What's the alternative to bombing ISIS?

Edgar Allan Pillow

Ero-Sennin
Joined
Dec 7, 2010
Messages
42,037
Location
┴┬┴┤( ͡° ͜ʖ├┬┴┬
I know bombing is never the answer and always seems be a step in worse direction, but is there any other practical alternative?

Negotiations are out of the question here. They don't seem the type to live and let live even if we recognize them as a country and leave them to it. Standing back and hope they die of old age isn't really a solution. So what else?

Despite the all the previous experiences I believe it's time for U.N led War against Terrorism.

So would you support a war on ISIS?
 
These people are not going away anythime soon. There is a reason why those countries needed people like Saddam Hussein and Gaddafi to keep them under control. Not a fan of dictators at all, but that's what it will take to get them under control again, not bombing the respective countries into the stoneage, or military campaigns on the ground.
 
ISIS in Iraq and Syria... Or the idea of ISIS in the west?
 
Military campaign on the ground and installation of very strong states in Irak, Syria and Libya. It will take a very long time, a lot of blood and a lot of diplomacy. The terrorist attacks will continue after that but it will diminish with time and lack of powerful/influential heads.
 
The ideology is going nowhere but the groups that propogate it can be dealt with. Removing one group by force has always just led to it's replacement by another, but is that such a bad thing? IS are a particularly deranged bunch, allowed to grow to be so influential only because no-one had the political will to keep them in check. If we remove them, it's highly likely the replacements won't be as bad. I'd support bombing them if we do it properly. Going in with one hand tied behind our back like last time would be a mistake.
 
JPRouve said:
Military campaign on the ground and installation of very strong states in Irak, Syria and Libya. It will take a very long time, a lot of blood and a lot of diplomacy. The terrorist attacks will continue after that but it will diminish with time and lack of powerful/influential heads.
Click to expand...
I agree sir
 
ghagua said:
These people are not going away anythime soon. There is a reason why those countries needed people like Saddam Hussein and Gaddafi to keep them under control. Not a fan of dictators at all, but that's what it will take to get them under control again, not bombing the respective countries into the stoneage, or military campaigns on the ground.
Click to expand...

Exactly this and its been some of the worst foreign policy decisions that have got us here. The west need to go back to meddling and fixing elections to instil such dictators.

All we can done until the area stablises itself is to highten and fund added security, stop giving any fuel to radicalisation and stop our own countries from being racist idiots.
 
To be honest, I'm not sure the different governments know what to do, let alone anyone else. First recognise the complexity of everything. I don't think the governments can have an all-encompassing strategy.

The individuals involved in the attacks in France etc are a very varied group with multifaceted motives. Some motives are psychological, sociological, economic, religio-political. Some of them are born in the country which they attacked but have a multiple identity and allegiance to an "external entity". This loyalty is sometimes "transcendental", by which I mean something religious and all consuming. In other contexts it could be nationalism or a political ideology such as Communism. The situation at present reminds me of 17th century Europe. Guy Fawkes was a "homegrown terrorist".

This complexity is reflected in the "Jihadi movement". Some want to reclaim India for the Mughals, others Al-Andalus etc. There doesn't seem to be ONE enemy to negotiate with, one with aims which you can tick off, one which can be direclty attacked as if we were in WW2.

Immensely complex but on the home front the communities must be involved in everyday life. There must be channels for communication, the local radicals must be dealt with by their own community to the extent that it is possible, not only by security forces and government. Integration is a two-way process, but how do you socialise with a woman covered from head to toe ?
 
Last edited:
GloryHunter07 said:
at what cost to innocent lives?
Click to expand...

A heavy cost. Modern war has no glory or marches to neutral battlegrounds.

As history shows, fighting war against guerrilas entrenched in their land, is difficult and expensive and brutal. Either you starve them out (some civilians will die), or they will eventually wear you out. Boer War or Vietnam.
 
Does anyone watch the young turks? I find myself agreeing with a lot of stuff they say:



It's more a of a talk about ISIS and past historical groups/religion that is started of by talking about the attack in Kabul.
 
Carolina Red said:
I agree sir
Click to expand...

I'm glad you do. We need to stop with the stupid religious debates and the vain nationalistic propositions. We know the enemy, we know where they are but aren't not willing to do anything because modern politicians don't want to be linked with a long and difficult war, they don't want to be linked with the death of thousands of soldiers but the fact is that in the case of France, Hollande declared the war, he brought that to himself, to us.
 
Here is how Sun Tzu would do it (juxtaposed a bit with how Clausewitz might)
http://www.thestrategybridge.com/the-bridge/2016/4/15/in-the-war-with-isis-dont-forget-about-sun-tzu

TL/DR... Sun Tzu would win the intelligence war first, cut off ISIS ability to exploit freedom of speech and technology to their advantage, utilize deception and attack soft strategic targets first while tightening the noose around ISIS. He would avoid large scale city assault battles, but would starve out their supplies leaving them 1 avenue of escape then annihilate them once out in the open with "shock and awe" and superior armored/mechanized forces.
 
RedSky said:
Mars? Pluto? An Asteroid?
Click to expand...

Pluto isn´t a planet anymore. That kind of sucks. Who wants to live on a fecking Plutoid. Not big enough for the greatest nation in the universe – ever.
Mars would have a fitting color. So that’s a plus. We´d also weight about 62% less, so the fatties would feel better about themselves. It might be a bit cold, but the caf seems only concerned about heat, so that shouldn´t be a problem. It has the biggest mountain in our solar system, so enthusiastic climbers would be certainly on board. In 30 million years, it will have ring around it, which could be quite beautiful. If you liked it then you shoulda put a ring on it. The Noctis Labyrinthus could be a great playground for kids. Almost like a labyrinth in a cornfield, just bigger. Two moons with cool names (Phobos and Deimos). What else could you ask for? Sounds like a paradise.
I am only concerned, that those pesky Martians are going to take your jobsL, so we need to build a wall first. Following Wells´ historic account about them, they also might be quite aggressive (any links to ISIS?). So first of all we need to bomb them until the sand glows. Meh.
Maybe we really need to settle for an asteroid, but asteroids are kind of like foreigners. They come and go and often they destroy the natural harmony of the place. Do we really want to really to go there?

I have no clue what to do. We are stuck.
 
PedroMendez said:
Pluto isn´t a planet anymore. That kind of sucks. Who wants to live on a fecking Plutoid. Not big enough for the greatest nation in the universe – ever.
Mars would have a fitting color. So that’s a plus. We´d also weight about 62% less, so the fatties would feel better about themselves. It might be a bit cold, but the caf seems only concerned about heat, so that shouldn´t be a problem. It has the biggest mountain in our solar system, so enthusiastic climbers would be certainly on board. In 30 million years, it will have ring around it, which could be quite beautiful. If you liked it then you shoulda put a ring on it. The Noctis Labyrinthus could be a great playground for kids. Almost like a labyrinth in a cornfield, just bigger. Two moons with cool names (Phobos and Deimos). What else could you ask for? Sounds like a paradise.
I am only concerned, that those pesky Martians are going to take your jobsL, so we need to build a wall first. Following Wells´ historic account about them, they also might be quite aggressive (any links to ISIS?). So first of all we need to bomb them until the sand glows. Meh.
Maybe we really need to settle for an asteroid, but asteroids are kind of like foreigners. They come and go and often they destroy the natural harmony of the place. Do we really want to really to go there?

I have no clue what to do. We are stuck.
Click to expand...

Sounds like paradise to me.
 
Piers Morgan has suggested a complete shutdown on immigration in his latest article. Can't be asked to post it as its the type of article that will appeal to the Daily Mail masses.
 
The reason all these attacks keep happening is because they're slowly but surely losing grip of the 'caliphate' and their territory in Iraq, Syria, etc is being retaken by the local forces.

This are like death rattles but unfortunately they're going to be very painful and last a fair bit yet.
 
Fearless said:
Click to expand...


Quinn was a fecking badass.

It's also true.

I think I got reported or warned or whatever for suggesting the only way of dealing with these people is by killing them after one of the other attacks in the past year and anyone near them. It's horrible but it's the truth. We won't because it's inhumane and absolutely barbaric but also because there's too much foreign interest and money involved in keeping ISIS and different wars going to make them stop. Too few have too much to lose so the poor people in the region get affected whilst they sit atop their pile of blood money.

When it comes to ISIS, you fight fire with fire. All the fire, that never stops burning so they can't rise from the ashes.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.