Would you be okay with state or state-backed ownership?

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DickDastardly said:
So, you think a 9 year old you would even know about the owners?
Did you know about the owners at the time?

Owners before the Glazers bought out most of the shares.
Some Irish lads, racehorse owners. Who eventually got into a legal bickering with Sir Alex about a horse. Would you think less of them if you knew that?

You're romaticizing about the "good old days" when you were nine years old and United was at the top of the game.
It was a lovely time to be a fan, i was about the same age around then.

My son is now 7.
Loves watching games with me.

You think he'll wreck his brain around who's the owner of Manchester United?
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No he won't. And I'm sure that if I was a 7 year old watching my team winning nothing and suddenly getting to buy Mbappé and Verratti I'd be thrilled.

But I'm not a 7 year old. I'm old enough to know better now. And this will affect how I feel about the club whether I want it to or not.
 
BerryBerryShrew said:
No he won't. And I'm sure that if I was a 7 year old watching my team winning nothing and suddenly getting to buy Mbappé and Verratti I'd be thrilled.

But I'm not a 7 year old. I'm old enough to know better now. And this will affect how I feel about the club whether I want it to or not.
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Old enough to know better about what?

Qatar? Sportswashing? Billioners? Oil states? How the rich get richer?

This will affect how you feel about the club only if you allow it to.
You could still watch Manchester United football club play football and enjoy our wins just like you did when you were 9 years old.

Would you celebrate Giggsy's FA cup goal if you knew he was shagging his brothers wife?

You don't have to overthink everything.
It's a football club.

Be happy when we win, be miserable when we lose. Easy as that.
 
Looking at it from purely a football POV. I feel like it could bring a period of United domination. The only clubs in the world who have our potential are Real Madrid and Barca. But in terms of global size of the club, the league we play in, and then looking at quality of manager and adding in unlimited resources? City have 3 of the 4 but they'll never be able to match the old elite in terms of size. Add that factor in and you really get a beast that should be dominating global football.

As I said previously though. I don't want us to buy our way. If the inevitable happens, I'd want them to limit their financial doping to infrastructure, facilities, community investment, clearing debts etc. Being good employers to the many employees of the club. Pump all the money into things like that. Playing squad investment should come purely from just the club resources, the club revenues. Last thing I want is a Boehly type transfer window.
 
Don't think this is going to matter anymore.

Its looking very likely to happen and there is feck all anybody can do about it.
 
bosnian_red said:
Looking at it from purely a football POV. I feel like it could bring a period of United domination. The only clubs in the world who have our potential are Real Madrid and Barca. But in terms of global size of the club, the league we play in, and then looking at quality of manager and adding in unlimited resources? City have 3 of the 4 but they'll never be able to match the old elite in terms of size. Add that factor in and you really get a beast that should be dominating global football.

As I said previously though. I don't want us to buy our way. If the inevitable happens, I'd want them to limit their financial doping to infrastructure, facilities, community investment, clearing debts etc. Being good employers to the many employees of the club. Pump all the money into things like that. Playing squad investment should come purely from just the club resources, the club revenues. Last thing I want is a Boehly type transfer window.
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They'll like just take out new debt to fund the infrastructure so it'll be the club paying for that.

Also you were claiming they wouldn't define the club yesterday but what you've just described sounds very intrinsic to our success. So they may not define our history but they'll define the club going forward.
 
DevilRed said:
Don't think this is going to matter anymore.

Its looking very likely to happen and there is feck all anybody can do about it.
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Hmm, if the Qatari Royal Family are dead serious that they have to own United and are willing to throw substantial money behind it, then they'll probably get the club because the current owners just want the most money and there probably isn't any other realistic buyer who can outbid them

Something inside me says it won't be quite so straightforward though and that the interest is being amplified by someone

We'll see. It'll be interesting to see which interested party is the next to go public with their interest. If the Qatari's do, i'll eat my words. But I don't think it'll get to that personally.
 
Smores said:
They'll like just take out new debt to fund the infrastructure so it'll be the club paying for that.

Also you were claiming they wouldn't define the club yesterday but what you've just described sounds very intrinsic to our success. So they may not define our history but they'll define the club going forward.
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It doesn't define the club. But of course it raises the potential of the club having infinite money, and in that aspect we would be pretty unmatched. I wouldn't want them to run it in a certain way, but the likely scenario is they would throw money at the squad.

And of course, every owner has an impact on the club. They are not the club, they own it for a small period of time in the history but of course they set the starting blocks towards future performance. But just like 1 player doesn't define the club, the owners don't either.

In terms of the facility investment, if we do get ME ownership, don't see why they would take out a debt for that. That would almost certainly be part of their initial investment to get fans on their side.
 
I would hope we don't flout any rules in FFP and start performing self sponsorship. The club has managed to spend a billion through its own earnings from over a century of building up. We can compete without a billionaire sheik.

Had we been run semi competently we could've won the odd league title and CL in the last 10 years, financed a new stadium that would've been paid off by now. Problem is the people that the Glazers have hired have been catastrophically poor in spending that billion, picking the managers and structuring the club since Fergie left. The owners haven't had much in the way of vision, just sit on the asset and hope some chinless wonders can be lucky.

Someone like Ratcliffe should've come in during the last 10-20 years. The club and sport has gone beyond this level of business men.

If we can get a renovated or rebuilt stadium, the surrounding area vastly improved. Modern facilities for both men and women teams and stay away from self sponsorship, and fiddling the FFP and spend what the club earns on the pitch I don't see much of a problem.

If we end up paying someone like Mbappe silly signing on fees, and enormous loyalty bonuses in the tens or hundreds of millions in desperation like PSG do now I wouldn't feel good about the club or the owners. It's not money in the game but infinite money outside, from the state trying saving face and keep the fabrication going.
 
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I think if you want to know what might happen to us, you only have to look at PSG and City.

They haven‘t won the Champion‘s league, despite massive investment.

More importantly, City was banned from European competitions for two years and are in serious trouble now.

The reason for this is the disrespect for the rule of law by these authoritarian states. They think money can buy everything and the rules don‘t apply to them.

City might lose some of the titles they won and even get relegated. So ask yourselves, is this what we want for our club?
 
I previously stated on this thread that I do not like this at all.

I love this game, incredibly. But there is a lot that has crept into our game that I really have no time for, elements of the football industry are now, sadly I feel, forever, quite ugly.

I also hate the fact that the fans are powerless in all of this. It's horrible.

I'd prefer Qatar state bla, bla to spend such investments on improving health equalities. And they DO have the money to make a serious impact.

It's just wrong. Wrong.
 
NLunited said:
I think if you want to know what might happen to us, you only have to look at PSG and City.

They haven‘t won the Champion‘s league, despite massive investment.

More importantly, City was banned from European competitions for two years and are in serious trouble now.

The reason for this is the disrespect for the rule of law by these authoritarian states. They think money can buy everything and the rules don‘t apply to them.

City might lose some of the titles they won and even get relegated. So ask yourselves, is this what we want for our club?
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That makes no sense, sorry.

City fell foul of regulators because they broke the rules so they could fast track unfair levels of investment into their playing squad. We will not need to do so. We already have more than enough brand, market reach and most importantly revenue.

The fact that neither PSG or City have won the CL is not really the fault of the owners. Both clubs have world class squads and City have arguably the best manager in the world.

Not that I'm a fan of Qatari investment, but let's not be lazy about our assessments.
 
Drizzle said:
That makes no sense, sorry.

City fell foul of regulators because they broke the rules so they could fast track unfair levels of investment into their playing squad. We will not need to do so. We already have more than enough brand, market reach and most importantly revenue.

The fact that neither PSG or City have won the CL is not really the fault of the owners. Both clubs have world class squads and City have arguably the best manager in the world.

Not that I'm a fan of Qatari investment, but let's not be lazy about our assessments.
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I think he's saying that all Arabs are cheaters.
 
NLunited said:
I think if you want to know what might happen to us, you only have to look at PSG and City.

They haven‘t won the Champion‘s league, despite massive investment.

More importantly, City was banned from European competitions for two years and are in serious trouble now.

The reason for this is the disrespect for the rule of law by these authoritarian states. They think money can buy everything and the rules don‘t apply to them.

City might lose some of the titles they won and even get relegated. So ask yourselves, is this what we want for our club?
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Do you really not see the difference between City in 2008 and us in 2023 and why exactly city have issues with FFP and we would not? I don't understand how is it even comparable. We will not have any issues with FFP, no risk of being banned from anywhere, rest assured.
 
sglowrider said:
I think he's saying that all Arabs are cheaters.
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And that kind of inflammatory crap not helpful either. Because he's right that City's owners did cheat, on a massive scale. He did not make the racist accusation that you suggested he did.
 
In an ideal world we’d have a United fan with a spare £6BN, happens to be a real angel who’s never even stolen a penny sweet and takes in stray animals. In reality, any person or group of people who can buy United are going to be shady to varying degrees.

I want an owner who’s mission is make Manchester United the most elite football club in the world in every aspect without expecting any monetary return. Out of the realistic candidates, ME investment seems to be the only ones who fit that bill.

People are talking about City, FFP and ‘cheating’ but United if run well can dominate well within the rules. In fact, to try and ‘cheat’ success with United would be incredibly stupid from many aspects. We spend craploads of money anyway, just really poorly. Trying to attract the best players in the world is what this club should be aiming for regardless of owners.

We need investment in stadium and training facilities, youth and women’s team and maybe development in surrounding areas. The first team needs competent recruitment and management. All can be achieved well within the rules and they’d be no unfair advantages whatsoever. All the advantages come from being one of the most famous and supported sports teams in the world.
 
Ronaldo's ego said:
In an ideal world we’d have a United fan with a spare £6BN, happens to be a real angel who’s never even stolen a penny sweet and takes in stray animals. In reality, any person or group of people who can buy United are going to be shady to varying degrees.

I want an owner who’s mission is make Manchester United the most elite football club in the world in every aspect without expecting any monetary return. Out of the realistic candidates, ME investment seems to be the only ones who fit that bill.

People are talking about City, FFP and ‘cheating’ but United if run well can dominate well within the rules. In fact, to try and ‘cheat’ success with United would be incredibly stupid from many aspects. We spend craploads of money anyway, just really poorly. Trying to attract the best players in the world is what this club should be aiming for regardless of owners.

We need investment in stadium and training facilities, youth and women’s team and maybe development in surrounding areas. The first team needs competent recruitment and management. All can be achieved well within the rules and they’d be no unfair advantages whatsoever. All the advantages come from being one of the most famous and supported sports teams in the world.
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To me, as much as I'd like us to be an all-conquering football force once again, it's far more important that United doesn't become an arm of an autocratic state. Besides, we can still be successful while not being state backed. The fact we are one of the most famous and well supported teams is precisely why we don't need to compromise our integrity by climbing into bed with autocrats to pump us full of cash. Our issue hasn't been a lack of spending, it's been bad management and lack of rigorous oversight which we have now seemingly largely corrected.
 
Would be a good idea to open the main thread considering there’s been more news from France.
 
If Emir al Thanos buys the club as his own passion project, I wouldn't rule out Messi for a season
 
Qatar should look to offload PSG if they’re serious about United and it’s going to lead to complications with the bid.

As far as I can see there is only one goal there, win the Champions League, which they fail at every year. For the vast majority of the season no one cares about them. Plastic club in a boring league.

Not sure why Qatar would let their continued ownership jeopardise their chances of owning United.
 
sugar_kane said:
They should look to offload PSG if they’re serious about United and it’s going to lead to complications with their bid.

As far as I can see there is only one goal there, win the Champions League, which they fail at every year. For the vast majority of the season no one cares about them. Plastic club in a boring league. Not sure why they would let their continued ownership jeopardise their chances of owning United.
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Perhaps they'll ship Rashford and Casemiro over there on loan for a bit, win the CL and then bring them back.
 
Señor Sloppy said:
Out of curiosity, has anyone in this thread actually physically spent prolonged periods out in the Middle East, or at least has some connection to the region through friends/family/etc.?
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No, but I've read enough Daily Mail articles to know that they are not to be trusted, thank you very much!!!
 
Simply put yes, unless they attempt to force their beliefs on to the club or the fans then others beliefs much like their politics or religion do not effect how I feel about United.
 
sugar_kane said:
Qatar should look to offload PSG if they’re serious about United and it’s going to lead to complications with the bid.

As far as I can see there is only one goal there, win the Champions League, which they fail at every year. For the vast majority of the season no one cares about them. Plastic club in a boring league.

Not sure why Qatar would let their continued ownership jeopardise their chances of owning United.
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I'm pretty sure they will eventually bin PSG off. They're already briefing about it I think.
 
I posted this in the other thread before it was locked but closer cultural ties with the west is far more likely to improve things in these countries for people than making them pariah states. Look at the difference between now and ten years ago for women in Saudi Arabia, of course its far from perfect but there has been progression. There are people alive today who lived through a time in the UK where homosexuality was illegal, and we chemically castrated them. This didn't change over a few years it's only been ten years gay marriage has even been legal, it might take 20-30 years, but closer ties with the west and a desire to make a country that more westerners want to visit is more likely to change how things are done, than isolating them and demanding they do it our way right now
 
redcucumber said:
To me, as much as I'd like us to be an all-conquering football force once again, it's far more important that United doesn't become an arm of an autocratic state. Besides, we can still be successful while not being state backed. The fact we are one of the most famous and well supported teams is precisely why we don't need to compromise our integrity by climbing into bed with autocrats to pump us full of cash. Our issue hasn't been a lack of spending, it's been bad management and lack of rigorous oversight which we have now seemingly largely corrected.
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If we can get non state backed ownership who’d run the club as it should be then I’d be more than happy with that. Unfortunately I just don’t see any realistic options willing to invest that kind of money without expecting a financial return.
 
jm99 said:
I posted this in the other thread before it was locked but closer cultural ties with the west is far more likely to improve things in these countries for people than making them pariah states. Look at the difference between now and ten years ago for women in Saudi Arabia, of course its far from perfect but there has been progression. There are people alive today who lived through a time in the UK where homosexuality was illegal, and we chemically castrated them. This didn't change over a few years it's only been ten years gay marriage has even been legal, it might take 20-30 years, but closer ties with the west and a desire to make a country that more westerners want to visit is more likely to change how things are done, than isolating them and demanding they do it our way right now
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This is a fair assessment. There is (very slow) progress in the Middle East states towards a set of beliefs and laws more in line with my own. This is in contrast to the US where the rights of women, LGBTQ and BIPOC people are under attack. Gun laws are being weakened and even democracy itself is no longer untouchable with presidential candidates refusing to abide by the results. I know that the US government won’t be buying United, but I’m sure that some of the 74 million people who voted for Trump in 2020 are likely to be involved in any US consortiums. And that worries me at least as much as Qatari owners.
 
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Cant wait to see the players wear a Bisht lifting the pl trophy next season.

The Emirs a United fan too.
 
I have so far kept myself from forming an opinion on the matter, but been reading through all opinions expressed on the caf.
I do know that I have an aversion to politics and people directly or indirectly associated with that world.
Is fan-ownership now totally out of the question? even partial? Like no rumours about any potential owners opening up 10 to 30% to fans to own?
 
Señor Sloppy said:
Out of curiosity, has anyone in this thread actually physically spent prolonged periods out in the Middle East, or at least has some connection to the region through friends/family/etc.?
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I think there are probably only a few on here? Lots of keyboard warriors in these kinds of threads.
 
DickDastardly said:
Old enough to know better about what?

Qatar? Sportswashing? Billioners? Oil states? How the rich get richer?

This will affect how you feel about the club only if you allow it to.
You could still watch Manchester United football club play football and enjoy our wins just like you did when you were 9 years old.

Would you celebrate Giggsy's FA cup goal if you knew he was shagging his brothers wife?

You don't have to overthink everything.
It's a football club.

Be happy when we win, be miserable when we lose. Easy as that.
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We're Manchester United. We're going to get lumped in with City, PSG and Chelsea. That's my worst nightmare. I would rather get relegated than everyone calling us a dirty oil club who got lucky winning the lottery and are now winning things again just because of oil money.
 
JPB said:
We're Manchester United. We're going to get lumped in with City, PSG and Chelsea. That's my worst nightmare. I would rather get relegated than everyone calling us a dirty oil club who got lucky winning the lottery and are now winning things again just because of oil money.
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A lion does not concern himself with the opinions of the sheep. You don't need to wish relegation on the club just because of the haters's words. Haters are gonna hate and say whatever they can come up with to hurt you. We are Manchester United, we do what we want.
 
I saw someone in another thread suggesting that if enough people protested against Qatari ownership, it would stop the process (like the ESL). Of course it would potentially leave us in the hands of the Glazers or other parasites. Is this a possibility?
 
I've softened my stance in relation to Qatar/Saudi ownership. I respect anyone able to walk away from the club and understand the reasoning but for me personally, I couldn't do it.

I despise our current owners, I support the team. I don't see what difference it makes in that way. If they are willing to get rid of the debt, redevelop the stadium and training facilities, and improve the club I think they deserve a chance to show that they can be suitable for the club and the area.
 
Señor Sloppy said:
Out of curiosity, has anyone in this thread actually physically spent prolonged periods out in the Middle East, or at least has some connection to the region through friends/family/etc.?
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I don’t think anyone is claiming that lots of places in the Middle East aren’t great places to visit/live for most. I’m sure I could go to Qatar and have a great time, loads of people did for the World Cup. I am also not a migrant worker, gay (I’ll stop there before I start sounding like Infantino). Bizarre argument to say that people can’t form an opinion about it in 2023 given the access to information that we have.
 
Sir Erik ten Hag said:
A lion does not concern himself with the opinions of the sheep. You don't need to wish relegation on the club just because of the haters's words. Haters are gonna hate and say whatever they can come up with to hurt you. We are Manchester United, we do what we want.
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It's not just that. I hate City and Chelsea and PSG like everyone else. I do not want anything given to us for free. We don't need it. We just need a fair owner who will let us spend our own money the way we want to. And not an owner who takes money out of the club for themselves like the Glazer's.

Let's say we get a super rich owner like Qatar, am I mistaken or they won't be able to just shower us with money however they like? We'll still only be able to spend what we generate as a club right? So what's the point? Do people want to see us to end like City with these guys illegally pumping money into the club?
 
I’m loving my life said:
I saw someone in another thread suggesting that if enough people protested against Qatari ownership, it would stop the process (like the ESL). Of course it would potentially leave us in the hands of the Glazers or other parasites. Is this a possibility?
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Would rather keep Glazer's than Qatar.
 
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Reapersoul20 said:
Hard to argue against Liew's conclusion, although some of the uneducated spunkbuckets in this thread would:



Arguably the biggest club in english football being owned by a foreign nation-state would be truly depressing.
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True, though I suspect that back in 2012 the author and his colleagues were too busy screaming “Aguerrooo” and “we hate manyoo” to care about state ownership or ethical regimes.

So, fcuk them.
 
JPB said:
We're Manchester United. We're going to get lumped in with City, PSG and Chelsea. That's my worst nightmare. I would rather get relegated than everyone calling us a dirty oil club who got lucky winning the lottery and are now winning things again just because of oil money.
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Hahaha what??
 
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