Sorry to reply to you twice (nothing personal) but I don't think that's factually correct? @Wibble ?
That doesn't reply to what I bolded (or meant), namely that as far as I know, the Australian Govt hasn't offered him any loophole then decided to detain him.
I think the issue here’s is that while mandatory vaccinations to travel are common, those vaccines are basically >95% effective at preventing the disease (e.g., yellow fever vaccine which I have dome myself). The data is out there for vaccine effectiveness at preventing symptomatic infection against Omicron and for example a double dose of AZ after some time has 0% against it. Current covid vaccines are basically all about preventing serious illnesses, which is still a really great achievement as it stops the hospitalization rate but in this case I guess you can see the logic the gap? When someone have had covid twice (apparently), and won’t be an issue for public health services it doesn’t make any sense to make such a show out of this.
Litsening to the AUS prime minister the implication is he applied for the visa under false pretences.
How is that an "issue"? It isn't. People can debate the virtue of vaccines until infinity but that doesn't change the fact that the current rules to enter Australia demand either a vaccination or a valid exemption. Whatever people feel about them, those rules are still there to be respected.
No, it was under the ATAGI guidelines that allowed him to get an exception initially:
Then the prime minister goes out and says this:
In other words you don't have to be fully vaccinated to enter and you have the loophole in the rules. Before he took off it is clear that if he presents proper papers he would be allowed in unvaccinated. For whatever reason obviously his team fecked up royally the paperwork.
AUS PM:
"All eligible inbound travellers must be fully vaccinated to enter Australia, unless an exemption applies. All children eligible for inbound travel aged under 12 years, as demonstrated by their passport, count as fully vaccinated for travel purposes. -
Hmmm.
)... I agree in general, but nobody prevents us from questioning them rules if they’re a bit stupid? While I support the vaccination requirement I don’t see how anyone can argue from a scientific point of view that past infections aren’t at least as good at preventing Omicron than some of these vaccines. Should be a valid exemption in my book for recent infections at least.
You said it yourself, you must be fully vaccinated unless an exemption applies.
Well that's up for debate and rumors all around. At this point I'm not sure anyone knows what his grounds were, but if he was ill advised - then the responsibility should be on "that guy".Hmmm.
I read something last night so quick Google...
This is from a journo (as Aussies call journalists
"... been told “on good authority” that Tennis Australia approached the nation’s medical body, ATAGI, for advice on ‘natural immunity’.
Specifically, whether natural immunity gained after recovering from a COVID-19 infection can work in place of two doses of a vaccine.
“ATAGI told Tennis Australia that past infection with COVID is not a valid reason against vaccination".
................
This matches what was leaked/released last night, namely that ATAGI put in writing that recent Covid is not a reason for exemption.
https://www.tennis365.com/australia...ief-novak-djokovic-visa-covid-19-vaccination/
Well you could certainly argue that keeping out people who refuse the vaccine (with no good reason) will weed out anyone who doesn’t take covid seriously and is likely to behave in a way that is more likely to cause the virus to spread.
Again - in the quote you provided yourself - you clearly don't.
People are free to question rules or voice objections as much as they want. I'm sure plenty have done so over the past 2 years and I certainly haven't always agreed with decisions made in my own country. However, what people can't do is knowingly go against them and expect others to accept that.
Think The Lancet had pieces in Nov and Dec saying that protection from having had Covid is still t.b.d. Varies from person to person and limited data yet.
Which exemption (per ATAGI) did he meet and prove?
Not sure why you're still arguing (or changing the 'discussion').
BlessNovak's mam said:
US in November announced new restrictions that no unvaccinated foreigners will be allowed entry, barring an exception for diplomats, allergies, etc.
The AUS PM says ‘…if he hasn’t told the truth then the person who’s made the mistake is Mr. Djokovic’.
Due to whose fault exactly? Yer man has been criminally vague about his vaccine status and under what basis he claimed exemption.
That’s irrelevant. What’s relevant is the fact that the Australian government (DoH) issued a medical exemption. And we all trust that the government have done their job diligently, and if the government said IT’S OKAY then it’s okay! Unless we’re not trusting the government all of a sudden?!
My original post was that the govt allowed the loophole, which I mentioned from the off.
If you’ve read social media a couple of years ago you’d would have thought Trump was the new Hitler. The whole thing is insane.
Without being too flippant here - anyone who has caught covid twice and still doesn't think vaccination is important is very unlikely to care who he infects when he catches it again. Sounds like a public health issue to me.
Against delta past infection (symptomatic and within the past 6 months) seemed to offer around 80/85% infection protection, but that dropped to less than 20% against omicron. You're right to argue that AZ at 6 months+ beyond second dose is also pretty ineffectual against omicron infection. Which sounds like Australia may need to update their border controls to include boosters.
Efficacy of Pfizer of Moderna even with booster has not been established against Omnicron as far as I am aware. Anecdotally, I know of 8-10 people in US who have contracted Covid despite getting booster from those two within last 2 months. Vaccines are now simply touted as ensuring that severity of the infection is not strong.
That is not how it works, because if the border forces say it's not okay then it's not okay. As has been said multiple times, a visa does not guarantee you entry to Australia. Entry can still be denied.
I mean....they were kinda correct on this one.
"The evidence presented in order to be granted a medical exemption was deemed to be insufficient"
Yeah I agree with that. I was once deported from Jordan upon landing in Amman although having a valid visa (for reasons still unknown to me). It happens.
The boosters are reckoned to offer around 70% effectiveness against omicron infection initially but that declines to maybe 50% at 3 months. The infection control aspect is not as big a part of the protection package as it was but there's still some there and it's part of the reason why the UK are so committed to the booster program. It takes a bite out of the R rate, as well as the hospitalisations.
Why should rules be respected? If they're clearly daft rules then they should be actively disrespected. This isn't primary school.
Have you been to Israel before going there?
Christ, that smacks of Earl Woods.
Pretty much this. Shame we won't see the goat at his best slam but it's his own choice to risk the tournament by not getting vaccinated so hard to feel sympathy.
Even if you think the rules are daft it's irrelevant here. Countries can set border restrictions as they wish. They're not breaching anyone's humans right so no they shouldn't be disrespected.
