We have 6 players for 3 berths. Finding the right combination To start with the right back up appears to be a conundrum
A serious look at Mauricio Pochettino
- Thread starter NotBrendanRodgers honest
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You were lucky to beat Ajax IMO because you lost in the first leg and and were 2-0 down in the second leg and if it wasn't for Ten Hag's naivety you would've been out because he carried on sacrificing defensive stability for goals.
The Champions League final was won comfortably by Liverpool. Whether both teams were tired after a long season is irrelevant.
Whether Davies is good enough or shouldn't be making disparaging comments about his former coach is irrelevant to the discussion. The fact is that he's made the comment which I felt needed discussing considering he (Davies) was a player that was coached by Poch.
Ok, agree to disagree then, we're clearly not going to see eye to eye here. I don't see how a team that has more possession, shots, shots on target, Xg and actual goals scored can be lucky to win but there we go. The goals are equally as valid whether scored in the 1st minute or last and football fans have a tendency to see last minute goal scored as somehow lucky.
Mourinho is clearly a better coach than Poch, especially if you're talking about one-off situations and past CV. Whether he'll have the same level of success as Poch at Spurs (or more than him) is still to be seen.
I'm not denying VdB's ability I would have him starting ahead of Pogba (who I do rate) as his form and fitness seem shot to pieces. Thing is VdB doesnt seem to be given a fair shot to establish himself for whatever reason.
I don't look at games like that because for me stats are interesting to observe but I never form my views on a game over stats and even your current manager agrees with me below. But for me Ajax were 3-0 up and they kept on sacrificing defensive stability which gave Spurs the opportunity to get back into the game.
I hope you're right mate and I hope if we do appoint him he proves me wrong and wins us titles.
I think Poch really wants the job, and he deserves a chance to manage a big club. He could be the one that brings us back to the top IF backed. 3/4 players could make the difference to get us there, and he is one that gives young players a chance also.
Fair enough. It can go both ways though, as we, and our current, found out recently as we were coasting into the 80th minute with a 3 goal lead against West Ham!
We'll see. Not sure I see Man Utd going for Poch anyway. As I said, as time went on, as much as I loved him, I saw us fall short a frustrating number of times in the biggest games. But if he does make the move, perhaps Poch makes that final leap at Man Utd. If he does go there, I wish him the best of luck (when he's not playing us of course).
That's fair enough mate..Fair enough. It can go both ways though, as we, and our current, found out recently as we were coasting into the 80th minute with a 3 goal lead against West Ham!
We'll see. Not sure I see Man Utd going for Poch anyway. As I said, as time went on, as much as I loved him, I saw us fall short a frustrating number of times in the biggest games. But if he does make the move, perhaps Poch makes that final leap at Man Utd. If he does go there, I wish him the best of luck (when he's not playing us of course).
I think VdB was bought by Woodward and Ole didn't want him. He wanted Grealish..
It was reported that Ole wanted both Haaland and Grealish. Haaland didn't happen because it was reported that he wanted a buyout clause in his contract and felt Solskjaer may not last long as United manager so chose BVB who are a enticing development school in European football for young players and play Champions League football regularly. So it makes sense signing someone like Cavani on a short team deal rather than panicking and signing someone for big money because they're the best available option.
Grealish he wanted too but it didn't make sense why he wanted him when we don't have a good enough DM or CB to help us play a more expansive game and transition play to a better level than we're currently seeing. It was also reported by journos close to Villa that Villa weren't gonna budge on their £80m price tag if they stayed up. So it's understandable that VdB was signed for less than half the price in the covid market and it was done with the blessing of Solskjaer.
The only problem I have had with our board post Fergie is that they've been naive in giving too much control to managers which has seen us go through a cull of the team with each new appointment and stability and continuity has been non existent.
All it'll take IMHO is a coach to come in and add a DM and CB to the current squad with the right attributes which would allow us to play a more expansive game which I don't believe we can do right now to the required standard against good teams.
19th November is when Spurs sacked him. So a few more weeks and he will be looking for work again, if the 12-month no-compete clause is true. It's no coincidence he's popped up on MNF now.
To be fair to him, while I strongly dislike the guy, Mourinho is one of the best tactical minds in all of football history. You only need to listen to his analysis when he was doing his punditry to understand as such. I think where he fails these days is being able to translate his ideas onto the field, but I don't doubt that his understanding of the game is above probably any coach in world football right now.
Being tactically inferior to Mourinho is nothing to be ashamed of, especially when what you see on the field from Poch is better IMO.
VdB said himself that the deciding factor of him coming here was Ole persuading him. So I don't think it's a Woody signing.
Yet when you look at Pochs record against the big clubs, his tactical game is clearly his biggest weakness. If you feel frustrated with Oles tactics, prepare for a new tier of annoyance with Poch. He's the wrong Manager for us imo.
I know everyone loves Poch on here, but his league points per game is almost identical to Ole. He'll just destroy the players fitness with his tactics, something he did on a regular basis at Tottenham and that was before the ridiculous current schedule.
Mourinho's analysis on Sky was truely educational and I thorougly enjoyed it. He was on a completely different level to the rest that appear on there. And i'm someone that was a big critic of his during his time here but I have to admit his break down of a football match from a tactical POV was amazing for a tactics geek like myself.
Yep. I genuinely hope when he calls it a day from management that he goes into the football analysis gig full time. He is on another planet to anyone really that you usually see on there.
About 2 years ago Poch was the only available manager I wanted then after what happened during his final months at Tottenham I had my doubts. However looking around at what is available at the time I'm 100 % with @Amadaeus on this.
Poch is the man. I don't think he would make us title conteders anytime soon, can't really see anyone doing that under the glazers but Poch would imo bring the stability that's needed. However I am certain he's going to end up elsewhere and we'll be stuck with Ole and then once Ole inevitably goes we'll hire some rubbish replacement.
Poch is the man. I don't think he would make us title conteders anytime soon, can't really see anyone doing that under the glazers but Poch would imo bring the stability that's needed. However I am certain he's going to end up elsewhere and we'll be stuck with Ole and then once Ole inevitably goes we'll hire some rubbish replacement.
I like Ole but feel like this maybe one of the few opportunities we will have over the coming years to get a potentially world class coach. Of couse hiring him doesnt guarantee success but coaches like Bielsa, Poch, Klopp are a rare breed and we have to put emotions aside and do what is the right thing for the club.
Describing Poch as potentially world class seems a stretch to me, but maybe he is, but is his style of football actually what we want going forward?
Only one who says world class is prob @Amadaeus but there's no denying he did a very solid job at both Totteham and Southampton. My issue is the obvious which is that at Tottenham he layed a very good foundation, built a solid team with class players but with our owners and structure he would probably struggle so thats my worry.
Imo he's without a doubt a better manager than Ole though and that's why I would rather have him and back him. Can't see Ole ever doing what Poch did at Spurs and while in the end Poch ultimately failed to win anything I still believe he would have done much better if he was backed like all the other top managers.
The repeated shit performances that we see under Ole time and time again outweighs the positives for me and he's been here long enough now to find some consistency but can't even find an ounce of it. It's the same one step forward 3 steps back pattern thats repeating all the time with him. Alarming how many games under him we've played so bad let alone the results.
Poch is comfortably a better manager than Ole, clearly, he will make us consistent again, big plus, probably get us winning the games we should regularly, but that's the bare minimum with the players we have, they're good enough to be doing better than what they're currently showing. I just can't shift the feeling he'd be out in a few years because he's not got us to that very next level.
Ole Hasenhüttl Nagelsman Poch Rose Ten Hag Brendan Rodgers. Give all these managers quality players that fit their system, which of them do you think will win the league?
I’d take Rose first over the others. Not that he’d leave this season though
He bought Son and Moura, and Kane maintains that Poch was the one that brought him on.
Defensively Spurs looked good with Toby.
Whatever you feel about him, his teams have been excellent to watch
Its funny how HE bought all the players that worked and Levy bought ALL the players that were shite.
Poch is a good coach but he will not change things over night, his first season with us was pretty bad and he was comparable to AVB. Given time he will certainly improve you but will he win your masses of silverwear, I honestly don't think so.
I’ve no idea about Levy, all I saw is what the players offered under him. If Levy bought them then brilliant but Poch had to work with them.
Ignoring all his other negatives, what kind of mentality is it that the manager and his players checks out just because they lost a CL final? So he does well as long as he exceeds expectations but when there’s a major disappointment like the CL final he is lost? I didn’t see Sir Alex, Simeone or Klopp having disastrous league campaigns after losing CL finals. Neither did anyone at United give up after losing the title to City in the last seconds on goal difference.
Maybe none of the coaches mentioned would win the league. But with the exception of Poch the rest would at the very least implement a attacking brand of football with the evidence at hand.
We need someone with a attacking philosophy that will start on the training ground and manifest itself on match days. When was the last time we played a big club and played front foot football against them? The last time I remember us playing front foot football against a big club was under LVG even if it was a short lived experience.
What else was he going to say?
I’m joining Utd for Only the money As I don’t rate Ole
How come?
This is always such a shit take
Poster : "What else is he going to say?"(proceeds to give the most extreme example. As if humans are only allowed to go from one extreme to the other when they speak).
There are thousands of things he could have said
I don't think it's that damning. They probably talked up the CL final as a once in a lifetime opportunity for Spurs and most of the players, everyone knew it was their peak, several players wanted out afterwards, other players got on in age. I think it's pretty normal to the squad to have some motivational issues after that. I mean what were they playing for at that point? "Come on guys, we just lost the CL final, now let's win that 4th place trophy"? They had clearly come to the end of their circle and probably would have needed a much bigger squad overhaul than they got. Poch made it into his 6th year, that's twice as long as Mourinho's usual life span, or Guardiola's jobs thus far. It's not like you can blame him for burning out quickly.
Oh and after Bayern lost their CL final under van Gaal they were 7th 10 games into their following season, 10 points behind the top spot. Inter completely fell apart after winning that final, too.
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I would assume due to Rose's belief/ability to implement a attacking brand of football but he's also shown that he can get results playing against big clubs like Bayern, Real Madrid and Inter even if he is handicapped by the lack of quality at his disposal compared to those teams.
Agree with this, I don't want Pochettino because even though he will probably do better than Ole he doesn't have a set attacking philosophy that I think we need to take the team to the next level.
I think we need to look at someone like Rose or Ten Hag. I am not really bothered about an immediate title challenge as I am with football style and incremental progression because I think with those two we can establish ourselves in the top 4 which would place us in a position to challenge for the title with one mega signing e.g adding someone like Haaland like Fergie did with RVP.
LVG is hardly a good example, he was sacked that season and Bayern was his last successful job. It is widely expected now that he was well past it when he came to United.
Also a CL final is always hyped up and if Poch comes to United then of course for the club it won’t be for the first time they would reach a CL final, but for our current players it would and with Poch not having won anything so far the situations would be comparable. There will be many disappointments at United still before we might reach the top again and if our manager can’t deal with those disappointments, we’ll then our current players definitely won’t.
Only my observation mind, but I’ve been watching him for a few years now. I was impressed with the team ethic at Salzburg as well as the tactical approach.
If we are to get away from the ‘superstar ‘ coach and the home grown coach then he’d be the first.
I meant more that a lot of signings made under Poch were fecking terrible.
Van Gaal was still good enough to win the double and make the CL final in the previous season. Did he suddenly become well past it between his two seasons at Bayern?
United has an entirely different dynamic than Spurs. If they experience a setback they can always spend loads in the summer and come back stronger. Like Liverpool, who bought Alisson, Keita and Fabinho after their lost final. It's "easy" to convince people to give it their best shot again, when you sign a bunch of top players to improve on the team's weaknesses. For Spurs it was different, they probably knew that they wouldn't get a shot at a big trophy anytime soon. And I find it a bit bizarre anyway to reject a coach, because he might not deal well with losing a CL final, when the club hasn't been anywhere close to one in about a decade now.
Honestly I couldn’t disagree more.
CL final was just an example. Spurs weren’t expected to reach one either.
LVG’s last few years as a manager is not a good example for me as he is actually a manager who failed at United (not because of his mentality, but rather because he was past it and our board isn’t very good).
With Poch there are already many question marks and then there’s the issue with his last season at Spurs.
At United he might get better resources, but he will also get much more pressure and might actually get a worse board to work with than he had at Spurs.
If he is not strong enough and has the right mentality to deal with setbacks he will be out of United much sooner than our previous managers.
He’s just after joining a new Club he’s obviously going to mention how he’s looking forward to working with manager .