Which current players do you want out before next season starts?

Bastian

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It's kind of a novel version of "it's the players" (I think it's the hierarchy, the manager, and the players mind).

I go with: Maguire, Lindelof, Shaw, Malacia, Bayindir, Casemiro, Eriksen, Bruno, Antony, Rashford, Zirkzee.

Maguire, Lindelof, Eriksen are all out of contract (if the club chooses so). Shaw and Malacia cannot stay fit. Casemiro and Rashford are earning multiple times what they produce on the pitch and the latter doesn't work hard. Bruno is earning now similar to the other two but might have some decent resale value and he is too inconsistent, with far too low a bottom level to be a maverick player. Zirkzee, it's harsh, but I just don't think he'll make it here. Antony is one dimensional and not shown any progression. And we need a keeper capable of actually competing with Onana so I'd ship out Bayindir.

That leaves Evans, de Ligt, Martinez, Dalot, Onana, Yoro, Mazraoui, Ugarte, Mainoo, Mount, Amad, Garnacho, Hojlund and the youth.

I hope we run to the right solutions next summer.
 
Ideal for me would be everyone in midfield bar Mainoo.
 
Bastian said:
It's kind of a novel version of "it's the players" (I think it's the hierarchy, the manager, and the players mind).

I go with: Maguire, Lindelof, Shaw, Malacia, Bayindir, Casemiro, Eriksen, Bruno, Antony, Rashford, Zirkzee.

Maguire, Lindelof, Eriksen are all out of contract (if the club chooses so). Shaw and Malacia cannot stay fit. Casemiro and Rashford are earning multiple times what they produce on the pitch and the latter doesn't work hard. Bruno is earning now similar to the other two but might have some decent resale value and he is too inconsistent, with far too low a bottom level to be a maverick player. Zirkzee, it's harsh, but I just don't think he'll make it here. Antony is one dimensional and not shown any progression. And we need a keeper capable of actually competing with Onana so I'd ship out Bayindir.

That leaves Evans, de Ligt, Martinez, Dalot, Onana, Yoro, Mazraoui, Ugarte, Mainoo, Mount, Amad, Garnacho, Hojlund and the youth.

I hope we run to the right solutions next summer.
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Surprised you are happy to keep Mason Mount. He’s just another Luke Shaw who can’t stay fit himself.

Chelsea absolutely fleeced us with this one.
 
RedDevilRoshi said:
Surprised you are happy to keep Mason Mount. He’s just another Luke Shaw who can’t stay fit himself.

Chelsea absolutely fleeced us with this one.
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Yeah, it's a tricky one. Fitness issues aside, I think he's a quality player who can function in a variety of tactical setups. And I think he works hard out of possession too, which is a trait we should be guaranteeing with every single player we target. But the wages, the #7, the lack of availability..I'd sell him mostly for the wages he's on to create a more harmonious dressing room and meritocracy, but I just don't think there's a market for him.
 
It's hard to say. While most players haven't performed particularly well under Ten Hag, it's clear they aren’t lacking in talent. This raises the question: would they perform better under a different manager? Other teams, which seemingly lack the depth we have, are consistently outperforming us. We struggle both defensively and offensively, which can't solely be attributed to a weak defence or attack. Although our current squad may not be elite enough to reach our lofty ambitions, sitting 14th in the table with this group of players is simply unacceptable.
 
Rashford and Bruno.

They aren’t bad players per see but we will never change our style of play while they are our options to build a team around.
 
id keep:
Onana, maz, De ligt, Mainoo, Höjlund.

The rest id do pretty much anything I can to get rid off.
 
rpitchfo said:
Rashford and Bruno.

They aren’t bad players per see but we will never change our style of play while they are our options to build a team around.
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I feel the same. For the money they’re on they should be producing a hell of a lot more than they have been. We can take both their wages and redistribute it across 4-5 younger players.

They embody ‘You can’t teach an old dog new tricks’. I don’t think Bruno’s going to suddenly become more conservative with regards to ball retention at 30, he’s just going to keep looking up once and Hail Mary that fecker at whoever is making the run…with a fair chance the ball goes back to the opposition. Rashford’s not going to suddenly reinvent himself either. Once that pace totally goes, there isn’t much going on there.
 
Only few need to go. I want a manager who will make this players better. Because these players are not bad as people think. It is on manager.

Most of these plsyers we bought because they WERE good in their previous clubs. We need a new manager. Simple as that.
 
I'm gonna second (not hara-kiri as it's not that bad yet) Bruno and Rashford, Rashford particularly. Perhaps an elite-level talent, but is effectively elite level about 15% of the time and the mentality is a patchwork quilt of shades of wrong.

Of the others, enough of Shaw, Malacia and their injuries - possibly Mount too. Casemiro has mentally retired. I think Eriksen can still be useful even if the legs are going. Remaining deadwood would be Lindelof and Maguire. Also agree that I don't think Zirkzee is going to cut it.
 
Players I like:

Mainoo
Mazroui
De ligt
Onana
Garnacho
Yoro (only because I’ve not seen him)
Ugarte (not really had a good run yet)
Amad

Players I don’t like:

Everyone else.
 
No player should be leaving before eETh. He’s had a starting 11 bought for him and he’s still clueless. The players aren’t to blame for him at all. Today people may have an argument and we missed many chances but the team lack confidence and I belle that’s in him. Change the manager and then asses players again.
 
I’d prioritize examining the players under the insanity contracts first, followed by all those whose contracts expire this season except for Amad, and then the persistently injured players.

First category includes Sancho, Casemiro, Antony, Rashford, Bruno, and Mount too.

Second group includes Evans, Eriksen, Maguire, Heaton, Lindelof.

Last group is Malacia and Shaw.

Realistically not all of these players would be shown the door. And let’s assume Sancho will move to Chelsea fully. So if it’s up to me, I move mountains to find an exit for Casemiro (Saudi or PSG), and Rashford (PSG, Juventus, Milan).

I think it’s better to keep Bruno due to his availability and ability to be useful in a different tactical setup, whether counterattacking from low block or a direct vertical style that isn’t so possession-focused.

As piss poor as Antony has been, I genuinely think he’d make a decent fullback/wingback. We need the depth, and his stock is far too low to negotiate any worthwhile deal at the moment. He’s got the work rate and won’t have the same pressure as he would in a winger role. In this scenario, he could improve his value to justify remaining with the team or to fetch a better transfer fee.

I’m unsure about Mount. I like his abilities but he’s injured a lot. Could see him doing well in Germany but I don’t know where he’d fit in.

From the second list I’d keep Eriksen and Maguire provided we can negotiate a favorable short term deal. Eriksen for depth and creative ability, and Maguire for depth and tactical substitution as he’s improved lately.

Last group, obviously Malacia. If our fullback depth is weak, we’d have to keep Shaw another year because he’s at least available sometimes, and has almost always elevated our game play when on. If we improve depth, then perhaps we sell at a good price or loan him out to a less physical league that gets him consistent playing time to raise his market value.
 
There isn't one player that if sold that anyone would have a fit over except maybe Mainoo and Garnacho. But we can't sell everyone. I'd 100 percent sell Shaw, Mount, Antony and Malacia. Absolutely no point in them. I'd replace Bruno, Rashford, Hojlund/Zirkzee, and Amad with first choice attackers. They don't have to be sold but they should become back ups. If they go then no big deal but I can't see anyone signing them on the wages they are on.
 
Everyone deserves a go under a new manager. Once he's in situ we'll see if they can adapt and raise their standards or prove they're not worth keeping.
 
Fred, McTom, Ronaldo, Weigy, Wan Bissaka. etc

Not good enough for us, wrong characters, never win anything with them etc etc
 
rpitchfo said:
Rashford and Bruno.

They aren’t bad players per see but we will never change our style of play while they are our options to build a team around.
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Rashford is objectively a very mediocre player. His talent is not big enough to start for any top 10 team.

I agree with OP. I would maybe give Zirkzee another year.
 
dannyrhinos89 said:
Players I like:

Mainoo
Mazroui
De ligt
Onana
Garnacho
Yoro (only because I’ve not seen him)
Ugarte (not really had a good run yet)
Amad

Players I don’t like:

Everyone else.
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That's not actually such a bad core to build a team around. Add some quality up front and a new manager and you might be getting somewhere.
 
Bastian said:
It's kind of a novel version of "it's the players" (I think it's the hierarchy, the manager, and the players mind).

I go with: Maguire, Lindelof, Shaw, Malacia, Bayindir, Casemiro, Eriksen, Bruno, Antony, Rashford, Zirkzee.

Maguire, Lindelof, Eriksen are all out of contract (if the club chooses so). Shaw and Malacia cannot stay fit. Casemiro and Rashford are earning multiple times what they produce on the pitch and the latter doesn't work hard. Bruno is earning now similar to the other two but might have some decent resale value and he is too inconsistent, with far too low a bottom level to be a maverick player. Zirkzee, it's harsh, but I just don't think he'll make it here. Antony is one dimensional and not shown any progression. And we need a keeper capable of actually competing with Onana so I'd ship out Bayindir.

That leaves Evans, de Ligt, Martinez, Dalot, Onana, Yoro, Mazraoui, Ugarte, Mainoo, Mount, Amad, Garnacho, Hojlund and the youth.

I hope we run to the right solutions next summer.
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Why get rid of Bayindir? Unless he wants to leave himself which I could understand.

I agree with Maguire, Lindelof, Shaw, Malacia, Casemiro, Eriksen, Bruno, Antony, Rashford. I'd keep Zirkzee though to see if he can get better and get rid of mount if he doesn't get and stay fit for a good number of games.
 
Andycoleno9 said:
Only few need to go. I want a manager who will make this players better. Because these players are not bad as people think. It is on manager.

Most of these plsyers we bought because they WERE good in their previous clubs. We need a new manager. Simple as that.
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This is my worry. That they keep getting chances. I sort of made this thread in anticipation of a managerial change. Because there's loads of problems still at the club even after Erik has been sacked (which was the correct decision of course).
 
Bastian said:
This is my worry. That they keep getting chances. I sort of made this thread in anticipation of a managerial change. Because there's loads of problems still at the club even after Erik has been sacked (which was the correct decision of course).
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There really aren’t. ETH was a single point of failure and an absolute disaster over the last 15 months. I’ve been continually impressed by the players’ attitude in circumstances where they must have known that the tactics they were being asked to play were insane. They seem a decent bunch generally and all deserve a chance under a new manager before any decisions are made. We should have plenty of time to do this over the remainder of the season, before making decisions in the summer.
 
It's easier to list those I'd want to keep.

Yoro
de Ligt
Martinez
Mainoo
Amad
Garnacho
Hojlund
Evans & Eriksen as elder statesmen squad options.

Everyone else can do one.
 
Doracle said:
There really aren’t. ETH was a single point of failure and an absolute disaster over the last 15 months. I’ve been continually impressed by the players’ attitude in circumstances where they must have known that the tactics they were being asked to play were insane. They seem a decent bunch generally and all deserve a chance under a new manager before any decisions are made. We should have plenty of time to do this over the remainder of the season, before making decisions in the summer.
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Have you been living under a rock? If you are correct I look forward to securing a top 4 finish this season, winning the Europa League and seeing amazing swashbuckling football on a weekly basis where everyone gives their all.
 
Bastian said:
Have you been living under a rock? If you are correct I look forward to securing a top 4 finish this season, winning the Europa League and seeing amazing swashbuckling football on a weekly basis where everyone gives their all.
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Top 4 is very difficult from this position and any new manager will need time to implement their tactics. I don’t think it’s unreasonable to expect that a competent manager would have this squad top 4 had they been appointed in the summer though.

We should have a good shot at the Europa given the new long format means that there’s time to recover, so I would expect us to go far in that if we get a good manager in shortly.
 
Rashford
Antony
Casemiro
Eriksen
Bruno
Shaw
Lindelof

None of those should be here after next summer.
 
Id sell zirkzee and hoylund and buy two real strikers who score goals every other game.
Its a joke we have these two novice and very average strikers as our only central attackers. Martial was lazy sod but had twice the ability of both.

Anthony can go too.
 
To be a bit realistic:

Maguire, Lindelöf, Eriksen, Evans - no point in giving them new contracts. Maybe keep one of the CBs as a 4th option.
Shaw, Malacia, Mount - no point in keeping players that are never ever available

Then try to get rid of Rashford or Antony and bring in a new winger. But I don't expect more to happen as we would already need two left backs, two midfielders and a winger in that scenario. And I haven't seen us completing more than 5 major deals in a window for many years.
 
Doracle said:
Top 4 is very difficult from this position and any new manager will need time to implement their tactics. I don’t think it’s unreasonable to expect that a competent manager would have this squad top 4 had they been appointed in the summer though.

We should have a good shot at the Europa given the new long format means that there’s time to recover, so I would expect us to go far in that if we get a good manager in shortly.
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We're 8 points off top 4 with 29 matches to go. If it's as you say, that the only issue was ETH, it should be like drinking water. Especially if all the players are top class and were only being held back by Erik. So I'm looking forward to seeing that all pan out immediately.
 
Rashford and Antony have to be right at the top of the list by any long measure.
Retiring older players like Casemiro and Eriksen and clearing out the deadwood like Lindelof.

Mount has been plagued with injuries, so I don’t understand the hate against him?
Even if we didn’t need him, if he’d been a consistently fit player, he would have been very good in this team, however, with his injury record and the fact he was in the final year of his contract with Chelsea, we should never, never had paid the transfer fee for him.
It was a stupid purchase at the time.
If he can’t stay fit, then he needs to be shipped out, along with Shaw and possibly Malacia, only because we can’t afford to carry sicknotes.

I agree that Zirkzee probably has no chance of making it in this league.
He may be underperforming badly and suffering like a rabbit in the headlights, but it’s apparent that he’s far too slow, particularly off the ball and has shown no natural inclination to be combative when needed.
Just cut our losses and allow the poor lad to move on.

I wouldn’t write off the other younger lads.
They would really benefit from some good experience brought into the team, but not more ageing stars, who could be accused of looking for a lucrative last contract in the twilight of their career, or are now suffering from more frequent injury worries.


..
 
Bastian said:
It's kind of a novel version of "it's the players" (I think it's the hierarchy, the manager, and the players mind).

I go with: Maguire, Lindelof, Shaw, Malacia, Bayindir, Casemiro, Eriksen, Bruno, Antony, Rashford, Zirkzee.

I hope we run to the right solutions next summer.
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I agree with most of your list but I'd put Mount in place of Zirkzee and I've honestly never seen Bayindir play for us so can't comment.

So my list is Maguire, Lindelof, Shaw, Malacia, Casemiro, Eriksen, Bruno, Antony, Rashford, Mount

I'd also be looking at Martinez given his injury history and the chance of him following ETH somewhere.
 
Bastian said:
It's kind of a novel version of "it's the players" (I think it's the hierarchy, the manager, and the players mind).

I go with: Maguire, Lindelof, Shaw, Malacia, Bayindir, Casemiro, Eriksen, Bruno, Antony, Rashford, Zirkzee.

Maguire, Lindelof, Eriksen are all out of contract (if the club chooses so). Shaw and Malacia cannot stay fit. Casemiro and Rashford are earning multiple times what they produce on the pitch and the latter doesn't work hard. Bruno is earning now similar to the other two but might have some decent resale value and he is too inconsistent, with far too low a bottom level to be a maverick player. Zirkzee, it's harsh, but I just don't think he'll make it here. Antony is one dimensional and not shown any progression. And we need a keeper capable of actually competing with Onana so I'd ship out Bayindir.

That leaves Evans, de Ligt, Martinez, Dalot, Onana, Yoro, Mazraoui, Ugarte, Mainoo, Mount, Amad, Garnacho, Hojlund and the youth.

I hope we run to the right solutions next summer.
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Yoro, WHO? Mazraoui, is he a right back or ATM? Ugarte, can he run for 90min

And Zirkzee, apart from 1st touch of the 1st game, can't see him contributing anything.

In fact, they are all recruited this summer, by the new management committee.
 
I was going to start a new thread but it maybe fits in here.

My question is not only which players we would want to get rid of, but also how much of a factor does these players play into getting the right manager?

We have spent a fortune of bringing in Ten Hag's signings with Antony, Hojlund, Casemiro, Martinez, Onana, Mount, Mazraoui, De Ligt, Yoro, Ugarte, Zirkzee and Eriksen all supposedly bought of at least not vetoed by him.

Realistically in the financial position we are in, we will need a coach who can make these players function as a team.
 
I honestly don't want that many out, I really don't think our squad is actually that bad, we just need real quality now, particularly in attack and midfield.
 
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