VAR and Refs | General Discussion

Posh Red

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Do you watch rugby or cricket? They both seem to have adapted really well to delayed decisions. This is not meant as some kind of gotcha, sports are all subtly different and perhaps some lend themselves to VAR and others don’t. Point being, I think a) VAR itself will improve, and b) we will get used to it.
I don’t to be honest. So perhaps there’s some truth in that, but I find it hard to ever envision being really happy with VAR. I’m sure it will
Improve though.
Also, I don’t feel like those sports ever had moments equivalent to the goal celebrations in football anyway, but could be wrong.
 

Jev

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Do you watch rugby or cricket? They both seem to have adapted really well to delayed decisions. This is not meant as some kind of gotcha, sports are all subtly different and perhaps some lend themselves to VAR and others don’t. Point being, I think a) VAR itself will improve, and b) we will get used to it.
I don’t see how this is a point in VAR’s favour. You get used to writing with your left hand if you lose your right arm in an accident. Doesn’t mean it improved your life.
 
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Fully Fledged

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I think you’re looking back with rose tinted glasses a little. If you looked back to a bad decision (pre VAR) at Utd you’d easily have 100 enraged people for every “them’s the breaks” post.
I'm sorry but the idea that you have to keep your hands behind your back because a pen will be given against you if your hands is in a natural running position is destroying the game. The same would be said with giving a goal offside for a toenail. If this is the way we are going with football we might as well wrap it up now.
 

NicolaSacco

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I don’t see how this is a point in VAR’s favour. You get used to writing with your left hand if you lose your right arm in an accident. Doesn’t mean it improved your life.
Poor choice of words, maybe. If you get used to it but still hate it then yes. But you have to acknowledge, the majority of people react quite poorly to change, and it’s not necessarily because the change itself was the problem. Again, the above sentence can be true, and yet still not apply in this specific case, so there’s no right or wrong. I guess I err on the side of viewing the current problems as primarily a rules issue (in the case of handballs) or a speed issue (in the case of offsides). If I’m right then both of these can be fixed, allowing us to keep the accuracy of VAR without changing the fan experience too much. I’m possibly being hopelessly optimistic, I’m aware!
 

NicolaSacco

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I'm sorry but the idea that you have to keep your hands behind your back because a pen will be given against you if your hands is in a natural running position is destroying the game. The same would be said with giving a goal offside for a toenail. If this is the way we are going with football we might as well wrap it up now.
I agree with the handball thing- but I’d argue it should result in a rule change rather than scrapping VAR and having obvious fouls, violent conduct, and offsides consistently missed by the officials. Because that is what we’d be going back to.
 

ROFLUTION

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"Need bad to experience good" is a bizarre argument. People are now literally arguing they're fine with bad decisions to spare some VAR intervention.
No. You just live in a World where you forgot which emotions football and honest/dishonest football feels. Football should reflect life, not be a PC polished version of life. It should be in the moment.
Everything around us in everyday is digested and feelings are stripped from it before it entere consumers in a polished way. Original football before VAR was raw and honest. And that includes injustices at times.

Football before VAR was brilliant, yet you try to make sense of VAR - probably in logic ways - but football has for centuries been loved for it’s heat of the moment … the passion, not the technicalities.
 

VorZakone

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No. You just live in a World where you forgot which emotions football and honest/dishonest football feels. Football should reflect life, not be a PC polished version of life. It should be in the moment.
Everything around us in everyday is digested and feelings are stripped from it before it entere consumers in a polished way. Original football before VAR was raw and honest. And that includes injustices at times.

Football before VAR was brilliant, yet you try to make sense of VAR - probably in logic ways - but football has for centuries been loved for it’s heat of the moment … the passion, not the technicalities.
If this is where you're coming from, we're miles apart on this subject.

VAR didn't take away the passion for me. It's not even needed for each goal!
 

V.O.

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They're just chucking yellow cards around like confetti at this Euros. Griezmann and Rabiot just booked for next to nothing, and we've seen similar in other games.

Given how draconian the suspension rules are as well, it's just ridiculous having players miss key games in a tournament for things that are barely fouls.
 

Shane88

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Faking head injuries is one of the biggest blights in the game now.

Players know that if there is an opposition limb within 2 feet of their head they can just throw their hands to their face, scream, and get an automatic free-kick. It's ridiculous.
 

Uniquim

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Will say that the semi-automated offsides thing have been worked well during the Euros. Hoping it works as well when the Premier League implements it for this coming season.
 

fallengt

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No handball imo but i wouldnt be against it if that was given.
But then Toni Kroos shouldve been sent off long before that.

We have seen worse from Taylor.
 

RedDevil@84

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Just feel Taylor didn't have the balls to call it. The occasion, the big teams involved and all that. He didn't dare for it to he decided on his penalty call.
 

Stadjer

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No handball imo but i wouldnt be against it if that was given.
But then Toni Kroos shouldve been sent off long before that.

We have seen worse from Taylor.
Kroos should have received a yellow when he injured Pedri. He is experienced enough to finish the game with a yellow from that point on but he did get away with multiple yellow card momemts.

Says a lot about Taylor that he had a really bad game and that we have seen worse of him :lol:
 

Red Stone

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No handball imo but i wouldnt be against it if that was given.

We have seen worse from Taylor.
The only reason it wasn't given was an offside right beforehand. Otherwise it was one of the most obvious handballs of the tournament so far. I wouldn't complain if that was given against us in the league.

And while you're right, that's just a horrifying indictment on Taylor.
 

NotChatGPT

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No handball imo but i wouldnt be against it if that was given.
But then Toni Kroos shouldve been sent off long before that.

We have seen worse from Taylor.
10/10 times it’s a penalty with the standards set by UEFA for CL and the Euros. It’s bonkers that VAR didn’t recommend Taylor to watch it on the screen
 

RedDevil@84

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10/10 times it’s a penalty with the standards set by UEFA for CL and the Euros. It’s bonkers that VAR didn’t recommend Taylor to watch it on the screen
Any idea who was at VAR. I was shocked they had made a decision within seconds, as if it was already decided
 

Rektsanwalt

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10/10 times it’s a penalty with the standards set by UEFA for CL and the Euros. It’s bonkers that VAR didn’t recommend Taylor to watch it on the screen
exactly. Penalty clear as daylight. Surely this was one of the worst mistakes in big games since implementation of VAR
 

NotChatGPT

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The only reason it wasn't given was an offside right beforehand. Otherwise it was one of the most obvious handballs of the tournament so far. I wouldn't complain if that was given against us in the league.

And while you're right, that's just a horrifying indictment on Taylor.
They didn’t even check it for offside?
 

Shane88

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I think it's a penalty. They keep saying his hand was down by his side. It wasn't, it was on its way down but it was significantly out and it blocked a powerful shot that looked to be heading on target. Penalty.
 

Red Star One

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I think it's a penalty. They keep saying his hand was down by his side. It wasn't, it was on its way down but it was significantly out and it blocked a powerful shot that looked to be heading on target. Penalty.
Never a pen because of offside in the buildup, crazy how people ignore it
 

Red Star One

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No lines have been drawn up to conclude, and the angles from all the replays are inconclusive in terms of the parts of his body that he can score with, it just looks tight.
no lines have been drawn up as the ref didn't deem it necessary and didn't whistle the handball in the first place, but it doesn't mean it was not offside. for me it was quite clear and if the handball was any tighter I think we'd see the replay and there would be no doubt.
I've seen it as well and it's clearcut for me, it's really wild how they only showed it once, briefly, and never talked about it again
I think that's because Taylor didn't think the handball of Cucu was worth checking for a pen, so he disregarded that. But for me, watching it live and seeing the replays now, Krug was clearly off.
 

Red Stone

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This discussion highlights the need for some form of explanation, either through pictures and text or audio between the ref and the VAR room, of how controversial decisions were made. VAR being put on blast by everyone now for something that could have been avoided if refs could accept just some accountability and willingness to defend their work.
 

NotChatGPT

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no lines have been drawn up as the ref didn't deem it necessary and didn't whistle the handball in the first place, but it doesn't mean it was not offside. for me it was quite clear and if the handball was any tighter I think we'd see the replay and there would be no doubt.

I think that's because Taylor didn't think the handball of Cucu was worth checking for a pen, so he disregarded that. But for me, watching it live and seeing the replays now, Krug was clearly off.


”clearly off”

Mental.
 

hellhunter

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no lines have been drawn up as the ref didn't deem it necessary and didn't whistle the handball in the first place, but it doesn't mean it was not offside. for me it was quite clear and if the handball was any tighter I think we'd see the replay and there would be no doubt.

I think that's because Taylor didn't think the handball of Cucu was worth checking for a pen, so he disregarded that. But for me, watching it live and seeing the replays now, Krug was clearly off.
Only reasonable explanation, yeah, but would've saved everyone a lot of blood pressure to just show some lines there
 

NotChatGPT

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Only reasonable explanation, yeah, but would've saved everyone a lot of blood pressure to just show some lines there
The supposed offside has nothing whatsoever to do with it.

If it did, the chain of events would be: VAR checking to see if it’s penalty -> VAR checking if it was offside in the build up.

They didn’t check it. Taylor said he saw the handball and signalled that the player had his arm close to his body, VAR didn’t do anything because then they didn’t deem it as clear and obvious fault
 

VorZakone

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Did Taylor know there was an offside in the build-up? He seemed to suggest it wasn't handball instead.
 

hellhunter

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The supposed offside has nothing whatsoever to do with it.

If it did, the chain of events would be: VAR checking to see if it’s penalty -> VAR checking if it was offside in the build up.

They didn’t check it. Taylor said he saw the handball and signalled that the player had his arm close to his body, VAR didn’t do anything because then they didn’t deem it as clear and obvious fault
Does it matter why the penalty wasn't given if there's a valid, yet not considered, reason it wasn't given?