I want him gone because no matter where he'd play, we possibly have better players. He holds back the team by starting automatically.
Who wants Rooney gone and who wants him to stay
- Thread starter 032Devil
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I don't disagree with your post but think it is unfair to say he is not comparable to the above players because most of them played here for a short period at their peak. Only Robson and Keane were here for the period of time Rooney has been and by the end both of them were not the same player that got them legendary status and salary.
I don't think Rooney should be here anymore in fact I just changed my vote from undecided because I just think some players have different career spans and his is coming to an end. However we shouldn't forget everything he did for this club when his body was not failing him. During his key years he was up there with RVP, Ruud, Ronaldo and even Cantona in terms of impact on the club. He was our heartbeat for so long he deserves to be remembered as a United legend.
When we go on the pre-season tour in China, just leave him there - job done.
This in a nutshell. If he plays as striker, then Ibra and Rashford offer more. If he plays as a 10, I would prefer to see Mata or Herrera there. And thank f*ck Mourinho came out and squashed the "Rooney in midfield" bull*it before it escalated
Genuine question
If we forget how good he was between 2006-2011, forget his reputation, his scoring records for England and United etc... How good is Wayne Rooney now as a football player in 2016 on talent alone?
Personally, I don't think on talent alone, he even breaks into the best 20 PL players any more. Maybe not even the top 30.
If we forget how good he was between 2006-2011, forget his reputation, his scoring records for England and United etc... How good is Wayne Rooney now as a football player in 2016 on talent alone?
Personally, I don't think on talent alone, he even breaks into the best 20 PL players any more. Maybe not even the top 30.
No.........no he wasn't.
When he goes, you wont here his name sung the week after, never mind the decade after
I'll give you Ronaldo and possibly Cantona but don't think its as close as you think and certainly not with Ruud and RVP (who only had 1 good season here). Rooney was definitely a world class player for a couple of years and was our talisman in the same way Ruud was.
Anyone who denies that has either been blinded by his poor performances over recent years or never let go of the anger that he said he wanted to leave to go to City. The latter is why he won't have songs sung not because his performances from 2005-2010 were not good enough.
Only in England do we debate something like this. Your absolutely correct he isnt even one of the best strikers in the league anymore. I think you guys hold onto the past too long. An example I think of is Raul, he knew, and the people at Madrid knew when his time was up at the elite level. Rooney's time went 2 seasons back, but the English media, culture still hold onto that belief that the old Wayne Rooney is still in there.
It's over guys. He would struggle in a mid table team in the EPL these days
Worst thing about it is how exaggerated are his actions when he does something that ranges from ok to good. A long pass from to an isolated full back is praised like it was never seen before. Tbh, I wonder if most us are crazy on the caf because he's still so highly rated in the media. What does he get rarely criticized ?
I don't think he was. He was a very good player. He would put in the occasional world class performance. What he did in his best years was the donkey work for Ronaldo.
Wayne Rooney has never, ever put in 10 performances in 20 games that where world class. He has only a couple of genuine "wow" moments in his entire career. His debut (arguably his best performance in a United shirt), the volley against Newcastle, the biccy against city and maybe the goal at upton park.......Note the level / stage / opposition. World Class is Ronaldo, Messi, Bale, Iniesta, Di Maria performance in Champions League Final.....Zidane in World CUp finals and Hamden Park......fat Ronaldo....Ronaldinho against Real Madrid. Sorry but Wayne Rooney has never been close to that.
World class players perform a a much higher level than him far more consistently.
Rooney is a posh mans Jonathan Walters. Nothing wrong with that. It should not be seen as a criticism because he's had a very good career.
The only criteria should be - is he good enough to be the first choice main/support striker for a top 3 EPL and perennial CL semi finalist side? You know the level we are trying really hard to get back to. The answer, imo and to most not blinded by sentimentality and fanboyism is clearly no! I wouldn't mind if, even at his obscene wage, he is relegated to squad player status and gets to start matches on merit not through special privileges that smack of a manager scared shitless of what Rooney's media buddies will do to him if he dares acknowledge what we have seen over the past three years and acts on it.
This is historical revisionism at its worst and has no basis in reality. Rooney's mistake has been staying around too long especially after alienating the fans. If he hadn't done the city thing, people would have accepted his decline like they did that of Neville.
Also by your logic a team full of world class players such as Scholes, Giggs, Ferdinand, Tevez, Vidic, Evra etc were just doing donkey work for Ronaldo. You make it seem like one of the best United teams ever was like Wales with Bale. A well drilled team with one star player.
Jesus i've heard some shit on here in regards to Rooney and then theres this.
Look at his scoring record over his United career despite not being an out and out striker for the vast majority of it. Right up there with the best strikers around. He was world class for quite a few years. He's been on the decline for the last few years but lets not re-write history.
The worst thing is for all we know he never even wanted to go to City. There is no solid info to suggest there was any real link beyond tabloid bullshit that seems to have stuck in peoples minds as fact.
That effectively what Fergie always had. We always have hard working mentally strong payers that did their jobs and had 1 player….Eric, Ruud, Ronaldo and RVP…..that made the difference.
Don’t get me wrong, Scholes, Gigsy, Rio, Vida and Evra where indeed all world class. But they played in an entirely different position to Rooney. They all fulfilled the role dictated by their position to a world class level.
As a goal scorer and finisher, Rooney isn’t world class and never was.
As a provider he isn’t world class and never was
As a passer he isn’t world class and never was
As a dribbler he isn’t world class and never was.
As a header of the ball he isn’t world class and never was.
His movement isn’t world class and never was.
At his very best, his hunger, work rate and passion where exceptional, combined with his then pace and power and generally being a good player made him a very good player. Never world class.
What he was is irrelevant anyway. Lets agree to disagree on Rooney at his peak. He’s now far from that. Rooney the player he is now would get nowhere near any of our title winning teams and if we intend on winning the league again this season, he should be nowhere near it.
For me, he’s been finished since he renewed after the first contract dispute. After the City threat. To be fair, he was right. And it goes back to what I said earlier about players being selfish. Wayne Rooney knew he needed Tevez and Ronaldo to make him look better. To make his job easier and to increase his chances of winning the league. He was bang on that the club appeared to lack ambition by letting them too go and replacing them with Valencia. He went about it wrong but the sentiment was correct. The show is on the other foot now though, we are showing a lack of ambition by not being ruthless enough to get rid of him.
Rooney's best season was the 2009/10 campaign, the one after Ronaldo left.
That was the closest he ever got to a genuinely consistent full season of world class performances, he was fantastic right up to his injury in Munich.
He finished the 2010/11 season well and he scored a lot in 2011/12, even if his all round performances were pretty average, but then after that it was a slow gradual decline in my opinion. People seem to forget, Rooney's game started to deteriorate when Fergie was still here and everything was settled.
That was the closest he ever got to a genuinely consistent full season of world class performances, he was fantastic right up to his injury in Munich.
He finished the 2010/11 season well and he scored a lot in 2011/12, even if his all round performances were pretty average, but then after that it was a slow gradual decline in my opinion. People seem to forget, Rooney's game started to deteriorate when Fergie was still here and everything was settled.
I think you're going to have another rude awakening like you did with LVG. Mourinho is a big admirer of Rooney and he will play him in his proper position.
I think so too.
I think he's start behind Zlatan.
But I think his inept performances will stand out like a saw thumb and Jose will be ruthless enough to drop him. He wont be able to hide, or be carried.
His goal scoring record is as a result of longevity not pure class. A world class forward playing for United for 12 years would have smashed that record out of sight years ago.
It was like this in the Euro's first match v Russia. He played a few long balls to the right and gave a 7/10 performance, but the media and fans on here jumped on it and even created the cringeworthy "Rooney midfield General" thread. Fortunately the dream was instantly shattered by his performance versus Iceland and I am so happy Mourinho came out and said what he did.
I have wanted him gone ever since the first contract crap.
I don't like him , never have done, but while he is a United player I will clap and cheer when he does well and slag him off when he does bad, but once he has gone that will be it, I wont care who he plays for or what he does.
I don't like him , never have done, but while he is a United player I will clap and cheer when he does well and slag him off when he does bad, but once he has gone that will be it, I wont care who he plays for or what he does.
Aye like Ronaldo has done at Real or Messi at Barca. Does anyone really believe it would take RVN the best part of thirteen years to score circa 250 club goals? That he has taken this long is testament to his inconsistency which meant that no manager trusted him totally as a goal scorer and always had to me moved around to accommodate more reliable goal getters.
You also need to look at the importance of goals.
When I think back to our early premier league / double winning days. I remember a lot of 1-0 cantona’s. I remember the volleyed lob mid week at home to arsenal. I remember the volley away at Newcastle. I remember the last minute volley at Wembley against Liverpool.
When I remember the Ruud days, we had basically a season of 1-0 Ruud. Winners. Big game winners.
When I remember the Ronaldo years, I remember goals in cup finals, I remember goals in Champions League finals, I remember the screamer away against Porto when we were flat and struggling. I remember the last minute winner away at Fulham.
RVP….countless winners. The last minute free kick away at city.
All game changers. All contributions to a title / double winning season.
I honestly do not recall a last minute, big game decisive Wayne Rooney winner. I don’t recall him dragging us through big games with massive performances.
Zlatan will. Even at his age. Zlatan, miki and martial this season will be a damming indictment of the level of player Wayne Rooney now is.
The only way I won't mind him is if he accepts a very different role, basically that he won't be a starter but a bench warmer.
Let him have his testimonial and as he is walking off, someone convince Koeman to hand him a contract from Everton. (Even then he would struggle to get into that team with Lukaku up top and Barkley behind)
I feel sorry for any player if this is now the yardstick they are being held up to. What Messi and Ronaldo have been doing is phenomenal and we won't see it again for a long time. They are abnormal in how they stay fit all season, play every match and are just ruthless. However that is what has put them up as challengers for the best player ever.
As for Ruud, he had the system set up to play completely through him as an out and out striker and luckily had Beckham at his peak putting pin point crosses in. The season Rooney played as dedicated centre forward, the focus of our team whilst still being fit he had a great season and did score more than 30 goals.
Anyway I have a feeling I am not changing anyone's mind so I'll stop after this...
Every successful United player has been mentally strong but try telling Eric that Kanchelskis, Sharpe and Giggs were just hard working or Ruud that Beckham and Scholes were just hard working. These were top class creative talent that ripped the league to shreds. The reason we have been successful for so long is that goals and assists are able to come from everyone exactly the opposite of relying on one player. We have never been Liverpool for gods sake.
Except that isn't true his scoring record is right up there with the best. I posted this last september when someone else made the same assertion (accurate up to Sep 2015 so it obviously doesn't include last season or the equivalent seasons of other strikers).
And i'll say the same now as back then, considering he's only ever really had 1-2 seasons where he played as a 9, and the fact he never took penalties for the first 5-6 years of his career. I think it's pretty fecking impressive.
So after seeing his numbers compared to the likes of Shearer, RVN and Law do you still believe that?
Jesus wept
He is past his peak now, only heading in one direction
Would even let him go at a cut price deal thus saving big on over inflated wages!
Would even let him go at a cut price deal thus saving big on over inflated wages!
And what about matches played? Ruud had a ratio close to 0.7 while Rooney is under 0.5 I believe for example. (Goals per match)
Can't believe some of the things being written here, trying to make him out as some sort of Emile Heskey, yes he's not a Ronaldo or Messi but was a top player at his peak, don't know how people can deny this.
I have never denied that, at his prime he was WC but he is not any more.
Not sure anyone is claiming he is WC anymore?
I know that, was just making a point.
Why 18-29 when Rooney is closing in on 31? Shearer spent a large part of career playing for Newcastle where Rooney had ten uninterrupted years playing for what was then a top two side alongside creative talents like Scholes, Giggs etc. Didn't Ruud had two seasons effectively written off due to injury during that period? The only excuse he has is that of being shunted around but then someone could say he suffered that fate because managers didn't have absolute faith in his reliability/consistency in his favoured position.
Be that as it may he has been a great servant and if he didn't have those ugly contract renewal periods he'd be a legend imo. Those instances to me tainted his legacy and I now view him as a high priced whore who has overstayed.
Ah the ever shifting goalposts of a Rooney bashing debate.
Yes Van Nistelrooy does indeed have a better ratio as you would expect from someone who played his entire career upfront and took penalties for the duration of it.
Heres goals/games ratio of the three for the previously mentioned period:
Shearer P-467 G-236
Nistelrooy P-341 G-237
Rooney P-479 G-233
His scoring record is still very impressive and not solely down to longevity. He was a top player for a long period of time.
What, no ready list of match-winners and dominant performances against decent opponents? *waits*
Look, we can all be as exasperated as you are, no matter if we're pro or anti-Rooney; but 'Jesus wept' proves nothing.