Which midfielder do you prefer?

Florian Wirtz (offensive midfielder)
Frenkie de Jong (ball advancing conduit) — Bruno Guimarães (box-to-box midfielder)
​
  • de Jong (6): reprises his Ajax role; will collect the ball in the defensive third and progress it vertically. If Barcelona are willing to sell him for €50-60 million, we should absolutely try to lure him — failing there shouldn't be an immediate disqualifier as plenty of Ajax players did much better in their second ago (like Bergkamp, Davids, Sneijder, van der Sar et cetera).​
  • Guimarães (6): willing runner and presser with a well-rounded technical and athletic skill set. The defensive base with him and Frenkie will be slightly imperfect at first as there are some characteristic overlaps, but he definitely has the on-paper qualities to mature into an astute field general type with with the right coaching.​
  • Wirtz (10): no Bruno Fernandes might seem daft at first, but Wirtz is a massive talent — with the best goal + assist contributions for Bundesliga-based players after only Lewandowski, Müller, Håland — and could emerge as a more composed offensive midfielder in short order. Sometimes you have to part ways with your focal point to advance as a team (like Liverpool with Coutinho).​
 
Rice or De Jong would be the dream.
Tchouameni, Neves or Kessie would be a tier below but very good signings.
Kamara, Haidara or Zakaria would be underwhelming but sufficient.
 
golden_blunder said:
I don’t think Dortmund will sell Bellingham in the same season as Haaland and I’m becoming a bit sick of their over estimations on prices. We got done on Sancho. Not saying he won’t come good, just that we paid 20m too much

my preference would be rice + neves or Tielemens
Click to expand...
I also would go for Rice plus Neves.

I would take Tielemens as an alternative to Neves and be very happy but I think Neves seems slightly more rounded and with the game intelligence to fill in if Rice goes on the rampage.
 
I think we need two midfielders in the summer. Rice is going to be the obvious shout, but for 100m I can't see the value.

I've liked Neves for a while now, and he seems attainable and would be open to moving. I also like McGinn. He's added goals and assists to his game, and is a quality all-rounder. I hate his face when we play against Villa, which is always a sign of a players influence on a game.

A midfield 3 of Neves at 6, with Bruno and McGinn as No.8's would tick a lot of boxes for me. They can all pop one in top bin from range, have an eye for a pass and are hard working and adept at winning the ball back.

Of course, I'm sure there are classier players out there that are a little less unproven. Gravenberch springs to mind, and De Jong of course given Barcelona troubles. Neves and McGinn are PL proven, rarely injured and are experienced professionals. Just the base we'd need to cement ourselves as a top 3 team as a first step I think.

A shoutout to Tielemans too, he's having a poor season, so could get a deal done under the radar there. Still a quality player.
 
Pogba and Matic are almost certainly going to leave in the summer and we need to replace the pair of them.

So, a #6 who can actually defend, run around, and not shit themselves on the ball, as well as an #8 who can press, can pass the ball and chip in with the odd goal or few.

We should be going all in for Rice plus another, in my view. I don’t trust the powers that be to sort this, however. They showed little interest in doing so last summer and the problem remains as we do sod all through January.
 
If we are moving to 4-3-3 permanently we really need 3 midfielders added when you look at what we currently have.

#6 - Matic
#8(B2B) - McTominay/Fred
#8(AM) - Bruno/Pogba

Matic and Pogba will be off in the summer and we need a box-to-box upgrade, but sadly I don't see us doing anything in January and then we'll look for one midfield signing in the summer like Tchouameni, a couple of youth promotions and continue to keep starting one of McFred.

#6 - Tchouameni/Garner
#8(B2B) - McTominay/Fred
#8(AM) - Bruno/Hannibal

In summer 2023, if their progression trajectory continues, I can see us trying for Bellingham or Jacob Ramsey to add as a box-to-box.
 
Last edited:
Invictus said:
  • Wirtz: no Bruno Fernandes might seem daft at first, but Wirtz is a massive talent — with the best goal + assist contributions for Bundesliga-based players after only Lewandowski, Müller, Håland — and could emerge as a more composed offensive midfielder in short order. Sometimes you have to part ways with your focal point to advance as a team (like Liverpool with Coutinho).​
Click to expand...
Bruno is nothing like Coutinho who was a liability w/o the ball.
It really is daft to replace the best player on the team with an 18-year old from BL (though he's hugely talented).
 
Seeing how we never solve all our problems in one window I'd say we'd still see at least one of McFred starting next season.

If we are getting just one midfielder to pair with Bruno and Fred/Mctominay then I think it should be someone that can bring composure and control to that midfield. Right now the midfield trio of Bruno Fred and Mctominay are just too careless with the ball

I think Fabian Ruiz can be that player to bring composure to the midfield.
 
Devil may care said:
If we are moving to 4-3-3 permanently we really need 3 midfielders added when you look at what we currently have.

#6 - Matic
#8(B2B) - McTominay/Fred
#8(AM) - Bruno/Pogba
Click to expand...

So Matic and Pogba most likely off this summer. I want to see what Garner can do at 6, but we need a nailed on starting 6 by this summer. That still leaves me wondering what DVB needs to do as our 8 needs a massive upgrade...
 
jamesjimmybyrondean said:
Seeing how we never solve all our problems in one window I'd say we'd still see at least one of McFred starting next season.

If we are getting just one midfielder to pair with Bruno and Fred/Mctominay then I think it should be someone that can bring composure and control to that midfield. Right now the midfield trio of Bruno Fred and Mctominay are just too careless with the ball

I think Fabian Ruiz can be that player to bring composure to the midfield.
Click to expand...

Yeah still feel we need BOTH a CDM and a CM strong on the ball rather than just signing one player who can offer both things
 
Mctominah i thought was very good in the holding MF against Brentford.
 
Watching rice play against us, he will take us to another level. If we are serious and want to win the Champions League we should throw near £200m on him and Verratti. £80m Rice, £90m plus Martial for Verratti (they would problem entertain the deal if pogba was included instead)

Verratti
Rice - Pogba
----bruno-----

Garner/Fred
Mctominay - fred/Dvdb


That will be the best midfield in football no doubt
 
Rice will cost £100m minimum, he'd be great for us but the problem with all these big signings (Lukaku, Pogba, Maguire) is that it leaves is far less transfer cap spend availability to improve other areas. I think we need more of a 2007 summer style window where we signed a lot of quality but on the lower end per transfer.

Bissouma for me fits the mould for a lot of our needs - defensively excellent in the tackle, and excellent on the ball. He could easily grow to be our Casemiro. Rumours are that he's available for around £30 - £40m too.

Do that and it leaves us space to get a dribbling winger, and one or two other players. I think the belief that one player would make all the difference is misguided, this team is good but the first XI is still quite a bit off from a team like Liverpool's. At a minimum we need two wide players that have the potential to become world class (none of Rashford, Greenwood or Sancho currently have the raw dribbling ability to get on to the level of Salah /Mane, in my opinion) and likely another attacking RB and another midfielder that has a great passing range. Build the first XI and success would follow, not just one position. Thinking back to 2007 we could badly do with another window of the calibre of Nani, Hargreaves, Anderson and Tevez. Would actually fill four of our biggest current needs.
 
marktan said:
Rice will cost £100m minimum, he'd be great for us but the problem with all these big signings (Lukaku, Pogba, Maguire) is that it leaves is far less transfer cap spend availability to improve other areas. I think we need more of a 2007 summer style window where we signed a lot of quality but on the lower end per transfer.

Bissouma for me fits the mould for a lot of our needs - defensively excellent in the tackle, and excellent on the ball. He could easily grow to be our Casemiro. Rumours are that he's available for around £30 - £40m too.

Do that and it leaves us space to get a dribbling winger, and one or two other players. I think the belief that one player would make all the difference is misguided, this team is good but the first XI is still quite a bit off from a team like Liverpool's. At a minimum we need two wide players that have the potential to become world class (none of Rashford, Greenwood or Sancho currently have the raw dribbling ability to get on to the level of Salah /Mane, in my opinion) and likely another attacking RB and another midfielder that has a great passing range. Build the first XI and success would follow, not just one position. Thinking back to 2007 we could badly do with another window of the calibre of Nani, Hargreaves, Anderson and Tevez. Would actually fill four of our biggest current needs.
Click to expand...

Bissouma might be in prison come the summer so I think we should be looking elsewhere.

Tielemans should definitely be a target. He’s going to have only 1yr left on his deal so should be more affordable than ever.

Then add one of other names listed.

With Pogba, Matic and maybe Donny going it’s going to be a big job next summer.

The next manager coming in will be a huge factor as well. If it was ETH then I think Donny stays and we bring in Gravenberch.
 
Amadaeus said:
Watching rice play against us, he will take us to another level. If we are serious and want to win the Champions League we should throw near £200m on him and Verratti. £80m Rice, £90m plus Martial for Verratti (they would problem entertain the deal if pogba was included instead)

Verratti
Rice - Pogba
----bruno-----

Garner/Fred
Mctominay - fred/Dvdb


That will be the best midfield in football no doubt
Click to expand...
A package of over 100m for a 29 year old veratti?
 
marktan said:
Rice will cost £100m minimum, he'd be great for us but the problem with all these big signings (Lukaku, Pogba, Maguire) is that it leaves is far less transfer cap spend availability to improve other areas. I think we need more of a 2007 summer style window where we signed a lot of quality but on the lower end per transfer.

Bissouma for me fits the mould for a lot of our needs - defensively excellent in the tackle, and excellent on the ball. He could easily grow to be our Casemiro. Rumours are that he's available for around £30 - £40m too.

Do that and it leaves us space to get a dribbling winger, and one or two other players. I think the belief that one player would make all the difference is misguided, this team is good but the first XI is still quite a bit off from a team like Liverpool's. At a minimum we need two wide players that have the potential to become world class (none of Rashford, Greenwood or Sancho currently have the raw dribbling ability to get on to the level of Salah /Mane, in my opinion) and likely another attacking RB and another midfielder that has a great passing range. Build the first XI and success would follow, not just one position. Thinking back to 2007 we could badly do with another window of the calibre of Nani, Hargreaves, Anderson and Tevez. Would actually fill four of our biggest current needs.
Click to expand...
Do that and get caught short if he’s found guilty of the sexual assault charge hanging over him. Don’t you read the news?
 
sparx99 said:
Bissouma might be in prison come the summer so I think we should be looking elsewhere.

Tielemans should definitely be a target. He’s going to have only 1yr left on his deal so should be more affordable than ever.

Then add one of other names listed.

With Pogba, Matic and maybe Donny going it’s going to be a big job next summer.

The next manager coming in will be a huge factor as well. If it was ETH then I think Donny stays and we bring in Gravenberch.
Click to expand...

I like Tielemans but he's similar to Fred and Mctomonat, a B2B, and whilst he is an upgrade we really don't need another one of those.
golden_blunder said:
Do that and get caught short if he’s found guilty of the sexual assault charge hanging over him. Don’t you read the news?
Click to expand...

It shouldn't be hard to figure out what the actual issue is, and thus the likely penalty. Based on everything I've read it's likely it's inappropriate touching in a club, which whilst bad is probably not a prison sentence. Of course if we find out that it's something worse then yeah steer well clear, but it should be one we look at properly. Given our scouting team though I'd be surprised if they even know who he is. Our scouts top 3 CM targets are probably Rice, Kroos and Bellingham or whatever flavour of the month plays CM at Ajax.
 
marktan said:
I like Tielemans but he's similar to Fred and Mctomonat, a B2B, and whilst he is an upgrade we really don't need another one of those.


It shouldn't be hard to figure out what the actual issue is, and thus the likely penalty. Based on everything I've read it's likely it's inappropriate touching in a club, which whilst bad is probably not a prison sentence. Of course if we find out that it's something worse then yeah steer well clear, but it should be one we look at properly. Given our scouting team though I'd be surprised if they even know who he is. Our scouts top 3 CM targets are probably Rice, Kroos and Bellingham or whatever flavour of the month plays CM at Ajax.
Click to expand...

AKA sexual assault. And you'd want us to sign him if he's just been found guilty of such? The scale of the punishment isn't the only issue there.
 
marktan said:
I like Tielemans but he's similar to Fred and Mctomonat, a B2B, and whilst he is an upgrade we really don't need another one of those.


It shouldn't be hard to figure out what the actual issue is, and thus the likely penalty. Based on everything I've read it's likely it's inappropriate touching in a club, which whilst bad is probably not a prison sentence. Of course if we find out that it's something worse then yeah steer well clear, but it should be one we look at properly. Given our scouting team though I'd be surprised if they even know who he is. Our scouts top 3 CM targets are probably Rice, Kroos and Bellingham or whatever flavour of the month plays CM at Ajax.
Click to expand...
I think it’s telling that only Villa are linked with him. That’s going to have to be cleared up before a big team drops 40m on him

by the way bissouma is b2b too
 
golden_blunder said:
I think it’s telling that only Villa are linked with him. That’s going to have to be cleared up before a big team drops 40m on him

by the way bissouma is b2b too
Click to expand...
Who isnt? Even the West Ham fans are saying that Rice is better as a b2b even though he can play as a 6 and thats been reflected by Moyes pushing Soucek deeper to accommodate. The only true DM is Ndidi.
 
UpWithRivers said:
Who isnt? Even the West Ham fans are saying that Rice is better as a b2b even though he can play as a 6 and thats been reflected by Moyes pushing Soucek deeper to accommodate. The only true DM is Ndidi.
Click to expand...
Rice has played more than enough as a DM to know he can. He’s also showing that he can do more.
All bissouma has shown so far is that he can chase on the pitch as a b2b
 
Anyone who watches La Liga tell me how William Carvalho is doing for Betis? Considering they're 3rd in La Liga right now and he seems to be a regular starter I'd assume pretty well?!

Been a big fan of him ever since I saw him play for Portugal in the U-21 Euros in 2015! The way he constantly won the ball, broke up play and controlled the game really impressed me... he's 29 now, I still can't understand why he's managed to fly under the radar all this time and why a big club hasn't come in for him yet? Admittedly, I haven't seen him play for quite a few years at club level! He could be quite a steal... Would love a partnership of him and Tielemans! They could compliment each other very well!
 
If I were spoilt for choice, I would choose one of the trio. 1. Tchouameni or 2. Frenkie de Jong 3. Camavinga (if Real urgently need the money for Mbappé and Haaland)

sign as a regular player.
 
In order of preference...

#6 - Rice, Tchouameni, Kamara, Bissouma
#8 - Guimaraes, Bennacer, Kessie, Neves

Rice and Tchouameni would likely be stupidly expensive. Kamara is a free in the summer or cheap now. Same with Kessie. Guimaraes and Bennacer both probably 40m. Neves and Bissouma probably overpriced compared to what they provide but better than nothing. All huge improvements on Fred and McTominay IMO.
 
Amadaeus said:
Hazard went to real Madrid at 28 for nearly around £100m. Verratti in my opinion is as good as or even better than hazard in the role he plays. I would prefer psg accept less, but I feel Verratti is one of the few untouchables in football at the moment.
Click to expand...
Look what happened hazard. No way we’re gonna drop 100m on a 28 year old
 
Amadaeus said:
Hazard went to real Madrid at 28 for nearly around £100m. Verratti in my opinion is as good as or even better than hazard in the role he plays. I would prefer psg accept less, but I feel Verratti is one of the few untouchables in football at the moment.
Click to expand...
And universally accepted as a terrible transfer.
 
Come on just because hazard was a bad transfer, doesn't mean all players at that age will turn out bad if we spend that much on them. There is definitely more risk, but what I have seen of Verratti his ability comes from his football intelligence, ball control and composure on the ball. I can't see that diminishing anytime soon
 
Amadaeus said:
Come on just because hazard was a bad transfer, doesn't mean all players at that age will turn out bad if we spend that much on them. There is definitely more risk, but what I have seen of Verratti his ability comes from his football intelligence, ball control and composure on the ball. I can't see that diminishing anytime soon
Click to expand...
Unless I’ve been dropped on my head, we’re still owned by the glazers. They aren’t dropping 100m on veratti, they just aren’t
 
I'll get (in order of preference, not so much likelihood, per window):

Winter 2022: one of Kamara or Haidara or Zakaria
Summer 2022: one of Tielemans or Neves
Summer 2023: one of Rice or Bellingham

Midfield outgoings (during the span of these windows): Matic, Pogba, Mata, Fred, VdB, Lingard

6 players out
3 players in for no more than 150mill
 
rice is more technical that Tchouameni and plays more line breaking passed than Tchouameni he starts most of West Hams attacks & Tielemans prem proven know what your getting creativity and can chip in with goals.

Rice - Tielemans
Bruno

Midfield capable of battling against anyone totalling £140 million maybe less depending on Tielemans price
 
Realistically, we’re not bringing in Rice in this transfer window. Maybe never, but definitely not in the next week.

A versatile midfielder who can do a job defensively now and the pure CDM in the summer.
 
Amadaeus said:
Hazard went to real Madrid at 28 for nearly around £100m. Verratti in my opinion is as good as or even better than hazard in the role he plays. I would prefer psg accept less, but I feel Verratti is one of the few untouchables in football at the moment.
Click to expand...
The PSG fans don’t rate him. I personally think he’s great, but he’s had injuries and a poor run of form. No way is he worth 100m. More like 30-40m.
 
We Need Another Rebuild said:
rice is more technical that Tchouameni and plays more line breaking passed than Tchouameni he starts most of West Hams attacks & Tielemans prem proven know what your getting creativity and can chip in with goals.

Rice - Tielemans
Bruno

Midfield capable of battling against anyone totalling £140 million maybe less depending on Tielemans price
Click to expand...
About 12-18 months back, I wrote a long post about how Rice was over rated, wasn’t technical enough and was basically a CB being played further forward.

I was dead wrong. The improvement he has made with his forward passing, his reading of the game, even his technique has improved. He doesn’t cover as much ground as, say Kante, but who does? Is he worth 100m? Probably not. If you could get him for 60-70m then maybe go for it, but West Ham are asking for the moon, so I don’t see it happening.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.