Where should Fred be rated on a world scale in his primary role of midfield runner/harasser?

Fortitude

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Don't wade in stating Fred is a crap all-round midfielder as this thread is specifically about him being utilised purely to disrupt the opposition high up the pitch.

We've seen him shut down De Bruyne; he's made Pedri and De Jong look like players of lesser repute than they have. Evidently, he is a player with a lot about him as midfield runner - how he utilises the ball etc. is besides the point.

I'm not following other teams as I used to, so I'm asking the caf: in terms of the pure, unadulterated role of midfield runner, where does Fred fare in world terms?

Does he make top 10? Which players are better than him at that particular task?
 
He's still very frustrating in his general play. To answer your question, probably top 20.
 
He’s very good when playing in a certain role. He’s better suited playing in these games against Barca/City than at home vs Bournemouth where we dictate possession.

Top 10 in that role where he is breaking up play to start counter attacks.
 
Nobody is qualified to judge Fred. He's such an inconsistent enigma that any opinion, either way, is invalid.

Fred does not compute.
 
It's probably a very big exaggeration but he is a bit like a modern Gattuso in some sense. The big difference IMO is that Fred lacks composure on the ball and ends up giving the ball away a lot making him both a good asset for his pressing and harassing the opposition (and even passing through balls at times) and also a liability that can turn over possession at the worst of times. Him and AWB are players that in the same game, make me loose my mind with how poor they can be but then later be impressed with how good and valuable they are in other situations.

So how should we rate him? I guess for a side that cares little for possession he would be near the top. For a side that values possession though, he is Fred :lol: Goes from good to bad and back again like it's a roll of the dice.
 
He's top 5 imo. Unless I am just forgetting players, I can't think of many who get about the pitch as well as he does.
 
Very dificult player to evaluate. He's full of mistakes. Stray passes, unnecessary free kicks given away, you name it. However with all that said he has other qualities which are paramount to the way we want to play. I'd say he's top 5 in the department he's good at and I for one am more than happy he's a member of our squad.
 
How can we create a thread to try and make Fred look good? Fred isn't very good at playing football, it doesn't matter how much he runs around.
 
Great player to have in a squad, not sure he's a starter for a team who want to challenge for the league playing the way ETH wants to because he's just erratic as hell on the ball. For the role you're talking about he's amongst the best in world football but obviously he's lacking in other areas.

I'm a big fan of his, I think we all know his issues but he offers so much more than many players we have/have had recently when deployed in the more advanced role where Ragnick used him and he was probably our only good player from that disastrous season. My theory about Fred is because his mistakes tend to be more basic (bad pass, bad touch) and therefore rarer in elite football people think he's levels below where he is and forget his skills aren't really as easy to quantify, like pressing, shuttling the ball up the pitch and general coverage of the pitch. Like an erratic Park Ji Sung who can samba. He's actually not a bad offensive player for us either, last season he got 10 goals and assists combined and this season he's on 7 - it's solid numbers for a hard working but limited CM.
 
Nobody will argue that he is, certainly, unequivocally, in the top 10,000 in his role, and this cannot be questioned.
 
simplyared said:
Very dificult player to evaluate. He's full of mistakes. Stray passes, unnecessary free kicks given away, you name it. However with all that said he has other qualities which are paramount to the way we want to play. I'd say he's top 5 in the department he's good at and I for one am more than happy he's a member of our squad.
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Have to agree with this. He is frustrating as anything but ultimately i'm glad we have him. I'm even conflicted writing that!
 
When all is going well he is great at it. When it’s not he’s easily bypassed and he’s incredibly soft in 50/50’s. He’s too inconsistent at it to be rated that highly.
 
Alek M said:
A modern park ji sung
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Park didn't really make that many mistakes, though? When Park had a bad game he was simply ineffective. When Fred has a bad game all hell breaks loose because he's at the center of the action.

They are both hard-working and annoying for the opponent to deal with, but I think that's were the similarities end.
 
On a similar note, on his best days, when he is not playing rubbish, David de Gea is one of the best keepers in the world at saving shots from between 27 and 29 yards out, on his left side.

Point is being sometimes excellent at a very narrow range of the game qualifies you as a fringe player at best. Fred could have lost us that game yesterday, penalty possibility, bad first half, quick free kick backwards in our own half to put the whole team under pressure.
 
since when do skills such as ball control and passing not apply to a midfielder, let alone one here. Park was an incredibly talented footballer as well as being a runner / harasser. he was a top quality attacking player (lots of goals and assists at PSV) before Fergie moulded him into more of a midfield runner.
 
Since Fred is unique, I'd say he is probably the best in the world at being Fred
 
Herman Toothrot said:
Nobody is qualified to judge Fred. He's such an inconsistent enigma that any opinion, either way, is invalid.

Fred does not compute.
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He’s also leagues ahead of any redditor, twitter or redcafe poster. I think he’s better than people think but he screws up 1-2 important passes nearly every game, which people are drawn to instead of the other 88 minutes
 
Superden said:
since when do skills such as ball control and passing not apply to a midfielder, let alone one here. Park was an incredibly talented footballer as well as being a runner / harasser. he was a top quality attacking player (lots of goals and assists at PSV) before Fergie moulded him into more of a midfield runner.
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Park first touch was incredible. Always felt he was underrated because of the off the ball work he used to do.
 
Bit sloppy but he must be an absolute nightmare to play again, he's just constantly there nipping at your heels, hassling you and he somehow seems to win the majority of his tussles.
 
It's not just being a runner/tackler, his passing just goes up a level as well with quick first time passes. It's ridiculous tbh when he goes into beast mode
 
jackal&hyde said:
It's probably a very big exaggeration but he is a bit like a modern Gattuso in some sense. The big difference IMO is that Fred lacks composure on the ball and ends up giving the ball away a lot making him both a good asset for his pressing and harassing the opposition (and even passing through balls at times) and also a liability that can turn over possession at the worst of times. Him and AWB are players that in the same game, make me loose my mind with how poor they can be but then later be impressed with how good and valuable they are in other situations.

So how should we rate him? I guess for a side that cares little for possession he would be near the top. For a side that values possession though, he is Fred :lol: Goes from good to bad and back again like it's a roll of the dice.
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He seems like he'd be really good playing for Jurgen Klopp or one of those other gegenpress/transition managers.
 
I honestly don't get why people wanted to sell him or even consider him a flop or something. He has been a great signing. He been a stable in our midfield these last few years and pulled out many great performances. He might not be good enough as a permanent starter, but he's definitely a great squad option to have around.

I'll keep him 100%. If one midfielder needs to be sold, it's Scott.
 
Would be an asset for any squad in the world when used correctly. That’s the same for the vast majority of our players. I’ve always maintained that. There’s a reason why City wanted him.
 
Like the majority of the side, not good in the first half. Second half was the Fred that I love. Pocket dynamo. Duracell bunny. Warrior.
 
He is a very good player most of the time, you don't dominate Barca in back to back games as a bad player. He might make some twitchy with how erratic he can be but in this form the positive aspects of his game vastly outweigh the bad moments.

World class energy, persistence, tenacity and a much better technical player than his critics want to accept.
 
Someone said:
A top 10 or a top 100 depending on the day.
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This, Fred seems to have a very high ceiling but very low floor. His inconsistency is his biggest issue, sometimes he has perfect technique and other times he can't control a ball
 
As I said in the other thread, stats has him above Kante since 2019 but social media is weird like that where a player just gets famous for being bad
 
shamans said:
As I said in the other thread, stats has him above Kante since 2019 but social media is weird like that where a player just gets famous for being bad
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And the sheep like mentality of social media has people afraid to speak against the prevailing tide of memes.
 
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