How has he done this last season?
Ander Herrera is a Manchester United Player!
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Started poorly but improved steadily as the season went on. Important to Athletic getting the CL spot. I guess one way of looking at it is that he's viewed as one of Barca's possible midfield signings.
I suppose the question of his playing position will come up again, he tends to play further forward than our beloved midfield 2. In terms of skills and temperament though, he looks like a classic box-to-box player to me.
A question, as when I've occasionally watched Bilbao I haven't paid much notice, but is that Iturraspe the better player? Just it was he that was selected for the Spanish World Cup preliminary squad, while Herrera was not. Any good?
I don't think we can be too choosy to be honest. We need a player in midfield that keeps possession, can pass, has some speed and stamina to go box to box and occasionally assist and chip in with a goal or two.. He fits the bill, I thought this over the two legs we played Bilbao a few years back and was really gutted we did not sign him last summer. I feel we would have had a much better season.
I watch La Liga most weeks and do not see a huge difference in him and Koke. Although I agree Koke is better and slightly more attack minded and that's why he has been picked for Spain squad.
The last four seasons they have scored (Koke first) 14/13 goals and 28/18 assists so not a huge gulf in quality considering A.Madrid are the better team.
I know we don't just sign players based on stats but when you look at our best midfielder over last 4 years, Carrick, he has 5 goals and 11 assists.
I don't think we will sign him to be honest but it is further proof that players are out there if we are willing to pay for them.
Agree with the Koke comparison, they are similar sort of players; box-to-box, diligent players who love a tackle and can really pick a pass.
I think his move here is done and dusted. We should move on. I don't see him much, but he does not really convince me, esp given that it will cost like 35m to get him here.
He is a very good player but more defensive than Herrera. With Koke, Fabregas, Iniesta, Xavi they have no need for another similar player.
Busquets, Martinez and Alonso were preferred for the defensive midfield role which meant Iturraspe missed out on final squad.
Thanks. Good enough to play for United?
That 40% thing just seems ridiculous. Why do players even want that in their contracts as presumably it's there to 'reward' them with a cut of the fee but all it does is put every fecker off ever bidding for them.
I think they both are but no doubt he would also have a buy out clause like Herrera so would not come cheap.
The press digging up this and the Guarin link shows they haven't a notion who we are chasing.
I don't understand the 40% part, what do you mean by that ?
And the clause is an obligation, asked by players syndicate ( if i'm not mistaking), it allows players in lower leagues to not be taken in hostages by their clubs.
Hmmm, I wondered why I hadn't noticed this one in AS. When I did a search the story came up as: http://futbol.as.com/futbol/2014/06/17/primera/1402977585_241930.html
In which AS say, "according to reports in the English press," we're asking about Herrera again. In other words the origin is presumably some English tabloid, and all The Mirror are doing is re-reporting the story.
AS do put the release clause numbers in their article €36m rising to €40m in July.
What do you mean by 40%?
Herrera does not have any clause that gets him piece of the fee. It's the other way around. His release clause is structured that way that he personally has to pay Athletic this 32M or smth. These clauses are mandatory in Spain and they are always legally constructed as a punitive damages for one-sided contract termination. So the player himself is always liable, not a club that wants to buy him. So if a club gives money to player to buy out his contract it creates tax problem. This money is accounted as income, so a player must pay income tax to the government, in the tune of 50%. So then 30M suddenly becomes 45M if you want to trigger a release clause without current club's content.
Most club though are not being pricks about it and if they get an offer that constitutes a release clause they just accept it as a transfer fee, so it's a transactions between two corporate entities and huge income tax is not involved. But spanish clubs are not legally bound to do so.
Spanish clubs don't pay 40% tax, even if they activate a release clause in the formal - go to Liga HQ and hand over the money - way.
Real Madrid did it last summer with Illarramendi and they had to pay the release clause + IVA (VAT) - money that as they are VAT registered they immediately reclaimed.
The situation is more complex for foreign clubs as they don't have the same legal standing to La Liga as a Liga member does. However Bayern established a significant precedent when they used the release clause process. They paid the release clause only, no additional taxes.
Good player and at the right age and stage in his development to make the step up club wise. He can play a variety of roles in midfield he is tenacious too which for me is important if you want to play cm in the Premiership. With Bilbao you either pay the player's release clause or way above the odds. He is one of the best options out there for us, but I doubt we are in for him.
I've talked about how Munich did it. That route is now pretty much closed.
As for spanish clubs, i don't know for sure if they can pay release clauses themselves. I doubt it, but it is possible. What i know for sure is, that Real actually reached an agreement with Sociedad. Because if they had activated the clause, there would be no VAT involved. You are mixing things a bit here. VAT is a tax on services rendered. Punitive damages are not services and release clause payouts are damages, so they are not subject to VAT. But transfers on the other hand are considered as "purchase of assets", so they are subject to VAT. Only of course club reclaims it as you said, because VAT paid by the final subscriber or final client. So VAT paid from tickets sold, shirts sold and so on. But if VAT was involved then it means that Sociedad accepted a release clause sum from Real as a transfer fee. I think had Sociedad declined it, Real would have had to pay much more. But as i've said actually accepting offers if they meet release clause sum is a normal business practice for most of the clubs. Athletic being and an exception though.
-------Stootman----
---Herrera-------
------------Barkley
Januzaj-------Mata
-------vanP--------
Shaw and rafa overlapping? Thats a serious team.
This transfer window,and next years success hinges on at least 3 midfielders who can cover each other floating all over the centre<obtainable targets>. A solid 6/8,and 2Creative deeper8/10.
Herrera will come good im sure of it.
Really hope we have a proper go at this fella.
---Herrera-------
------------Barkley
Januzaj-------Mata
-------vanP--------
Shaw and rafa overlapping? Thats a serious team.
This transfer window,and next years success hinges on at least 3 midfielders who can cover each other floating all over the centre<obtainable targets>. A solid 6/8,and 2Creative deeper8/10.
Herrera will come good im sure of it.
Really hope we have a proper go at this fella.
This is a team you made up. Hence why its good....
I don't think the Bayern route is that closed. There was a lot of talk about tax office pressure but that really related to them saying they would reject payment from Bayern. In an actual release clause action the cheque can pass through the LFP's hands, in effect becoming a payment from the LFP. The LFP however can be obliged to withhold some fraction of the payment for the tax man and certain other creditors.
The general principle agreed at that time though was that the LFP were willing to interpret the Spanish contract as a version of the FIFA model contract. That included the principle that a club could provide the funds directly to them for the release, with the player's approval but without it being treated as the player's income. It's untested in court of course, as so many of those things are.
You may be right about the Illarra, both clubs tried to keep the "paid the clause" Vs "exercised the clause" thing obscure. The deal took place at the LFP, that doesn't necessarily mean it was a forced release though.
And you're certainly right about release clause deals in general - the formal use of the LFP system is very rare. So rare that you need good lawyers and plenty of time.
You'd imagine, were we actually in for him, this would be the one kind of thing Woody should actually be good at.
Remember Jonathan Wilson saying this guy would be perfect for a LVG team, compared it to the role he had in Bielsa's Bilabao side....
I watched him with a keen eye last season, after our interest in him the previous summer, so I caught most of the games he played in.
He definitely grew into the season somewhat, although I do think the extent of his 'poor start' has been a bit overstated.
In almost all of his games he was played in the 'hole' but for me it isn't his best position as he doesn't score or assist enough and I think that position should be for a more attacking player. His link up play is very good though and he isn't afraid to attempt the risky pass. He's energetic which is something I feel our midfield needs and always wants to get stuck in.
I still like him and would be happy if we signed him. The links sound a bit tenuous though. After last time we know what we need to do to get him so of it genuinely in our plans it shouldn't be too hard or protracted.
He definitely grew into the season somewhat, although I do think the extent of his 'poor start' has been a bit overstated.
In almost all of his games he was played in the 'hole' but for me it isn't his best position as he doesn't score or assist enough and I think that position should be for a more attacking player. His link up play is very good though and he isn't afraid to attempt the risky pass. He's energetic which is something I feel our midfield needs and always wants to get stuck in.
I still like him and would be happy if we signed him. The links sound a bit tenuous though. After last time we know what we need to do to get him so of it genuinely in our plans it shouldn't be too hard or protracted.
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Get him. We obviously are not going to get a top, top midifielder. Anders is still very good and will improve us vastly. Extra we pay in transfer fee can be compensated in lower wages he'd get compared to a Kroos or Fabregas.
http://www.mercafutbol.com/ander-herrera-continuara-en-el-athletic/
His agent says that yes, they've heard rumours about bids that were supposed to be happening, but no one has bid and no one's been talking to him about a bid.
"Ander is fully focused on Athletic - he's very excited about playing in the Champions League with them."
His agent says that yes, they've heard rumours about bids that were supposed to be happening, but no one has bid and no one's been talking to him about a bid.
"Ander is fully focused on Athletic - he's very excited about playing in the Champions League with them."
Bumped for this? You dream crusher.
Shame.. Him and Strootman would have made for a brilliant summer if possible..
Summer 2013 all over again.
Players that thrived under Bielsa would presumably adapt quickly to Van Gaal as well. Herrera has all the attributes that we are looking for so if worst comes to worst and we can't get any of our top midfield targets I would be happy if we just paid his release clause and brought him here.
After seeing Holland play I'm more convinced than ever that James McCarthy would be perfect for us but I really can't see that one happen.
After seeing Holland play I'm more convinced than ever that James McCarthy would be perfect for us but I really can't see that one happen.
Not again. I presonally think this guy is just not worth the trouble. We won't get him. Not unless we pay not even just a release clause, but this clause with a hefty premium. Like we did for Fellaini, which would mean like a 37-38M transfer. I would rather go for portuguese Carvalho.
Do we still like him or is he shit now ?
Spanish radio station Cadena Ser say the signing of Herrera will be announced in a matter of hours. No idea if reliable.
The fuk ?
Thought it might worth a new thread
Here's some tweets from the Twitter thread
Here's some tweets from the Twitter thread
Can't see a transfer this big getting this far without it being reported elsewhere. Call stinky bullshit on this one.
The British press surely would have jumped all over this by now
Hope there's truth to it, throw a bit more at 'em for Iturraspe aswell.
Would be very surprised if that were true. I don't think it is.
Better than nothing.
Translation: The Aragonese @anderherrera8 road @ManUtd luck champion! You will always have a place in the @RealZaragoza
A former club of Herrea's have wished him luck at Utd
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