Agreed. Veron was bought to enable United to challenge against European teams who were getting familiar with the way we play. He as not come up with the goods (barring the very odd exceptional contribution), we made a mess of what was a good semi draw and the PL has been sacrificed in the process. Lets hope Veron has a good world cup and then he can be offloaded at a reasonable price and a (young) world class central defender be brought in for the new season.
Originally posted by passiveman:
<strong>Whatever the truth about that in regard to the PL - we lost the game tonight because there wasn't the same commitment shown by all of the players as by Keane. If they'd all given as much as he did we'd have looked a lot better than we did - in the end they had too much time on the ball in the midfield, and you can only point to a lack of determination from some of the players to explain that...
Isnt it Fergie's job to sort this out?
If there was a lack of desire and determination, surely he should be motivating them more (although if there's a lack of motivation for a Champions League Semi 2nd leg, then something is seriously wrong)...but you get my point...Fergie did/said something amazing at half time during your game at Tottenham...so his motivation abilities arent in question...but what happened last night?
Surely he's not losing the hunger himself...the whole thing confused me.
Originally posted by uranushk1:
<strong>So you haven't watched the game yet but can't wait to come to defend Veron? Okay, I tell you how he perform: </strong><hr></blockquote>
Try again:
I'm just going to watch the replay of the game tonight, but the live show said to me that he played very well.
You will all get my full assessment after the replay and without the emotion of the live viewing.<hr></blockquote>
Got it now? Of course I bloody watched the game! <img src="graemlins/houllier.gif" border="0" alt="[Houllier]" />
Nutter!
The fact of the matter is that Veron is a class(?)player who unfortunately is not suited at all at United. Come to think about it; is he all that class after all? Wasn't he completely pants last season as well for Lazio and got voted worst player in the Serie A? I know, I know the passport thingy, BUT STILL.....
He disrupts the team balance big time, there can be no question about that.
It also seems like he doesn't really care too much about what happens to United. He doesn't have the right feelings for United. This could very well be just me being wrong, but that's the way it looks like IMO.
I say sell him for £30mill and buy one or two defender(s), one midfielder and one striker.
He disrupts the team balance big time, there can be no question about that.
It also seems like he doesn't really care too much about what happens to United. He doesn't have the right feelings for United. This could very well be just me being wrong, but that's the way it looks like IMO.
I say sell him for £30mill and buy one or two defender(s), one midfielder and one striker.
I don't rate Veron as a United player. To be a United player you have to have passion and desire above all else, and I am afraid that for all his amazing skill, he doesn't have this most vital quality.
I think he should be sold in the summer.
I think he should be sold in the summer.
wow. its amazing how many fans have now come out and said Sell Veron. Stan has been saying it all season and got laughed at...or maybe thats just because he's stan
1. We stared the season like a team that had just been promoted thru the nationwide playoffs.
2. Complacency at the begining of the season. Since Fergie was leaving the whole team seemed complacent that the season would be a stroll. Instead of fighting tooth and nail earlier on.
3. Injuries to our best defenders in early season. That did not help cohesion and Barthez's form which was abysmal.
4. Scholes had his worst season in his career.
5. Veron's failure to settle in because of firstly the pre-season pastport scandal and the achilles injury.
6. Fergie's decision to move Giggs into the "hole" came too late in the season.
7. The loss to Middlesborough. It cost us the title!
8 . Last and more important. The lads had forgetten howit felt to be trophless. Apart from Becks, Blanc, Keane, Van Nistelrooy and Solksjaer
the team lacked the desire needed to win things.
The hunger was gone!
If it returns next season with a new centerback, a new striker, proper back up for Giggs and a settled Veron a treble is on the cards!
2. Complacency at the begining of the season. Since Fergie was leaving the whole team seemed complacent that the season would be a stroll. Instead of fighting tooth and nail earlier on.
3. Injuries to our best defenders in early season. That did not help cohesion and Barthez's form which was abysmal.
4. Scholes had his worst season in his career.
5. Veron's failure to settle in because of firstly the pre-season pastport scandal and the achilles injury.
6. Fergie's decision to move Giggs into the "hole" came too late in the season.
7. The loss to Middlesborough. It cost us the title!
8 . Last and more important. The lads had forgetten howit felt to be trophless. Apart from Becks, Blanc, Keane, Van Nistelrooy and Solksjaer
the team lacked the desire needed to win things.
The hunger was gone!
If it returns next season with a new centerback, a new striker, proper back up for Giggs and a settled Veron a treble is on the cards!
Originally posted by golden_blunder:
<strong>wow. its amazing how many fans have now come out and said Sell Veron. Stan has been saying it all season and got laughed at...or maybe thats just because he's stan
Earlier in the season, even critize Veron was not allowed, let alone said sell him! I critized Veron's performance and said he was not the type of player we needed in last Nov/Dec, but then I got a dozen replies all flaming me.
But seriously speaking, we need to give a new player at least one season to settle in and perform his best. So it's too early to say Veron should be sold several months ago.
Originally posted by kemo:
<strong>1. We stared the season like a team that had just been promoted thru the nationwide playoffs.
2. Complacency at the begining of the season. Since Fergie was leaving the whole team seemed complacent that the season would be a stroll. Instead of fighting tooth and nail earlier on.
3. Injuries to our best defenders in early season. That did not help cohesion and Barthez's form which was abysmal.
4. Scholes had his worst season in his career.
5. Veron's failure to settle in because of firstly the pre-season pastport scandal and the achilles injury.
6. Fergie's decision to move Giggs into the "hole" came too late in the season.
7. The loss to Middlesborough. It cost us the title!
8 . Last and more important. The lads had forgetten howit felt to be trophless. Apart from Becks, Blanc, Keane, Van Nistelrooy and Solksjaer
the team lacked the desire needed to win things.
The hunger was gone!
If it returns next season with a new centerback, a new striker, proper back up for Giggs and a settled Veron a treble is on the cards!
1. It was not that bad at the start of the season... We got to the worst point in late Nov and early Dec.
2. I think the complacency is caused by we have won the league too easily in last two years....not only the players, but the manager also. Fergie thought the PL will be a stroll so he experiement a new lineup nearly every matches.
3. Injuries? I think it's LOST of our best defender.
4. Scholes is sacraficed all through the season. Fergie have tried to play him in nearly every position in the midfield and up front. How can he perform if he played in his best position for only 20% of the matches?
5. Strange, how can "passport scandal" affect his settlement? (He won't come here anyway if there is no passport scandal.) And he got his achilles problem just two months ago.
6. Right.
7. Why only single out one match? We have lost too many matches which we shouldn't, such as Bolton(home), West Ham(home), Chelsea(home),.... all of those matches contribute to our PL lost.
8. No comment. "Desire" is such an abstract thing, it's quite subjective to say who have desire, who haven't.
Originally posted by kemo:
<strong>
7. The loss to Middlesborough. It cost us the title!
1 result doesnt lose the title. we would have been top now if we'd been as consistent as Arsenal, instead of doing our best Chelsea impression.
It says in the Daily Mail that Veron IF he moves will be going to Spain! Lazio can't afford him! They still owe us 11 Million for Jaap Stam.
Personally, I think Veron should stay until Christmas.
What if he has an excellent World Cup, and then finally starts performing like he should in the new season? I think, the better world cup he has, the more chance he's got of playing better for united. He'll be back oozing with confidence!
If he doesn't prove himself early in the season, then it's time to show him the door..
Personally, I think Veron should stay until Christmas.
What if he has an excellent World Cup, and then finally starts performing like he should in the new season? I think, the better world cup he has, the more chance he's got of playing better for united. He'll be back oozing with confidence!
If he doesn't prove himself early in the season, then it's time to show him the door..
It is not just a case of how Veron himself will perform next season ....he'd have to improve radically to overcome the fact that the players around him have also struggled to play well when he is in the side.
Early in the season we had Scholes playing out of position and ineffective (as on Tuesday until late in the game), and it appeared in November/December that SAF had decided he couldn't have both Veron and Beckham in the same team.
In February/March we began to see Veron relegated to the bench for the first time...this co-incided with our most effective winning sequence in the league and the climb back to the top of the table. It was only when Becks and Keane were both clearly out of the game for several weeks that SAF decided Veron should reclaim his place in the first choice midfield.
There seems to me no point just hoping that Veron's own form will return unless we have a better idea of how the midfield as a whole will function next season - otherwise it will be more of the same.
Early in the season we had Scholes playing out of position and ineffective (as on Tuesday until late in the game), and it appeared in November/December that SAF had decided he couldn't have both Veron and Beckham in the same team.
In February/March we began to see Veron relegated to the bench for the first time...this co-incided with our most effective winning sequence in the league and the climb back to the top of the table. It was only when Becks and Keane were both clearly out of the game for several weeks that SAF decided Veron should reclaim his place in the first choice midfield.
There seems to me no point just hoping that Veron's own form will return unless we have a better idea of how the midfield as a whole will function next season - otherwise it will be more of the same.
If I had more time I could give a list of Manchester United players who were at first dismissed as good buys because they did not set the world alight in their first season.
It has been a disappointing season but also an experimental one. That the experiments by and large did not work out is not Veron`s fault. Next season if we are lucky enough to keep him, he will be more integrated with the team and Sir Alex Ferguson will have had more time to assess what is the best set up in the team when he plays.
Veron scored a cracker this season and also set up goals that showed his class. He is neither a failure nor a mistake. The challenge is for Sir Alex to find the best combination for a Manchester United side that can choose such fantastic players as Veron,Keane, Scholes, Beckham and Butt.
Overall he was a good buy and you cannot blame Sir Alex for grabbing him when he had the opportunity. While I prefer homegrown talent, Manchester United must also be ready to sign international talents when they are available, so long as it is not for the sake of buying them because they are available.
Give Veron another season and if he is an unmitigated flop (which he wasn`t this season), then sell him. Wait until then.
It has been a disappointing season but also an experimental one. That the experiments by and large did not work out is not Veron`s fault. Next season if we are lucky enough to keep him, he will be more integrated with the team and Sir Alex Ferguson will have had more time to assess what is the best set up in the team when he plays.
Veron scored a cracker this season and also set up goals that showed his class. He is neither a failure nor a mistake. The challenge is for Sir Alex to find the best combination for a Manchester United side that can choose such fantastic players as Veron,Keane, Scholes, Beckham and Butt.
Overall he was a good buy and you cannot blame Sir Alex for grabbing him when he had the opportunity. While I prefer homegrown talent, Manchester United must also be ready to sign international talents when they are available, so long as it is not for the sake of buying them because they are available.
Give Veron another season and if he is an unmitigated flop (which he wasn`t this season), then sell him. Wait until then.