‘Successful’ scenarios for Summer ‘23

[Jericholyte2]

So, we all see the great improvement ETH has made to us over the case of this last 6/7 months, but we need a good summer to push on forwards.

I was going to put a specific scenario in the title but thought I’d make it more general: what would you consider to be a ‘successful’ Summer ‘23?

For example if we brought in FDJ & Osimhen as our only signings, with more outgoings, would you consider that to be a successful summer window?

As above:
In: FDJ & Osimhen
Out: Jones, Bailly, Telles, McT, Martial

Success?

 

[ArbeitervonWien]

Is this a genuine question? Getting de Jong and Oshimen would be a wet dream of a window. It would make us instantly favorites in every competition we play in.

 

[bosnian_red]

This is what I'd see as a "perfect" summer where we address pretty much everything and have a good set up now, good depth, and good transition plans for aging players.

• Starting striker - Osimhen/Kane
• New goalkeeper - Diogo Costa
• New starting CM - Frenkie/Bennacer
• Backup DM (young) - Lavia
• Backup CB (young) - Bella Kotchap/Scalvini/Ahmedhodzic

Outgoings would be:

• Henderson
• De Gea (or stay 1 more season on a fraction of his previous wages and not first choice anymore)
• Bailly
• Telles
• Tuanzebe
• Williams
• Jones
• Maguire
• McTominay
• Van de Beek
• Greenwood
• Elanga
• Butland loan over
• Sabitzer loan over
• Weghorst loan over

Squad:
Diogo Costa, De Gea, Heaton
Dalot, Wan Bissaka
Varane, Martinez, Lindelof, Bella Kotchap
Shaw, Malacia
Casemiro, Lavia
Frenkie, Fred
Bruno, Eriksen
Antony, Sancho
Rashford, Garnacho
Osimhen, Martial

Pellistri, Amad, Hannibal, Mainoo either part of the squad as deep depth or loaned out.

Just a "good enough" summer where I think we can push on for a title challenge would be Osimhen, replacing McTominay with a proper young DM, and replacing Maguire with someone who fits that role better (not a problem of Maguire's quality as 4th CB, more it's just not good for the morale of the squad to have him there like that). New starting goalkeeper and starting CM are the 2 next big things after striker but we can make do and probably can challenge with Eriksen and De Gea starting and Fred/Lavia and then someone like Mainoo or just signing Sabitzer as the midfield depth.

 

[SAFMUTD]

First new owners.

A top striker (Kane or Osimhen) and a back up striker, 2 quality midfielders.

Out Maguire, Martial, McTominay, Tuanzebe, Jones, Alex Telles, Bailly, Elanga, Brandon Williams, VdB.

 

[KiD MoYeS]

Sabitzer and Weghorst should be signed. Martial and one of Maguire or Lindelof should be sold. We might need to sell prospects like Amad and Pellestri, simply because they're more likely to attract buyers than some others. It will be a pain shifting Bailly and Telles. Henderson should attract a buyer somewhere. McTominay I'm not sure, we still had to bring him on the cup final on Sunday so I'm undecided on whether we can afford to offload him, squad wise. Obviously a goalscorer should be the priority for any incoming transfers.

 

[BuzzKillington]

This is what I'd see as a "perfect" summer where we address pretty much everything and have a good set up now, good depth, and good transition plans for aging players.

• Starting striker - Osimhen/Kane
• New goalkeeper - Diogo Costa
• New starting CM - Frenkie/Bennacer
• Backup DM (young) - Lavia
• Backup CB (young) - Bella Kotchap/Scalvini/Ahmedhodzic

Outgoings would be:

• Henderson
• De Gea (or stay 1 more season on a fraction of his previous wages and not first choice anymore)
• Bailly
• Telles
• Tuanzebe
• Williams
• Jones
• Maguire
• McTominay
• Van de Beek
• Greenwood
• Elanga
• Butland loan over
• Sabitzer loan over
• Weghorst loan over

Squad:
Diogo Costa, De Gea, Heaton
Dalot, Wan Bissaka
Varane, Martinez, Lindelof, Bella Kotchap
Shaw, Malacia
Casemiro, Lavia
Frenkie, Fred
Bruno, Eriksen
Antony, Sancho
Rashford, Garnacho
Osimhen, Martial

Pellistri, Amad, Hannibal, Mainoo either part of the squad as deep depth or loaned out.

Just a "good enough" summer where I think we can push on for a title challenge would be Osimhen, replacing McTominay with a proper young DM, and replacing Maguire with someone who fits that role better (not a problem of Maguire's quality as 4th CB, more it's just not good for the morale of the squad to have him there like that). New starting goalkeeper and starting CM are the 2 next big things after striker but we can make do and probably can challenge with Eriksen and De Gea starting and Fred/Lavia and then someone like Mainoo or just signing Sabitzer as the midfield depth.

You’ve only got 5 homegrown players in your squad. Which is the problem when most people submit these fantasy summer lineups.

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

New Wealth Owners, end of story

 

[bosnian_red]

You’ve only got 5 homegrown players in your squad. Which is the problem when most people submit these fantasy summer lineups.

What's the rule, 4 United homegrown and 8 within England and homegrown means 3 years before 21?
United: Heaton, Rashford, Garnacho possibly?, Amad in January 2024?, Mainoo, Hannibal... possibly Martial? Other youth players.
England: Wan Bissaka, Shaw, Lavia, Sancho

So that is definitely 4 outside United, 4 definite within United without counting other randoms we could register, and then probably another 3 that would qualify right away or very soon.

 

[CM]

You’ve only got 5 homegrown players in your squad. Which is the problem when most people submit these fantasy summer lineups.

Username checks out

 

[Traub]

New Wealth Owners, end of story

NWO, brother

 

[BuzzKillington]

What's the rule, 4 United homegrown and 8 within England and homegrown means 3 years before 21?
United: Heaton, Rashford, Garnacho possibly?, Amad in January 2024?, Mainoo, Hannibal... possibly Martial? Other youth players.
England: Wan Bissaka, Shaw, Lavia, Sancho

So that is definitely 4 outside United, 4 definite within United without counting other randoms we could register, and then probably another 3 that would qualify right away or very soon.

8 homegrown players. 21 or over of a squad of 25. Can be any nationality as long as they’ve been registered with an EFL club for 3 years prior to turning 21, or at the end of the season they turn 21.

Can have as many youth players as you want on top of the 25 but they don’t count towards the HG quota.

The issue is you clearing out all the British players and replacing them with foreign players of questionable ability. Lavia, Bella-Kotchap etc.

 

[Scandi Red]

A solid center forward, please! Kane, Osimhen or someone else around this level. I don't care if that's the only incoming player as this is the most pressing matter by far.

The next priority would be a central midfielder to play alongside Casemiro. Sabitzer might prove to be the solution here. Too early to say.

Finally, we should definitely offload some players. Henderson, Maguire, Martial and at least one out McTominay and Van De Beek.

 

[Ali Dia]

This is what I'd see as a "perfect" summer where we address pretty much everything and have a good set up now, good depth, and good transition plans for aging players.

• Starting striker - Osimhen/Kane
• New goalkeeper - Diogo Costa
• New starting CM - Frenkie/Bennacer
• Backup DM (young) - Lavia
• Backup CB (young) - Bella Kotchap/Scalvini/Ahmedhodzic

Outgoings would be:

• Henderson
• De Gea (or stay 1 more season on a fraction of his previous wages and not first choice anymore)
• Bailly
• Telles
• Tuanzebe
• Williams
• Jones
• Maguire
• McTominay
• Van de Beek
• Greenwood
• Elanga
• But land loan over
• Sabitzer loan over
• Weghorst loan over

Squad:
Diogo Costa, De Gea, Heaton
Dalot, Wan Bissaka
Varane, Martinez, Lindelof, Bella Kotchap
Shaw, Malacia
Casemiro, Lavia
Frenkie, Fred
Bruno, Eriksen
Antony, Sancho
Rashford, Garnacho
Osimhen, Martial

Pellistri, Amad, Hannibal, Mainoo either part of the squad as deep depth or loaned out.

Just a "good enough" summer where I think we can push on for a title challenge would be Osimhen, replacing McTominay with a proper young DM, and replacing Maguire with someone who fits that role better (not a problem of Maguire's quality as 4th CB, more it's just not good for the morale of the squad to have him there like that). New starting goalkeeper and starting CM are the 2 next big things after striker but we can make do and probably can challenge with Eriksen and De Gea starting and Fred/Lavia and then someone like Mainoo or just signing Sabitzer as the midfield depth.

Good post. I agree with all of this. We should be able to recoup a nice bit of money for those players who aren’t getting a look in this season. They aren’t good enough to come back and really challenge to get into this group. Greenwood is more than good enough but obviously it’s a huge call whatever happens there.

 

[bosnian_red]

8 homegrown players. 21 or over of a squad of 25. Can be any nationality as long as they’ve been registered with an EFL league for 3 years prior to turning 21. Can have as many youth players as you want on top of the 25 but they don’t count towards the HG quota. The issue is you clearing out all the British players and replacing them with foreign players of questionable ability. Latvia, Bella-Kotchap etc.

They don't have to be 21 or over. Just need to qualify as homegrown... so we'd tick that box. Alternatively if you have only 7 home grown, you can only register 24 players. But if the player is under 21, then it doesn't matter as they don't need to be registered anyway. So yeah, not an issue. We have plenty.

 

[BuzzKillington]

Username checks out

I’m just saying be realistic about what we can do in the summer and the reasons why we hang onto players like McTominay and Elanga. A 4th choice midfielder and winger.

Given what we’d need to spend to replace them on a like for like basis, with what we sell players for, against what we pay for players from the prem (for the squad roles they fulfill and the quota they satisfy) it doesn’t make sense to get rid. Grow our own players from the academy then replaces them when we can. Which is kind of the point of the rule.

 

[BuzzKillington]

They don't have to be 21 or over. Just need to qualify as homegrown... so we'd tick that box. Alternatively if you have only 7 home grown, you can only register 24 players. But if the player is under 21, then it doesn't matter as they don't need to be registered anyway. So yeah, not an issue. We have plenty.

I may be interpreting it differently to you but here is the rule

Homegrown rule

 

[JakeC]

If Mctominay is happy to be a Nicky butt type player, we'd be mad to sell him.

Maguire will go, so will Henderson, Telles, Williams, and Elanga unless Pelistri goes on loan again.

Goalkeeper wise we need to be smart. Getting rid of de gea would be suicide. A clear progression plan with a younger goalkeeper is the best bet.

We need a striker.

 

[Lash]

Successful is really just adding 2 players to this squad if no one leaves. Weghorst replacement and another midfielder.

After that, it entirely depends who leaves.

 

[Back To Madeira]

NWO, brother

Vince to sell WWE and buy United?

 

[Ole'sattheWheel]

Kane
Sabitzer on a permo or an equivalent signing.
FDJ type midfielder to rotate with eriksen
CB depth signing
Bring back Amad

sell:
Martial
Elanga
Maguire
Donny

 

[bosnian_red]

I may be interpreting it differently to you but here is the rule

Homegrown rule

Basically: max 17 players who are not homegrown, but not counting u21 players. So yeah that's fine. We'd have like 14 or 15. That's never been an actual concern with United as we don't hoard players like Chelsea and have a good chunk of our squad as homegrown always.

 

[CM]

I’m just saying be realistic about what we can do in the summer and the reasons why we hang onto players like McTominay and Elanga. A 4th choice midfielder and winger.

Given what we’d need to spend to replace them on a like for like basis, with what we sell players for, against what we pay for players from the prem (for the squad roles they fulfill and the quota they satisfy) it doesn’t make sense to get rid. Grow our own players from the academy then replaces them when we can. Which is kind of the point of the rule.

Only messing fella. It's a fair point but an annoying rule, players like McTominay shouldn't really be hanging on beyond the summer.

 

[RuudTom83]

It’s incredibly hard to move players out.

You could see a few clubs in the mid-to-lower part of the table asking about Maguire/McTom, but I have doubts if they would be tempted to leave a winning team.

 

[AshRK]

Sell
Maguire
Bailly
Van de Beek
Henderson
Telles
Pellestri
Elanga (loan)
Mctominay ( I personally would keep him)

Buy
De jong( he would be my dream signing)
Striker
Sabitzer
Weghorst (squad option)
LCB

I think we can seriously get close to £100m in our sales and can spend close to £200m on the above buy. Our net spend will just be £100m

 

[justsomebloke]

It's really all about the funding, how that looks. We have lots of issues, some small some big, which can nearly all of them be solved in a big way or a small way. The need for a new striker is really the only one where it's a given that a major investment in a major player has to be made.

Otherwise;

Midfield: We urgently need a credible backup for Casemiro, and we also need an 8 with a creative impact who's good enough that Eriksen doesn't need to play so much. Lots of ways to solve that - including signing a single player who can fill both of those needs. It doesn't have to be Frenkie de Jong and a top young defensive midfielder for 160 million.

In defence, I think both the club and Maguire want and need a move out, which means we need another defender - unless ETH is comfortable bringing Williams or Laird or some other youngster into a significant playing time status. With the positional versatility Shaw, Martinez and Dalot have, it doesn't necessarily have to be a CB. If we end the season without anyone (realistically, Dalot) proving themselves a viable No 1 option at RB, it would seem likely that would be the focus.

The potentially biggest mess is the keeper position, where options range from just extending or re-signing De Gea, loaning Henderson out again and getting in a backup on loan all the way to selling Henderson, letting De Gea walk and signing two new GKs. Which you'd have to think would come in at well above 50m.

All in all - 100m or so for a striker is a given, beyond that it's anything from 2 to 5 new signings (at least one CM, and at least one GK, possibly on loan). Which might cost not much more than we make on sales, if we do the minimum version. But the maximum version would be an overall cost of 300-350 million, and it would be well justified too.

 

[Bondi77]

Another transfer thread and it is the first of March....Jesus wept!!

 

[JanK]

Don't know what's the exact situation with De Jong - was it because Barcelona forced us to pay the pay cut gap which was forced to him? Or didn't he truly want to join? I guess he sees what is going on right now within our squad and might change his mind, because... why not?

Osimhen is a tricky one. He'd cost way too much and might not perform, I think it's a bit too much of a gamble, although he'd be amazing signing.

I'd like to see Sabitzer and Weghorst in the team for squad depth or adding just options for tactical tweaks. They seem to be very professional-minded and have the grit to perform, giving a lot on the pitch.

 

[tenpoless]

Focus on the next game heh

 

[Mike Smalling]

In: Two midfielders (one of them could be Sabitzer) and a striker
Out: Maguire, Telles, Jones, Elanga, van de Beek

 

[Anthony Gropetis]

Easier said than done. Very difficult to sell fringe players without practically giving them away and possibly paying a percentage of their wage for the new club. Especially when some of those players won't even go on loan to promote themselves.
This is where the difference between super wealthy owners and the Glazers becomes more apparent. The former would do this cull.
I find it incredible that some players at the club would not go on loan over the last few seasons. In other words I am surprised some players don't care about their career or ambitions if their immediate wage is really high.

 

[PigeonEscobar]

Its a bit weird but at no point as a Manchester United supporter was I less interested in having an opinion about potential transfers as I do now.
Erik’s transfers and decision making have been outstanding thus far and eclipsed all my expectations, don’t see any reason for that to change.

If ETH thinks we don’t need to sign a midfielder because Mainoo or Hannibal are ready, then so be it.
If ETH think that we should buy half of the Ajax team in the summer, then I’m all for it.
If ETH wants to bring Titus Bramble out of retirement and play him as a target man no.9 I won’t even question it and will be convinced he has a plan.

 

[Jacob]

Outgoings (19) - 65M:

Maguire (30M)
Van de Beek (20M)
Martial (15M)
Tuanzebe (free)
Telles (free)
Henderson (free)
Williams (free)
Bailly (free)
Jones (free)
Greenwood (free)
Butland (free)
Weghorst (loan expiry)
Sabitzer (loan expiry)
Elanga (loan)
Pellistri (loan)
Hannibal (loan)
Iqbal (loan)
Shoretire (loan)
A. Fernandez (loan)

Incomers (6) - 310M:

Bellingham (150M)
Diogo Costa (60M)
Toney (40M)
Goncalo Ramos (60M)
Sabitzer (free)
Amad (loan expiry)

Squad (26):

GK: Costa, DDG, Heaton
RB: Dalot, AWB
CB: Varane, Lindelöf
CB: Martinez, Mengi
LB: Shaw, Malacia
DM: Casemiro, Fred, McTominay
CM: Bellingham, Eriksen, Bruno, Sabitzer, Mainoo
RW: Antony, Sancho, Amad
LW: Rashford, Garnacho
ST: Toney, Ramos

Net spend: 245M

 

[bringbackbebe]

In:
1) World class CF - 100m
2) Young & upcoming forward - 60m
3) A deep central midfielder in place of McTominay who can defend (also called FDJ) - 80m
4) Young backup CB - 40m
5) Renew De Gea

Total In: 280m

Out:
1) Henderson (15m)
2) Telles (5m)
3) Bailly, Jones (0m)
4) VDB (10m)
5) Maguire (30m)
6) Amad (20m)
7) Pellistri (15m)
8) Hannibal (15m)
9) Iqbal (10m)
10) Savage (5m)
11) Elanga (20m)
12) Williams, Tuanzebe (5m total?)
13) Laird - 10m (with buy back option)
14) McTominay (30m)

Total Out: 180m

Net: 100m

I can see people shouting "oh, you're selling our best young talent" but let's be honest - if they can't get game time, we might as well move them on quickly rather than let them rot in the bench and depreciate. All of the above players have barely added value. Mainoo looks to be the only one inline for any game time.

I'm also not commenting on Greenwood for the time being & adding my bias to it till club's position is sorted out.

 

[Floyd]

So, we all see the great improvement ETH has made to us over the case of this last 6/7 months, but we need a good summer to push on forwards.

I was going to put a specific scenario in the title but thought I’d make it more general: what would you consider to be a ‘successful’ Summer ‘23?

For example if we brought in FDJ & Osimhen as our only signings, with more outgoings, would you consider that to be a successful summer window?

As above:
In: FDJ & Osimhen
Out: Jones, Bailly, Telles, McT, Martial

Success?

Erm...... hell yeah.

 

[captaincantona]

I did think we needed a RB but I actually now think that in Dalot and AWB we have a great combo - depending on the team we face, both have excellent qualities.

While I think we need two midfielders I don’t think we need a DeJong or Bellingham as they have the potential to upset the balance of what we have created so far and Realistically, we ain’t paying big money for Rice or Caicedo either as they won’t be happy as bench options for Casemiro.

As a back up for Casemiro we should be looking at Koopmeiners. Improving year on year, not of a profile that would demand a starting slot every week, part of a good Atalanta team, won’t cost the world and is Dutch so you know ETH will have had looked at him before at some point.

As a McT replacement - Sabitzer. The guy is just quality. Makes the “adaptation” arguement made for some players look like complete bullshit.

Striker - Weghorst has shown the importance of a hard working striker, we just need to add the goals. In that regard Osimhen is the dream…if not …Gonçalo Ramos who also presses well by all accounts and looks so eager anytime I’ve watched him. Both would bring additional goals and fit with our style of play.

our midfield next season:
Casemiro
Fred
Koopmeiners
Sabitzer
Eriksen
Hannibal
Mainoo

Our options including at number 10:
Rashford
Sancho
Antony
Garnacho
Bruno
Amad
Martial
Osimhen/Ramos
(Pellistri)

Sell - Elanga/Tuanzebe/Telles/Bailly/Williams/VDB/Maguire

 

[Floyd]

Out:
1) Henderson (15m)
2) Telles (5m)
3) Bailly, Jones (0m)
4) VDB (10m)
5) Maguire (30m)
6) Amad (20m)
7) Pellistri (15m)
8) Hannibal (15m)
9) Iqbal (10m)
10) Savage (5m)
11) Elanga (20m)
12) Williams, Tuanzebe (5m total?)
13) Laird - 10m (with buy back option)

Getting rid of 15 players? That won't happen, never does.

And for what it's worth, I'm not giving up on Amad Diallo, he needs a PL loan next season.

 

[bringbackbebe]

Getting rid of 15 players? That won't happen, never does.

And for what it's worth, I'm not giving up on Amad Diallo, he needs a PL loan next season.

I edited my post to add 1 more (McTominay) - so that makes it 16

Unless we're looking to win the U21 league, if a young player doesn't look like making it, he most likely won't make it. There is no point keeping him hoping he will be brilliant one day (may happen but most likely won't). None of the outgoing players have added much to the current season, and IMHO, can be compensated by adding better incoming players.

 

[harms]

As above:
In: FDJ & Osimhen
Out: Jones, Bailly, Telles, McT, Martial

Success?

That would be a fantastic window, really, even though it’s probably better to keep Martial as a back up in that scenario.

 

[Josh 76]

So, we all see the great improvement ETH has made to us over the case of this last 6/7 months, but we need a good summer to push on forwards.

I was going to put a specific scenario in the title but thought I’d make it more general: what would you consider to be a ‘successful’ Summer ‘23?

For example if we brought in FDJ & Osimhen as our only signings, with more outgoings, would you consider that to be a successful summer window?

As above:
In: FDJ & Osimhen
Out: Jones, Bailly, Telles, McT, Martial

Success?

Bailly maybe a surprise next season after a preseason with ETH.

 

[Mwooyo]

Honestly we only need 4 signings to compete on all fronts next season.

One is to make sabitzer a permanent signing, 2 is to bring in a midfielder like ruben neves. 3 is to bring in a young CB to replace maguire like alex disasi from monaco. 4 is to sign our next long term goal keeper in raya. We also need to recall amad

We can then get rid of maguire, donny, bailley, telles, mctominay, martial, henderson, elanga, jones etc.

We only need a striker if we sell greenwood. None the less, next season rashford becomes an out and out striker with the backup being gw or whoever the replacement is.

Antony and amad fight it out for the RW, sancho and Garnacho go toe to toe for the LW while bruno tussles it out with eriksen for the AM role

Midfield will be casemiro or ruben neves, fred or sabitzer

Shaws fights with malacia, dalot fights with AWB, varane fights with disasi. De gea fights with raya.

4 signings is all we need