FA Premier League

Newcastle United 1:0 Manchester United

St. James's Park

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Sun, 11 February 2018 @ 2:15pm GMT
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Discussion Your Lineup Prediction

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    We have had very good games 90% of the times we used 4-2-3-1. I don't get why people are suddenly worried about it. It has gradually edged out 4-3-3 among elite teams in world football.

    Juventus are ridiculously good in a 4-2-3-1...but apparently it's outdated tactics and a sign of Mourinho being past it.

    Tottenham utilize 4-2-3-1 in many of their games; while at the same time Pochettino is a tactically progressive manager...

    Anything to bash our team.
     
    4-2-3-1 is like Kryptonite, I hope we leave McTominay in to form a 3 man midfield, then it's either Martial, Mata or Lingard with Jose's two investments in the front 3.

    There should be no question as to if Lingard should start, of course he should!
     
    4-2-3-1 is like Kryptonite, I hope we leave McTominay in to form a 3 man midfield, then it's either Martial, Mata or Lingard with Jose's two investments in the front 3.

    4-3-3 is a better lineup for us but against dross like Newcastle it really shouldn't matter. If we don't win with 4-2-3-1 it won't be because we went with 4-2-3-1.
     
    We have had very good games 90% of the times we used 4-2-3-1. I don't get why people are suddenly worried about it. It has gradually edged out 4-3-3 among elite teams in world football.

    Most of the elite teams play 4-3-3, Barca, Real, Bayern, PSG, City and then the other big sides like Liverpool, Dortmund and Napoli. Only Juve of the really big sides play 4-2-3-1, but the main issue is that we don't have the right players for it, Pogba leaves us wide open in the formation and that is part of the reason Maticf has gotten so worn down, he has too much work to do in the formation even against smaller teams.

    Juventus are ridiculously good in a 4-2-3-1...but apparently it's outdated tactics and a sign of Mourinho being past it.

    Tottenham utilize 4-2-3-1 in many of their games; while at the same time Pochettino is a tactically progressive manager...

    Anything to bash our team.

    No one is bashing the team, we simply aren't suited to the formation for the reason above. Also Spurs don't play 4-2-3-1 just because that's what Sky put in their graphic, take a look at where Dele and Eriksen constantly provide a 3rd man in midfield.

    There should be no question as to if Lingard should start, of course he should!

    Nah, I'd start Martial.

    4-3-3 is a better lineup for us but against dross like Newcastle it really shouldn't matter. If we don't win with 4-2-3-1 it won't be because we went with 4-2-3-1.

    It could be, we are so open through the middle in the formation that even lesser teams can get at us on the counter.
     
    Juventus are ridiculously good in a 4-2-3-1...but apparently it's outdated tactics and a sign of Mourinho being past it.

    Tottenham utilize 4-2-3-1 in many of their games; while at the same time Pochettino is a tactically progressive manager...

    Anything to bash our team.
    The difference is, the pivot of Juve and Spurs are disciplined. Pogba isn't.
     
    I would expect to get 3 points here, but I also expected 3 points at Huddersfield. With only 12 games remaining we need the points to at least finish 2nd.
     
    Since the next game is at Fa cup followed by CL, I can see Young starter here, Shaw against Huddersfield then Young again against Seville.

    De Gea
    Valencia - Jones - Smalling - Young
    Pogba - Matic
    Mata - Lingard - Sanchez
    Lukaku​

    Can't think about a different lineup here, maybe Rojo can get involved but that's it.
    Sorry to be so anal about this, but Pogba really never features on the left of a midfield (two), there are even threads discussing this problem.
     
    Most of the elite teams play 4-3-3, Barca, Real, Bayern, PSG, City and then the other big sides like Liverpool, Dortmund and Napoli. Only Juve of the really big sides play 4-2-3-1, but the main issue is that we don't have the right players for it, Pogba leaves us wide open in the formation and that is part of the reason Maticf has gotten so worn down, he has too much work to do in the formation even against smaller teams.
    Actually, those two alternate very much, Barcelona with 4-4-2 and Real Madrid with 4-3-1-2, 4-3-3's not their dead sure system for a while.
     
    Very funny, Mourinho's comments about people wanting Pogba to be “a box in the box and staying in the box.” How many times (30!) did he say “box”!:lol:

    By the way, anyone knows who was the pundit Mourinho was making fun with those “box-to-box that doesn't have to defend” comments?
     
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    Since the next game is at Fa cup followed by CL, I can see Young starter here, Shaw against Huddersfield then Young again against Seville.
    I see your logic, but Young could also play in Valencia's spot against Huddersfield to allow him some rest before Sevilla, otherwise it's Darmian.:nervous:
     
    Very funny, Mourinho's comments about people wanting Pogba to be “a box in the box and staying in the box.” How many times (30!) did he say “box”!:lol:

    By the way, anyone knows who was the pundit Mourinho was making fun with those “box-to-box that doesn't have to defend” comments?

    Rooney said that Pogba is a 'box to box' player that is free of defensive responsibility.
     
    Actually, those two alternate very much, Barcelona with 4-4-2 and Real Madrid with 4-3-1-2, 4-3-3's not their dead sure system for a while.

    Those alterations have been due to injuries though, with Bale out a lot Zidane moved to a diamond and Barca switched due to Dembele getting injured almost immediately.
     
    Time for Jose to win his first game away at Newcastle.
     
    ..................De Gea
    Valencia-----Smalling-----Rojo-----Shaw
    ............. Matic-------Pogba
    Lingard------Sanchez----Martial
    ................ Lukaku

    Yes, Pogba in midifleld 2.
     
    Maybe Lingard's honeymoon period is over!
    I do not want it to...Just saying.

    Honeymoon period??

    He is just an excellent player! Why classify his good form as a honeymoon period, and not just think of it as his current standard??!
     
    ..................De Gea
    Valencia-----Smalling-----Rojo-----Shaw
    ............. Matic-------Pogba
    Lingard------Sanchez----Martial
    ................ Lukaku

    Yes, Pogba in midifleld 2.
    But on the wrong side of the pitch.
     
    NO same side as I mentioned.

    Matic on right towards Valencia's side and POgba on left Toward's Shaw's side.
    But you know that never happens, though, don't you? Is it just wishful thinking from you?
     
    NO same side as I mentioned.

    Matic on right towards Valencia's side and POgba on left Toward's Shaw's side.


    As in when everything is going on good for him.

    So Messi must be having one long honeymoon period!

    Or we could just say that this is his current level now, that of being a darn good player that deserves more respect, and to be thought of as a key player.
     
    But you know that never happens, though, don't you? Is it just wishful thinking from you?
    Matic is obviously positioned more at centre, and behind, rather than right or left of Pogba . I have seen Pogba playing on left side more than right. For e.g. check heat map in this game. Utd 2-2 BUrnley.

    I dont know if we can get average heat map over the season. if we can get that, I would say Pogba's position would be skewed towards left.
     
    So Messi must be having one long honeymoon period!

    Or we could just say that this is his current level now, that of being a darn good player that deserves more respect, and to be thought of as a key player.

    long honeymoon period == thats his level
    short honeymoon period == just in form

    Not hard to catch, is it?

    For now, I reserve my doubts over LIngard unless he consistently proves throughout a season.
     
    long honeymoon period == thats his level
    short honeymoon period == just in form

    Not hard to catch, is it?

    For now, I reserve my doubts over LIngard unless he consistently proves throughout a season.

    How long is a short period? 1 game? 2 games? 5 games?

    Just wanting some clarification here that is all.
     
    How long is a short period? 1 game? 2 games? 5 games?

    Just wanting some clarification here that is all.

    TO be judged a 'top' player for us, should perform consistently for 10 games for half season and 20 games for full season.
    Will be happy to clarify if you have any other doubts.
     
    Matic is obviously positioned more at centre, and behind, rather than right or left of Pogba . I have seen Pogba playing on left side more than right. For e.g. check heat map in this game. Utd 2-2 BUrnley.

    I dont know if we can get average heat map over the season. if we can get that, I would say Pogba's position would be skewed towards left.
    You're clearly wrong on your impressions, even in the game you mention, just check ‘Players positions’. Pogba on the left, with Matić in a midfield two, never happens (maybe there was an exception to this rule once).
     
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    You're clearly wrong on your impressions, even in the game you mention, just check ‘Players positions’. Pogba on the left, with Matić in a midfield two, never happens (maybe there's an exception to this rule).

    Maybe you only check player position as shown in the lineup, thats why you have 'never' seen pogba on the left. IN that "player position", POgba always play at same level with Matic, Valencia plays on the same line with Smalling, but do they?!

    Heat map is the most accurate indicator of player's actual position. If you check Pogba's heatmap on that game, its on left.
    In the same link you sent, go to Match center>>Heatmap , and you will be more clear.
     
    TO be judged a 'top' player for us, should perform consistently for 10 games for half season and 20 games for full season.
    Will be happy to clarify if you have any other doubts.

    Okay when you say games, do you mean full 90 minute games? What happens if he starts on the bench but comes on scores? Or vice-versa?
     
    Maybe you only check player position as shown in the lineup, thats why you have 'never' seen pogba on the left. IN that "player position", POgba always play at same level with Matic, Valencia plays on the same line with Smalling, but do they?!

    Heat map is the most accurate indicator of player's actual position. If you check Pogba's heatmap on that game, its on left.
    In the same link you sent, go to Match center>>Heatmap , and you will be more clear.
    No, ‘Players positions’ as in the Match Report, not Match Center (in the link I've offered, where's yours?) is their average position from every touch/movement they had. Even if Pogba had a lot of touches on the left that game, as showed in the Heatmat, Matić had even more, never even coming to the right, contrary to Pogba! And it makes sense, since that particular game was around the time Pogba thought he could have a freer role.

    Besides, we both were forgetting that game had Rojo coming out at half time and Matić dropping to centerback, no wonder Pogba had more time on the left!
     
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    Okay when you say games, do you mean full 90 minute games? What happens if he starts on the bench but comes on scores? Or vice-versa?

    It is counted as 1 game if he is involved in the game, whether from starting lineup, or from bench. No need to be play full 90 mins.
    Why dont you list all your doubts and post here, and I will answer all of those in one post.
     
    No, ‘Players positions’ as in the Match Report, not Match Center (in the link I've offered, where's yours?) is their average position from every touch/movement they had. Even if Pogba had a lot of touches on the left that game, as showed in the Heatmat, Matić had even more, never even coming to the right, contrary to Pogba! And it makes sense, since that particular game was around the time Pogba thought he could have a freer role.

    Besides, we both were forgetting that game had Rojo coming out at half time and Matić dropping to centerback, no wonder Pogba had more time on the left!
    I got that you are referring to Player position, and thats why, I told you to instead refer to heatmap in the match center for the reasons I already mentioned. If you have not figured out how to get to heat map there, here is the link for you.
    dsz0t7

    https://ibb.co/dsz0t7

    Heatmap is not just about touches, if you are stationed on the left corner flag without ever touching the ball, the heatmap will still show the 'actual postiion' as the left corner flag.
    YOu mentioned Matic had even more, so what is the problem with that? that only means both played predominantly on left side, close to each other.
     
    I got that you are referring to Player position, and thats why, I told you to instead refer to heatmap in the match center for the reasons I already mentioned. If you have not figured out how to get to heat map there, here is the link for you.
    dsz0t7

    https://ibb.co/dsz0t7

    Heatmap is not just about touches, if you are stationed on the left corner flag without ever touching the ball, the heatmap will still show the 'actual postiion' as the left corner flag.
    YOu mentioned Matic had even more, so what is the problem with that? that only means both played predominantly on left side, close to each other.
    I give up. Only if you show me Pogba's first half heatmap, before Matić dropped to centerback, could you be partially right. And even that would be just partially right about an exception!
     
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Post-match discussion

Player Ratings

4.7 Total Average Rating

Highest Rated Player

Lowest Rated Player

Compiled from 458 ratings.

Score Predictions

552,18,37
  • Man Utd win
  • Newcastle win
  • Draw

Detailed Results

  • 27% Newcastle 0:2 Man Utd
  • 19% Newcastle 0:3 Man Utd
  • 14% Newcastle 1:3 Man Utd
  • 11% Newcastle 1:2 Man Utd
  • 8% Newcastle 0:1 Man Utd
  • 7% Newcastle 0:4 Man Utd
  • 3% Newcastle 1:1 Man Utd
  • 2% Newcastle 0:5 Man Utd
  • 2% Newcastle 0:0 Man Utd
  • 1% Newcastle 1:4 Man Utd
  • 1% Newcastle 2:2 Man Utd
  • 1% Newcastle 2:1 Man Utd
  • 1% Newcastle 2:0 Man Utd
  • 0% Newcastle 2:4 Man Utd
  • 0% Newcastle 3:0 Man Utd
  • 0% Newcastle 1:0 Man Utd
  • 0% Newcastle 3:1 Man Utd
  • 0% Newcastle 2:3 Man Utd
  • 0% Newcastle 3:5 Man Utd
  • 0% Newcastle 4:0 Man Utd
  • 0% Newcastle 5:0 Man Utd
  • 0% Newcastle 2:5 Man Utd
  • 0% Newcastle 1:5 Man Utd
Compiled from 607 predictions.
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Match Stats

  1. Newcastle
  2. Man Utd
Possession
36% 64%
Shots
10 13
Shots on Target
3 4
Corners
0 10
Fouls
12 15

Referee

Craig Pawson