceding an even softer goal in this year's cup final.

I do think at points he's been harshly judged whereby people are blaming him for every single shot that goes in. But overall a pretty bad season.
Click to expand...

If Martinez and Shaw are healthy next year and we replace Varane, I expect Onana to have a much better year....potentially even one where people like myself and others happily say we were wrong about him based on the first six months.
 
Hasn’t really shown the ability on the ball we saw in the UCL final last year either which I think is a lot do the reason why a lot of us wanted him. He isn’t a serious problem so he’ll do for now.. he hasn’t exactly had the easiest first season so you never know, he could improve.
 
It's crazy to think that we had Kovar on our books and we just shipped him out to Leverkusen where he is just happy to be the cup keeper. Not only that, but he impressed as well.

I followed him(as I did Vitek, our other academy GK) and I noticed that he was a bit of a Mainoo himself. He looked much more assured and commanding of the box than De Gea was at the time. The limited time he had during our pre season he showed a very good GK display. So I was sad to see him go.

Meanwhile during the winter phase we were absolute shambles GK wise. Onana was coming of consecutive howlers in the CL and we were losing him to AFCON.

If we were a well run Kovar would be our No. 2 and our cup keeper. He would've easily had 15+ appearances this season. And right now we wouldn't be too worries about the GK situation, because if Onana continued on his current trajectory, a young lad would be there to take his place.

Alas, it's another what could have been. I do hope that we do have some kind of buy back option.
 
RoyH1 said:
I agree with the bolded part. While cheapish would be great, if we have to spend then let it be so. GK is one position where you absolutely need consistency and a pair of safe hands.
Click to expand...
I mean, look at what we got Schmeichel and VDS for - many other examples in today's market. The GK market is an interesting one, especially if we consider our financial situation and upgrades required up the pitch. If Keylor Navas can replicate his form for his recent clubs that's more than good enough for a side challenging for top 4, IMHO.
 
Eric_the_Red99 said:
I actually think that the ‘great moments’ and his mistakes are connected - he has a tendency to make routine saves look like worldies because he’s *only just* saving them, usually because he’s reacting so late or he was in a bad position to begin with. Sometimes a shot will be going straight towards him and he’ll dive dramatically into the air to push it over the bar when a more competent keeper would simply have caught the ball, no muss, no fuss.

If you play like that, and when you face as many shots as our defence allows, eventually one of those easy shots will go in and he’ll be exposed.
Click to expand...
I was sort of combining all his decent ball playing into one as part of the "great" descriptor. May as well be generous at this point...:lol:

I agree most of his goalkeeping in general has not been very impressive in terms of shot stopping in particular, commanding the box and aerial skills have also been average at very best. Clearly his passing is his best skill which he still fecks at times but in general is quite good.
 
I like the guy, but he's not a good goalkeeper. I mean, it's just blindingly obvious at this stage. The Doku shot bounced twice along the ground before it reached him and he still couldn't save it.

He's comfortable with the ball at his feet, I'll give him that, but he's gonna let in 8 to 12 shit goals like that a season, guaranteed.

If people are happy with that, fine, let's keep him.
 
I'm all for giving people time but I've never seen a keeper so poor at getting down to low shots before

it's such a glaring weakness I wonder how he made it this far in his career, to be honest
 
Yakuza_devils said:
He easily have the most mistake of any 1st choice GK in Man Utd as far as I remember. He made too many comical mistakes in one season.
Click to expand...

You should have seen Schmeichel in the 1st half of the treble season. Comical mistake after mistake.
 
He has to face a minimum of 15 shots per game playing for us, and he's come from a team in Inter who control games and are largely untroubled by their opponents in Italy. Plus he's following in the footsteps of one of the greatest shot stoppers ever in De Gea. I'm willing to give him more time.
 
He is Pogba in goalkeeping form.

Some elite characteristics, but completely let down by the lack of simple basic fundamentals of the position.
 
I don't think he is a brilliant keeper but he has also faced a ridiculous amount of shots this season, most in the league.

We have far bigger issues to address. He is not as good as De Gea so I can understand people's annoyance but we are where we are and he isn't our biggest issue by a long shot.
 
You can't judge a goalkeeper who faces so many shots by the volume of mistakes he makes, or indeed the great saves he makes.

Onana has made a lot of good saves and a lot of mistakes this year because he's had to make over 200 saves. Objectively he has the highest save % in the league, but how PSxG prevented is only decently above average this year. So I think it's fair to say he's done decently as a shot stopper this season, but the eye test just won't work because we hold good and bad bits in far more weight than average stuff. There's no way you're going to think a goalkeeper who makes 12 mistakes in 200 saves is as good as a keeper who makes 3 mistakes in 50 saves but objectively they're the same failure rate.
 
It will be interesting to see how we adapt our play next season. His on the ball play has largely been great in flashes and ultimately the strength of that is supposed to mitigate his other weaknesses. If anything, ETH has him adapt more than the other way this season. Hopefully next season, whoever the manager is, we more deliberately shift to a possession based system and we see more of what he does best helps us score more goals.
 
DevTheRed said:
Hasn’t really shown the ability on the ball we saw in the UCL final last year either which I think is a lot do the reason why a lot of us wanted him. He isn’t a serious problem so he’ll do for now.. he hasn’t exactly had the easiest first season so you never know, he could improve.
Click to expand...

Actually think he was much better on the ball with Lisandro in front of him.
 
I think we signed a goalkeeper whose main strength is his use of the ball before improving the technical quality of the players ahead of him. We need defenders and midfielders who are technically better to maximise his strengths. His weaknesses are obvious but in a quality team, which we currently arent, theyd be far less important.
 
shabadu84 said:
It will be interesting to see how we adapt our play next season. His on the ball play has largely been great in flashes and ultimately the strength of that is supposed to mitigate his other weaknesses. If anything, ETH has him adapt more than the other way this season. Hopefully next season, whoever the manager is, we more deliberately shift to a possession based system and we see more of what he does best helps us score more goals.
Click to expand...
I keep hoping that and then we sign someone like Mason Mount.
 
ShinjiNinja26 said:
Tbf though, how many previous Utd keepers had to face 20+ shots every game?
Click to expand...

He faces an average of 5 shots on target per game out of that 20+.

Bearing in mind the mistakes he's made this season, if I was the opposition manager I'd be getting my forwards to shoot as much as possible.

Unfortunately for Onana, and us, there's always an error waiting just around the corner!
 
We do not need a new keeper now. Yes, he's a flawed keeper but his flaws would be masked with a better back line. What we need to do is to address more urgent priorities -- two CBs, a CDM and a striker at least -- and if Onana has another season like the one he just had then we can upgrade him next summer.
 
Cantonalegod said:
He faces an average of 5 shots on target per game out of that 20+.

Bearing in mind the mistakes he's made this season, if I was the opposition manager I'd be getting my forwards to shoot as much as possible.

Unfortunately for Onana, and us, there's always an error waiting just around the corner!
Click to expand...

He also has the highest save percentage in the league. He’s made quite a few mistakes no doubt, most of them coming in the CL but he’s been nowhere near as bad as some are making out. With what could be a limited budget for the summer window there’s far more pressing areas that need addressing before we spend a good chunk of the budget on another goalkeeper. I’d give him another season with hopefully a settled defence in front of him and see how things go, if he’s still making errors on a regular basis then shift him on next summer.
 
We need another keeper and Onana can stay and compete with them for the number one spot if he wishes. Or he can feck off. I don’t actually care.
 
Onana is the least of our problems. Our CL exit was destined anyway, and it saved us from embarrassing ourselves in the knockouts. He appears to have moved on from that episode. Apart from the occasional loss of concentration, he has redeemed himself well.
 
Not where we need to spend money this window. Give him one more year, hopefully behind a settled defence, and see how he comes on.
 
DRJosh said:
Onana is the least of our problems. Our CL exit was destined anyway, and it saved us from embarrassing ourselves in the knockouts. He appears to have moved on from that episode. Apart from the occasional loss of concentration, he has redeemed himself well.
Click to expand...

If you consider some of our top keepers in the past (Schmeichel & VDS), they were first "reliable" as a goalkeeper without multiple brain fart moments and then had other attributes that contributed to team's game play. You could argue the same about Ederson at City or Alisson at Liverpool who are two top goalkeepers of the previous decade. If Onana was a striker, no one would care. At GK (or defence), reliability is critical. Can Onana become more reliable?
 
I've grown to like Onana. Not saying he is going to end up one of the goalkeeping greats, still a lot to convince me. But, he has certainly grown on me.

Yes, some high profile mistakes in the Champions League cost us. Some other dodgy moments throughout season, including in Cup Final.

But, the media would certainly love you to believe Onana is rubbish, just as they like to focus on every other negative aspect of the club and explain how it is 100% negative, whereas anything that could be considered positive it not talked about.

I could probably analyse every other keeper in the PL to death, and show you many clips of them making mistakes and dodgy decisions. Some leading to goals, many not leading to goals, because they got away with it. Allison has made many errors over his Liverpool career. But, if the team is generally doing well, or just a lesser profile side (well, every team is lower profile), these mistakes are quickly forgotten. But, with Onana, all mistakes are remembered, so he can be added to the portfolio entitled "arguments to prove Man Utd are the worst club in the world"

Onana has faced a ridiculous number of shots this season, playing behind an unsettled defence. The shots he has faced are not all hit and hope shots, but include many glorious opportunities, where opponents run into the middle of the box and get a free shot from about 10 yards out. However, Onana's save percentage is higher than any other keeper in the league, who have played more than 10 games. Having heard him speak, I also have belief he is a very strong character, and he certainly has the potential to become a real important figure at Utd going forward.

Nothing is certain. But, Utd have much bigger problems to resolve in the playing department than Onana. It would be absurd to think Utd are going to spend a good bit of money to try and bring in another good goalkeeper, when Hojlund needs competition and support up front, we need to look at adding strength and character into that midfield and the defence is crying out for quality, robust players to come in.
 
ShinjiNinja26 said:
He also has the highest save percentage in the league.
Click to expand...
5th highest actually, Alisson, Pope, Kelleher, Areola then Onana/Pickford. Still well up there and not too much difference at the top. Interesting to see Kelleher there, wonder how he feels about being only a back-up. Only played 10 league matches so his stats might be a bit inflated, or not, but he does look good.
 
711 said:
5th highest actually, Alisson, Pope, Kelleher, Areola then Onana/Pickford. Still well up there and not too much difference at the top. Interesting to see Kelleher there, wonder how he feels about being only a back-up. Only played 10 league matches so his stats might be a bit inflated, or not, but he does look good.
Click to expand...
I'm not sure where the most reliable stats are found. But, in the site I found,

Allisson 73.4%
Pope 72.4% (though only played 15 games)
Kellehere 71.1% (played 10 games)
Areola 74.5%
Pickford 73.9%
Onana 74.9%

Agree with Kellehere, he does look a good goalkeeper. What really surprised me is that he is already 25 years old, and only made 15 league starts for Liverpool (and has been at Liverpool his entire career). Unless he is virtually guaranteed to take over Allison soon, surely he has got to look for a move to another PL club. Even on loan (I'm also surprised that he hasn't even been loaned out before)
 
711 said:
5th highest actually, Alisson, Pope, Kelleher, Areola then Onana/Pickford. Still well up there and not too much difference at the top. Interesting to see Kelleher there, wonder how he feels about being only a back-up. Only played 10 league matches so his stats might be a bit inflated, or not, but he does look good.
Click to expand...

Ah my bad, he’s top for most saves made, although hardly unexpected as he faces so many shots per game.
 
Swango1980 said:
I'm not sure where the most reliable stats are found. But, in the site I found,

Allisson 73.4%
Pope 72.4% (though only played 15 games)
Kellehere 71.1% (played 10 games)
Areola 74.5%
Pickford 73.9%
Onana 74.9%

Agree with Kellehere, he does look a good goalkeeper. What really surprised me is that he is already 25 years old, and only made 15 league starts for Liverpool (and has been at Liverpool his entire career). Unless he is virtually guaranteed to take over Allison soon, surely he has got to look for a move to another PL club. Even on loan (I'm also surprised that he hasn't even been loaned out before)
Click to expand...
I know what you mean about stats, I used OPTA stats obtained from membership of a fantasy football site, I'm reluctant copy and paste out of respect for the site.
 
bringbackbebe said:
If you consider some of our top keepers in the past (Schmeichel & VDS), they were first "reliable" as a goalkeeper without multiple brain fart moments and then had other attributes that contributed to team's game play. You could argue the same about Ederson at City or Alisson at Liverpool who are two top goalkeepers of the previous decade. If Onana was a striker, no one would care. At GK (or defence), reliability is critical. Can Onana become more reliable?
Click to expand...
Have you watched Schmeichel's last season? He made more errors than Onana.
 
How good is Lunin? Apparently he is unhappy at Real. Was looking at his stats on fbref and they are decidedly better than Onana but I dont watch La Liga so I dont really know how good he really is.
Maybe some of our Madrid fans can comment.
 
I'll give him one more season under a manager who is not ETH before discarding him. Im sure there is a GK there somewhere, even as a backup.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.