What is United's "game model" ?

[Pughnichi]

I think the game model is Wheel of Fortune.
Eric gets up on a Saturday morning, spins the wheel and just lets fate decide the starting eleven and tactics.

Gotta love Domenech selecting squads and starting line ups based on star signs and astrology. Absolute fruit cake

 

[Rooney25]

Did ETH have a game model at Ajax?

 

[tomaldinho1]

Do we reckon it's fair to say Ineos want us to play with a 5 at the back?

The two concrete links have been Tuchel and now Amorim is confirmed, add in frank who was a strong rumours also has played this way a fair bit.

Wilcox can then build the game model off how Amorim plays.

 

[Ekeke]

Do we reckon it's fair to say Ineos want us to play with a 5 at the back?

The two concrete links have been Tuchel and now Amorim is confirmed, add in frank who was a strong rumours also has played this way a fair bit.

Wilcox can then build the game model off how Amorim plays.

No. I think we would have signed a wingback when we were trading fullbacks in the summer if that was their plan.

However the manager they seem to have decided is the outstanding candidate does play that way so I expect going forward our transfer windows will reflect that

 

[sunama]

Exactly. Football fans nowadays have a fetish for overcomplicating the game. It's just 22 players kicking a ball on grass. Ain't rocket science.

Teams only need balance between attacking and defending. Playing Styles aren't that critical imo, especially in possession. Defensively, there should be structure and work ethic.

Mourinhos Chelsea and Fergies United were two of this leagues most dominant sides. I don't recall them having a specific game model or philosophy. Both stuck to the fundamental principles and would regularly adapt their systems.

Correct!
Over the last few years, we have lost to many "lesser" teams, including newly promoted teams at Old Trafford.
They might have had a game plan, but in all honesty, we lost because the opposition wanted to win more than we did.
There is no explanation that we can beat MCFC one week and lose the very next game.
It's all about desire and the will to win.

 

[tomaldinho1]

No. I think we would have signed a wingback when we were trading fullbacks in the summer if that was their plan.

However the manager they seem to have decided is the outstanding candidate does play that way so I expect going forward our transfer windows will reflect that

We signed 2 CBs and swapped AWB for Maz who can play wing back - that to me screams back 5 build although, as you say, ideally we would have an LWB although it seems no one knew the extent of Shaw's injury. Shaw and Malacia could play there.
Would have thought Zirkzee was in their mind for the inside attacker type role as well?

 

[Erictheking7]

Has there been anything said about this or has this term just been used when the new hierarchy has been referred to, and how this is something new? Even Erik is using the term now, whereas before he used "philosophy". Have they adapted to his vision, is he adapting to theirs, is there a clear unified vision that is being worked towards?

I think it's called Chaos

 

[RedinIndia]

Did ETH have a game model at Ajax?

He did. Wasn't too far off what he was trying with United.

Involved direct play getting as many players to the opponent box as quickly as possible. All the while leaving gaping holes at the back that half decent teams could decimate at will.

Worked at Ajax somewhat because the league is weaker and he had very good players coming from the academy at the same time. But the fundamental fallacy of his system was always there. Should never have been hired.

Didn't work at United because United didn't have players who were considerably better than the opposing players.

 

[RedinIndia]

Add that to the fact that we were having to carry players bought under coaches with a markably different system prior. Be it Ole or Jose before.

The time to do a complete reset and pivot to the modern game should have been done when LVG was fired. He had gotten the basics of the possession game even if most of the game was boring and drab.

Instead , we pivoted to Mourinho who had a markably different style of playing. Compounded that failure by appointing Ole who quite frankly was clueless in tactics.

 

[Bastian]

Do we reckon it's fair to say Ineos want us to play with a 5 at the back?

The two concrete links have been Tuchel and now Amorim is confirmed, add in frank who was a strong rumours also has played this way a fair bit.

Wilcox can then build the game model off how Amorim plays.

I doubt it extends to set formations, that's if there even is a game model. Under SAF it was to attack with power, pace, penetration and unpredictability. Safe to say that we attack with none of those things.

 

[Hammondo]

I doubt it extends to set formations, that's if there even is a game model. Under SAF it was to attack with power, pace, penetration and unpredictability. Safe to say that we attack with none of those things.

That's not a game model, these are just vague descriptions of attack every team aims for.

 

[Ekeke]

We signed 2 CBs and swapped AWB for Maz who can play wing back - that to me screams back 5 build although, as you say, ideally we would have an LWB although it seems no one knew the extent of Shaw's injury. Shaw and Malacia could play there.
Would have thought Zirkzee was in their mind for the inside attacker type role as well?

We're also coming off a season where we couldnt keep CBs fit, or a leftback. So we signed multiple CBs in case it happens again and a replacement fullback for AWB who could also cover Shawn on the left. It all fit the current plans

Unfortunately the current plans didnt work. I'd be very surprised if in the next 18 months we dont sign someone who plays wingback on a weekly basis - assuming that Amorim wants to play the same way he does at Sporting. Theres a chance he's happy to play closer to the way we currently play at least formation wise. Sometimes managers come to a big club or new league and have a different idea of what they want to do. But still its best to assume he's very likely to do what hes already done successfully

 

[Bastian]

That's not a game model, these are just vague descriptions of attack every team aims for.

Sure, it's not a game model, but core principles. Neville was onto the same thing on his pod after the Chelsea match. There is zero tempo to our game. That tempo is pretty much what our teams under SAF were about. And we attacked down both wings and we had players capable of shooting accurately from outside the box so we had a three pronged attack. Now we still tend to overload the left (even without a left back) and we are super slow in the build up phase and give teams plenty of time to set up against us.

I still doubt if there is a clear idea on the hierarchy's part about whether we want to play high octane football, or a slow possession game, whether we want to defend with a high line or sit deep, I also haven't seen much difference in our set pieces since the start of the season despite having a set piece specialist in place. The only thing I notice about them is that we often fail to clear the first man for our corners (like Bruno in the last kick of the Chelsea match) and Dalot is probably among the worst throw-in takers in the game. Takes an awfully long time, and we lose possession very often from them. But that's another story.

 

[tomaldinho1]

We're also coming off a season where we couldnt keep CBs fit, or a leftback. So we signed multiple CBs in case it happens again and a replacement fullback for AWB who could also cover Shawn on the left. It all fit the current plans

Unfortunately the current plans didnt work. I'd be very surprised if in the next 18 months we dont sign someone who plays wingback on a weekly basis - assuming that Amorim wants to play the same way he does at Sporting. Theres a chance he's happy to play closer to the way we currently play at least formation wise. Sometimes managers come to a big club or new league and have a different idea of what they want to do. But still its best to assume he's very likely to do what hes already done successfully

I have no doubts we will sign wing backs, it would be a shame if the formation Amorim seems most clued in on he ditches here. Ineos weren't planning on firing ETH when they did, it just seems very coincidental that the oinked coaches (with actual credible links) all have a preference for a rarer tactical system & just because we did not sign wing backs, it seems pretty scant evidence against them having at least some kind of bias there.

 

[romufc]

Sure, it's not a game model, but core principles. Neville was onto the same thing on his pod after the Chelsea match. There is zero tempo to our game. That tempo is pretty much what our teams under SAF were about. And we attacked down both wings and we had players capable of shooting accurately from outside the box so we had a three pronged attack. Now we still tend to overload the left (even without a left back) and we are super slow in the build up phase and give teams plenty of time to set up against us.

I still doubt if there is a clear idea on the hierarchy's part about whether we want to play high octane football, or a slow possession game, whether we want to defend with a high line or sit deep, I also haven't seen much difference in our set pieces since the start of the season despite having a set piece specialist in place. The only thing I notice about them is that we often fail to clear the first man for our corners (like Bruno in the last kick of the Chelsea match) and Dalot is probably among the worst throw-in takers in the game. Takes an awfully long time, and we lose possession very often from them. But that's another story.

I dont know why fans are bogged down into schematics. Does using football terms like Game model make fans feel empowered?

You talk about you dont know the hierarchy's idea... I mean its quite clear if you see the signings brought in, they want to create a young squad with potential, with a young manager.

If you also watch how Amorim plays, its both a high line and sit deep, you cant just have one.. when you press the ball, you play a high line, when the opponents have controlled possession by breaking the press, you play a deeper line.

Amorim's system usually goes from a 3-4-3 or a 3-2-4-1 to a 5-4-1 defensively. In games where we play deeper, we transition quickly and in other games to break teams down you play a slow possession game.

The teams that are successful do both, its not you can only play one way.

 

[RedinIndia]

Also this isn't the case where we signed Zirkzee thinking we would get him for the next manager like how the scousers signed Firmino keeping him in mind for Klopp.

We didn't have a clue on who the next manager was following from ETH.

 

[Hammondo]

Sure, it's not a game model, but core principles. Neville was onto the same thing on his pod after the Chelsea match. There is zero tempo to our game. That tempo is pretty much what our teams under SAF were about. And we attacked down both wings and we had players capable of shooting accurately from outside the box so we had a three pronged attack. Now we still tend to overload the left (even without a left back) and we are super slow in the build up phase and give teams plenty of time to set up against us.

I still doubt if there is a clear idea on the hierarchy's part about whether we want to play high octane football, or a slow possession game, whether we want to defend with a high line or sit deep, I also haven't seen much difference in our set pieces since the start of the season despite having a set piece specialist in place. The only thing I notice about them is that we often fail to clear the first man for our corners (like Bruno in the last kick of the Chelsea match) and Dalot is probably among the worst throw-in takers in the game. Takes an awfully long time, and we lose possession very often from them. But that's another story.

Well SAF played slow as well as fast, it's a bit of a myth that's all we did. There were games we simply couldn't. He was known to be flexible, but unless you have the top level of individuals it doesn't work so well.

 

[Ekeke]

I have no doubts we will sign wing backs, it would be a shame if the formation Amorim seems most clued in on he ditches here. Ineos weren't planning on firing ETH when they did, it just seems very coincidental that the oinked coaches (with actual credible links) all have a preference for a rarer tactical system & just because we did not sign wing backs, it seems pretty scant evidence against them having at least some kind of bias there.

Its not that rare. Its the most popular its ever been with the current German champs, Italian champs and Portuguese champs all using the system

Thats probably why the managers we're looking at, we've decided to go with 1 who uses the system. Because some of the other candidates are too

They got rid of McTominay when ETH was using him as a get out of jail and keep your job card, if they wanted us to use wingbacks they would have signed them