Veron against the Saints
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Originally posted by Julian Denny:
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You make some very valid points there. I mentioned Sven because apparently he was on the verge of agreeing to come to us when Fergie changed his mind. I did not express an opinion as to whether or not he would be the right man for what is probably the biggest job in football. I like Martin O'Neill and David Moyes but by Kenyon's definition they would not qualify due to inexperience. The same goes for Steve McClaren, but he's one to watch. Who else is there ? Hitzfeld, Capello or someone else from the continent ? Of course it all depends on when Fergie goes and if he sees out the remaining two years which I don't think he will although I could be wrong of course. If he doesn't he is likely to remain at the Club having moved "upstairs" in some capacity. The fact that he will still be there may be a problem for a prospective replacement though. My biggest fear is that this is going to be a re-run of the debacle that followed Busby's retirement which took the best part of 20 years to finally resolve. That of course is the bleakest outlook and such pessimism is not warranted , at least not for the time being. It's a huge task that awaits Kenyon and I wouldn't be surprised if quite considerable thought is being given to it right now.</strong><hr></blockquote>
i did make a point about this in some other thread, that i also thought SAF moving upstairs could pose a problem for future managers.
Because of this, we MUST get a manager who is not going to be easily intimidated by SAF's success at the club. Unproven managers with not a lot of trophies to show for like O'Neill or O'Leary just don't fit the bill.
I think we're going to need someone like Hitzfeld or Capello who are both over 50 and know their roles in the clubs. The characters of these two will not allow SAF to be influencial in the jobs. Moreso, managers like Hitzfeld or Capello will have had a lot of success and will thrive on the challenge of taking 'another' team to the throne and add to their own list of success.. i think they will find this job to be very challenging and will be very motivated to do the job.
Julian Denny
Full Member
Originally posted by An Extremely Boring Man:
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So then, aren't the players to blame then????</strong><hr></blockquote>
You can have great players but unless they are moulded into a team or unless they can adapt to a particular plan, then you don't have a successful team. It's the manager's reponsibility to select the team and to decide on the tactics he wishes to employ to beat the opposition. if he makes the wrong decisions then it doesn't matter how many great players you have you won't be successful.
Julian Denny
Full Member
Originally posted by RUnited:
<strong>
i did make a point about this in some other thread, that i also thought SAF moving upstairs could pose a problem for future managers.
Because of this, we MUST get a manager who is not going to be easily intimidated by SAF's success at the club. Unproven managers with not a lot of trophies to show for like O'Neill or O'Leary just don't fit the bill.
I think we're going to need someone like Hitzfeld or Capello who are both over 50 and know their roles in the clubs. The characters of these two will not allow SAF to be influencial in the jobs. Moreso, managers like Hitzfeld or Capello will have had a lot of success and will thrive on the challenge of taking 'another' team to the throne and add to their own list of success.. i think they will find this job to be very challenging and will be very motivated to do the job.</strong><hr></blockquote>
I worry that Capello is over the top as well. He wasn't able to get the better of Liverpool with Roma, which is a definite black mark on his cv !
Hitzfeld seems more like it but what's going on at Bayern at the moment ? It's going to have to be someone who has a proven track record of success, someone who is endowed with a strong personality, tactically aware and a disciplinarian first and foremost. I agree with you, that the greater the experience the less likely to be intimidated by Fergie upstairs. Not that I would expect Fergie to interfere however. As I said before it's a daunting task.
Originally posted by Julian Denny:
<strong>
I worry that Capello is over the top as well. He wasn't able to get the better of Liverpool with Roma, which is a definite black mark on his cv !
Hitzfeld seems more like it but what's going on at Bayern at the moment ? It's going to have to be someone who has a proven track record of success, someone who is endowed with a strong personality, tactically aware and a disciplinarian first and foremost. I agree with you, that the greater the experience the less likely to be intimidated by Fergie upstairs. Not that I would expect Fergie to interfere however. As I said before it's a daunting task.</strong><hr></blockquote>
it's highly difficult right now to think of that man IMO. here's a list i've come up with as a POSSIBLE replacement in 1 or 2 years time:
1. Hitzfeld (remain high on my list because of his character, i like it and i think the players at United will respect him, it's good we beat him in '99 as the players do not hate him) - i think what's happening at Beyern right now is a sign that the end for him there is near.. but they're still topping the league, so he should get 1 more season to prove himself before being sacked.
2. Cappello - the problem with Roma is definitely depth of the squad, and not the manager himself. he has managed in two countries so his experience will be limitless. he could also do a little bit of scouting work as he has been around. it's difficult for Roma to play in Europe because they do not not have enough of good players around.. they only have maybe 13-14 decent players and we all know how it could be very difficult to play 50-60 games a year with only 13-14 first team squad.
3. Del Bosque - his european record should be evidence enough that he IS good - provided that money is available at all times. if we only care about the ECL then he's the man for the job.
4. Sven - his slow playing style tactics are beginning to show, but if we fail to get the three above then i think he will be the main target again.
5. Guus Hiddink - he's doing wonders again at PSV after the S. Korea spell.. i think he has got enough experience to take over this team.
i'm NOT saying i'm rushing into kicking out SAF.. but since SAF said he wanted to leave before i'm merely suggesting some replacements possibility.
i said in another thread.. i'm willing to place two odd bets:
we will win the ONLY the ECL this season, and SAF will quit right after - provided that the board has found the best replacement.
Julian Denny
Full Member
Originally posted by RUnited:
<strong>
i'm NOT saying i'm rushing into kicking out SAF.. but since SAF said he wanted to leave before i'm merely suggesting some replacements possibility.
i said in another thread.. i'm willing to place two odd bets:
we will win the ONLY the ECL this season, and SAF will quit right after - provided that the board has found the best replacement.</strong><hr></blockquote>
Either way this could well be SAF's last season in charge of the team. Certainly if it's trophyless, there will be huge pressure to replace him. Equally if he wins something particularly the ECL he would be wise to go out on top. So discussions of Fergie's successor are very relevant. By the way we seem to have strayed somewhat from the title of this topic !
Originally posted by Julian Denny:
<strong>
Either way this could well be SAF's last season in charge of the team. Certainly if it's trophyless, there will be huge pressure to replace him. Equally if he wins something particularly the ECL he would be wise to go out on top. So discussions of Fergie's successor are very relevant. By the way we seem to have strayed somewhat from the title of this topic !</strong><hr></blockquote>
there's another thread discussing this, so it may be wise to move our discussions there..
just to add to it, we haven't gone more than 1 season without a trophy in 10 years.. and i think we have only gone without a trophy in 2 season! so to be going 2 trophyless season in a row is really going to be the final straw IMO..
anyway.. if SAF feels he still wants the job and ask for time to rebuild the squad then i'm sure the board will be OK with it - unless they have a suitable replacement of coz..
so the odds are, IMO, that SAF will only step down for:
1. win the ECL, then quits.
2. Not win anything, the board finds perfect replacement, SAF gets the sack.
IMHO, the number 1 should be happen easier.. all fingers crossed..
Julian Denny
Full Member
Originally posted by RUnited:
<strong>
there's another thread discussing this, so it may be wise to move our discussions there..
just to add to it, we haven't gone more than 1 season without a trophy in 10 years.. and i think we have only gone without a trophy in 2 season! so to be going 2 trophyless season in a row is really going to be the final straw IMO..
Fair comment, although I think the Board may have to do something if it's another trophyless season, no matter what fergie says. But as you say, let's hope he can pull something off. Despite my current misgivings I don't underestimate the man !
anyway.. if SAF feels he still wants the job and ask for time to rebuild the squad then i'm sure the board will be OK with it - unless they have a suitable replacement of coz..
so the odds are, IMO, that SAF will only step down for:
1. win the ECL, then quits.
2. Not win anything, the board finds perfect replacement, SAF gets the sack.
IMHO, the number 1 should be happen easier.. all fingers crossed..</strong><hr></blockquote>
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