'We are starving for leaders on the pitch": has Amorim just exposed the true scale of the problem facing United

fastwalker

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I heard Rueben Amorim's press conference earlier and he mentioned "we are starving for leaders on the pitch". I am stunned that none of the journalists pressed him on this. However, the more I thought about it, the more I realised just how damning an indictment it is and just what it reveals about the problems at United.

I am mindful that English is not Amorim's first language and he may have exaggerated to make a point. But even so, he is clearly not a stupid man and must understand the weight that words carry. Think about it, he did not say 'we need leaders' or that 'we need more leaders' or even that 'we need to show more leadership'. He said 'we are starving for leaders'. Effectively what Amorim is saying that there is hardly anyone on the pitch who sets examples for others, is prepared to take responsibility, is accountable for their actions, is willing to take the initiative, will sacrifice for the cause. Basically, no one gives a s**t. It is an incredible thing for a manager/ coach to say publicly about their players. Amorim is telling us exactly what he thinks of the current United team.

If he feels the need to say this publicly, what must he have seen privately?
 
Honestly, when you look at what a truly great United team was, you had van der sar, neville, vidic, ferdinand, evra, scholes, giggs, tevez, Ronaldo, Rooney and even quieter characters like brown and Carrick. Every single one would be a leader in current team. So from a squad with maybe maguire, martinez, de ligt and Bruno as senior leader type players, his comments aren't surprising and i don't think any player at United could argue with them.

Our team completely lacks cajones
 
fastwalker said:
I heard Rueben Amorim's press conference earlier and he mentioned "we are starving for leaders on the pitch". I am stunned that none of the journalists pressed him on this. However, the more I thought about it, the more I realised just how damning an indictment it is and just what it reveals about the problems at United.

I am mindful that English is not Amorim's first language and he may have exaggerated to make a point. But even so, he is clearly not a stupid man and must understand the weight that words carry. Think about it, he did not say 'we need leaders' or that 'we need more leaders' or even that 'we need to show more leadership'. He said 'we are starving for leaders'. Effectively what Amorim is saying that there is hardly anyone on the pitch who sets examples for others, is prepared to take responsibility, is accountable for their actions, is willing to take the initiative, will sacrifice for the cause. Basically, no one gives a s**t. It is an incredible thing for a manager/ coach to say publicly about their players. Amorim is telling us exactly what he thinks of the current United team.

If he feels the need to say this publicly, what must he have seen privately?
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It's not exactly news to anyone who has watched some of the spineless displays over the last few years though.
 
We've known it for years. It's been impossible not to notice. It's probably the main reason for various players running amok and getting too big for their boots, which is how the culture became so toxic and uncontrollable. It's why the problems persist regardless of who we buy each summer and regardless of who the manager is
 
I think it’s a very healthy challenge to the squad. We’re keeping on guys like Maguire who if nothing else have shown character.

What I think he means, as he did expand somewhat, is that we have a lot of young players with few to look up to.

You look at the attacking line for example and who there is a leader?
 
Nothing that we don’t all see for ourselves in every game we watch United play, nobody pushed him on it because we all know it’s true.. they point fingers at each other for their own mistakes, just last week Casemiro missed a practically open net and turned around to have a go at Mainoo for what? Putting it on a plate for him?… it’s a team full of shirkers and players that hide when things go south.
you need a leader in defence and midfield at least, and we don’t have any.
We need a player like Joelinton, but for some reason we never seem to scout them..
 
I think it’s quite clear that the lack of leaders is, and have for many years been the biggest problem. Not sure that Maguire is part of the solution though.
 
HookedOnAPhelan said:
By saying it publicly he's clearly trying to challenge his players to step up.
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100% this. He’s also facilitating the relegation talk to get a response from these soft feck players who seem unbothered and complacent. The good managers can use the media and press to get a response from their players.
 
erikcred said:
Man's too naive. He thinks our lot will respond to challenges by stepping up to it?

It's like no one's briefed him on his job at all.
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What do you want him to do, have a meltdown in his press conferences and tell the media their questions are offensive?
 
Giggsy13 said:
What do you want him to do, have a meltdown in his press conferences and tell the media their questions are offensive?
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I'm saying that he needs to come up with some revolutionary sports psychology ideas in addition to his day job. These old school tricks won't work with our players.
 
A different manager and the fans would be saying he has thrown the entire team under a bus,
It’s refreshing to see you all behind him.
 
Well, duh.

Hopefully he can make some of them (enough of them) realize how much of a problem this actually is.
 
We don't have many players with those qualities it is true. I think there is a fair shout that we move on from Bruno this summer and honestly who would replace him as Captain from the current squad? MDL has some of those qualities but it is debatable that he would be in our best XI long term and besides him I am struggling to think of anyone with the experience and personality to be a leader which is worrying because the alternative is to give it to a new signing and that was a huge mistake when we did that with Maguire.
 
moses said:
He right, we've all been saying it for ages, pundits too.
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Spot on.
Once the game has started, the coach can do very little apart from substitutions.

That is where he should rely on the on pitch leaders.
Similarly, in the dressing room.
The team should be capable of reacting to changing conditions.

As many have said. We are mentally far too weak instead of being mentally tough.
 
Yes we do. We dont have many players that are communicating and telling other players what to do to improve our play. Its a shame his defending hasn't been good recently because Lisandro is one of the only ones that does do that. He's encouraged Dalot to push forward down the left for example.
 
That really is a damning blow to the likes of Bruno, Casemiro, Lisandro, De Ligt and Onana.

The reality is we’ve been relying on a 22 y/o Amad and 23 y/o Ugarte as our only above average performers since Amorim took over. Our senior players really need to step up and dig us out of this mess with better leadership and in turn better performances.
 
Amorim giving Rangnick a run for his money with the truth bombs. :lol: Question is whether the squad will respond any better to their coach going public like this now than they did back then?
 
It's hardly exposing anything it's what we've all been saying and most pundits have been getting at for a fecking age now.

I'm not ordinarily for a manager purely calling out the players but it's not like mentality wise they can get that much worse, so it's probably worth a shot..
 
Bang on (and lets face it, not really news).

It's why I get frustrated by heavy criticism of the younger players. Yes they haven't been performing well enough, but it's the likes of Casemiro, Bruno, Rashford, Martinez, Onana etc that should be showing far more leadership and accountability.
 
#07 said:
Amorim giving Rangnick a run for his money with the truth bombs. :lol: Question is whether the squad will respond any better to their coach going public like this now than they did back then?
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Rangnick was an interim though
 
Giggsy13 said:
Rangnick was an interim though
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Everyone is an interim at Man Utd. If we're 14th in April do you think Sir Jim is going to be any more patient with Berrada, Wilcox and Amorim than he was with Dan Ashworth?

He's in his 70s and he bought Man Utd as a legacy project. He wants to be known as the man who got us back on our feet. Not the man who oversaw us flirting with the Championship.
 
He’s dead right to call it out. There has been too much indulgence for the players and their weak culture, over the top salaries etc. I know some say it’s a generation thing and the days of Bruce and Keane are gone. But they’re not gone so far in other clubs…..
 
daba said:
That really is a damning blow to the likes of Bruno, Casemiro, Lisandro, De Ligt and Onana.

The reality is we’ve been relying on a 22 y/o Amad and 23 y/o Ugarte as our only above average performers since Amorim took over. Our senior players really need to step up and dig us out of this mess with better leadership and in turn better performances.
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Said it in another thread but I’m not sure the likes of Eriksen and Casermiro necessarily feel they are leaders at the club as they have one eye on leaving and know they’re not part of the future here.

The longest serving players, the likes of Shaw, Rashford, Dalot, Lindelof-you can’t say any of them are leaders. Bruno is more debatable.

People on here said De Ligt was a great leader and organiser of the defence but even though he’s done alright so far, I’m not seeing his personality on the pitch. It’s a terrible mix in a lot of ways of inconsistent or passive senior players and very young players not really being helped by the culture.
 
I am happy he said it, it’s been obvious for nearly a decade. His predecessors didn’t mention it which I thought was strange, perhaps it was to protect the players or perhaps it was because player power was too strong.

Regardless, I am happy it is said and I hope the new regime does something about it.
 
SER19 said:
Honestly, when you look at what a truly great United team was, you had van der sar, neville, vidic, ferdinand, evra, scholes, giggs, tevez, Ronaldo, Rooney and even quieter characters like brown and Carrick. Every single one would be a leader in current team. So from a squad with maybe maguire, martinez, de ligt and Bruno as senior leader type players, his comments aren't surprising and i don't think any player at United could argue with them.

Our team completely lacks cajones
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Bruno, Maguire, De Ligt would be eaten alive by Keano, Neville and co. There are in different leagues
 
As said Amorim is not a silly person and knows exactly what he said and he’s 100% right in what he said as for far too long the club has been starved of genuine leaders, you only have to look at the fact the two biggest people as far as supposed leaders go in the dressing room are Fernandes and Rashford.

The first United team I remember was captained by Bryan Robson but also had Jim Leighton, Steve Bruce, Paul McGrath, Gordon Strachan and Mark Hughes then the great squad with Schmeichel, Bruce, Pallister, Irwin, Robson, Ince, Keane, Cantona and Hughes.

Our squad that won the treble had Schmeichel, Neville, Stam, Johnsen, Irwin, Beckham, Keane, Butt, Scholes, Giggs, Sheringham and Yorke then over the years we had VDS, Ferdinand, Vidic, Evra, Carrick, Hargreaves, Fletcher, Rooney, Ronaldo, RVN, Tevez and RVP and everyone of those names would be captain right now in this piss poor spoiled squad.

The problem is that this goes all the way to the very top as we’ve a leadership void from the very top that has worked its way down, the people at the top put the decisions on everyone below with no clear instructions with last summer just the latest in a long period of piss poor decisions from the top down.

What kind of message does it send when we can’t even get our ‘footballing structure’ to agree on a philosophy and style of play or a preferred tactic ? We had Ole with 4-2-3-1 and counter attacking, Rangnick with ge-gen pressing, ETH with 4-1-4-1 and whatever the feck he was apparently trying and now Amorim with 3-4-2-1 and the power struggle between Berrada and Ashworth.

What Amorim said is 100% bang on but it applies to the entire club and not just the playing squad, we need leaders at the top which Berrada could very well be as he’s got the background and know how and hopefully that will bleed into the rest of the club but as far as on the pitch goes we need people that will run through walls for Amorim and the team and lift each other so Fernandes needs to lose the captaincy as a starting point.
 
I mean it's been known hasn't it? Rio, Keane and Neville bang on about it every other sentence saying there is no leaders on the pitch
 
noodlehair said:
It's hardly exposing anything it's what we've all been saying and most pundits have been getting at for a fecking age now.

I'm not ordinarily for a manager purely calling out the players but it's not like mentality wise they can get that much worse, so it's probably worth a shot..
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Sounds like a challenge to me.
 
Sunny Jim said:
Bruno, Maguire, De Ligt would be eaten alive by Keano, Neville and co. There are in different leagues
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I know that, but they're still the senior ones we have who might have some steel to them. Across the board from strongest to weakest there's been a massive fall off.

It works both ways a little - de ligt has shown leadership elsewhere and i can imagine he'd grow more surrounded by the likes of keane. All in all the standards are just so low across the club its hard to believe
 
#07 said:
Amorim giving Rangnick a run for his money with the truth bombs. :lol: Question is whether the squad will respond any better to their coach going public like this now than they did back then?
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The key difference is that we now have the balls to drop and looking to get rid of Rashford and the rest of the highly paid players.
 
Sunny Jim said:
Bruno, Maguire, De Ligt would be eaten alive by Keano, Neville and co. There are in different leagues
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Bruno would have been a great leader and player in any United side between 1993 and 2013.

On the other side, Neville, Keane and co would have all struggled in this current side. The environment that has been allowed to build at the club post 2013 means a constant struggle, even for the good players to thrive.
 
Big Ben Foster said:
"All managers are interim managers" - Rafa Benitez (paraphrased)
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No one cares what the fat Spanish waiter has to say. Amorim has more leverage than rangnick ever did with the players, so his comments will have far more weight and impact on the squad.
 
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