Well, the penalty...?
- Thread starter kanchelskis14
- Start date
If you try reading it again, you'll realize that this is my opinion of how I believe the rule should be, not how it is. They give out red cards when you foul a player through on goal, even if he is outside the box. Can't see why they couldn't give a penalty instead and let both sides continue with 11 men.
I'll make it clear for the Arsenal fans :
Eduardo dived and Boruc didnt touch him. Not only that but as he came out, he took his hands away to make sure he didnt give anything away. It was a blatent dive.
Rooney stretched to get the ball before the keeper came at him, hands out and made contact. He left the floor before the keeper fouled him. It was still a foul but clearly Rooney was playing for the penalty.
The difference is that with Eduardo there was no foul. Therefore it was a dive. With Rooney there was a foul. Therefore it was a penalty.
Eduardo dived and Boruc didnt touch him. Not only that but as he came out, he took his hands away to make sure he didnt give anything away. It was a blatent dive.
Rooney stretched to get the ball before the keeper came at him, hands out and made contact. He left the floor before the keeper fouled him. It was still a foul but clearly Rooney was playing for the penalty.
The difference is that with Eduardo there was no foul. Therefore it was a dive. With Rooney there was a foul. Therefore it was a penalty.
Rooney himself said that "I've gone to try and get on the end of the ball and I've done so, the keeper's come and took me legs from me so I've had no option".
Here's a link to the interview - SkySports Video Player (v09)
There's nothing about getting his foot stuck in the turf. You can see he's simply trying to get to the ball before Almunia and then make sure he makes contact with the 'keeper (he's on the way down before any contact)... So it's a dive.
Here's a link to the interview - SkySports Video Player (v09)
There's nothing about getting his foot stuck in the turf. You can see he's simply trying to get to the ball before Almunia and then make sure he makes contact with the 'keeper (he's on the way down before any contact)... So it's a dive.
Of course i know its your opinion on how it should be, im just saying how crazy it sounds
I think the current rules are fine as they are
Put it in the podcast Mike, put it in the podcast.
You might want to bring up Fletcher being an 'average mid-table player' aswell, the same Fletcher that's ripped his side apart three times in the last four months.
Spot on the money sir.
factoid...
No Mike
I can see at full tilt the ref has no option. My point is more about Rooney's intentions and the diving than about the actual decision - the moment that idiot Almunia clatters into him there's no argument about it for me . Had Almunia not done that Rooneys dive would have looked as embarrassing as Eduardo's had done or that bell-end Ebeoue
What if, what if. We can never be sure what would have happened had Almunia not dove in. Rooney may have gone down anyway, or he might have just pulled his trailing leg back up. Of course he knew what he was doing, he was expecting the challenge as any striker would do.
your probably correct, although it pains me to say. as it happnes that idiot did...
It's a dive and a penalty.
this is no different than a player looking for a foul to gain possession. There is no malice by the player committing the foul and no 'simulation' by the player who gets the call.
I remembered Muamba in the Liverpool match playing for the foul and was given it. In no way did he fake it and there was no intention by the Liverpool player to hurt the Bolton player.
Rooney was hoping the goalie would have contact with him instead of the ball and Alumnia made the mistake of missing the ball and bringing down the player.
Decision...a penalty.
I remembered Muamba in the Liverpool match playing for the foul and was given it. In no way did he fake it and there was no intention by the Liverpool player to hurt the Bolton player.
Rooney was hoping the goalie would have contact with him instead of the ball and Alumnia made the mistake of missing the ball and bringing down the player.
Decision...a penalty.
Great hustle by him to get the ball first, but I can only think that after that it was a really cynical dive. The fact is that he was already going down (seemingly purposefully) before Alumnia touched him. Between that and Rooney not having a hope in hell of playing the ball after his touch for me = no penalty. I can't seem to see it any other way.
Dear me, some of our resident Arsenal fans are really embarrassing themselves here.
So let me get this right, Rooney would have been as bad as Eduardo if there hadn't been contact...which there was.. so that leaves me to ask what is your actual point?
At the end of the day, did Almunia get the ball? No.. did he get Rooney? Yes. Does that make a penalty? Yes.
When was this ever up for debate? It was identical to the penalty given to us against Liverpool at OT last season.
There is a difference between being hit by something and not being hit by something (see Eduardo and Eboue vs Rooney). One is a dive, the other isn't.
Hope this clears things up.
So let me get this right, Rooney would have been as bad as Eduardo if there hadn't been contact...which there was.. so that leaves me to ask what is your actual point?
At the end of the day, did Almunia get the ball? No.. did he get Rooney? Yes. Does that make a penalty? Yes.
When was this ever up for debate? It was identical to the penalty given to us against Liverpool at OT last season.
There is a difference between being hit by something and not being hit by something (see Eduardo and Eboue vs Rooney). One is a dive, the other isn't.
Hope this clears things up.
spot on, well done fella.
Yep that clears it up - what is embarrassing is you lot making some 'b' class arguments for Rooney not diving
Tell me this then
1/ Eduardo gets faint minimal contact (and that's where many of you are wrong from the start) and theatrically dives
2/ Rooney starts diving (even before Eduardo did) gets clattered and theatrically dives
I'm not arguing whether Rooney's was a penalty- Almunia made sure of that but there's absolutely not a single shred of evidence that says he did not dive, that he he got knocked to the ground, or as Brad put it 'got his boot stuck in the mud' and then "fell" over ....mmm
The only 'falling over' regarding the Rooney pen is all of us laughing at that explanation
So what would have happened if Rooney hadn't gone down early?
He would've been caught anyway and gone down milliseconds later, maybe even with an injury.
He would've been caught anyway and gone down milliseconds later, maybe even with an injury.
More likely he would have steamed into Almunia like Hunt did on Cech, which was not a favourable outcome for all parties involved.
It was a classic case of looking for it. He was clearly going down before he was caught.
And thank feck it wasn't Ronaldo. Otherwise the match commentators, analysts, media, MOTD et, al would've made such a big deal out of it that we would've been denied a dozen legitimate penalties throughout the season.
And thank feck it wasn't Ronaldo. Otherwise the match commentators, analysts, media, MOTD et, al would've made such a big deal out of it that we would've been denied a dozen legitimate penalties throughout the season.
Not really, that is what I thought initially but if you break the video frame by frame, it is a stone cold penalty. Rooney did not looked for it.
Now, I mirrored the video, and looky looky I will get some gif here soon. I am working with a shitty computer right now.
I mean if someone hit your shin like that, at top speed what are you to do? Look at where Rooney landed? Almost went out of the pitch not by his doing, but just his momentum.
Rooney's is a pen he knows the keeper is going through him. There is no rule which says you have to stand bolt upright and take the contact. Everyone who ever played football does this all the time with slide tackles otherwise you would get your legs broken three times a season. If Rooney's judgement was out and the keeper manages to pull out of the challenge then the keepers put him off, well played keeper, and play goes on. The Arsenal fans on here are second guessing Rooney's response to not being touched in an incident where in fact he was.Lee Dixon says it was and this time at least he is right.
The only dive I saw in this game is the Eboue's blatant attempt to get Evra sent off. If you want to debate sportsmanship in the game let’s start there.
The only dive I saw in this game is the Eboue's blatant attempt to get Evra sent off. If you want to debate sportsmanship in the game let’s start there.
Jason dignified in victory as always
I try my best to please.
Not really, that is what I thought initially but if you break the video frame by frame, it is a stone cold penalty. Rooney did not looked for it.
Now, I mirrored the video, and looky looky I will get some gif here soon. I am working with a shitty computer right now.
I mean if someone hit your shin like that, at top speed what are you to do? Look at where Rooney landed? Almost went out of the pitch not by his doing, but just his momentum.
PRobably topple over and not end up sliding on my knees... at top speed.
Picture number 5 is all anybody needs to see to know that it was a penalty. But then there are always those who will not zee.
No matter. I was a bit nervous when Rooney stepped up to take it, given his record of missing them but it was a beautifully placed kick.
But I think I Arsenal fans have far more class than Liverpool. I have read some comments from some of their forums and their analysis is fair and understandable.
Rooney was on his way down before Almunia touched him.
Not a penalty.
Not a penalty.
But in the world of reality, Rooney was not going down prior to contact - see the stills above. He was happy to go down once clattered but it's still a penalty. The only penalty decision wrong was the one not given against Fletcher - but Arshavin scored from the move anyway so it evens out.
Everybody in the media, Alan Green (amazingly), Andy Gray (surprisingly) and all the pundits on MotD (apparently) have not even the slightest reservations about it - definite and clear penalty. The only people who don't think so are RAWK, the Arsenal fans on here and those United fans who think they have to prove they are more sporting by never acknowledging that sometimes we do get fouled in the box without our player diving.
Yep that clears it up - what is embarrassing is you lot making some 'b' class arguments for Rooney not diving
Tell me this then
1/ Eduardo gets faint minimal contact (and that's where many of you are wrong from the start) and theatrically dives
2/ Rooney starts diving (even before Eduardo did) gets clattered and theatrically dives
I'm not arguing whether Rooney's was a penalty- Almunia made sure of that but there's absolutely not a single shred of evidence that says he did not dive, that he he got knocked to the ground, or as Brad put it 'got his boot stuck in the mud' and then "fell" over ....mmm
The only 'falling over' regarding the Rooney pen is all of us laughing at that explanation
going to need video or photograph evidence of that, every one I've seen shows no contact
I was thinking Rooney may have stopped moving his legs because he didn't want to hit Almunia with his knee ala Cech/Hunt. So not only is he not a cheat hes a bloody nice guy!
Maybe.
Maybe.
well that clears that up.......it's that saying isn't it 'opinions are like assholes'
Basically everyones got their own agenda
Try reading the whole post again. You'll get there eventually.
At the game I thought the Arshavin one was an absolutely nailed on penalty but the move ended in a goal anyway. I thought the Rooney one looked a bit soft but when I watched it on MOTD last night it's a penalty every time. I don't know what people are arguing about really. Almunia is a bit thick, he should have just kept out of the way, Wayne was going nowhere. It was a hell of a sprint for him to get to the ball but he got there first and Almunia cleaned him out. Penalty every time.
I wasn't sure when it first happened, although I immediately shouted 'penalty' when I saw Rooney go down. When I saw the replay, I think it was a definite penalty, he was clearly caught by their keeper.
Yep that clears it up - what is embarrassing is you lot making some 'b' class arguments for Rooney not diving
Tell me this then
1/ Eduardo gets faint minimal contact (and that's where many of you are wrong from the start) and theatrically dives
2/ Rooney starts diving (even before Eduardo did) gets clattered and theatrically dives
I'm not arguing whether Rooney's was a penalty- Almunia made sure of that but there's absolutely not a single shred of evidence that says he did not dive, that he he got knocked to the ground, or as Brad put it 'got his boot stuck in the mud' and then "fell" over ....mmm
The only 'falling over' regarding the Rooney pen is all of us laughing at that explanation
Sorry, there was no contact whatsoever and countless replays have shown that.
You're absolutely, categorically wrong.
Boruc made no contact with Eduardo, proven by the video link i posted on pg3 of this thread.
Throughout that play Eduardo doesn't have any contact with any Celtic player.
He did not dive before contact he stretched for the ball and your idiot keeper hit him.
Any forward would have prayed in the same situation for the keeper to react exactly as Almunia did --------- For those who are a bit dim in this thread THERE IS NO OBLIGATION WHATSOEVER FOR ROONEY TO TRY AND AVOID BEING TAKEN OUT BY THE KEEPER'S STUPID CHALLENGE.
Even Almunia and the rest of the arsenal players barely bothered to protest as they realised it was a clear penalty