[NessunDorma]

He had a decent game, he didn't play as a DM though, that was Herrera

Well okay . . . but still, Rooney is not a midfielder by trade. Herrera is. And Herrera, who I rate very highly, wasn't too great himself.

Just saying that it's unfair to lambast Rooney for not being great in a position that isn't his.

As I said in the pre-match thread, Rooney should have continued up front, AdM in Fellaini's place, and Fellaini in Carrick's place.

Do actually think we played quite well today, and who am I to question Van Gaal, but . . . we'd have been more dangerous with Rooney as a centre forward.

 

[Cassidy]

Well okay . . . but still, Rooney is not a midfielder by trade. Herrera is. And Herrera, who I rate very highly, wasn't too great himself.

Just saying that it's unfair to lambast Rooney for not being great in a position that isn't his.

As I said in the pre-match thread, Rooney should have continued up front, AdM in Fellaini's place, and Fellaini in Carrick's place.

Do actually think we played quite well today, and who am I to question Van Gaal, but . . . we'd have been more dangerous with Rooney as a centre forward.

What? He was probably our best player behind Shaw.
Also I already said, he (Rooney) had a decent game. Fellaini in Carricks place would have been a disaster.

 

[ThanksBoss26]

Not a huge fan of him in Midfield but can see why we went down that route today.

We could really do with Carrick or Blind back next week though so we can get him back up front.

 

[NessunDorma]

What? He was probably our best player behind Shaw.
Also I already said, he (Rooney) had a decent game. Fellaini in Carricks place would have been a disaster.

And those few simple, cross field, misplaced passes straight to Chelsea players were quite dangerous.

 

[Acole9]

He did a very good job in midfield for us today, we all know his best position is up front but we really needed him back there today to keep things ticking over.

 

[Cassidy]

And those few simple, cross field, misplaced passes straight to Chelsea players were quite dangerous.

See this is the thing, he misplaced two passes all game but apparently didn't have a good game. Rooney gave the ball away in midfield twice too, one which led to a Chelsea counter, but apparently you choose to ignore that... right.

Most passes, most interceptions, best pas accuracy, but two mis placed passes mean he had a poor game?
I actually wasn't critising Rooney, I said he had a good game, but what is this nonsesne about Herrera not having a good game about?

 

[NessunDorma]

See this is the thing, he misplaced two passes all game but apparently didn't have a good game. Rooney gave the ball away in midfield twice too, one which led to a Chelsea counter, but apparently you choose to ignore that... right.

Most passes, most interceptions, best pas accuracy, but two mis placed passes mean he had a poor game?
I actually wasn't critising Rooney, I said he had a good game, but what is this nonsesne about Herrera not having a good game about?

Oh right. All I said is he Herrera 'wasn't too great himself'.

In the context of Herrera playing in midfield as a midfielder, and Rooney playing in midfield as a striker.

In know which one is getting the most stick, despite that context.

 

[Cassidy]

Oh right. All I said is he Herrera 'wasn't too great himself'.

In the context of Herrera playing in midfield as a midfielder, and Rooney playing in a midfield as a striker.

In know which one is getting the most stick, despite that context.

Herrera also played out of position btw (but yes he is a midfielder and Rooney isn't)
He still played better than Rooney, I'm not even giving Rooney stick, if you want to stick up for Rooney then do so, but why bring Herrera into it (one of our better players today for that matter too)
If you want a midfielder who didn't have a good game today, who is actually a midfielder, look no further than Fellaini.. who you say should have played inplace of Carrick...

 

[markhrad]

I am not upset by his missed chances. That's the life of a goalscorer. What I do not like is his apparent lack of connectivity with our (other) strikers. He rarely passes to RVP or Falcao and as a striker himself he should know what type of passes they want. I am not expecting a link up on the scale of Cole and Yorke but God Almighty can we not at least have a few one-twos once in a while?
I wonder if during training if the strikers do not work on plays between themselves. Especially with the lack of creativity of our central midfielders I would think Rooney, RVP and Falcao would get together and work on some plays together.

 

[Cassidy]

I am not upset by his missed chances. That's the life of a goalscorer. What I do not like is his apparent lack of connectivity with our (other) strikers. He rarely passes to RVP or Falcao and as a striker himself he should know what type of passes they want. I am not expecting a link up on the scale of Cole and Yorke but God Almighty can we not at least have a few one-twos once in a while?
I wonder if during training if the strikers do not work on plays between themselves. Especially with the lack of creativity of our central midfielders I would think Rooney, RVP and Falcao would get together and work on some plays together.

I'm sure hes got quite a few assists by passing to RVP over the past few seasons...

 

[Nighteyes]

A free header against a team that rarely concede from set pieces is in your eyes a difficult chance? The wonder goal Rooney scored against Villa was a difficult chance, the header today was easy as feck. How you see it any other way, I don't understand.

Good performance? Zouma is a defender and performed really well, for his team. In contrast, Rooney, who's played in midfield enough to know the basics, wasn't good, at best an average performance. Have you forgotten that we lost the game.

You're an odd poster, you are. In another thread you post this "That's twice Van Gaal has had 70% of the ball against Mourinho and lost whilst barely creating anything". Yet call Rooney's performance good, for creating f*ck all, all game... I have no clue what your ridiculously low standards for Rooney are, but I expect him to perform better than today, especially, if Blind and/or Carrick don't return, otherwise, we'll find ourselves in a position we don't want to be in.

Herrera out shone our Captain whilst playing as a DM for the first time in the EPL. FWIW, I gave Rooney a 5/10 and Herrera a 6/10, which illustrates what I thought of their performances.

The last part is funny because you failed to realise that my comment about the chance being incredibly hard was tongue in cheek, and then proceeded to throw a strop for your shortcomings.

Yes, good performance and I'm sick of explaining why. He's not a midfielder (unlike Herrera) for a start. He passed the ball well (just checked 93% pass completion) and kept the ball ticking against the likes of Fabregas and co. That's pretty good going in my view.

As for the creativity point, that wasn't directed at this game in particular. Even the game at Anfield, we created about 2 chances in the entire game despite controlling it. It's a general problem that we could and should improve upon especially from the wide areas. Rooney's not all that creative from deeper positions as he's more of an instinctive passer which suits more of a #10 role rather than a #8.

My shortcomings? Not at all. Maybe if you stopped accusing me of saying things I never said..

 

[NessunDorma]

Herrera also played out of position btw (but yes he is a midfielder and Rooney isn't)
He still played better than Rooney, I'm not even giving Rooney stick, if you want to stick up for Rooney then do so, but why bring Herrera into it (one of our better players today for that matter too)
If you want a midfielder who didn't have a good game today, who is actually a midfielder, look no further than Fellaini.. who you say should have played inplace of Carrick...

You're free to read my contributions to the Herrera thread. Never criticised the boy, and have praised him lavishly. That's because I rate him highly.

Just saying, though, that Rooney was probably slightly better - even WhoScored ratings, which as everyone knows are infallible, put Rooney ahead of Herrera - than Herrera. And I know which one is getting the most stick, even though one was playing out of position, and one wasn't.

But in the popular imagination, Herrera is the little brilliant cute Spanish boy band bastard, and Rooney is the fat scouse ogre.

Do the math.

 

[markhrad]

I'm sure hes got quite a few assists by passing to RVP over the past few seasons...

Not sure about that but even so look at the games this season. There is very little interaction I really wonder what do these guys work on in training?
When was the last time you saw Rooney involved in a one-two with a striker or even a nice dummy play? Those are the kind of moves that unlock tight defences.

 

[Cassidy]

You're free to read my contributions to the Herrera thread. Never criticised the boy, and have praised him lavishly. That's because I rate him highly.

Just saying, though, that Rooney was probably slightly better - even WhoScored ratings, which as everyone knows are infallible, put Rooney ahead of Herrera - than Herrera. And I know which one is getting the most stick, even though one was playing out of position, and one wasn't.

But in the popular imagination, Herrera is the little brilliant cute Spanish boy band bastard, and Rooney is the fat scouse ogre.

Do the math.

They were both playing out of position, granted Rooney more so.
I don't get the reference to whoscored (who cares about their ratings system), I can only say from what I watched he was better than Rooney, that no criticism of Rooney though, I thought he had a decent game (Rooney that is)
Also 2 misplaced passes, from a player who played the most passes, had the most touches and had the highest passing accuracy means that most other players played more misplaced passes, unless they just wernt getting on the ball as much. So what whoscored marked Herrera down for I'm not too sure.
Anyway since you seemed to think Rooney was playing as a defensive mid today, I'm just going to take what you say with a pinch of salt..

 

[NessunDorma]

They were both playing out of position, granted Rooney more so.
I don't get the reference to whoscored (who cares about their ratings system), I can only say from what I watched he was better than Rooney, that no criticism of Rooney though, I thought he had a decent game (Rooney that is)
Also 2 misplaced passes, from a player who played the most passes, had the most touches and had the highest passing accuracy means that most other players played more misplaced passes, unless they just wernt getting on the ball as much. So what whoscored marked Herrera down for I'm not too sure.
Anyway since you seemed to think Rooney was playing as a defensive mid today, I'm just going to take what you say with a pinch of salt..

Yeah . . . i'll admit I wasn't able to watch the game properly, due to child care responsibilities. Rooney was still in midfield though, and out of position. You yourself admit that he was more out of position than Herrera, and was generally okay.

What's our disagreement again?

 

[Cassidy]

Not sure about that but even so look at the games this season. There is very little interaction I really wonder what do these guys work on in training?
When was the last time you saw Rooney involved in a one-two with a striker or even a nice dummy play? Those are the kind of moves that unlock tight defences.

You're right about the last point, but that is not really Rooneys game tbh which is a shame
With regards to passing to other Strikers, you seem to forget he was our top assister last season.

 

[Cassidy]

Yeah . . . i'll admit I wasn't able to watch the game properly, due to child care responsibilities. Rooney was still in midfield though, and out of position. You yourself admit that he was more out of position than Herrera, and was generally okay.

What's our disagreement again?

That Herrera wasn't that great and had a better game I guess.
Originally the only thing I did was point out that you were wrong about Rooney playing as a DM

 

[markhrad]

You're right about the last point, but that is not really Rooneys game tbh which is a shame
With regards to passing to other Strikers, you seem to forget he was our top assister last season.

Rooney will always be top in stats. Free kicks, corners last year etc but when you look at the actual games there really is very little interaction between him and his fellow strikers or even when he plays midfield. It would not be that big a problem if the highly touted Mata and Herrera would actually create more for our strikers but they seem more interested in their own scoring.
I am happily surprised with how well we are doing right now but next year, with CL football, our level of creativity has to greatly improve.

 

[RooneyLegend]

Shame the early shot didn't go in we would have won this with ease (forcing Chelsea to come out). I dont like him in midfield and that 30 yard floater he tends to always play annoys the shit out of me even when it finds a wide man.

Why? You want him to try to pass the ball through a mou bus? That's a counter waiting to happen.

 

[Castia]

Why? You want him to try to pass the ball through a mou bus? That's a counter waiting to happen.

He just tends to do it all the time, it's so predictable and when he finds a man (usually Valencia or Young) the ball is so slow and expected the opposition are waiting for it. I mean it's not like he throws a 30 yard ball over the top and sends either of them on the break, the ball is usually brought down dead and just passed into midfield.

 

[LeftyBlaster]

Strawman in your eyes, buddy.

If that's an acceptable or good performance, then you've low standards. In case you forgot, we lost and weren't that close to winning. Our best chance fell to Rooney and he fluffed it.

I don't hate Rooney, nor would I criticise a player for no reason. You, for some reason or another, seem to be incapable of seeing any bad in his performances, and just because someone else does, you insult them.

I called his performance average as he did nothing out of the ordinary, never created a chance, hardly passed forward and missed two good chances (the header was a free one against a team who rarely concede from set pieces; golden opportunity in my eyes). However, I also recognise the good in Rooney's performances, he kept the ball under pressure and kept it ticking. However, I expect more from a player who I rate quite highly. If you're going to resort to name calling, then please don't respond.

10 points for Gryffindor

 

[berbatrick]

When I'm saying he did well in midfield I'd think that would be the consensus - I hate him there! I thought his worst traits were suppressed today -- only gave the ball away twice needlessly, handled pressure well, passed short mostly, curbed his diagonals to an extent, and didn't foul pointlessly.

 

[Cooksen]

He did a job in midfield.

Thats all what you could expect

 

[::sonny::]

 

[Mrs Smoker]

Pretty pretty good yesterday.

 

[Mrs Smoker]

Not sure about that but even so look at the games this season.

2014/15 2 (out of 6)
2013/14 4 (out of 21)
2012/13 4 (out of 13)

 

[RooneyLegend]

He just tends to do it all the time, it's so predictable and when he finds a man (usually Valencia or Young) the ball is so slow and expected the opposition are waiting for it. I mean it's not like he throws a 30 yard ball over the top and sends either of them on the break, the ball is usually brought down dead and just passed into midfield.

There's no space to break when a bus has been well and truly parked. The problem is our wingers can't do anything with a ball so it looks like a fruitless exercise. Give those balls to hazard and he's taking the fullback to the cleaners, give it to young and its recycled to midfield. You can't blame him for our wingers being inept. He found fellaini was some good balls in the channels, and he himself didn't do too much with the balls.

 

[Dante]

 

[Sam]

I thought that was probably his best midfield performance for us this season tbh. We missed him upfront massively though.

 

[VeevaVee]

He played fine in midfield, but not playing him upfront totally ruins us in terms of breaking teams down, and creating holes for people to run into.
Van Gaal needs to address this because we can't have a couple of injuries completely dictate how we play.

 

[RedMachine03]

 

[Still ill]

Thought he was very good, crisp, sharp intelligent use of it in the centre of the field, a couple of unnecessarily sprayed missiles off target but otherwise, don't see how we could have asked for more.

 

[Timdbro]

Didn't understand this move by LVG, pretty disappointed about that to be honest - if Herrera was the one destined for the Carrick role (which he clearly was), there was really no need to play Rooney in midfield. He did nothing there that any other midfielder couldn't do, and almost all of his strengths were not being used. It also had the knock-on effect of forcing Falcao to start; I don't think anyone will be surprised at how that went.
Here's hoping Rooney's back up top next week.

 

[Rooney in Paris]

Didn't understand this move by LVG, pretty disappointed about that to be honest - if Herrera was the one destined for the Carrick role (which he clearly was), there was really no need to play Rooney in midfield. He did nothing there that any other midfielder couldn't do, and almost all of his strengths were not being used. It also had the knock-on effect of forcing Falcao to start; I don't think anyone will be surprised at how that went.
Here's hoping Rooney's back up top next week.

Which other midfielder could've played instead?

 

[Timdbro]

Which other midfielder could've played instead?

Poor phrasing perhaps; what I meant was that another player playing as a midfielder could have performed that role. Valencia, Di Maria, even Mata could have played as a slightly more advanced CM to Herrera. The right-sided triangle had been disrupted anyway, so I suppose the only question (for Mata/Valencia) is whether the number 9 was a more or less important position not to disrupt than RB and RW. I'd say it was more important to us creating opportunities than the other two, and also that our backups for those positions were more capable of replacing them than Falcao with Rooney.

 

[caisenma]

we do have moyes to credit for that.

again, it almost seems like some of the best things moyes did happened after he had left (mata, fellaini, rooney)

 

[Roman Bellic]

we do have moyes to credit for that.

again, it almost seems like some of the best things moyes did happened after he had left (mata, fellaini, rooney)

Don't think he deserves any credit for Fellaini and Mata though, for all we know Fellaini might have still been crap this season and the Rooney deal was more about the big boys than Moyes - don't think Moyes had that much pull to spearhead a blockbuster deal for Rooney or convince him to stay.

 

[caisenma]

Don't think he deserves any credit for Fellaini and Mata though, for all we know Fellaini might have still been crap this season and the Rooney deal was more about the big boys than Moyes - don't think Moyes had that much pull to spearhead a blockbuster deal for Rooney or convince him to stay.

oh jeez. so now that fellaini is doing good, he's no longer moyes' fault - in fact, he can't be given credit for it either? it doesn't work like that.

and of course moyes deserves credit for rooney staying - rooney said so himself.

 

[Roman Bellic]

oh jeez. so now that fellaini is doing good, he's no longer moyes' fault - in fact, he can't be given credit for it either? it doesn't work like that.

and of course moyes deserves credit for rooney staying - rooney said so himself.

I don't see how he deserves credit for Fellaini when he signed him as a star player for Everton and turned him into ......well you saw him last season, we were actually linked to Fellaini when Fergie was still around, Moyes just ensured that we overpaid for him.
Mata was signed by Ed Woodward.

300k a week would not have happened under Fergie, so of course Rooney would thank the Small time manager who let him have his way.

Not trying to hate on Moyes, I just don't see how he deserves any credit(been hearing this ever since Fellaini turned his fortunes around) for our players playing the way they were supposed to play in the first place, how about Fellaini deserves credit for his form this season ?

Rooney signed his deal in February ( when the board had allegedly agreed to wait for Moyes to mathematically fail to qualify for the CL so they could sack him), all he had to do at that point was smile for the cameras, he rejected a 20m bid from Chelsea....BIG DEAL, who the feck was going to sell Rooney for 20m to CHELSEA in the first place, would have been sacked before the season started had he accepted that bid.

 

[caisenma]

I don't see how he deserves credit for Fellaini when he signed him as a star player for Everton and turned him into ......well you saw him last season, we were actually linked to Fellaini when Fergie was still around, Moyes just ensured that we overpaid for him.
Mata was signed by Ed Woodward.

300k a week would not have happened under Fergie, so of course Rooney would thank the Small time manager who let him have his way.

Not trying to hate on Moyes, I just don't see how he deserves any credit(been hearing this ever since Fellaini turned his fortunes around) for our players playing the way they were supposed to play in the first place, how about Fellaini deserves credit for his form this season ?

Rooney signed his deal in February ( when the board had allegedly agreed to wait for Moyes to mathematically fail to qualify for the CL so they could sack him), all he had to do at that point was smile for the cameras, he rejected a 20m bid from Chelsea....BIG DEAL, who the feck was going to sell Rooney for 20m to CHELSEA in the first place, would have been sacked before the season started had he accepted that bid.

I dont have time to reply to this because I want to take a nap and typing bores me, but again, Rooney credited Moyes for keeping him at United. There is no way around that. If you dont accept that, then there is literally nothing else anyone can say that can change your mind because clearly it's already made up.

One again, Moyes was instrumental in keeping Rooney at United. He mended relationships for Rooney at the club. Both Rooney and Moyes have said as much and I believe Fergie may have said something to that effect as well.