Who are the "problem" players.

sdb4884 said:
Not kidding we need around 5-6 actually good players to replace the dead wood that has accumulated and started to rot. AWB, Maguire, Casemiro, Martial, Rashford even Fernandes all need to go. We can make some good money off the latter two.
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He's had a bad season but it's crazy to suggest getting rid of Bruno IMO. That's a drastic decision that should only be made if we were able to bring 6 or 7 players in this summer.
 
Sandikan said:
We seem to have this thread every season, even thought the playing cast changes.
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True. We do like to acquire mercenaries though and we also have a rotten culture. Some of the players have been here quite a long time too.

Thinking about it differently, I can think about maybe 5-6 players who have left us in the last few seasons that have likely been top professionals (some of whom were rapidly declining). Mata, Matic, Fellaini, Young. Out of those I'd say Young and Matic are ones that drive the team on a bit, Matic more so. So it really is slim pickings in terms of players with the commensurate mentality for a club wanting to compete. In our current squad we see Bruno clearly have desire, but it is a bit wayward at times. There is no other leader type in the side besides maybe Martinez, but he's been out all season.

In terms of attitude I think this squad is nowhere near where this club wants to apparently go. So a new manager or not, this squad obviously needs a major overhaul.

There are likely loads of players in the squad too that are uncertain about their futures and that won't do anyone any good either. With a manager walking the tightrope too it obviously has all the makings of a completely demoralised camp.

Will be interesting to see if there is any appetite in this team for those dead rubber matches in the league.
 
It's not about attitude problems but I feel most of our players are not that good and should be sold.
 
Silverman said:
Ill preface this by saying I think the squad is a shambles and we need to sell the vast majority.

Are there many players that are actually causing problems or are they just not good enough/past it?
Ya hear people saying that they have thrown managers under the bus but it's hard to pinpoint specific players in the squad that are actual bad eggs.

For example, I think Casemiro has a great mentality but his legs are gone and he just isn't up to it but I don't think he's a player casing problems.

What players are the main culprits that are at fault for the mess we're in?
Or is our biggest issue with the squad that they just aren't good enough?
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Rashford is the obvious one in this case (Martial as well but he's the walking embodiment of redundant by this point.) I think Bruno is problematic in other ways but not because he has a bad attitude. Then there are obviously players who just need to go because they are not good enough and have been here far too long (AWB, McTominay, and Lindelof are the ones who immediately spring to mind in this case.) And then there is Antony...
 
Chairman Steve said:
They fall into three categories for me:
  • Not good enough
  • Don‘t care
  • Not good enough and don’t care
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I agree.

This is how I see it:

............Onana................
Dalot........CB...Licha...LB
..........MF......Mainoo.....
Garnacho (RW)...Bruno...LW (Garnacho)
...............CF.................

So, we need at least five players who can walk into our starting XI and make an immediate impact.
I don't trust Dalot on the RB, but he's decent enough as we certainly won't be able to buy another player in that position.
We should see if Mount can stay injury-free. I believe we can still get something out of him.
Hojlund needs a serious competition. At the moment, he's not good enough to be our only option as a striker.
Give Amad more games.
Sell Rashford, if someone wants to pay for him. The most important aspect is to offload his salary.
Try to get rid of the following players: Casemiro, Evans, Malacia, Amrabat, Antony.
Keep Varane and McT as squad players as they are both experienced, plus we can't replace every player in the team. Same goes for Shaw.
As for Lindelof and Maguire... I don't even know... I cant believe we're still discussing them, seems like they've been in the club since the dawn of the time. I f they remain, it's evident they shouldn't be anything more than rotation players.
 
Probably not a problem player but aside from the most obvious player that needs to be kicked on the Eurostar Casemiro is Bugging the shit out of me
 
Chicharo said:
I agree.

This is how I see it:

............Onana................
Dalot........CB...Licha...LB
..........MF......Mainoo.....
Garnacho (RW)...Bruno...LW (Garnacho)
...............CF.................

So, we need at least five players who can walk into our starting XI and make an immediate impact.
I don't trust Dalot on the RB, but he's decent enough as we certainly won't be able to buy another player in that position.
We should see if Mount can stay injury-free. I believe we can still get something out of him.
Hojlund needs a serious competition. At the moment, he's not good enough to be our only option as a striker.
Give Amad more games.
Sell Rashford, if someone wants to pay for him. The most important aspect is to offload his salary.
Try to get rid of the following players: Casemiro, Evans, Malacia, Amrabat, Antony.
Keep Varane and McT as squad players as they are both experienced, plus we can't replace every player in the team. Same goes for Shaw.
As for Lindelof and Maguire... I don't even know... I cant believe we're still discussing them, seems like they've been in the club since the dawn of the time. I f they remain, it's evident they shouldn't be anything more than rotation players.
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The back 4 and holding/defensive midfielder are our biggest problems. That's what nearly cost us yesterday.

That has to be the priority this summer. We'll be with ok with Dalot and AWB at right back for another season but unless Martinez and Shaw can find a way to stay fit, we need to sign two first choice centre backs and a left back.

For me, Maguire and Lindelof aren't good enough but they've largely escaped criticism because they appear to be trying when they play. Perhaps, you keep one of them and bring in another rotation option

Onto the midfield. Casemiro can't run and needs replacing. Amrabat isn't at the level required so we shouldn't sign permanently. You arguably need two for their position. Ideally, you want someome young enough to build long term with but need an experienced option aswell.

If you can somehow sort that out (so at least 4 signings but ideally 6) then you need to look at Hojlund. Bring in cover for him that won't disrupt his potential development.

Onto the other players, I've not seen anything consistently from Amad or Pellestri to suggest that they can be long term options. If you can sell one and keep the other for Europa/Conference League group matches. If you can then sell Sancho, Greenwood and Antony, you might bring in enough money to buy serious competition for Rashford and Garnacho.

Eriksen, Varane and Martial will all presumably be released this summer. Brandon Williams will move on aswell. That will bring create a fairly significant saving on wages.
 
Rashford because he clearly brings everyone down with him too. Cannot stand the guy
 
Very hard to judge many players because the team isn't organised or set up well. Personally, I think ETH gives too much detail in what he wants and the players don't understand it because it's too in depth. We will have a better picture once we get a new manager in.
Rashford is a worry and his attitude looks horrendous. You can see players like Dalot and AWB are giving it their all. Casemiro does look like a problem long term as we saw yesterday how far off the pace of the game he is (haven't look physical fit and lean all season) - hopefully he will take a way out rather than festering on the bench which he will do. Erickson needs to be sold this Summer too - he hasn't looked remotely interested this season either and is a bit part player.
 
Problem players -

Rashford and Martial. - No desire.
Casamiro and Erikson. - too old and too slow
Mctominay - goes missing most games. Not good enough despite chipping in with goals.
Anthony - not good enough, one trick pony and a pratt
Varane - far to injury prone,
martinez and Shaw both class but sadly injury prone.
Bruno - erratic.
 
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Wanting Bruno out the door is madness.

He is one of the very few that actually tries to put in a shift every game.

Get quality players around him and he would be great again.

There are a whole list of players I'd rather boot out the door before Bruno.
 
Genuinely the only players I'd keep if I was a new manager would be:

Onana, Dalot, Shaw, Maguire, Martinez, Mainoo, Garnacho, Mount, Hojlund

And then I have question marks over Onana (Ability), Shaw (fitness), Maguire (Pace) and Mount (General).

What a mess.
 
  • Varane & Casemiro - overpaid mercenaries who don't give a shite
  • Rashford - mentally gone, discipline issues, overpaid
  • AWB - lazy, disinterested or stupid - possibly all three
  • Shaw - highly talented but constantly injured, has been present nearly the entirety of our years of failure and I get the impression from him he doesn't give a shit
  • Sancho/Martial - don't even need to explain these ones
  • Eriksen - a non-entity, skilled but mentally checked out. The only reason I wouldn't bracket him with Case/Varane is because he probably isn't paid that much
Build the team around players who have a strong mentality and workrate - Bruno, Hojlund, Garnacho, Onana, Martinez, Dalot.

McTominay, Antony, Lindelof, Maguire - just not good enough but probably fine as backup options. At least each of them (maybe not Lindelof) seem to have a strong mentality.
 
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I don’t think it’s that bad, we just need to replace Casemiro and Rashford and get a left back.

Dalot and AWB for competition and backup is fine. It’s easy to pinpoint one or two bad games, but they’ve overall progressed quite a lot from 2 years ago.

Mainoo needs a tough and solid partner

We need a winger who plays fluidly with the team and creates a lot/seeks to be heavily involved.

Maguire’s been quite alright this year, so he can play a full year imo, but get a center back talent in also. A shame we missed out on Kim.
 
Regulus Arcturus Black said:
Gotta say, the bolded is an absolutely INSANE take after how he has come back this season.
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The problem is lack of ability. He'd do well in a team like West ham, not a team going for the title.

I'd rid of Rashford, Martial, AWB, Antony, Maguire, Lindeloff, Malacia, Varane, Casemiro, Eriksen, Mctominay. I'd give Bruno another season but if an upgrade becomes available I'd bench him. He is overrated on this forum.
 
Ignoring likes of Sancho, Greenwood and VDB who aren’t part of the current squad…

to leave - at any price pretty much
Antony
Martial (already gone isn’t he?/not being renewed)
Eriksen
Casemiro
Varane (same as Martial?)
Lindelof

To leave for a reasonable fee
Rashford
Wan Bissaka

Maguire and McTominay I’m happy to let stay. Both have their obvious limitations, but if used right McTominay has shown he can be a useful player (10 goals) and I think Maguire has been our only (mostly) reliable defender all season.

So that leaves us with needing at least…
2 cb’s, of which one needs to be straight into first team alongside Martinez,
2 mobile cm’s
a winger
and another striker
Probably another back up keeper too.

And that’s just the beginning really.
 
We have wasted so much money on players that are either past it or simply not good enough and some are just outright shite.
 
Casemiro and Antony are probably the two biggest ones. Both Ten Hag signings, funnily enough. Sancho likely falls into the same camp if he returns.

Rashford and Fernandes are players who I think will perennially blow hot and cold. They'll need replacing in the longer term, if not this summer. A better coach could get more out of both of them but neither should have such a prominent role in our squad anymore.
 
We need to be ruthless in order to set the tone for our club moving into the future…

Manager - Graham Potter (trusted by new leadership)

Xi-
Onana

Dalot - TODIBO - BRANTHWAITE - Martinez(c)

Mainoo - ONANA - THURAM

Garnacho - Hojlund - NETO


Consider offers for players over the age of 21 to change current climate, generate funds and to enable a reset of current wage structure.

Use suitable reserve & youth team graduates to develop 25 man first team squad.

Understand it as a 2/3 year project to establish a new playing philosophy & team culture then be ready to compete for titles.
 
Chairman Steve said:
They fall into three categories for me:
  • Not good enough
  • Don‘t care
  • Not good enough and don’t care
The ones who don’t care are the ones we need to urgently get rid of, as they are a negative influence on the culture of the dressing room, especially for some of our younger, more impressionable players.
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Agree with this, id be generous enough to add a couple of other categories

*Good enough and cares enough (Mainoo, I'd probably lump Garnacho into this as well, I'm not surprised he's getting annoyed at always being the one to be subbed while Rashford performs poorly). Rasmus it's impossible to tell as I think he's been given an unenviable task and there should be a second senior striker to play alongside him, and he was looking good before his injury. I definitely wouldn't question his attitude, and I'd like to see what happens when he's receiving proper coaching and a proper system

*Always injured so can't comment - I'd like to put Licha into the category above, but he's always injured (probably because of being rushed back), thus making him fall into the category of not being able to be relied upon, I wouldn't question his attitude or ability, so it's sad he's fallen into this injury cycle, because he's one of the few I'd happily keep. Mount - impossible to tell which of the categories he falls into, because he's always injured, likewise Malacia

Martial probably this category, and doesn't care. Shaw, I'd probably say is good enough, but unsure in terms of attitude, and again, is always injured

The likes of Bruno, Dalot and McT - I wouldn't question their attitude for all of Bruno's whining, but in the long term they are players who need to be replaced if we want to challenge for titles, or at least have better players around them. I'd convert McT to a striker. They do need replacing eventually, but unfortunately there's way more pressing problems (I'm looking at you Rashy, Antony)

Case and Erikson I'd put in the "probably care but legs have gone" category. Varane is a mix of the always injured and legs are starting to go, but I'd probably try and manage him properly and keep for another season, as he's not the biggest problem

ETH would be in the not good enough category

Unfortunately I think only Mainoo and maybe Garnacho are the only ones who could walk into a team which is challenging for titles, that's how far we have fallen and part of why we are where we are now. Inadequate recruitment despite all that money spent
 
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United Hobbit said:
Unfortunately I think only Mainoo and maybe Garnacho are the only ones who could walk into a team which is challenging for titles, that's how far we have fallen and part of why we are where we are now. Inadequate recruitment despite all that money spent
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Even these two as great as they are wouldn't be playing every week. Not because they lack quality just because they're still so young and learning. The fact we're having to play them into the ground at 18/19 is damning.
 
CloneMC16 said:
I honestly think most of our squad isn't good enough.

There are only three players that I'm 100% confident could play for us in a title winning team. Mainoo, Garnacho, and Bruno. Dalot is maybe. He has performed this season more often than not, but I'm not 100% convinced by him. I think Shaw and Martinez are good players, but their availability has been a massive problem.

Two of our worst players this season have been Rashford and Casemiro. You would expect them be carrying the team, but they have been dead weights all season. Casemiro just took one of the worst penalties I've ever seen and he's a 5 time CL winner. If the guy you should be counting on is garbage, the team is in huge trouble.

I don't think the team has many 'bad eggs'. If there are any, the only one is really Rashford. They're just not good enough.
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Exactly how I feel in a nutshell.
 
Onana - Stays, he's starting to look better but needs to cut out time wasting and speed the play out from the back up
AWB - Goes, not good enough and I don't think he has an elite attitude to get us where we want to be
Dalot - Stays, he's probably been our best player this season
Shaw - Stays, but we need a good backup who can stay fit and fight for the LB spot
Malacia - Goes, not good enough for me
Maguire - Goes, not fast enough physically or mentally
Evans - Goes, Willy should get his minutes next season
Willy - Stays, needs to get minutes in the cups next season
Lindelof - Goes, not good enough and never has been
Varane - Goes, too injury prone to be relied on, could stay if he took a wage cut
Martinez - Stays, one more season to see if he can stay fit, if not he'll have to go the season after
Amrabat - Goes, not good enough
Mainoo - Stays, need to build the MF around him
Eriksen - Goes, too slow mentally and physically
Casemiro - Goes, too slow and looks like he's mentally checked out
McTominay - Stays, if used correctly as an impact sub and further forward
Bruno - Stays, gives 100% and runs himself into the ground for the club, if he just directed and conserved his energy and used it wiser he's be great
Anthony - Goes, no where near good enough
Sancho - Stays, I'd be interested to see how he goes with a new manager
Rashford - Goes, he's so lazy it's unbelievable and his attitude is very poor on the pitch IF we could get a new manager bounce out of him for a year then keep and then sell
Garnacho - Stays, should be our nailed on left winger
Diallo - Stays, needs more minutes to show what he can do
Pellestri - Goes, don't think he's the quality we need
Martial - Goes, obviously
Hojlund - Stays, needs to be groomed into the No.9 role learning of one or two experienced strikers we need in the squad

Probably missed some players but that's what I'd do with this lot and how ruthless we need to be (giving Sancho one more year isn't ruthless I know) if we ever want to get back to the top.

11 = Stays, but some on last chance
13 = Goes, due to attitude, fitness or just not being good enough

Next years first XI would include....
Onana
Dalot Martinez New CB Shaw/New LB
Mainoo New CDM
Bruno
New RW Hojlund/New CF Garnacho

New CB needs to be lightening fast, i.e., VDV
New CDM needs to be able to actually screen the defense and be fast to cover Mainoo & Bruno's lack of pace
New CF would be someone like Ivan Toney
 
The only players that I wouldn't sell if a decent offer came in are Mainoo, Martinez and Garnacho. Two kids and a player who has missed the whole season, not a good place to be.

There are some that I would be in more in a rush to sell than others of course, but if money can be brought in from selling them and their wages can be cleared off then I wouldn't miss the majority of them.
 
Rashford, Fernandes, Casemeiro, Shaw, Maguire for different reasons. Rashford -> mentality. Fernandes -> bickering and decision making. Casemeiro --> Past it. Shaw --> Injuries. Maguire --> Not good enough.
 
Attitude problem, it looks from a fan's perspective that Martial (leaving), Rashford, Casemiro are the worst right now. The latter is visibly so done with us he's trying to pick up as many cards as he can.
Quality problem, take your pick. Maybe 3-4 who I think are good enough if we want to challenge for a title.
 
Jose just came out with another interview saying that there are still players at the club he wanted to get rid off because they were not professional enough for a club like United. I wonder who these are - the only ones left from his tenure are Martial, Shaw, Lindelof, Dalot and Rashford right?
 
Freak said:
Jose just came out with another interview saying that there are still players at the club he wanted to get rid off because they were not professional enough for a club like United. I wonder who these are - the only ones left from his tenure are Martial, Shaw, Lindelof, Dalot and Rashford right?
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Martial is a cert, Ragnick also had him as a problem player (along with Cavani and Pogba) and we know Mou's history with him.

I suspect it's only really him he actively wanted out, he thought Shaw could be great but wasn't always focused and I guess tried to toughen him up with the direct comments which backfired and probably shows the changing style of management needed these days with the modern player. That was a big error of judgement from Mourinho but Shaw was young and I think he rated him as a half decent player.

He liked Rashford but I think he, like most people, weren't sure he was that amazing, he signed the other two so it won't be them.
 
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