Why did our football peak during lockdown?

Paolo Di Canio

"we have to realise it's a doggy dog market"
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Im sure you are all witnessing the videos surfacing during lockdown and some of our great team goals we scored with no fans in the stadium, some excellent counter attacking moves, fast, one touch, movement off the ball etc

What has changed since?

- Ole was onto something?

- No fans = no pressure?

- The coaching staff had more insight into
players off the field habits?

- Greenwood and Cavani were more important than we thought?

We still have the same structure with Bruno and Rashford heading our attack, but its like the players they were then and now are night and day, we are clueless in attack with arguabley better players now


Whats your take on it?
 
We have friends in the Chinese black hat deep state that tweaked the bioweapon for Man Utd players.

It was a peculiar time in a lot of ways, maybe the focus and pressure changed for a while in ways that could benefit (or be a detriment) to some teams.
 
Because these players wilt in high-intensity, high-pressure environments. Like any stadium that has fans in them.
 
A combo of things being good with Ole, the system working with the personnel available and being before that tranafer window (sancho, Varane and Ronaldo)

The lack of fans made a difference too as it left teams without someone to spur them on, OT can often be bad when we're losing and for many teams if they get a sniff their fans really get behind them.

I actually think the summer 2021 window may be our worst post-Fergie for the damage it did.
 
horsechoker said:
A combo of things being good with Ole, the system working with the personnel available and being before that tranafer window (sancho, Varane and Ronaldo)

The lack of fans made a difference too as it left teams without someone to spur them on, OT can often be bad when we're losing and for many teams if they get a sniff their fans really get behind them.

I actually think the summer 2021 window may be our worst post-Fergie for the damage it did.
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It really is quite spectacular how bad that window turned out to be. From such lofty expectations to such despair in such a short amount of time … and now that group is all gone.
 
I don't think it can be understated how bad we are away from home. No fans was a big help for us.
 
git_united said:
It really is quite spectacular how bad that window turned out to be. From such lofty expectations to such despair in such a short amount of time … and now that group is all gone.
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After that Leeds game I really felt like United were going to have a big season and heck even after the Newcastle game it still felt that way.

Then the Young Boys game happened
 
Paolo Di Canio said:
Im sure you are all witnessing the videos surfacing during lockdown and some of our great team goals we scored with no fans in the stadium, some excellent counter attacking moves, fast, one touch, movement off the ball etc

What has changed since?

- Ole was onto something?

- No fans = no pressure?

- The coaching staff had more insight into
players off the field habits?

- Greenwood and Cavani were more important than we thought?

We still have the same structure with Bruno and Rashford heading our attack, but its like the players they were then and now are night and day, we are clueless in attack with arguabley better players now


Whats your take on it?
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We often have a peak in the managers first or second season for a few months. It happened under LVG, Jose, Ole and EtH. All 4 had some really good runs for part of a season. Ole's coincided with lock down. That's all imo.

fps said:
Because these players wilt in high-intensity, high-pressure environments. Like any stadium that has fans in them.
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I did expect this to be said. I don't think our players are any weaker mentally than most others. They're just not as good of a team.
 
We had goalscorers back then.

Grenwood, Martial, Rashford and a half season of Bruno scored 74 goals in 2019/20

Then we added Cavani and those 5 scored 78 goals the next season.

Ole is the only coach that did anything remotely positive with our attack. We managed 73 goals in 2021/22. The only season we have got more than 70 goals in the league since Sir Alex left. It's not even that high a total either. Shows how we really bad we have been.
 
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git_united said:
It really is quite spectacular how bad that window turned out to be. From such lofty expectations to such despair in such a short amount of time … and now that group is all gone.
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It seemed like Ole wanted to play more on the front foot in 21/22 instead of counter attacking/transition, what ever you want to call it, like he did in previous seasons. Having Ronaldo thrust upon him by Woodward meant the team had to change to accommodate him. Ole said himself in an interview that in hindsight we shouldn't have re-signed Ronaldo.

Would love to know how the dynamic changed in the team/dressing room after those first 3 games, which we did ok in, 2 wins and a draw.
 
thegregster said:
We had goalscorers back then.

Grenwood, Martial, Rashford and a half season of Bruno scored 74 goals in 2019/20

Then we added Cavani and those 5 scored 78 goals the next season.

Ole is the only coach that did anything remotely positive with our attack. We managed 73 goals in 2021/22. The only season we have got more than 70 goals in the league since Sir Alex left. It's not even that high a total either. Shows how we really bad we have been.
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Add Pogba in there as well. Bruno played his best football in his first season and a half, with Pogba and Matic behind him.

 
madzo2007 said:
It seemed like Ole wanted to play more on the front foot in 21/22 instead of counter attacking/transition, what ever you want to call it, like he did in previous seasons. Having Ronaldo thrust upon him by Woodward meant the team had to change to accommodate him. Ole said himself in an interview that in hindsight we shouldn't have re-signed Ronaldo.

Would love to know how the dynamic changed in the team/dressing room after those first 3 games, which we did ok in, 2 wins and a draw.
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I don't think we'd have won the league that season but we'd have probably finished top 4 again without Ronaldo. Pogba and Varane's injuries, Greenwood from January, Cavani not interested and Sancho not materialising would probably have left us muddling through anyway.

It would have been interesting where Ole would have been had he finished top 4 again. Would the board have kept him on? Probably, but with ten Hag (don't at me) looking promising we may have gone with him anyway.

Had we not signed Ronaldo also, it's possible we would have signed an attacker in January as Cavani had checked out so we might have got lucky like we did with Fernandes.
 
Ole inherited the most talented/capable squad out of all our managers.

Rashford, Greenwood, Martial, Pogba and then we added Bruno Fernandes soon after. That was a very capable attacking outfit.

The crazy thing was that, despite all that attacking talent he was still so incompetent that we only ever scored a maximum of 73 league goals under him - a total that was bettered by 7 clubs in the league just last season.

Soon after him, his mismanagement (especially with injuries) permanently damaged potentially 3 of those players.
 
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We had a defined plan at the time and it coincided with our players being at the right age and levels to blend with each other and suited what the manager wanted. It wasn't good enough to challenge for the Prem, but we did have a squad that suited each other and the manager and we were building towards that. It then got ripped up as Ole tried to change to something that could in his eyes make the step up, but he wasn't able of implementing that and the players we signed then broke that chemistry that we had.
 
horsechoker said:
I don't think we'd have won the league that season but we'd have probably finished top 4 again without Ronaldo. Pogba and Varane's injuries, Greenwood from January, Cavani not interested and Sancho not materialising would probably have left us muddling through anyway.

It would have been interesting where Ole would have been had he finished top 4 again. Would the board have kept him on? Probably, but with ten Hag (don't at me) looking promising we may have gone with him anyway.

Had we not signed Ronaldo also, it's possible we would have signed an attacker in January as Cavani had checked out so we might have got lucky like we did with Fernandes.
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Did Cavani only check out because Ronaldo came, taking his shirt number and him becoming the main man. It seemed Ole was integrating Sancho in slowly, think he was injured or ill during preseason so wasn't fully fit, would have been interesting to see how Ole would have handled him.
 
We had a functional midfield, which enabled the attack and defense to do well
 
Lack of pressure, a lot of penalties and some players hitting top form like Martial, Shaw and Bruno.
 
We already started struggling at the end of that season when teams adapted to us. They started to press our midfield more or park the bus which was reflected in the Euro final.
 
No fans = less pressure. Also lowered expectations. That's all there was to it. You crapped all over yourselves as soon as there was the slightest bit of pressure on you. Leipzig. Up there with City in March, promptly drop out of any title race talk over the next 3 games. Villarreal.
 
People don’t understand how much a player like Matic balances a team. A real shame we got him at the end of his peak years. We’ve simply never had an anchor like him since
 
giorno said:
No fans = less pressure. Also lowered expectations. That's all there was to it. You crapped all over yourselves as soon as there was the slightest bit of pressure on you. Leipzig. Up there with City in March, promptly drop out of any title race talk over the next 3 games. Villarreal.
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January. Went top after GW19 with 40 points (admittedly City had a game game in hand, and were 2 behind).

Then won 2 of the next 8, and by Gameweek 27 we were 14 behind Man City.
 
horsechoker said:
I don't think we'd have won the league that season but we'd have probably finished top 4 again without Ronaldo. Pogba and Varane's injuries, Greenwood from January, Cavani not interested and Sancho not materialising would probably have left us muddling through anyway.

It would have been interesting where Ole would have been had he finished top 4 again. Would the board have kept him on? Probably, but with ten Hag (don't at me) looking promising we may have gone with him anyway.

Had we not signed Ronaldo also, it's possible we would have signed an attacker in January as Cavani had checked out so we might have got lucky like we did with Fernandes.
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Yeah we wouldn’t have won but Ole definitely would have stayed on. The next step would have been to find our long term number 9 and Matic’s replacement. Seems like a lifetime ago now…. So much disappointment since then…. Back to my beer.
 
git_united said:
Yeah we wouldn’t have won but Ole definitely would have stayed on. The next step would have been to find our long term number 9 and Matic’s replacement. Seems like a lifetime ago now…. So much disappointment since then…. Back to my beer.
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We'd have needed to replace Pogba too, I doubt he'd have stayed.

Wasn't Casemiro a club signing? I think we'd have got him but we wouldn't have signed Eriksen, Martinez and Antony. Greenwood needed replacing too assuming in this alternate reality he does what he did.
 
DOTA said:
Martial and Rashford were fit and in form.
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Yup. They made the attack work because one could hold it up and the other could make runs, and both could finish. Can't find a basic skillset like that from any of our current attackers.

Also the other guy. Also Bruno in the middle of his streak, and Pogba passing from deep.
 
We were not indulging ourselves in needles tiki taka type possession based football. It was all about keeping shape, quick counters and crisp passing. Not too dissimilar to the 4-0 FC during earlier Jose era. As a football club, we were doing what we have always done best, instead of trying to me mini pep.

And we will remained destined to keep repeating the same nonsense because we have bought into a style of football which just looks alien.

Ole was on to something because he knew how the team plays best, until of course Ronaldo was dumped upon him for marketing reasons.
 
giorno said:
No fans = less pressure. Also lowered expectations. That's all there was to it. You crapped all over yourselves as soon as there was the slightest bit of pressure on you. Leipzig. Up there with City in March, promptly drop out of any title race talk over the next 3 games. Villarreal.
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So this benefitted United but not most other teams?
 
horsechoker said:
We'd have needed to replace Pogba too, I doubt he'd have stayed.

Wasn't Casemiro a club signing? I think we'd have got him but we wouldn't have signed Eriksen, Martinez and Antony. Greenwood needed replacing too assuming in this alternate reality he does what he did.
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Not a big assumption…does Greenwood do what he did if Ronaldo never came? Probably.
 
We didn't, we weren't very good, few players hit a run of form and we won a few games. It was overrated and things like a Matic Pogba midfield were always going to fall on their arse. Rashford and Martial were 'tired' and doing zero work off the ball. Greenwood the same.
 
1) Martial, Rashford, Pogba and Bruno all in peak form
2) Greenwood exploding onto the scene
2) Less pressure with empty stadiums
3) There was good harmony and mutual respect throughout the squad. Ronaldo's arrival did a lot of damage to that the following season
 
stevoc said:
So this benefitted United but not most other teams?
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Yes. It benefited the really talented but also young and inexperienced big club side. Same thing happened to Milan for example. Only difference is they were able to build upon that confidence and went on to win the league afterwards
 
No Cristiano Ronaldo. As soon as he joined it all went downhill, before then it was a team playing freely with no egoes and everyone olaying for each other.
 

Why did our football peak during lockdown?​

It didn't.

We played some good counter-attacking football but were still wildly inconsistent. Go top and promptly lose at home to relegation certainties Sheffield United inconsistent.

Did not win any trophies, either.

We finished a distant second and thought we were hot shit suddenly. The season after started apace but eventually still trophyless Ole, bless him, got cruelly found out by the likes of Rafa, Dean Smith, Moyes and was eviscerated by a vengeful Scouse.

We just did not learn any lessons at all.

Blood Mage said:
Ronaldo's arrival did a lot of damage to that the following season
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It did, but I would argue he revealed a lot about United which marginal success concealed.

Ronaldo's arrival was massive and the players loved it. Seen as the missing piece in our puzzle, CR7 was destined to return and lead us to immediate glory.

However, having an infinite all-time champion gets tiresome whenever their proven standards are not met. Some players cowered under it. Happy finishing third and positive vibes but not title races or coping with pressure.

I was happy when Ronaldo left but grateful enough to accept he didn't join us for the good times. Can't be said of many other major transfers.
 
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